'Hearts are in a relegation battle'

[Tokyo Drifter]

56 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

Heard this said on the radio on saturday and really hope that anyone could be this dense and think that there is a possibility of us going down this season. We're poor but there's no way 10/11 teams are better than us in this league.

 

It's between us and St Johnstone for 6th place, I reckon. Not convinced we'll get it, but if we don't finish top 6 we'll be best (or almost best) of the rest, I'm sure. Can't see us in a relegation battle, especially not if we can strengthen even a little in January (i.e ship out Randall, Grizzly, Martin and maybe Nowak and bring in at least two half decent players)

[Locky]

We're 3 points off the relegation playoff if IIRC. Closer to bottom than to Hibs.

 

Personally, I think we're too good to go down, but then again, we've not won in our last 6, which has included 4 bang average teams, a derby and a poor Rangers side.

[Escobar PHM]

1 hour ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

Heard this said on the radio on saturday and really hope that anyone could be this dense and think that there is a possibility of us going down this season. We're poor but there's no way 10/11 teams are better than us in this league.

I remember when Hibs thought they wouldn't go down. In fact they thought they'd finish top 6 right up until the week before they finished bottom 6 and went on to blow it in the split.

Anyone looking at our form and our next half dozen games surely has to realise that we're in trouble if results don't pick up.

I doubt we'll finish bottom. Partick look to be falling off the pace a bit. We could easily finish 11th though. On current form we WILL finish 11th at best. Something has to change, and fast. If we're still in this state at the end of January, strap yourself in because its going to get hairy.

[Escobar PHM]

50 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

And only exceptionally poor sides go down.

You only have to have 10 teams better than you to go down ( via the play offs) Exceptionally poor or just pretty poor or just a wee bit poor doesn't come into it. If your results from here onwards are the worst of the teams in the bottom 6 your going down.

[The Gorgie]

There are a few teams in the league too good to go down, we are not one of they teams.  This run of 10 games or so to be played in Edinburgh was suppose to be where our season kicked on. Yeah that hasn't really gone to plan. We are well and truly in a relegation battle.

[The Old Tolbooth]

Anyone thinking we're not in a relegation battle is a little bit dense in my opinion! 

 

We have the worst current form in the league, we have scored the second fewest goals in the league (with supposed good strikers *cough*), the fact we're top 6 is merely papering over some huge cracks, and I'd wager that we'll be bottom 3 or 4 by the turn of the year when you see the fixtures coming up. 

 

If we don't have a decent January transfer window, then we could be in serious trouble, and if the last few transfer windows are anything to go by, then the 18/1 on offer for us finishing bottom 2 in the league looks pretty generous to me! (40/1 to finish bottom)

 

Motherwell are 12/5 to beat us on Saturday, that looks like printing money right now! 

 

Our next fixtures are 

 

Motherwell home (loss)

Dundee home (draw)

Celtic home (loss *gulp*)

St Johnstone (away) I actually think we could get something there, so a win)

Hibs home (draw hopefully, but no doubt another loss with that spineless lot!)

Aberdeen away (loss) 

 

So that's 5 points out of our next possible 18 points, and that's being generous, and folk think we're not involved in a dogfight? Jesus! 

 

 

[Hendricks]

Are we in a relegation battle? No not yet, it’s 16 league games into the season. Do I think we will be relegated? No.

 

However anyone who does not think we can quite easily be dragged into a scrap for the bottom 3 or 4 places and therefore a potential relegation battle is seriously kidding themselves and clearly not paying attention. 

 

We we are averaging a point a game for the last 33 league matches (exactly 33/33). We have won just 4 of 16 league matches this season after winning just one of the last 10 last season and we are devoid of creativity and goals. Just 19 in our last 26 league matches since beating Saturday’s opponents 4-0 in March. We can’t even beat the piss poor teams at home right now and our fixture list is about to get a whole lot harder. This doesn’t even take into account the truly shambolic League Cup efforts. 

