The Rangers soap opera goes on and on.

[Fermit the Krog]

Anyone else see a delayed start to the season being more and more likely?

 

Not a chance. Thankfully.

 

Time is fast running out.

[Hagar the Horrible]

These boffins at CERN have today perhaps found the god particle without blowing up the entire planet, there must be somebody there who can sort this mess out!

[Ecce Romanov]

How long does it take to say "we're no' having a vote the day and we're leaving it to the SFL because we're a bunch of jessies."

 

 

Kind of like having to decide on climate treaties, where every word needs to be debated.

 

It's all rather sad and predictable.

 

They are on a hiding to nothing, so should at least come out with some dignity and show that they are not willing to be blackmailed.

[Hagar the Horrible]

Hibs will be changing there vote

Is this based on something or just an educated guess?

[Paolo]

Anyone else see a delayed start to the season being more and more likely? At this rate, we'll be lucky to have any football next season!

No. The season will start on time and the SPL will use the need for this as an excuse to keep the New Huns in.

Edited July 4, 2012 by Simon Says

[Sterling Archer]

Perhaps the no to newco campaign could have been worded better.

 

Maybe #applythecurrentapplicationrulestoaNewco might have been better.

[Ecce Romanov]

Not a chance. Thankfully.

 

Time is fast running out.

 

How can you be so confident Harry? If they don't pull the finger out, no-one will know where they are.

[Rick Grimes]

If this vote doesn't happen today newhuns wont be playing anywhere.

 

It'll be a year out then league reconstruction will see them enter the 2nd tier next year.

 

 

I don't think that's the case any more. Its become abundantly clear that NewHun will be playing within the top two flights next season & I fully expect the SFL to bounce the vote on the 12th as not being their responsibility.

 

They're staying in the top flight & they'll be crowing about how we wouldn't let them take the honourable path from Div 3.

 

Its sickening.

[Alwaysinourshadows]

Where are you hearing this?

My old mans mate is mates with a Hibs scout, he said that clubs are changing there votes today and that Hibs will be one of them.

[Fermit the Krog]

How can you be so confident Harry? If they don't pull the finger out, no-one will know where they are.

 

There wont be a delay to the season. Im pretty damn sure of it.

 

Although i admit to basing that on nothing more than gut feeling

[...a bit disco]

You can run but you can't hide!

 

BBC Sportsound ?@bbcsportsound RT @bbcraymondb: Former Rangers owner Craig Whyte fined ?280 for speeding after being caught at almost 90mph in a 60mph zone near Inverness.

 

[Rick Grimes]

How long does it take to say "we're no' having a vote the day and we're leaving it to the SFL because we're a bunch of jessies."

 

 

Kind of like having to decide on climate treaties, where every word needs to be debated.

 

It's all rather sad and predictable.

 

 

We've got to hope that at least five are standing firm and arguing there needs to be a vote. If the rest don't agree then they announce the press that there were 5 No votes & 7 abstentions. If that many do hold firm then there's no possible justification for the rest refusing to vote as its a fait acompli.

Edited July 4, 2012 by Rick Grimes

[Hagar the Horrible]

General other chat (All unconfirmed) is that 6 clubs have said NO, dont know who or who is saying it just wild speculation at the moment, will surf everywhere for more info, BBC tweets so far are on silent, so will wait untill somebody there has something concrete to state!!!!

[Bickfest]

Interesting to see Green's response to this http://www.sportinglife.com/football/transfer-centre/article/168/7865895/steven-naismith-free

 

Will he sue as he said he would? Have Everton received international clearance? (If so, presumably the SFA have slapped Green down on this one.)

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

I still can't work out Doncaster's motivation. He's either personally on the hook with the TV companies and sponsors or he's privy to information we don't know about - either legal action from Sky or Celtic pushing even further for a way out of Scotland.

[Optimus Prime]

If the "no gang" are really intent on standing up for sporting integrity then the only viable option now appears to be resigning from the SPL and forming a new league. The SPL have clearly shown their hand and sporting integrity is not on their agenda. There is now a basic flaw in the relationship between members and the governing body and a divorce from the current arrangement is the only way forward.

 

Scottish football has effectively sold it's sole to TV revenue and the only honourable way out of this is to revert to a ground zero situation where we start from scratch. If clubs current business model means that they can only survive on TV money/Old Firm gates then it is clearly flawed and they must be allowed to die (and i include Hearts in that) and reform again at the bottom. It may result in the game going backwards for a few years maybe as much as a decade but a new model of equality and less emphasis on TV revenue will make the game stronger in the long run. The one guarantee the clubs have with this scenario is the supporters will stick with them if it's for the good of the game in the long run. The other option for the clubs is short term gain followed by a slow drawn out death as everybody slowly walks away.

 

As the line goes in Braveheart the clubs should stop squabbling for the scraps from Longshanks table and see their god given right to something better.

[Guest Bilel Mohsni]

Then they will probably just delay the vote again, and delay the start of the season.

 

There would be uproar and attendances would drop even further once it finaly got up and running, people have planned work and travel etc around the current fixtures.

