More Tory lies

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

She was being opportunistic. It's my biggest beef about her and her Government but it's what politicians do. She was trying to put daylight between hers and the UKG as were the Welsh administration. 

She is also using the rise of ugly English nationalism to further the independence cause. I don't like that either.

But at the risk of whatabootery she has done nothing to compare with that bent fascist currently in no 10 and I have seen nothing from his prospective successors that suggests they will dampen down the nasty rhetoric either.

Actually good summary . The opportunism however caused prolonged stress and upset for people as well as businesses I feel . The example being when we all but closed down at Boxing Day until mid Jan due to the supposed threat of a new variant .  It cost businesses dearly . England chose not to close down . 

[JudyJudyJudy]

20 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

But also expect to see all the leading candidates fall into the top cabinet posts.  Great,  another government made up of people who can't stand each other and are only formed together out of mutual benefit.

And that’s new ? 

[JudyJudyJudy]

18 minutes ago, Costanza said:

😅

All for heckling Johnson but Kenny McCaskill is a fecking doughnut

 

 

[Cade]

"The country is in a right old state, but it's nothing to do with us. We've only been in power for twelve years. Vote for us and we'll sort it out."

 

[Unknown user]

9 minutes ago, Cade said:

"The country is in a right old state, but it's nothing to do with us. We've only been in power for twelve years. Vote for us and we'll sort it out."

 

"Oh, and remainers are stealing your Brexit"

[i wish jj was my dad]

39 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

Actually good summary . The opportunism however caused prolonged stress and upset for people as well as businesses I feel . The example being when we all but closed down at Boxing Day until mid Jan due to the supposed threat of a new variant .  It cost businesses dearly . England chose not to close down . 

I'm not going to defend her approach. I think she was over cautious and that caused harm but fwiw I think she made an honest bit wrong call over that Xmas. She knew it was unpopular but she still made the call knowing that. I find that hard to criticise in terms of honesty.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

5 hours ago, Ked said:

It's a complex issue no doubt.

And I think it's disingenuous to say women are "panicking " because they want their safe space.

We had the recent rape crisis scenario where a man identifying as a woman sat in meetings whilst dressed as a man.

I also note the language you use of "you lot" sees you have little time or empathy for safe space for women .

Who are overwhelmingly more likely to fall victim to violence by men sexual or otherwise.

 

What is entirely missing from this entire sorry and destructive conversation is any evidence that allowing trans women to pee in the women's loo increases the likelihood of sexual assault. The implication is that by allowing someone with a Y chromosome who has or maybe even used to have a cock and balls into the space, that that person is an imminent danger to women.

 

What every bit of reasonably sourced evidence I've seen shows is that yes, you can find one-off cases where a trans woman actually assaults another woman, but it's about as rare as women sexually assaulting other women (which is also rare but does happen from time to time). Far more often although still rare, you have someone who isn't actually trans but is just a sexual predator, and puts on women's clothes to facilitate the assault. What is far, far more likely is that a cis man doesn't bother with any of that but just sexually assaults women he knows, or a man like Boris Johnson uses his position of authority to manipulate women into feeling like they have to have sex with him, and none of this trans panic does a goddamn thing about.

 

I have every bit of sympathy for women wanting safe spaces, and every person I know who actually works with rape survivors, abused women, and women who are stalked is that this trans panic is total bullshit and a smokescreen for the ways in which women are actually endangered every day. And I believe them a lot more than I believe J K Rowling.

 

Meanwhile, the "safe spaces" chat is heaping even more stigma onto trans teens who are killing themselves. So yes, "you lot" (by which I mean you, a dude, making a fuss over "safe spaces" for women based on no evidence) are actively creating conditions that kill kids over nothing. And it is ****ing revolting and I will condemn it without sympathy for your sorry-ass feelings.

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

The implication is that by allowing someone with a Y chromosome who has or maybe even used to have a cock and balls into the space, that that person is an imminent danger to women.

Its about being sensitive and empathic to biological women's feelings ,  perceptions and views about these areas where trans people want to infiltrate for their own reasons...which are numerous.  Anyway IM not getting into a big argument yet again about this but when you are posting nonsense like this you need challenged. If you want to discus the trans issue create a new thread about it or post on this one.