 

We have a dreadful squad, with very few keepers in terms of players you’d want to stay around. The atmosphere in the stands is completely shot and the team spirit is far from evident most weeks. That’s hugely concerning coupled with the lack of ability and options to change things. In short we are a mess and personally I’ll think it will take strong leadership and further upheaval to turn it around. Nobody in the dugout or on the park is sorting this shitshow out. 

[bobskeldon]

1 hour ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

Heard this said on the radio on saturday and really hope that anyone could be this dense and think that there is a possibility of us going down this season. We're poor but there's no way 10/11 teams are better than us in this league.

The degree of smoke and mirrors (Madden's fault, Cathros's fault, Michael Stewart's fault, BBC Sportsound's fault etc) from many on here is quite staggering!  How anyone can look at the stats, consider our form over a significant period of time, recognise we have a manager with a poorer win ratio than Ian Cathro and contemplate our next 6 fixtures but still think we are not in REAL danger of being in a relegation dog-fight in a few weeks is clearly deluded! Dense would be saying there is no possibility of us going down based on absolutely nothing and zero evidence! 

[Paolo]

Based on current form,

we will be in one.   As others have said, Hibs and Dundee Utd fans were also in denial the seasons they went down. 

 

I happen to think we will NOT get relegated, but if we don’t pick up soon, we will be in that battle. 

[bobskeldon]

1 hour ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

Dundee United were an exceptionally poor side, with no quality going forward and leaky at the back. Not one player from that side would get in this Hearts side.

 

I think we had the better of the opening exchanges, obviously the game turned with the red card so there's no way to know how it would have panned out. 

 

We definitely need to start putting points on the board, I'd agree with that.

"I think we had the better of the opening exchanges" what game were you at, Hamilton were better all over the park than us prior to the sending off!

[Gambo]

1 hour ago, Thomaso said:

 

And there you have it.   The last 6 months results of Cathro's reign also had us at the bottom of the league!!

 

Who is responsible for this shambles??

 

Michael Stewart?

 

You?

 

Spencer?

 

Alan Preston?

[bobskeldon]

52 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

Ifs and buts. Your argument is based on the premise that we fail to win the next 2 games which is unlikely. And should we fail to win the next 2, there's no certainty about us heading for the playoffs.

Please explain why losing to Motherwell and Dundee is "unlikely"?

[Thomaso]

1 hour ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

We've conceded the 3rd fewest goals in the league. Defence is fine, we just can't score goals consistently at the moment. You don't go down if you have a solid defence.

 

Mate  have a look at the points from the last 6 games - THAT is relegation form!!

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

Just now, bobskeldon said:

Please explain why losing to Motherwell and Dundee is "unlikely"?

 

You' get about 6/1 at the bookies for starters.

[bobskeldon]

49 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

If you're not going to go down you're not in a relegation battle.

[buzzbomb1958]

25 minutes ago, Lambo85 said:

There are so many fans on here with their head in the sand.

We are a very poor team and have been for over a year now.

Failing to beat Partick, Ross County and Hamiltion at home has put the pressure on us.

We have got some really tough games coming up. We need to take 6 points away from the next 2 matches because after that we are away to St Johnstone home to Celtic, home to Hibs and home to Aberdeen.

we will not win any of these games

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

4 minutes ago, bobskeldon said:

"I think we had the better of the opening exchanges" what game were you at, Hamilton were better all over the park than us prior to the sending off!

 

No they were not, it was fairly even, both sides creating few chances but we were moving to ball around nicely in midfield. But don't let your agenda get in the way of the facts.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

I don’t think we’ll go down but the delusion on here gets worse. We are in serious trouble and going backwards.

[Thomaso]

49 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

Logic buddy, you should try it some time.

 

With respect buddy, your belief that we are not going to be battling in the bottom 6 is based on absolutely no logic taking account of our current form and results!

