hughesie27 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Fun and games. Good watching MPs everywhere squirm. Some people just like to watch the world burn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 All over a set of circumstances that would probably not occur. But the 'ITS OOR SOVEREIGNTY', little Englander, my home is my castle, this was their finest hour, still living in imperial times mindset zealots insist on there being a unilateral exit mechanism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Boris said: Or have another referendum? May could get her deal through if it were put to the people. I reckon enough MPs would vote for that. May's deal or remain. Ah, but then that'd have to be a legally binding referendum. Which parliament would need to vote for. Which they wouldn't. Brexiteers would be terrified of a binding Remain. Remainers would be terrified of a binding May Deal. Edited March 12, 2019 by Cade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Cade said: Ah, but then that'd have to be a legally binding referendum. Which parliament would need to vote for. Which they wouldn't. What, like the original one? Why does it have to b e legally binding? Not related, but I really wanted to post this pic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Ian Blackford just ripped the PM and the Tory party to shreds . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 25 minutes ago, Boris said: What, like the original one? Why does it have to b e legally binding? Not related, but I really wanted to post this pic... Ha ha. On the Brexit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Andrea Leadsom drooling on about the possibility of a 3rd meaningful vote. This is borne purely out of her being Leader of the House and therefore the house business convener. Clinging to control to the last breath. May would go along with it. Leadsom's nose is so far out of joint at the prospect of parliament taking over that it's virtually in another postcode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig_ Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 So the ERG and DUP are basically deciding the future of our country. Great to see we're "taking back control"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 It’s a truly baffling situation. I can’t for the life of me work out what it is that Labour would propose to do which would get the backing of both the EU and the house. The ERG seem oblivious to the fact that their idea of a good deal would get voted down. May seems to have come back with the same deal and gone ‘how about it?’ This will surely have to go to a second referendum. Parliament won’t resolve this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, Craig_ said: So the ERG and DUP are basically deciding the future of our country. Great to see we're "taking back control"... They kind of aren’t though because hardly anyone is supporting this deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Craig_ said: So the ERG and DUP are basically deciding the future of our country. Great to see we're "taking back control"... That's down to the mechanisms of the glorious institution of open democracy that is Westminster Edited March 12, 2019 by Cade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, The Frenchman Returns said: What time can we expect a vote? Around 7pm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 hour ago, AlimOzturk said: Ian Blackford just ripped the PM and the Tory party to shreds . He's been brilliant all through this fiasco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughesie27 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 I've noticed over last few weeks that Sky News regularly cut back to the studio midway through Blackford's remarks in the Commons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks said no Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: Around 7pm Cheers, will watch on phone. where were you when May (maybe) finally conceded defeat? In Bensons with Sweet Caroline playing in the background Edited March 12, 2019 by The Frenchman Returns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Thor Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 What's remarkable is listening to the, mainly Tory MPs who are now wrestling with the realisation that their party is on the verge of imploding. That lying slimy ***** Johnson trumpeting on for the no deal now. Jockeying for when the Maybot gets launched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 More switchers coming out of the woodwork. This could be a bit closer than we all think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notts1874 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 6 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said: What's remarkable is listening to the, mainly Tory MPs who are now wrestling with the realisation that their party is on the verge of imploding. That lying slimy ***** Johnson trumpeting on for the no deal now. Jockeying for when the Maybot gets launched. 