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

24 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

I'm not going to defend her approach. I think she was over cautious and that caused harm but fwiw I think she made an honest bit wrong call over that Xmas. She knew it was unpopular but she still made the call knowing that. I find that hard to criticise in terms of honesty.

" over cautious " or " anything to be different from Boris " ...now thats the question. 

[i wish jj was my dad]

3 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

" over cautious " or " anything to be different from Boris " ...now thats the question. 

Over cautious for the example you offered. Why would she take a decision she knew would piss 90% of people off? 

I think she was wrong but unlike him she didn't bow to populism or try to please the daily nazi. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Over cautious for the example you offered. Why would she take a decision she knew would piss 90% of people off? 

I think she was wrong but unlike him she didn't bow to populism or try to please the daily nazi. 

To be different from Boris. To create rancour and division.  To play to her manic mob.  Anyway this was all noted and argued on the covid thread ages ago. Old news. 

[jamboy1982]

3 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

" over cautious " or " anything to be different from Boris " ...now thats the question. 

It’s a bit rich to be slagging off sturgeon over her handling of Covid. She rightly took a cautious approach which was backed up by the figures. Her handling of the Covid situation was far superior to boris despite his attempts to rewrite history by telling us all ‘he got us through Covid’ and ‘he got all the big decision right’. 
 

He made decisions based on pressure from his backbenchers and against all the scientific evidence. From the very start until the present day he made an arse of it. He tries to take credit for the furlough scheme, but look back on their original proposal which was to provide funding of about £25 million. It was pressure for outside his government that led to a real scheme being set up. A scheme that they heralded but was actually worse than a lot of nations of similar standing. It was also a scheme that was so poorly administered that it led to wide scale abuse and theft of monies. The Scottish government was pilloried for taking a bit extra time when handing out funds but this led to much less abuse of the system. I won’t even start in the serco track and trace system. 
 

Sturgeons approach was very similar to nations all over the world, except the ones with crazy right wing leaders America, Brazil etc. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

That Suella  Braveman   is going for those people causing the financial crisis.  Yep those on the dole or the sick. Apparently there are " many unwilling and unable to work".  ^^^^ 

 

Least she against the death penalty but would press the nuclear button. She answered that with barely a blink of her eyes. 

 

Scary. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, jamboy1982 said:

It’s a bit rich to be slagging off sturgeon over her handling of Covid. She rightly took a cautious approach which was backed up by the figures. Her handling of the Covid situation was far superior to boris despite his attempts to rewrite history by telling us all ‘he got us through Covid’ and ‘he got all the big decision right’. 
 

He made decisions based on pressure from his backbenchers and against all the scientific evidence. From the very start until the present day he made an arse of it. He tries to take credit for the furlough scheme, but look back on their original proposal which was to provide funding of about £25 million. It was pressure for outside his government that led to a real scheme being set up. A scheme that they heralded but was actually worse than a lot of nations of similar standing. It was also a scheme that was so poorly administered that it led to wide scale abuse and theft of monies. The Scottish government was pilloried for taking a bit extra time when handing out funds but this led to much less abuse of the system. I won’t even start in the serco track and trace system. 
 

Sturgeons approach was very similar to nations all over the world, except the ones with crazy right wing leaders America, Brazil etc. 

Seriously......

[i wish jj was my dad]

2 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

To be different from Boris. To create rancour and division.  To play to her manic mob.  Anyway this was all noted and argued on the covid thread ages ago. Old news. 

I think you are wrong. She is lots of things but not stupid.  1982 nails it. I will leave it there. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

Just now, i wish jj was my dad said:

I think you are wrong. She is lots of things but not stupid.  1982 nails it. I will leave it there. 

yes lets not derail the thread about this topic too..:) 

[Mikey1874]

7 minutes ago, jamboy1982 said:

It’s a bit rich to be slagging off sturgeon over her handling of Covid. She rightly took a cautious approach which was backed up by the figures. Her handling of the Covid situation was far superior to boris despite his attempts to rewrite history by telling us all ‘he got us through Covid’ and ‘he got all the big decision right’. 
 