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

25 minutes ago, Tokyo Drifter said:

 

It's between us and St Johnstone for 6th place, I reckon. Not convinced we'll get it, but if we don't finish top 6 we'll be best (or almost best) of the rest, I'm sure. Can't see us in a relegation battle, especially not if we can strengthen even a little in January (i.e ship out Randall, Grizzly, Martin and maybe Nowak and bring in at least two half decent players)

 

About where I'm at, for Motherwell's decent run they haven't put that many points on the board, it will be between the three of us for 5th/6th/7th.

[Cruyff Turn]

15 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Defence is doing ok.  Problem is that if you aren't scoring goals then any you concede are going to hurt you.

 

We need to have a team with a spread of goals among the midfield and forwards, and need to create chances.  Some of the poor quality delivery into the box on Saturday was embarassing and these so called professional players need to have a look at themselves.

 

A few players in to get the balance in midfield plus a leftl-back might be enough.

 

The standard of the squad isn't good enough at the moment, that is the jist of it. Not only the standard but there is no balance in that squad, we've got 3 hold up men upfront for example. We won't score goals if our strikers are constantly facing our own goal. 

 

We desperately need a left back, a good Left Back will make our defence instantly better. A quality central midfielder, At least one pacey winger who can cross and a quick striker who will make runs in behind and into the channels would make a huge difference.

 

13 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

Read the form table. We are definitely in a dangerous situation. Our last 4 games were supposed to be 4 easy home wins. We've struggled in 3 out of the 4 games and taken only 3 points from 12. 

 

Based on our recent history, the January window will make us worse not better. We have had 2 successive January windows where our team has been made worse - Levein has been heavily involved during both windows.

 

The January signings are pivotal for us, if they go as wrong as our last 4 successive transfer windows in a row, we are knee deep in shite

 

 

 

We're no. We're just a mid table side with problems in our squad, which we can do nothing about until January.

 

The only way I can see us getting into difficulties is that we can't bring anyone in during January and have to struggle on with this bunch, which I don't believe will be the case.

 

Ann Budge and the board have expectations and financial projections. They won't settle for being a bottom 6 team.

 

Craig Levein has invested the best part of his life in this club, do people really think he doesn't care? Of course he does. 

 

These people will do their best to get us where we should be. 

 

Granted mistakes have been made with recruitment and especially Ian Cathro. These are problems that simply can't be fixed this season.

 

We will get better, 1000% confidence that we will. 

 

 

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

Just now, Thomaso said:

 

With respect buddy, your belief that we are not going to be battling in the bottom 6 is based on absolutely no logic taking account of our current form and results!

 

https://thebackpassrule.com/spfl-advanced-stats-team-table/

 

Use pretty much any metric from this, we are 6th best.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I don’t think we’ll go down but the delusion on here gets worse. We are in serious trouble and going backwards.

Nah, it is only vermin and trolls saying that we are in a relegation fight. Everything is awesome.

[WhenTheHeartsWentUp]

Not suggesting for a second that I think we'll go down, but I remember how much the hobbits over the road laughed when we sung down with the jambos to them at the 2-0 in March, little did they know then

[Thomaso]

46 minutes ago, August Landmesser said:

Meh, a relegation DOGFIGHT will make for an exciting season - more interesting than mid-table mediocrity anyway

 

 

That's as bad as Neilson's "It will be a good money spinner" after blowing a two goal lead against Hibs!!

[SE16 3LN]

We're in a relegation battle, only the deluded would think otherwise. I think we can come out of it but only with a couple of brilliant buys in the transfer window and an improved attitude from some of the current squad.

[i8hibsh]

The only way anyone could possibly say we are not is if they have their head buried in the sand.

[i8hibsh]

Only one team has scored less goals than us and only 2 teams have won less games than us and we are approaching the half way point.

 

I do however see us getting better as the season goes on as opposed to getting worse.  If we do get worse I will be wanting Cathro back.

