General Election

[Pans Jambo]

To be honest I ignored your question as it was so poorly worded that it wasn't 100 % clear what you meant. Assuming you we're asking if I'm happy about policies which target the vulnerable - my answer us no. Equally I'm not happy that the SNP claim to be protecting Scotland but I see little evidence to back this up - particularly looking at the latest education ratings.

I'm no Tory btw - but bash on with your assumptions. I'm quite happy to question the record of any of the political parties - I find myself questioning the SNP more and more given that their own supporters (and most independence supporters in general) seem unwilling to address their record openly.

OK Doogz. Likewise, I'm not a rabid SNP supporter...only thing is, there is no alternative up here until we get Indy (IMO of course). All the other parties (except the Greens) have had their chance to make a real difference since devolution and only ever read from the Westminster script. Nothing seems to be changing on that front from the Unionist parties. Hence I will vote for the party with the best chance to deliver Independence (although this thread isn't about that is it).

[Sraman]

So they're not going to abolish because of something the Tories may do ? This again would make me question the SNPs claim that they'll protect Scotland from Tory austerity.

 

 

They already are. The point you are discussing is the bedroom tax where Scots, in that predicament, are saving ?15.22 per month as opposed to those in a similar situation in the rUK. Add in ?8.10 for a monthly prescription and you are ?23.32 better off than your counterparts in rUK. If giving our people extra cash in their pockets isn't going some way to protecting Scotland from Tory austerity what is?

[Space Mackerel]

Ok Space Cadet - how do you bridge the deficit, set up a central bank to replace the BOE, cut your ties with the rest of the UK, and not have a huge recession requiring austerity measures?

 

The answer is the SNP won't tell us because they don't want people to break their fantasy.

This has utterly nothing to do with the GE. It's another argument for another day.

 

 

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[reaths17]

This has utterly nothing to do with the GE. It's another argument for another day.

 

 

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without the evasive manoeuvre, in other words you mean, you havn't a clue

[Doogz]

OK Doogz. Likewise, I'm not a rabid SNP supporter...only thing is, there is no alternative up here until we get Indy (IMO of course). All the other parties (except the Greens) have had their chance to make a real difference since devolution and only ever read from the Westminster script. Nothing seems to be changing on that front from the Unionist parties. Hence I will vote for the party with the best chance to deliver Independence (although this thread isn't about that is it).

The thing is the SNP ( or any other Independence Party) seem to struggle to define how independence will improve things in Scotland. I'm not fundamentally against it - I just want a clear explanation of how we will be better off and how this will be achieved. Given all the uncertainty around Brexit the last thing I want is the country to take another leap into the unknown just hoping everything will be okay. The SNP aren't in a position to change anything at Westminster - so to me it looks as if Independence would be the main reason people will vote for them. As unrealistic as it seems for Labour to win at the GE they still seem a better option to me to have some influence at Westminster. The SNP should focus on using all the powers available to them at Holyrood - not only to protect the Scottish people from the Tories as per their campaign, but also because this would make the best case for independence and also offer the country the smoothest possible transition to Indy.

[frankblack]

without the evasive manoeuvre, in other words you mean, you havn't a clue

 

Yip.  Thats how I read it.

[Maroon Sailor]

Yip.  Thats how I read it.

Space Sturgeon needs more time to find something on the web to reply to it.

 

Too busy searching frantically for things for the Manchester Arena thread that has an anti U.K angle

[jambo lodge]

This has utterly nothing to do with the GE. It's another argument for another day.

 

 

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Haha, it has everything to do with the Scottish National Party whose sole purpose in life is to make Scotland independent.

[Space Mackerel]

Space Sturgeon needs more time to find something on the web to reply to it.

 

Too busy searching frantically for things for the Manchester Arena thread that has an anti U.K angle

Anti UK? What a load of tripe!

 

I'm anti bullshit in the media. Big difference.

[Rudy T]

This has utterly nothing to do with the GE. It's another argument for another day.

