Youth Cup Final; Hearts v Motherwell.

[Martin_T]

2 years under Levein and we are still waiting, no sign of that type of player tonight either.

 

Wide men, ball winning central midfielders are what we have/get, sometimes we will play someone to play off the forward.

 

Where is this midfielder who will collect the ball and drive into the box centrally? Djuam about the closest we have and that is stretching it.

 

Basically the same tactics that are employed by Leicester City in romping home with the English Premier League.

[socrates82]

Pretty stupid to set all your teams up to play a way not suited to these players.

 

Pretty stupid to set up all your teams to play one way only.

 

Pretty stupid to bring in up and coming coaches and then try and change them.

 

Not going to take too much for opposition managers to work us out if we are set up to play one way.

 

The way Robbo talked, it will make no odds who the manager is, Neilson (who I don't want sacked btw) or AN Other will have to adopt the Levein way. Don't dare try and bring in other ideas you think may suit the players at your disposal, that is not part of the plan.

 

I'm all for having a continuity between the age groups etc but there has to be flexibility and we are not seeing much of that.

 

We have played better this season when being in other teams faces, taking the game to opposition (very rarely from the start of a game but sometimes when chasing a game), the players look happier playing this way and the fans seem to enjoy it more but we always end up back to square one in the next match playing the way all our teams have been taught to play.

 

To be fair Ajax do the same and they are recognized as the best youth football model out there.

[FarmerTweedy]

2 years under Levein and we are still waiting, no sign of that type of player tonight either.

Wide men, ball winning central midfielders are what we have/get, sometimes we will play someone to play off the forward.

Where is this midfielder who will collect the ball and drive into the box centrally? Djuam about the closest we have and that is stretching it.

Maybe the right player hasn't been available in our budget. Maybe we've tried to sign a few but they've chosen to go to other clubs. It's less than two years since we exited admin, it's utterly laughable that anyone would feel the need to condemn folk for, in that timescale, not having unearthed another player in the mould of two of our best players from the last 20 years.

 

Completely and utterly laughable.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Gambo willfully ignoring the facts as usual!

[Gambo]

Basically the same tactics that are employed by Leicester City in romping home with the English Premier League.

And that suits Leicester.

 

We are not Leicester or playing in the EPL though.

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

Basically the same tactics that are employed by Leicester City in romping home with the English Premier League.

Formation maybe. Our tactics are not like Leicester's.

[Martin_T]

Gambo willfully ignoring the facts as usual!

 

Quite how he's managed to spin a reasonably successful run in the youth cup to suit his pathetic anti-Levein agenda is anyone's guess.

 

Bizarre and slightly creepy.

[Debut 4]

Ffs, more than half these lads won't make the grade.

 

If 2 or 3 make it and that's a regular cycle every so often, then you can't complain.

 

Looking at the last couple of years we've probably over achieved with the emergence of Paterson, Holt, King, Walker, Nicholson etc....in such a short space of time, and there's definitely a few impressive players in that team tonight.

[luckyBatistuta]

Maybe the right player hasn't been available in our budget. Maybe we've tried to sign a few but they've chosen to go to other clubs. It's less than two years since we exited admin, it's utterly laughable that anyone would feel the need to condemn folk for, in that timescale, not having unearthed another player in the mould of two of our best players from the last 20 years.

Completely and utterly laughable.

Well said mate, it's like some folk would love for us to just start throwing money at players for instant success and who gives a #### about going back into debt. Some people just never learn

[Francis Albert]

Hell of a lot being taken from one youth game on this thread!!

For some, any excuse will do.

[Uncle Buck]

Well that's a disappointing result.

[socrates82]

Ffs, more than half these lads won't make the grade.

 

If 2 or 3 make it and that's a regular cycle every so often, then you can't complain.

 

Looking at the last couple of years we've probably over achieved with the emergence of Paterson, Holt, King, Walker, Nicholson etc....in such a short space of time, and there's definitely a few impressive players in that team tonight.