 

Anyone else see a delayed start to the season being more and more likely? At this rate, we'll be lucky to have any football next season!

 

No, I can't see it.

 

Not a chance. Thankfully.

 

Time is fast running out.

 

 

There wont be a delay to the season. Im pretty damn sure of it.

 

Although i admit to basing that on nothing more than gut feeling

 

I am of this same gut-feeling.

[Rick Grimes]

General other chat (All unconfirmed) is that 6 clubs have said NO, dont know who or who is saying it just wild speculation at the moment, will surf everywhere for more info, BBC tweets so far are on silent, so will wait untill somebody there has something concrete to state!!!!

 

 

Then, as I said, those clubs need to vote No and announce the results. If Doncaster or any of the yes voters think they can stall this by refusing to vote then just call their ******* bluff.

[davrosdalek]

A different version of the rangers song...

 

"No no gers at home,no ibrox to sadden my eyes,no ally no smith, no naismith no cheats,everyday is the 4th of july"

 

sing along everybody....

[Guest Bilel Mohsni]

Then, as I said, those clubs need to vote No and announce the results. If Doncaster or any of the yes voters think they can stall this by refusing to vote then just call their ******* bluff.

 

Fightin' talk, I like it, this is where I am at too.

[brunoatemyhamster]

If the 8 clubs that have publicly said NO turn round today and say "This vote is happening now!" how can the other 4 turn round and delay it?

 

I expect fist's to fly.Hope Rodney takes a big henchman with him.

[I P Knightley]

The clause in the contracts was designed to protect the TV companies if Rangers/Celtic got their wish to leave the Scottish league and push off to England/atlantic league etc.

 

this is not that situation, so the TV companies need to make clear their intentions, immediately.

 

The clause wouldn't have been so specific to limit it just to R or C leaving for a new league.

 

 

Whether they choose to exercise their right to withdraw has not been established; only assumed and assumed by Doncaster - who simply has to go.

[rossthejambo]

Clubs changing their votes, I didn't see that coming....

 

Seething just won't cover it if they're voted back in.

[jambovambo]

Scotsman survey results :

 

http://www.stumbleupon.com/su/1n2Pzt/www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/scotsman-com-survey-results-scottish-football-fans-have-their-say-on-rangers-newco-1-2391584

 

IN DETAIL

 

 

Which league does the team you support play in?

 

76.7% - SPL

 

6.9% - First Division

 

1.9% - Second Division

 

14.4% - Third Division

 

0.1% - N/A - Not interested in football

 

 

Would you back a Newco Rangers being admitted into the SPL?

 

7.7% - Yes

 

91.0% - No

 

1.3% - Unsure

 

 

Would you be happy to admit a Newco Rangers into the SPL with sanctions?

 

6.9% - Yes

 

90.0% - No

 

3.1% - Unsure

 

 

Would you stay away from games if Rangers were readmitted to the SPL?

 

79.2% - Yes

 

20.8% - No

 

 

Would you miss playing against Rangers in the SPL?

 

27.4% - Yes

 

72.6% - No

 

 

If you support an SFL team, which division should a Newco Rangers enter?

 

5.8% - First Division

 

1.0% - Second Division

 

62.2% - Third Division

 

31.8% - Would not support Rangers entering SFL

 

 

Do you support the reorganisation of Scottish Football into a two-tier structure?

 

43.9% - Yes

 

27.5% - No

 

28.6% - Unsure

 

 

If yes, what level do you think Rangers should be admitted to?

 

4.9% - First tier

 

95.1% - Second tier

 

 

If Rangers were not readmitted to the SPL, would you have concerns over the financial stability of your club?

 

13.1% - Yes

 

86.9% - No

 

 

Do you think other SPL teams could survive financially without Rangers in the league?

 

83.0% - Yes

 

7.1% - No

 

9.9% - Unsure

Edited July 4, 2012 by jambovambo

[jambos are go!]

the only thing Scottish League football has going for it is access to european football and local honours. Other than that an exodus for viable clubs including us is a no brainer. I put forward a plan to move to the English Leagues a few months ago and was slated I admit. The next best thing is to exploit the current situation to create a more level playing field and reverse OF domination. Thats the endgame and whatever farcical arrangements are put in place for the next year or two are negotiable. Id like to see Holyrood as well as the SFA getting involved in forcing through change includin the stranglehold of SKY never mind the ugly sisters.

 

Sporting integrity is facing a severe challenge with so much money lined up against it and getting a bigger share and handcuffs on the OF has benefits. Mind you the sporting integrity of OF bias on the pitch needs to be addressed and that is the root cause of the hatred of the OF by other fans as much if not more than religious issues.

Edited July 4, 2012 by jambos are go!

[Rick Grimes]

The clause wouldn't have been so specific to limit it just to R or C leaving for a new league.

 

 

Whether they choose to exercise their right to withdraw has not been established; only assumed and assumed by Doncaster - who simply has to go.

 

Indeed and we need a journalist to get these companies to make a public announcement. By staying quiet they're almost as complicit in this entire fiasco as Doncaster.