 

 

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Spacey thinks the GE has nothing to do with indy....now that's funny.

 

Spacey here is the thinking of a large majority of people in Scotland. Vote SNP you're voting for indyref2. Vote a unionist party and it's a warning shot to the snp you don't want indyref2. Let's not be deliberately naive here.

[Space Mackerel]

Spacey thinks the GE has nothing to do with indy....now that's funny.

 

Spacey here is the thinking of a large majority of people in Scotland. Vote SNP you're voting for indyref2. Vote a unionist party and it's a warning shot to the snp you don't want indyref2. Let's not be deliberately naive here.

The Section 30 Order has been sent, there will be a referendum.

8 Tory MP's isn't going to stop it.

[Doogz]

If it means people will be worse off, thanks to the Tories cutting benefits elsewhere, then of course they won't abolish it. That seems sensible to me.

Sorry - only just noticed your reply. It's the usual thing for me with the SNP ie blaming the Tories (on this occasion for something they haven't even done yet and probably won't IMHO).

I'd have preferred the SNP to abolish it all together (with cross-party support from all but the Tories). The risk of the Tories at westminster changing policy to undermine the SNP on this is minimal in my opinion - and if they did then its another genuine stick for the SNP to hit the Tories with, plus it would show the SNP actually using the powers they have available at Holyrood .... and if people were to be worse off after then they could raise taxes to mitigate this while still blaming the Tories. Seems like a no-lose situation to me.

[JamboX2]

The thing is the SNP ( or any other Independence Party) seem to struggle to define how independence will improve things in Scotland. I'm not fundamentally against it - I just want a clear explanation of how we will be better off and how this will be achieved. Given all the uncertainty around Brexit the last thing I want is the country to take another leap into the unknown just hoping everything will be okay. The SNP aren't in a position to change anything at Westminster - so to me it looks as if Independence would be the main reason people will vote for them. As unrealistic as it seems for Labour to win at the GE they still seem a better option to me to have some influence at Westminster. The SNP should focus on using all the powers available to them at Holyrood - not only to protect the Scottish people from the Tories as per their campaign, but also because this would make the best case for independence and also offer the country the smoothest possible transition to Indy.

 

If the SNP use their powers to build the nation they'd like to see then folk could back indy. By not they're doing little good for anyone.

 

Build it and they'll come would be a better place for their indy aims.

[Pans Jambo]

 

If the SNP use their powers to build the nation they'd like to see then folk could back indy. By not they're doing little good for anyone.

 

Build it and they'll come would be a better place for their indy aims.

Unyet if it was all sweetness and light then folk would say theres no need for Indy.

Damned if you do..,

[Doogz]

Unyet if it was all sweetness and light then folk would say theres no need for Indy.

Damned if you do..,

Are you suggesting they could improve things now but are holding off to push for Independence ?

[Sraman]

Are you suggesting they could improve things now but are holding off to push for Independence ?

 

 

No he isn't. He's suggesting that folks like you told us we would be better together but are now telling us we must pay more in order to be better together. 

 

I support Independence for Scotland and would be happy to pay more to build a Scotland for Scotland but there is no way I am going to pay more to be better together.

[Rudy T]

The Section 30 Order has been sent, there will be a referendum.

8 Tory MP's isn't going to stop it.

Oh spacey you don't believe if the SNPs majority falls they won't think twice about indyref2?

[Doogz]

No he isn't. He's suggesting that folks like you told us we would be better together but are now telling us we must pay more in order to be better together.

 

I support Independence for Scotland and would be happy to pay more to build a Scotland for Scotland but there is no way I am going to pay more to be better together.

That seems a strange interpretation of his post. But i do love the way you try an sell me on this positive vision you have for an independent Scotland - What happens to folk like me in your future version of Scotland ? What is our crime - asking a few questions ? Not being Scottish enough ?

[Maroon Sailor]

No he isn't. He's suggesting that folks like you told us we would be better together but are now telling us we must pay more in order to be better together. 