He made decisions based on pressure from his backbenchers and against all the scientific evidence. From the very start until the present day he made an arse of it. He tries to take credit for the furlough scheme, but look back on their original proposal which was to provide funding of about £25 million. It was pressure for outside his government that led to a real scheme being set up. A scheme that they heralded but was actually worse than a lot of nations of similar standing. It was also a scheme that was so poorly administered that it led to wide scale abuse and theft of monies. The Scottish government was pilloried for taking a bit extra time when handing out funds but this led to much less abuse of the system. I won’t even start in the serco track and trace system. 
 

Sturgeons approach was very similar to nations all over the world, except the ones with crazy right wing leaders America, Brazil etc. 

 

Had the same scientific advice as rest of UK as well. Including advising care on moving people out of hospital to care homes. 

 

Sturgeon says she was limited due to lack of financial powers so mainly limited by availability of benefits and furlough at doing anything radically different.

 

Held the line on things like working from home and mask wearing as long as possible.

Edited July 13, 2022 by Mikey1874

[Victorian]

Keep Brexit Done*

 

* not like.. get it done.  Just keep the illusion done.  Not made like.. less done than it is.. or isn't.

[JudyJudyJudy]

4 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Had the same scientific advice as rest of UK as well. Including advising care on moving people out of hospital to care homes. 

 

Sturgeon says she was limited due to lack of financial powers so mainly limited by availability of benefits and furlough. 

She would have kept us on furlough forever really.  Thank god Rishi gave her a knockback regarding that issue. 

[jamboy1982]

2 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Had the same scientific advice as rest of UK as well. Including advising care on moving people out of hospital to care homes. 

 

Sturgeon says she was limited due to lack of financial powers so mainly limited by availability of benefits and furlough. 

I remember listening to first ministers questions when the transfer of patients from hospital to care homes was happening. FMQs was strange for a few weeks as all sides were quite supportive of each other rathe than the usual squabbling. The tories, led by the red faced guy, we’re all congratulating sturgeon on the pace of transferring patients. This all happened when people had little idea of symptomless Covid patients and there was very little testing capacity in place. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

19 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

Its about being sensitive and empathic to biological women's feelings ,  perceptions and views about these areas where trans people want to infiltrate for their own reasons...which are numerous.  Anyway IM not getting into a big argument yet again about this but when you are posting nonsense like this you need challenged. If you want to discus the trans issue create a new thread about it or post on this one.

 

 

 

That thread is so thick with your toxic nonsense that I have no intention of darkening my day by wading into it, but once again you are talking about "being sensitive" while killing kids. **** off.

[Mikey1874]

8 minutes ago, jamboy1982 said:

I remember listening to first ministers questions when the transfer of patients from hospital to care homes was happening. FMQs was strange for a few weeks as all sides were quite supportive of each other rathe than the usual squabbling. The tories, led by the red faced guy, we’re all congratulating sturgeon on the pace of transferring patients. This all happened when people had little idea of symptomless Covid patients and there was very little testing capacity in place. 

 

This is the key area of scrutiny ultimately.

 

The information on a asymptomatic transmission was available as early as January 2020 and certainly by March 2020 and that has been published but perhaps conflicting information and pressures made the decision making more tricky.

 

The focus on the situation within hospitals seems to have guided decision making. 

 

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Mikey1874

[JudyJudyJudy]

22 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

 

That thread is so thick with your toxic nonsense that I have no intention of darkening my day by wading into it, but once again you are talking about "being sensitive" while killing kids. **** off.

and i thought i was a drama queen..." killing kids." what an absolute load of bollocks.  Kids are being counselling out of their sexual orientation  and identity by nutters and then thinking they are trans...its an epidemic.  Then those " kids " become adults who bitterly regret that no one was actually listening to them.  Pity as they are then c%%%  less and their lives ruined. Id say no more. You are off the scale. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

Just now, JudyJudyJudy said:

and i thought i was a drama queen..." killing kids." what an absolute load of bollocks.  Kids are being counselling out of their sexual orientation  and identity by nutters and then thinking they are trans...its an epidemic.  Then those " kids " become adults who bitterly regret that no one was actually listening to them.  Pity as they are then c%%%  less and their lives ruined. Id say no more. You are off the scale. 

 

Mate unlike you I provided evidence to back up my claims. Trans kids' suicide rates are appalling. Every study that tries to find out why points to stigma. You're heaping on stigma.