 

Ajax consider anything less than 2 or 3 players progressing to etc first team squad form the youth team a failure so that would be good going. We definitely seem to be focusing on ensuring younger players with potential aren't being blocked from progressing by releasing the likes of McKirdy, Mchattie and so on quickly after deciding they're not first team material.

[OTT]

I thought there were some positives to take from it.

 

Callumn Morrison (sp?) our right mid, he seemed very up for it and was taking players on.

Beith did a very good job centrally and was doing a lot of the captaining which was pleasing.

Smith played well and you can see the confidence in his play which is obviously really good.

 

I thought our leftside wasn't very strong. The left mid didn't really seem to do much and Henderson seems extremely one footed. Our goalkeeper Mason seemed to have an absolute car crash which was a bit disappointing.

 

Regardless a learning experience for all. And credit to Motherwell was really impressed with their right mid - whoever he is!

[davidkeye]

There is no doubt that these young laddies are good footballers, you don't get to clubs like Hearts by being average. But we seem to coach being a footballer out of our youngsters.

 

There is no doubt that we are coached at all age groups to play the same style as that looked as clueless as the first team have on many occasions.

 

Like the first team we have no one who can drive forward in the middle of the park.

 

A Hartley/Cameron type of player is no longer wanted at Hearts imo.

Agree with the above, not seen any u20 games in full this season, bar tonight, but having watched them quite a bit over the three seasons beforehand looks to be an element of over-coaching.

 

Worth pointing out that Motherwell traditionally and the surrounding areas has always produced technically sound players. Best team won tonight but roll-on next season where most of squad will still be eligible for u20 and hopefully we have the squad to drop 2 or 3 older heads each game to help bring them along.

 

I'd like to see the reserve league re-introduced again personally. You learn from working with experience not playing boys against boys.

[Debut 4]

Who's the lad with the white wrist bands and posture like Sir Rudolph Skacel?

 

Tidy player, in fact, I thought the midfield had good touch, weren't afraid to protect the ball until the right option was on. They never hurried it needlessly.

 

People forget this level is about developing players. Yes, they need to be winners and heavy defeats aren't great, but that'll come as the academy settles and the quality improves.

[FenderJaguar7]

Feel bad for the young lads tonight. Can only hope they learn from it and makes them more determined in the future. Decent getting to a final considering we are 11th in the dev league. Just hope we can work on a number of things in training like corners, playing balls to feet, final ball a bit better and tackling.

 

Was impressed with a number of the Motherwell players. As others have said they look and play like they've been together for years. We're really just on our way back up.

[Zico]

this ****ing thread. More shite posted here than in Frank McGarvey's letterbox.

[eckyboo]

So the lad Beith is ready to step up aye...

[Bauld]

Just in from the cold.

 

It was a decent watch from the stands. Hearts played decent pass and move football and for much of the game it was fine margins. Those fine margins are in attack, errors aside they were clinical and we were not. We split their defence on numerous occasions with some really good passing moves but nobody was there to put it in the net and nobody was willing to pull the trigger on instinct. Always looking for the next pass instead.

 

Most of all we looked lightweight. We have a few bigger guys but the development gap between 17/18 and 20 was made to look massive tonight. Motherwell looked strong, fully developed and ready for battle. Men against boys.

 

 

This summer is going to be important for our academy. We need to sign 6-7 decent 19-20 year olds to establish a proper development side and allow our U17s to be just that until they are ready.

[Mikey1874]

I'll be in a minority on here.

 

At game so didn't see half time interview. Saw couple of early season games 2-0 defeat at Dunfermline and 1-1 draw at Morherwell. Main impression was opposition fought harder and were physically stronger. Though we competed. Similar tonight though first two goals always made it harder when game was more even.

 

But there were some good signs. I'd say Hearts are being very brave in their approach. It will take time. If we carry on in say 5 years we will see the difference.