 

I support Independence for Scotland and would be happy to pay more to build a Scotland for Scotland but there is no way I am going to pay more to be better together.

There will never be a Scotland for Scotland under wee nippy

[deesidejambo]

Unyet if it was all sweetness and light then folk would say theres no need for Indy.

Damned if you do..,

 

This is a dilemma they face.

 

To get Indy they need to show things are bad.  But they have control over a lot of areas where they could make things better.   If they do, and Scots are increasingly happy with the situation, then they dilute the need for full Indy.

 

Also at Westminster -they push for the best deal for Scotland, and again if they deliver on that then some, like me, are happy with that, so why throw that away?

 

So its in the SNPs interests to not improve things.

[frankblack]

Desperation gutter tactics by the nats in Edinburgh West.

 

A leaflet through the door trying to smear Edinburgh West Lib Dem MSP Alex Cole Hamilton with misleading accusations. Looks like they are seriously scared of losing to the Lib Dems.

 

LIB DEMS IN

CHAOS

 

Police investigate Lib Dem MSP over expenses

 

He was cleared last year - unlike the SNP Edinburgh West MSP who was deselected for this election alongside a Glasgow SNP MP.

 

EXPOSED Lib Dem Geberal Election candidate has stood for election all over Scotland - each time posing as a "local candidate".

 

I fail to see the point here. Surely someone working at Westminster hardly needs to be born and bred in their constituency?

 

Lib Dems responsible for ?2.3 billion wortg of cuts to Scotland.

 

Ah the grievance card again from the SNP. Blame Westminster to deflect your own party's failure in devolved government.

 

The Lib Dems have this seat in the bag.

[Space Mackerel]

Oh spacey you don't believe if the SNPs majority falls they won't think twice about indyref2?

I'm sure it will fall due to tactical voting. It'll still be a landslide win so don't even bother dressing it up as anything else but this on the 8th.

[Space Mackerel]

There will never be a Scotland for Scotland under wee nippy

Are you gonna sail your wee fully armed Topper up the Forth?

[Maroon Sailor]

This is a dilemma they face.

 

To get Indy they need to show things are bad.  But they have control over a lot of areas where they could make things better.   If they do, and Scots are increasingly happy with the situation, then they dilute the need for full Indy.

 

Also at Westminster -they push for the best deal for Scotland, and again if they deliver on that then some, like me, are happy with that, so why throw that away?

 

So its in the SNPs interests to not improve things.

This is the bottom line. Selfish Numpty Party

[Sraman]

That seems a strange interpretation of his post. But i do love the way you try an sell me on this positive vision you have for an independent Scotland - What happens to folk like me in your future version of Scotland ? What is our crime - asking a few questions ? Not being Scottish enough ?

 

I merely pointed out that we are living the life you voted for, you won, this is the better together you wanted but all you do is moan about it and I never called you a criminal for voting the way you did, in fact I'm glad you voted and actually used your democratic right, far too many fail to do so. I also never proffered a vision of an Independent Scotland, I merely stated that I, personally, was willing to pay extra to improve an Independent Scotland but wasn't willing to pay more than the rUK whilst we are still in the Union, i.e. whilst we are "better together" that, after all, was the promise was it not?. Maybe it's a trust thing, I don't know?

 

Anyway, enough of the independence nonsense that's for another day. This is a General Election thread and Independence isn't on the agenda, fox hunting and coal mining on the other hand.

[Rudy T]

I'm sure it will fall due to tactical voting. It'll still be a landslide win so don't even bother dressing it up as anything else but this on the 8th.

Tactical voting....why is there tactical voting going on????

[Space Mackerel]

Tactical voting....why is there tactical voting going on????

Because Ruth, Kezia and Willie are up here campaigning at the bequest of their London masters.

[Rudy T]

Because Ruth, Kezia and Willie are up here campaigning at the bequest of their London masters.

Good effort....why are people voting tactically???

[Space Mackerel]

Good effort....why are people voting tactically???

Because you're Yoons and that triumphs over everything.