5 minutes ago, Cade said: More switchers coming out of the woodwork. This could be a bit closer than we all think. Sky News saying she will lose by over 100 votes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 16 minutes ago, Cade said: More switchers coming out of the woodwork. This could be a bit closer than we all think. Not enough. She's left it too late and she hasn't pitched the deal properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 20 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said: That lying slimy ***** Johnson trumpeting on for the no deal now. Jockeying for when the Maybot gets launched. Even someone with his lack of self-awareness must know that there's nothing like a majority in the House for a no-deal exit. That's a dead duck, as is May's deal. Which as far as I can see, leaves a second referendum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: Even someone with his lack of self-awareness must know that there's nothing like a majority in the House for a no-deal exit. That's a dead duck, as is May's deal. Which as far as I can see, leaves a second referendum. I genuinely have no idea what it leaves if this gets defeated other than an absolute cluster**** where no one wins. A no deal is never flying even with these charlatan *******s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 5 minutes ago, Jamboelite said: I genuinely have no idea what it leaves if this gets defeated other than an absolute cluster**** where no one wins. A no deal is never flying even with these charlatan *******s. True enough, most of the MPs seem shit scared of a second referendum too. The next logical step is an extension but since nothing is going to change with the EU, or not significantly, that will achieve nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: True enough, most of the MPs seem shit scared of a second referendum too. The next logical step is an extension but since nothing is going to change with the EU, or not significantly, that will achieve nothing. Exactly, i dont see what extending does we are still at the same impasse. Edited March 12, 2019 by Jamboelite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 It would kill me to witness May being triumphant. Not that I am so against this deal because it really is only a means to a transition period and starting point of the future relationship. It would not be all that bad because it would provide stability for 20+ months through the transition. Certainty for jobs and ongoing frictionless trade. No. It would kill me because of the way May has driven a steamroller through parliamentary process. Control freakery. Total exclusion of all others. Bribery with promises of ermine and government payroll positions. Bare faced lies. Contemptuous behaviour. Running down the clock. Menacing MPs with the revenge of their voters. Deflection of criticism on to those who have conducted themselves responsibly. A second referendum would not destroy democratic trust. May has already obliterated it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 5 minutes ago, Victorian said: No. It would kill me because of the way May has driven a steamroller through parliamentary process. Control freakery. Total exclusion of all others. Bribery with promises of ermine and government payroll positions. Bare faced lies. Contemptuous behaviour. Running down the clock. Menacing MPs with the revenge of their voters. Deflection of criticism on to those who have conducted themselves responsibly. I'm no fan of hers. But can you honestly say that any amount of co-operation across the house would have established a deal? The ERG are a nightmare. Corbyn is completely dishonest about his intentions. The Libs/SNP would never back Brexit regardless of the UK vote and the DUP are horribly right wing. I'm inclined to think that a Brexit deal relying on a majority vote in the house was an impossibility from the start. Which isn't to say she couldn't have engaged with people better but the woman has no people skills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, Victorian said: It would kill me to witness May being triumphant. Not that I am so against this deal because it really is only a means to a transition period and starting point of the future relationship. It would not be all that bad because it would provide stability for 20+ months through the transition. Certainty for jobs and ongoing frictionless trade. No. It would kill me because of the way May has driven a steamroller through parliamentary process. Control freakery. Total exclusion of all others. Bribery with promises of ermine and government payroll positions. Bare faced lies. Contemptuous behaviour. Running down the clock. Menacing MPs with the revenge of their voters. Deflection of criticism on to those who have conducted themselves responsibly. A second referendum would not destroy democratic trust. May has already obliterated it. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Just now, Jamboelite said: Agreed. Agreed too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: I'm no fan of hers. But can you honestly say that any amount of co-operation across the house would have established a deal? The ERG are a nightmare. Corbyn is completely dishonest about his intentions. The Libs/SNP would never back Brexit regardless of the UK vote and the DUP are horribly right wing. I'm inclined to think that a Brexit deal relying on a majority vote in the house was an impossibility from the start. Which isn't to say she couldn't have engaged with people better but the woman has no people skills. Yes a cross bench commission could easily have led to a more consensus laden approach to staged negotiations. Corbyn would not have driven the process. It would have marginalised the Brexit zealots instead of them having controlled the process. A critical circumstance commission, a sort of single issue parallel coalition government should have been given the mandate to enable a grown up, responsible Brexit. It absolutely could have worked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Thor Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 8 minutes ago, Victorian said: It would kill me to witness May being triumphant. Not that I am so against this deal because it really is only a means to a transition period and starting point of the future relationship. It would not be all that bad because it would provide stability for 20+ months through the transition. Certainty for jobs and ongoing frictionless trade. No. It would kill me because of the way May has driven a steamroller through parliamentary process. Control freakery. Total exclusion of all others. Bribery with