 

And we played a 14 year old sub.

[chester copperpot]

I personally thought we were very very poor at the basics tonight.

 

Something that badly needs addressed. Also thought our reaction and decision making were poor too which is a real shame as they can be worked on quite easily.

 

I wont add anymore as I am fecking freezing tnite and although a disappointing result, this is a development game so wont be losing much sleep over it!

[Maiden Gorgie]

I'll be in a minority on here.

 

At game so didn't see half time interview. Saw couple of early season games 2-0 defeat at Dunfermline and 1-1 draw at Morherwell. Main impression was opposition fought harder and were physically stronger. Though we competed. Similar tonight though first two goals always made it harder when game was more even.

 

But there were some good signs. I'd say Hearts are being very brave in their approach. It will take time. If we carry on in say 5 years we will see the difference.

 

And we played a 14 year old sub.

 

Sadly, you are in the minority. But I agree 100%

 

It's a shame that some can't see through a result and see the positives. Motherwell were physically stronger and thoroughly deserved the win, although 5-2 flattered them.

 

We got to the final and clearly sone of the lads aren't quite there yet. Some will make it, some will not but they gave everything tonight and it was a good game to watch.

[JamboJen]

Well deserved by Motherwell, hard lines to the Hearts players but we looked a bit robotic all game.

The Motherwell players did seem to have a better team bond,spirit and togetherness about them.

Guys we were gash, second best in every single department except prancing around with silly haircuts

Unfortunately I had money on us after seeing our team but they either didn't fancy it or rag are themselves as above it

I saw the last final and I honestly think we had a better squad then than now

The good thing about insane overreaction threads is that it helps unearth some of our "undercover" neighbours.

[Gambo]

Quite how he's managed to spin a reasonably successful run in the youth cup to suit his pathetic anti-Levein agenda is anyone's guess.

 

Bizarre and slightly creepy.

Nothing to do with cup run (check out their league position btw), i dont take too much notice of youth cup runs/league positions /results as imo it is all about developing at that age. Want them to do well yes, but dont get to upset over defeats.

 

Tonight though we were told what many people on here have tried to deny, that the team/club is set up to play Leveins way, it dosent matter who the coach is.

 

I love my team winning and support them through thick and thin but dont mind on fans forum with fellow Hearts fans debating merits of things happening at the club. Imo Levein/Neilson/Budge/players do great things and also get lots wrong (so do the fans when making these views, myself included) and these good/bad things can be debated, but you cannot see anything wrong with Levein whatsoever, which is creepy as im sure Levein would acknowledge some mistakes.

[Mikey1874]

Its certainly a learning

 

Hearts players will be disappointed with the performance. Hopefully the ones that really want it will use that to work even harder to improve.

 

And get back to Hampden!

[Boab]

It was freezing cold.

 

It was pretty crap from a footballing point of view.

 

It was, however, infinitely better than the bullshit posted on here on a nightly basis.

 

Unlucky , boys, you will learn from this....the Motherwell boys were decent.

[MacDonald Jardine]

Motherwell were strong favourites for the match and they are a more mature, physically stronger team and it showed.

 

People losing their shit over this match would not even be on this thread had we won tonight.

Nonsense. What's wrong with posting honest opinions about the performance and the way we played?

[Jammy T]

Gambo raging at a youth team game.

 

Ffs - chill out man.

 

We get that you hate Levein. He's here for at least another 3 years so I'd advise getting a coping mechanism.

[vesuvius]

Don't know if it's already been mentioned, but isn't it fortunate we scored our second goal!!!

V

[Boab]

Don't know if it's already been mentioned, but isn't it fortunate we scored our second goal!!!

V

 

No.

[FenderJaguar7]

Don't know if it's already been mentioned, but isn't it fortunate we scored our second goal!!!

V

In what way?

[Doc Rob]

In what way?