 

Anyway, 0.2 growth, TM is going to have a serious challenge on her hands to deliver her policies, and Brexit is on the horizon.

[Doogz]

I merely pointed out that we are living the life you voted for, you won, this is the better together you wanted but all you do is moan about it and I never called you a criminal for voting the way you did, in fact I'm glad you voted and actually used your democratic right, far too many fail to do so. I also never proffered a vision of an Independent Scotland, I merely stated that I, personally, was willing to pay extra to improve an Independent Scotland but wasn't willing to pay more than the rUK whilst we are still in the Union, i.e. whilst we are "better together" that, after all, was the promise was it not?. Maybe it's a trust thing, I don't know?

 

Anyway, enough of the independence nonsense that's for another day. This is a General Election thread and Independence isn't on the agenda, fox hunting and coal mining on the other hand.

All you have done is made a bunch of baseless assumptions about folk like me - how do you know how I voted, where have I ever said we are better together or that we now need to pay more to be better together ? All I've done is ask how we will be better once we are independent and how this will be achieved ? If you are so confident that its the right thing for the country you would explain why rather than resorting to empty rhetoric and insulting language.

[Rudy T]

Because you're Yoons and that triumphs over everything.

 

Anyway, 0.2 growth, TM is going to have a serious challenge on her hands to deliver her policies, and Brexit is on the horizon.

Deary me....long live an undivided harmonious independent Scotland..with the Nats and the Yoons. Absolute sadsack

[Space Mackerel]

Deary me....long live an undivided harmonious independent Scotland..with the Nats and the Yoons. Absolute sadsack

That 0.2% must have got to you.

Let's keep the GE thread about the GE coming up.

 

Sure and stable posting please. [emoji106]

[Rudy T]

That 0.2% must have got to you.

Let's keep the GE thread about the GE coming up.

 

Sure and stable posting please. [emoji106]

Listen man you should change your name to moon unit. You won't answer the question as to why there's tactical voting because you know fine well that it's all about independence. The GE in Scotland is underpinned by indyref2. The SNP are trying really hard to avoid the issue despite Sturgeon admitting it about month ago because they know they'll lose votes. Have they released their manifesto yet?

[frankblack]

That 0.2% must have got to you.

Let's keep the GE thread about the GE coming up.

 

Sure and stable posting please. [emoji106]

Isn't Scotland's economy performing worse than the rest of the UK?

 

I take it you agree its the fault of the SNP devolved government and the uncertainty caused by the threat of Indy Ref 2?

[ToadKiller Dog]

New Yougov poll to show Tory's on 43% Labour on 38%

Snp on 41% in the sub sample

http://scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/disaster-for-tories-as-up-to-date.html?m=1

[Space Mackerel]

Listen man you should change your name to moon unit. You won't answer the question as to why there's tactical voting because you know fine well that it's all about independence. The GE in Scotland is underpinned by indyref2. The SNP are trying really hard to avoid the issue despite Sturgeon admitting it about month ago because they know they'll lose votes. Have they released their manifesto yet?

The GE is about Brexit I thought, that's what TM called it for, it was on the tele, I seen it, with my eyes and ears, to deliver Sure and Stable mandate for maximum leverage against the other 27 EU leaders (as if they give a hoot)

 

You're voting like the UK has already partitioned, you're getting all excitable again.

[Ulysses]

New Yougov poll to show Tory's on 43% Labour on 38%

Snp on 41% in the sub sample

http://scotgoespop.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/disaster-for-tories-as-up-to-date.html?m=1

 

That's not all.

 

The latest Kantar Public poll shows the Conservatives leading 42-34, but a week earlier Kantar's poll showed the Tories leading by 47-29. 

 

The trend in polling is very definitely towards Labour.

[Space Mackerel]

Isn't Scotland's economy performing worse than the rest of the UK?

 

I take it you agree its the fault of the SNP devolved government and the uncertainty caused by the threat of Indy Ref 2?