 

It's based in evidence in the highest peer reviewed medical journals and released by the National Institutes of Health. Stigma kills trans kids.

[JudyJudyJudy]

4 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

Trans kids' suicide rates are appalling. Every study that tries to find out why points to stigma. You're heaping on stigma.

due to not being able to discuss whether they are trans or just old fashioned gay or lesbian  with medical professionals 

[Victorian]

Tory lies then...

[JudyJudyJudy]

11 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

 

Mate unlike you I provided evidence to back up my claims. Trans kids' suicide rates are appalling. Every study that tries to find out why points to stigma. You're heaping on stigma.

 

It's based in evidence in the highest peer reviewed medical journals and released by the National Institutes of Health. Stigma kills trans kids.

 

Teenagers contemplating suicide .  Nothing new there

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by JudyJudyJudy

[Ked]

1 hour ago, Led Tasso said:

 

What is entirely missing from this entire sorry and destructive conversation is any evidence that allowing trans women to pee in the women's loo increases the likelihood of sexual assault. The implication is that by allowing someone with a Y chromosome who has or maybe even used to have a cock and balls into the space, that that person is an imminent danger to women.

 

What every bit of reasonably sourced evidence I've seen shows is that yes, you can find one-off cases where a trans woman actually assaults another woman, but it's about as rare as women sexually assaulting other women (which is also rare but does happen from time to time). Far more often although still rare, you have someone who isn't actually trans but is just a sexual predator, and puts on women's clothes to facilitate the assault. What is far, far more likely is that a cis man doesn't bother with any of that but just sexually assaults women he knows, or a man like Boris Johnson uses his position of authority to manipulate women into feeling like they have to have sex with him, and none of this trans panic does a goddamn thing about.

 

I have every bit of sympathy for women wanting safe spaces, and every person I know who actually works with rape survivors, abused women, and women who are stalked is that this trans panic is total bullshit and a smokescreen for the ways in which women are actually endangered every day. And I believe them a lot more than I believe J K Rowling.

 

Meanwhile, the "safe spaces" chat is heaping even more stigma onto trans teens who are killing themselves. So yes, "you lot" (by which I mean you, a dude, making a fuss over "safe spaces" for women based on no evidence) are actively creating conditions that kill kids over nothing. And it is ****ing revolting and I will condemn it without sympathy for your sorry-ass feelings.

It's not my feelings you should consider.Please provide evidence of any sort which shows women are comfortable sharing safe spaces.

Because as far as I can make out any women who have concerns or groups have concerns they are either hounded like jk Rowling whose views you happily dismiss or they are refereed to as TERFS.

As for your assertion that taking the view that women who wish safe spaces away from adult men who identify as women as being responsible for the death of children is the kind of screaming panic bullshit that doesn't allow for debate.

Personally I couldn't care less if a man or women decides to be who they want to be.

But I do not think one person's rights should infringe another's.

Judy has this subject as something he obviously thinks about so what.

We all have su jects that we do.

To label him or anyone else the way you try to shows your intolerance .

Trans issues right now as far as I can see means it's now turned into a political thing instead of a psychological or medical matter.

The recent fiasco of children being given life changing drugs now sees enough numbers of them regretting it to call a halt .

It's a complex issue so please stop ranting and accusing people of causing the death of children.

 

[Spitonastranger]

5 hours ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

aye to be fair to her she was able to stand her ground with Sturgeon at Hollyrood. 

She was never able to stand her ground, part of the reason she scuttled down south to sit in the house of lords, more tory lies 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, Ked said:

It's not my feelings you should consider.Please provide evidence of any sort which shows women are comfortable sharing safe spaces.

Because as far as I can make out any women who have concerns or groups have concerns they are either hounded like jk Rowling whose views you happily dismiss or they are refereed to as TERFS.

As for your assertion that taking the view that women who wish safe spaces away from adult men who identify as women as being responsible for the death of children is the kind of screaming panic bullshit that doesn't allow for debate.

Personally I couldn't care less if a man or women decides to be who they want to be.

But I do not think one person's rights should infringe another's.

Judy has this subject as something he obviously thinks about so what.

We all have su jects that we do.