I assume he means avoiding a 5-1. Not that I reckon anyone would have been that fussed.

[RudiHMFC]

Hopefully we'll have learned some lessons from a properly run outfit tonight and might see a bit better in the years to come, I'd be amazed if any of them in the Hearts side make the step up apart from the 3 you could consider first team players, the goalie wants to be thinking about what career path he's going to go down, won't be football by the looks of it.

[amadjambo]

The HT piece about Motherwell's link with the local school was interesting. They even paid for there to be a football coach at the school.

[Francis Albert]

Hopefully we'll have learned some lessons from a properly run outfit tonight and might see a bit better in the years to come, I'd be amazed if any of them in the Hearts side make the step up apart from the 3 you could consider first team players, the goalie wants to be thinking about what career path he's going to go down, won't be football by the looks of it.

Sorry to be repetitive but if you are going to dismiss "the goalie"s career, the goalkeeper having achieved professional status against more than 1 in 1000 odds, couldn't you at least bother to find out his name?

[chester copperpot]

The HT piece about Motherwell's link with the local school was interesting. They even paid for there to be a football coach at the school.

Was it Dalziel high perhaps?

[jamboinglasgow]

Sadly, you are in the minority. But I agree 100%

 

It's a shame that some can't see through a result and see the positives. Motherwell were physically stronger and thoroughly deserved the win, although 5-2 flattered them.

 

We got to the final and clearly sone of the lads aren't quite there yet. Some will make it, some will not but they gave everything tonight and it was a good game to watch.

 

I agree. 

 

Having watched quite a few Under 20/19 games it was typical that for large stretches we were the dominate but just unable to get something with the final ball, while Motherwell were clinical when we made mistakes. Youth games usually show mistakes more than senior games.

 

But there was times when I thought the way we getting the ball forward was very pleasing and you could see how the team is wanting to play. But sadly we need to make the most of chances when we get them.

 

I though Zanatta was not afraid to get forward when possible, I like Baur and think with the right coaching could develop into a ball playing centre half. Though McDonald look interesting when he came on, did not realise he was only 14. I felt Beith was quieter than normal and surprised that Buchanan did not attempt more shots from outside the box because he can score from there.

 

You could see at the end how disappointed the players were at the result, I hope Daly encourages them to take that disappointment and use it to spur them on to improve and win it next year.

 

As for next season, I think again it will be small improvements on the previous as we are still suffering from under recruitment from previous years. I will be interested to see what plan the club has for recruitment for Under 20s.

[RudiHMFC]

Sorry to be repetitive but if you are going to dismiss "the goalie"s career, the goalkeeper having achieved professional status against more than 1 in 1000 odds, couldn't you at least bother to find out his name?

You're loving these odds that you're making up, are we meant to pretend he's good when he's clearly not?

[jamboinglasgow]

You're loving these odds that you're making up, are we meant to pretend he's good when he's clearly not?

 

does it matter that other matches I have seen him in that he has looked good? Or you basing it on one match?

[amadjambo]

Was it Dalziel high perhaps?

Braidhurst I think.

[disgruntledfan]

You're loving these odds that you're making up, are we meant to pretend he's good when he's clearly not?

Your a bellend lewis, hes 17 made a mistake for the first, made a save for the 3rd but it broke to them but you will know this as you were

watching it on TV and would have seen a million angles, while others were actually there watching it.

As someone said previous, hes already achieved more in football than you ever have or will, you stick to meltdows and leave the kids alone.

 

Well done to Well tonight thourghly deserved win.

[RDSK]

I think some of the criticism of Beith in this thread in a tad harsh.

 

Angus played well I thought in the first half. He covers ground quickly which is one of the main attributes Neilson and Levein look for in a central midfielder - that fact that this wasn't one of Aaron Scott's strong points is apparently one of the reasons he was let go. Second half he tired but he's played a lot of football recently in a season where he has been plagued with injury. I'm sure he can break into the first team next season. He reminds me of a younger version of the Ian Black we saw in 2011-12 who was raved about on this forum. Whilst he may not be at the level of Black at this time; the drive, passing range and potential is there for him to be a great player and a valuable asset for Hearts in years to come.