Yep, completely their fault, after all, they have full control over monetary policy, tax provision and interests rates. [emoji849]

[frankblack]

The GE is about Brexit I thought, that's what TM called it for, it was on the tele, I seen it, with my eyes and ears, to deliver Sure and Stable mandate for maximum leverage against the other 27 EU leaders (as if they give a hoot)

 

You're voting like the UK has already partitioned, you're getting all excitable again.

Outwith Scotland the main issue is Brexit.

 

Inside Scotland its all about Independence and preventing it.

[frankblack]

Yep, completely their fault, after all, they have full control over monetary policy, tax provision and interests rates. [emoji849]

They have more fiscal levers than Wales and NI yet refuse to use them and still we are performing the worst.

[Space Mackerel]

Outwith Scotland the main issue is Brexit.

 

Inside Scotland its all about Independence and preventing it.

I'm more bothered about Brexit before any independence referendum.

So should you, your job or standard of living could seriously depend upon the outcome.

[ToadKiller Dog]

That's not all.

 

The latest Kantar Public poll shows the Conservatives leading 42-34, but a week earlier Kantar's poll showed the Tories leading by 47-29.

 

The trend in polling is very definitely towards Labour.

Still a mile away from Prime Minister Corbyn but may well be getting closer to hung parliament territory if it continues close .

[Rudy T]

I'm more bothered about Brexit before any independence referendum.

So should you, your job or standard of living could seriously depend upon the outcome.

So presumably you're voting lib dem then? SNP don't want to prevent it they want a seat at the table.

[frankblack]

I'm more bothered about Brexit before any independence referendum.

So should you, your job or standard of living could seriously depend upon the outcome.

Brexit is happening.

 

The uncertainty over the horizon is from the SNP who want to throw us over a cliff blindfolded with independence once Brexit has occurred.

 

Whatever the result of Brexit its going to result in a deep recession in Scotland if Indy Ref 2 is lingering.

[Bowmans_Boot]

The GE in Scotland is underpinned by indyref2. The SNP are trying really hard to avoid the issue despite Sturgeon admitting it about month ago because they know they'll lose votes. Have they released their manifesto yet?

The tories are trying extremely hard to make this GE all about independence in Scotland. Why? Because they have absolutely nothing to offer Scotland and know it.

 

The SNP are attempting to talk about other issues, rightly so, as that is not what it is about. It is about what is best for the country at this point in time.

 

The SNP manifesto was to be launched this week but this was rightly delayed due to the terrorist attack in Manchester. Having a dig at them for this is pretty low, Rudy.

[Roxy Hearts]

How do you make a decision on who to vote for then?

 

Election material I've recieved has backed my belief that the Tories and Labour are useless.

A previous poster assumed I was a SNP member or alluded to it which I'm not. They are the only truly Scottish party so get my vote.

[Space Mackerel]

Brexit is happening.

 

The uncertainty over the horizon is from the SNP who want to throw us over a cliff blindfolded with independence once Brexit has occurred.

 

Whatever the result of Brexit its going to result in a deep recession in Scotland if Indy Ref 2 is lingering.

Aye, ok Mystic Meg.

I'd say Brexit has a 50/50 chance of happening. Wait till the spin starts from TM (who was a Remainer btw) and says it's not worth it.

[Roxy Hearts]

 

If the SNP use their powers to build the nation they'd like to see then folk could back indy. By not they're doing little good for anyone.

 

Build it and they'll come would be a better place for their indy aims.

Doing little good for anyone.So who is?

[Space Mackerel]

Still a mile away from Prime Minister Corbyn but may well be getting closer to hung parliament territory if it continues close .

Chancellor Angus Robertson has a nice ring to it.

[Cruyff Turn]

Brexit is happening.

 

The uncertainty over the horizon is from the SNP who want to throw us over a cliff blindfolded with independence once Brexit has occurred.

 

Whatever the result of Brexit its going to result in a deep recession in Scotland if Indy Ref 2 is lingering.

So you admit that Brexit is going to cost Scotland billions and cost tens of thousands of Jobs?