 

 

[bobskeldon]

9 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

You' get about 6/1 at the bookies for starters.

Is that the extent of your analysis? Deary me!

[Thomaso]

42 minutes ago, Cruyff Turn said:

We'll be in the top 6 by the end of the year.

 

Once we sign 3-4 players in January, we will be a completely different side.

 

Relegation chat is pant pishing nonsense, I even saw someone mention administration ffs. 

 

Get a ****ing grip.

 

 

Where did someone mention administration????  Patently that's shite if it was said.

 

With the run of games we have coming up there is no chance we will be top 6 by the end of the year!!

 

As for signing 3-4 players what makes you think Levein will get it right this time???

 

"Pant pishing nonsense"????   Suggest you and your Happy Clapper pals get a grip!

[bobskeldon]

8 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

No they were not, it was fairly even, both sides creating few chances but we were moving to ball around nicely in midfield. But don't let your agenda get in the way of the facts.

Does your seat face the pitch?

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

Just now, bobskeldon said:

Is that the extent of your analysis? Deary me!

 

Bookies aren't known for being wrong! But your argument is based on the possibility that Hearts lose the next 2, and you can't blame Hearts for losses that haven't happened, surely.

 

[August Landmesser]

6 minutes ago, Thomaso said:

 

 

That's as bad as Neilson's "It will be a good money spinner" after blowing a two goal lead against Hibs!!

I maybe should have clarified that I was being tongue-in-cheek.

 

Although, given a choice I would take defeats in our next few league games if it guaranteed that we won the cup tie. We desperately need a cup run, and to beat those goons... 

[Thomaso]

12 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

No they were not, it was fairly even, both sides creating few chances but we were moving to ball around nicely in midfield. But don't let your agenda get in the way of the facts.

 

 

Yup there you go. Typical Happy Clapper nonsense - confronted by the unpleasant reality of the shambles that our football side is in, and it's an "agenda"!  Pathetic!

[Thomaso]

3 minutes ago, August Landmesser said:

I maybe should have clarified that I was being tongue-in-cheek.

 

Although, given a choice I would take defeats in our next few league games if it guaranteed that we won the cup tie. We desperately need a cup run, and to beat those goons... 

 

I certainly would settle for a cup win and 10th place.

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

Just now, Thomaso said:

 

 

Yup there you go. Typical Happy Clapper nonsense - confronted by the unpleasant reality of the shambles that our football side is in, and it's an "agenda"!  Pathetic!

 

Tell me how Hamilton eviscerated our sorry team before the sending off

 

[August Landmesser]

Just now, Thomaso said:

 

I certainly would settle for a cup win and 10th place.

Especially if finishing tenth meant we had a chance of relegating Hamilton at Tynie...

[busby1985]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Bill said:

If you're near the bottom of the league then you're in a relegation battle.

 

I'll start sharing other people's optimism when we start winning games.

 

 

 

 

 

Same. 

 

The numbers are shocking when you start actual looking through them. 4 scorers this season. Only 19 goals scored in 2017? 39 points in a calendar year? 3 wins in 12 for Levein. 7 points off bottom spot with Thistle having a game in hand. Celtic, Aberdeen, Hibs, Motherwell and St Johnston all coming up. Failed to beat Killie, Thistle, County and Hamilton at home. Horrendous atmosphere at the club and confidence rock bottom. Am

worried. 

 

**the numbers could be wrong, fag paper math and all that. 

[The Old Tolbooth]

17 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

You' get about 6/1 at the bookies for starters.

 

3 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

Bookies aren't known for being wrong! But your argument is based on the possibility that Hearts lose the next 2, and you can't blame Hearts for losses that haven't happened, surely.

 

 

Celta Vigo were 8/1 to draw away to Barcelona at the weekendn(drew 2-2), Crewe were 100/1 to gain a draw at Blackburn after going 3-0 down yesterday (drew 3-3), 6/1 is a severely tempting price! 