 

With McKirdy and Henderson having deals on the table from Falkirk and JHM on his way too seemingly, I'd expect a few arrivals for the 20s this summer.

[C67]

The players look unfit and both teams seriously lacking in ability. We haven't even had a shot at goal in 40 mins lol. Oh well ?20 on Motherwell to win so every cloud

just don't understand why any fan would bet against our own team would rather not have that profit in my pocket

[La_Leyenda]

I thought there were some positives to take from it.

 

Callumn Morrison (sp?) our right mid, he seemed very up for it and was taking players on.

Beith did a very good job centrally and was doing a lot of the captaining which was pleasing.

Smith played well and you can see the confidence in his play which is obviously really good.

 

I thought our leftside wasn't very strong. The left mid didn't really seem to do much and Henderson seems extremely one footed. Our goalkeeper Mason seemed to have an absolute car crash which was a bit disappointing.

 

Regardless a learning experience for all. And credit to Motherwell was really impressed with their right mid - whoever he is!

Dom Thomas. He's a quality player, already played a few games in the first team at Motherwell, criminally underused actually. Won the man of the match award tonight.

 

I was at the game and spoke to Thomas at the end. Really nice guy as well. Hopefully goes on to be the next big thing for Scotland and doesn't disappear down south or sit on Celtic's bench.

[Jamhammer]

Club is rotten from bottom to top. Only 3rd in the league and runners up in a youth cup. Sack everyone and bring back Malofeev

[Neilson's Shank]

Dom Thomas. He's a quality player, already played a few games in the first team at Motherwell, criminally underused actually. Won the man of the match award tonight.

I was at the game and spoke to Thomas at the end. Really nice guy as well. Hopefully goes on to be the next big thing for Scotland and doesn't disappear down south or sit on Celtic's bench.

Believe Dom Thomas went to Motherwell after being released by Celtic

[Joe Hearts]

Harsh lesson for the youngsters but beaten by the better team on the night, great experience playing in a national final at Hampden and hope they enjoyed it overall. They did what most only dream of.

Time to dust themselves down, use that as character building material and work hard to come back as better players. Most of them are still young enough to play in the competition next year.

[Martin_T]

Nothing to do with cup run (check out their league position btw), i dont take too much notice of youth cup runs/league positions /results as imo it is all about developing at that age. Want them to do well yes, but dont get to upset over defeats.

 

Tonight though we were told what many people on here have tried to deny, that the team/club is set up to play Leveins way, it dosent matter who the coach is.

 

I love my team winning and support them through thick and thin but dont mind on fans forum with fellow Hearts fans debating merits of things happening at the club. Imo Levein/Neilson/Budge/players do great things and also get lots wrong (so do the fans when making these views, myself included) and these good/bad things can be debated, but you cannot see anything wrong with Levein whatsoever, which is creepy as im sure Levein would acknowledge some mistakes.

First paragraph, you don't care about results at youth level but 'check out their league position'. :s

[gashauskis9]

Liked the look of Buchanan in midfield. Looks like he's bulked up a bit since his cameo appearances last season.

 

I'm not going to jump on the bandwagon with wholesale criticism. I think the big pitch was clearly an issue for us and something that clearly played more towards Motherwell's style (goalkeeping errors aside).

[Harry Potter]

Liked the look of Buchanan in midfield. Looks like he's bulked up a bit since his cameo appearances last season.

 

I'm not going to jump on the bandwagon with wholesale criticism. I think the big pitch was clearly an issue for us and something that clearly played more towards Motherwell's style (goalkeeping errors aside).

Big crowd was lost in the vast stands, should never have been played there, oh wait, organised by u know who.