To label him or anyone else the way you try to shows your intolerance .

Trans issues right now as far as I can see means it's now turned into a political thing instead of a psychological or medical matter.

The recent fiasco of children being given life changing drugs now sees enough numbers of them regretting it to call a halt .

It's a complex issue so please stop ranting and accusing people of causing the death of children.

 

[Cade]

How can anyone "keep Brexit done" when the UK Government has refused to fully implement Brexit?

 

The EU is on the verge of taking legal action because the UK is dragging it's heels on transition periods.

If Brexit is so great, bloody do it.

Have some balls.

Own it.

 

[The Mighty Thor]

Can we take the minge fringe issue to **** please?

 

Start a thread and knock seven shades of metaphorical out of each other. 

 

This is not the thread for it.

 

Thanks.

 

Thor

He/His

Man replete with cock and balls. 

[Japan Jambo]

43 minutes ago, Victorian said:

Tory lies then...

 

Wrong thread (I think)

[Unknown user]

Smithee, They/Them, I'll get it cut off then pull James and treat him dreadfully.

[XB52]

37 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Can we take the minge fringe issue to **** please?

 

Start a thread and knock seven shades of metaphorical out of each other. 

 

This is not the thread for it.

 

Thanks.

 

Thor

He/His

Man replete with cock and balls. 

He started a thread on it but that wasn't enough for him so he posts his crap on every bloody thread 

[JudyJudyJudy]

41 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Can we take the minge fringe issue to **** please?

 

Start a thread and knock seven shades of metaphorical out of each other. 

 

This is not the thread for it.

 

Thanks.

 

Thor

He/His

Man replete with cock and balls. 

I have directed the debaters to the other thread.

 

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

36 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Smithee, They/Them, I'll get it cut off then pull James and treat him dreadfully.

OOOOOOO 

 

NO im old fashioned I do like a man with a ^^^^   😁

 

" treat him dreadfully."  ? join a long list of them who have   bit of excitement really  

 

Judy/ James 

 

No pronouns. 

[Unknown user]

Just now, JudyJudyJudy said:

OOOOOOO 

 

NO im old fashioned I do like a man with a ^^^^   😁

 

" treat him dreadfully."  ? join a long list of them who have   bit of excitement really  

 

Judy/ James 

 

No pronouns. 

 

Ah who am I kidding, I'll get dumped and greet, and have no dick.

[Victorian]

Hear hear.

 

Victorian (identifying as an octopus).

[Mikey1874]

Can the MPs stop Mordaunt?

 

 

[manaliveits105]

Mon Penny 

[Victorian]

To be quite honest,  every one of them will be horrific or just a continuation of the same Tory shitehawkery.  Simply as a bit of damage limitation and to keep the blood pressure down a notch,  it seems desirable to 'settle' for one of the more intelligent or normal types.  Tugendhat is most likeable but Mordaunt would do as someone with a brain.  Truss or Blabbermooth would end me.

[Mikey1874]

 

[Mikey1874]

4 more rounds of voting needed to get to final 2.

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

4 more rounds of voting needed to get to final 2.

Sounds like “ Britains got no talent “ to me 

[JudyJudyJudy]

26 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Ah who am I kidding, I'll get dumped and greet, and have no dick.

😂😎

[RobboM]

22 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Can the MPs stop Mordaunt?

 

 

It's to her benefit (at the moment at least) that being out of Johnson's toxic cabinet means she has far less recognition as a real ***** compared to the other *****
 

 

[Costanza]

Mordaunt you would think will be the favourite. That trans dog whistling has certainly helped her.

Sunaks backers nmght try and lend votes to knock her out as she would likely beat him with the membership.

Think the Tories have missed a trick here by not employing a first past the post vote to ensure a strong and stable election.

 

[Victorian]

In the event of not winning,  Truss is toast as Foreign Secretary anyway.  Sunak wouldn't likely be interested in returning as CotE.  Those two are all in.  The other candidates all stand a good chance of a cabinet position and maybe one of the big jobs if they strategise well and migrate to one of the main three candidates.  The strategising and trading will be furious right now.  

[Japan Jambo]

17 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

I'm not sure what depresses me more - that 32 two people voted for Suella or that 50 think Truss could do the job.