promises of ermine and government payroll positions. Bare faced lies. Contemptuous behaviour. Running down the clock. Menacing MPs with the revenge of their voters. Deflection of criticism on to those who have conducted themselves responsibly. A second referendum would not destroy democratic trust. May has already obliterated it. If nothing else then I would love to see the outcome of the Tory party breaking apart. It would be a beautiful thing to behold. It's simmering away just now and I suspect it won't take a huge amount for it to erupt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 9 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: I'm no fan of hers. But can you honestly say that any amount of co-operation across the house would have established a deal? The ERG are a nightmare. Corbyn is completely dishonest about his intentions. The Libs/SNP would never back Brexit regardless of the UK vote and the DUP are horribly right wing. I'm inclined to think that a Brexit deal relying on a majority vote in the house was an impossibility from the start. Which isn't to say she couldn't have engaged with people better but the woman has no people skills. Parliament had an obvious Soft Brexit majority. Could have been simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Just now, The Mighty Thor said: If nothing else then I would love to see the outcome of the Tory party breaking apart. It would be a beautiful thing to behold. It's simmering away just now and I suspect it won't take a huge amount for it to erupt. I tend to think it will continue as it is with a tacit truce out of a collective understanding that the party as it is provides the individual MP with their seat on the gravy train. There is a huge vested interest not to rock the boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SE16 3LN Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 No Deal it is then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 5 minutes ago, Lord BJ said: How long does it take to organise a referendum? How much notice is needed for a GE? The EU won’t grant an extension to go round in circles, with the May deal. So there needs to be something definitive change of direction to grant one. It it seems to me that this is going to need to be a pretty significant extension. 12 months at least which then would tie us to European elections etc. It's faster to call a GE than to organise a referendum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Just now, SE16 3LN said: No Deal it is then Nah, there's a majority in parliament to block a No Deal situation. It's deadlock. No to may's deal. No to no deal. Both binding votes. Paralysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Thor Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Just now, SE16 3LN said: No Deal it is then As it was always intended to be. Then the fun and games really begin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 There's no clear water indications in the opinion polls regarding what the public want to happen. Every scenario will have little popularity. My current most likely next stage is general election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costanza Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 No deal still a likely option here even if they vote against it with blame attributed to the EU. Playing with people's livelihoods because of that is an absolute disgrace. The government are in a pickle as an extension means taking part in the European elections which they don't want but have to otherwise a legal nigtmare. The safest way out of this is another referendum but that's apparently anti democratic. What a total clusterf*** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Vote margin? I was 100 off last time. Going 100 this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redjambo Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Victorian said: Vote margin? I was 100 off last time. Going 100 this time. I'll go 190. Edited March 12, 2019 by redjambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 170 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 12 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said: No Deal it is then But it wont be as no one wants it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 125 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Thor Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 And they're off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redjambo Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Jamboelite said: But it wont be as no one wants it. Some do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 23 minutes ago, Lord BJ said: How long does it take to organise a referendum? How much notice is needed for a GE? The EU won’t grant an extension to go round in circles, with the May deal. So there needs to be something definitive change of direction to grant one. It it seems to me that this is going to need to be a pretty significant extension. 12 months at least which then would tie us to European elections etc. Referendum chat was 6 months but that had a fair amount of scope in it depensing on who was saying it based on their agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, redjambo said: Some do. But not enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 There are not enough no deal lunatics to force a no deal. There is a clear majority in the house to rule out no deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redjambo Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Just now, Jamboelite said: But not enough. Fortunately. The tail often wags the dog in politics though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Forecast to be carnage for her again. Nae joy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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