 

Take your head out the sand mate. 

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

Just now, johnmitchell said:

 

 

Celta Vigo were 8/1 to draw away to Barcelona at the weekendn(drew 2-2), Crewe were 100/1 to gain a draw at Blackburn after going 3-0 down yesterday (drew 3-3), 6/1 is a severely tempting price! 

 

Take your head out the sand mate. 

 

So things that are unlikely happen sometimes? Cheers, Einstein.

[Heartsofgold]

1 hour ago, Thomaso said:

 

Think you need to wake up and smell the roses - DU fans were saying the same thing a couple of years ago!

 

We were no better that Hamilton even before the sending off, and they start as most peoples favourites for relegation.  We couldn't beat Ross County or Partick at Tynecastle - and we lost to Killie at Murrayfield!

 

Saturday was a must win game - now the Motherwell and Dundee games become must win games big style.  Lose these and we are rooted in the bottom 6 and in a dog fight that others will be up for.

I think the difference will be that we have (limited) resources to try and make amendments to the playing squad in January.  If this poor form continues through January/February though, I do have a little bit of the fear.

[luckydug]

41 minutes ago, Escobar PHM said:

I remember when Hibs thought they wouldn't go down. In fact they thought they'd finish top 6 right up until the week before they finished bottom 6 and went on to blow it in the split.

Anyone looking at our form and our next half dozen games surely has to realise that we're in trouble if results don't pick up.

I doubt we'll finish bottom. Partick look to be falling off the pace a bit. We could easily finish 11th though. On current form we WILL finish 11th at best. Something has to change, and fast. If we're still in this state at the end of January, strap yourself in because its going to get hairy.

I don't disagree with you.

Plenty teams have been relegated who on paper should be safe.

I think we will turn things around though.

Otherwise the only thing for it is the Dean Bridge?

If there is no improvement after the transfer window then I'll be worried.

 

[frankblack]

Some people on here need to wake up and accept that we started the season in a woeful state and all we can do in January is patch things up to keep us out of trouble.  We aren't going to achieve much more than lower bottom six, whatever happens.

 

I guess losing the next derby is something some fans just can't accept is probably going to happen.  Our team is shite, and changing the manager isn't going to make things better until we get better players.

[Cruyff Turn]

1 minute ago, Thomaso said:

 

 

Where did someone mention administration????  Patently that's shite if it was said.

 

With the run of games we have coming up there is no chance we will be top 6 by the end of the year!!

 

As for signing 3-4 players what makes you think Levein will get it right this time???

 

"Pant pishing nonsense"????   Suggest you and your Happy Clapper pals get a grip!

Yes, next 6 games thread someone said as much. 

 

We'll see Thomaso, I think we'll do ok and cling on in 6th until January, Motherwell game is a massive game for us.

 

What makes me think Levein will get it right? His future depends on it and he can't afford to get it wrong. Also I think he did give Neilson and Cathro complete freedom on how they ran their ship and who came in and who was out. Now as the manager though, being the guy that makes all the decisions, he will know exactly what we need.

 

People are comparing this with Cathro. Cathro was a novice, with zero experience and no ability to command a dressing room. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Jim Jefferies had the exact same record as Levein has when he came here during his first spell. He inherited someone else's team and had to weed out the shite. Thank **** JKB wasn't around in those days. 

 

No really happy clapping. It's more of a pragmatic view that we're shite, the squads not good enough, we're a mid table side and no one can do anything to change that at the moment. We're also in the top 6 almost halfway through the season with this awful, unbalanced squad, which isn't the worst thing in the world. Therefore, 3/4 players in January and we are certain to improve. 

 

There will be a cut off point for Levein. Clearly getting gubbed in the majority of these games should spell the end but if we're still in there come January, he deserves until the end of the season at the very least and I'd expect us to progress.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Saturday led me to believe it is not altogether impossible. Even before the reduction to 10 men, it was a toil. Not scoring when you play well. Losing a late goal to a team that is struggling to buy one, missing the chance to win a game then losing it 30 secs later. Looking at the last 4 weeks, relegation team we look every bit of one.

[portobellojambo1]

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

If we play like we did against Ross County we will beat the majority of bottom 6 sides. Need to be more clinical.

 

 

We have played the majority of the bottom 6 sides in the fairly recent past. The results were Dundee (lost), Kilmarnock (lost), Partick (drew) and Hamilton (drew). Do you not even find it a bit ironic/strange that in the game we played against Ross County (where on here I've heard comments going from played well to played excellently) we also only got a draw. Is that what we have now come to, a team with a section of fans who are happy to see us draw at home against the bottom sides in the league and actually consider the performance against Ross County as excellent. We failed to win any of those games due to our limitations, not because of the quality of the opposition, and it is our limitations which could drag us into trouble.

[bobskeldon]

4 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

So things that are unlikely happen sometimes? Cheers, Einstein.

It was you who used the bookies as evidence that we would not lose the next two games.

I would still like to know if your seat faces the pitch or has a restricted view. FYI Hamilton passed the ball better, got forward quicker, were in and around our box more and had more attempts on goal, which wasn't difficult given we had none until a dead ball situation! Are you sure football's your sport of choice? You seem to have very little understanding of the game, fantastic vocabulary but little knowledge of football!

[Jeff]

Just now, portobellojambo1 said:

 

 

We have played the majority of the bottom 6 sides in the fairly recent past. The results were Dundee (lost), Kilmarnock (lost), Partick (drew) and Hamilton (drew). Do you not even find it a bit ironic/strange that in the game that in the game we played against Ross County (where on here I've heard comments going from played well to played excellently) we also only got a draw. Is that what we have now come to, a team with a section of fans who are happy to see us draw at home against the bottom sides in the league and actually consider the performance against Ross County as excellent. We failed to win any of those games due to our limitations, not because of the quality of the opposition, and it is our limitations which could drag us into trouble.

 

We never played anything like how we did vs Ross County against the others. If we play like that week in week out we would win most games, the problem is that we don't. The ability is defo there though.

[VALDOS]

3 draws at HOME against bottom 6 teams, doesnt look too clever.

Those results are from the team "playing well".

[Thomaso]

25 minutes ago, Cruyff Turn said:

 

The standard of the squad isn't good enough at the moment, that is the jist of it. Not only the standard but there is no balance in that squad, we've got 3 hold up men upfront for example. We won't score goals if our strikers are constantly facing our own goal. 

 

We desperately need a left back, a good Left Back will make our defence instantly better. A quality central midfielder, At least one pacey winger who can cross and a quick striker who will make runs in behind and into the channels would make a huge difference.

 

We're no. We're just a mid table side with problems in our squad, which we can do nothing about until January.

 

The only way I can see us getting into difficulties is that we can't bring anyone in during January and have to struggle on with this bunch, which I don't believe will be the case.

 

Ann Budge and the board have expectations and financial projections. They won't settle for being a bottom 6 team.

 

Craig Levein has invested the best part of his life in this club, do people really think he doesn't care? Of course he does. 

 

These people will do their best to get us where we should be. 

 

Granted mistakes have been made with recruitment and especially Ian Cathro. These are problems that simply can't be fixed this season.

 

We will get better, 1000% confidence that we will. 

 

 

 

Levein was a great player for us however, he spend his career at Hearts because (sadly) he did his knee in, and no other Club would touch him as a consequence.

 

He cared about Hearts that much when he was Manager that he jumped at the first chance to leave on the eve of a big European game.

 

He is now back at Hearts because after his Scotland gig and his arrogant reputation in the game, he is a busted flush as a Manager and again no other team will touch him!

 

I have no doubt that Levein is trying his best however he is yesterdays man, and taking us nowhere.