[vintage1874]

The spl clubs have to vote today. They have prepared to do so. I can't see any reason for them not to (other than a safety valve for Rangers benefit). If there is not a vote today Hearts and the other "NO" clubs should resign from the SPL.

 

The 3rd Div is a weak punishment in itself a year ban and then apply to SFL seems fair to me. Div1 is a joke. It is not right this is being left in the hands of the SFL clubs as it is not their problem.

 

I am saddened by the way this has been handled. Last week I really thought it was the time for exciting change to scottish football . Now I feel like it was Hearts that lost the cup final 5-1

 

 

[...a bit disco]

Raman Bhardwaj ?@STVRaman Ally McCoist has left Hampden. Charles Green still present at SPL meeting.

 

 

 

 

[Lovecraft]

The SPL are playing a dangerous game of poker with both the SFL and the fans of every club in Scotland.

 

I still think they underestimate the amount of people that will walk away from the game forever if Rangers are anywhere but the Third division.

Edited July 4, 2012 by Lovecraft

[beijingandrew]

Heard today that Raith Rovers are considering applying for judicial review if the SFA bend their own rules to let Rangers into SFL1.

[jambovambo]

New petition to attempt to get Doncaster removed:

 

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/neil-doncaster-should-resign-from-his-post-in-the/

Edited July 4, 2012 by jambovambo

[davieholt]

Raman Bhardwaj ?@STVRaman Ally McCoist has left Hampden. Charles Green still present at SPL meeting.

 

 

 

 

 

My first reaction is that they voted no.

 

Sally has left in disgust but Green still there trying to get support for div 1

[Sterling Archer]

Clubs changing their votes, I didn't see that coming....

 

Seething just won't cover it if they're voted back in.

 

I'd rather they were voted straight back in tbh.

 

Firstly it'd show us who's who in the league.

 

Secondly it stops the whole charade that is putting them in the first for a year. It's already been established that they've got to be promoted within a year so what's the point.

 

Let them in and then leave.

[Seymour M Hersh]

Clarity on point 2;

Almost incredibly, all 3 TV deals; Sky, ESPN and Sports 5 have a clause in them allowing the company concerned to walk away from the SPL entirely, with no penalty, if both Rangers and Celtic are not in the SPL.

This was confirmed at the meeting yesterday.

I suspect the incompetence involved in allowing such a contract to be signed is why a certain individual is desperate to come up with a solution which is acceptable to the 3 TV companies and which, if delivered, will mean they do not invoke the clause.

Self-preservation.

 

The crux is the wording of the contracts Pistol. If as Eldar H alluded to in an earlier post the contract says the sponsors can withdraw if rantic are no longer in Scottish football they can walk away (obviously thinking the uglies were off to the EPL or some other foreign league) then you could successfully argue that as sevco are now in the 3rd Div in Scotland they are still in Scottish football. However if as you allude to the contracts demand them in the SPL then that would be a tougher case to win. Fwiw even though Dungcaster said it I'd still have my doubts to it being the fait accompli he indicates. The man's a slime-ball.

[Rick Grimes]

The SPL are playing a dangerous game of poker with both the SFL and the fans of every club in Scotland.

 

I still think they underestimate the amount of people that will walk away from the game forever if Rangers are anywhere but the Third division.

 

Indeed. My position has been that I would walk if Hearts were to vote for NewCo. If they get back in even with us saying No I'm going to find it hard to go back. We need the No voters to force this to happen today or its game over.

[hmfc1440]

I still can't work out Doncaster's motivation. He's either personally on the hook with the TV companies and sponsors or he's privy to information we don't know about - either legal action from Sky or Celtic pushing even further for a way out of Scotland.

 

This is behind the whole deal - and nobody can put their finger on it. Celtic's silence suggest they could be pulling the strings - either that or Doncaster has targets

to meet or he is bulleted - his ass is on fire from somewhere.

 

In terms of competition structure it was easy to amend to allow Newco 2 or 4 matches v Celtic by having a Premier Cup comeptition to run alongside the SPL with the cup

competition on an invitational basis and bolted on to existing commercial partners contracts. Only an additional minimum 5 cup matches to ensure OF matches.

However, this was presented to SPL and did not sway Doncaster's head. There is something hard & fast holding Doncaster to his propaganda and he is listening to nothing

out-with his plan. If Celtic is involved it means for whatever reason this is Celtic is prepared to lose ST's and fans to forge ahead with their chosen path.

Or is it that their ego's are through the roof and they believe they don't need to listen to anyone and all fans will return in the end?

 

Since Doncaster has been in office I wanted to ask him and Lawwell what is it that makes them refuse to accept changes that would benefit Scottish football? - now Regan

also.

[Lovecraft]

Indeed. My position has been that I would walk if Hearts were to vote for NewCo. If they get back in even with us saying No I'm going to find it hard to go back. We need the No voters to force this to happen today or its game over.

 

 

If they delay the vote today and try and put it back into SFL hands, I can't see anything but the angry SFL chairmen getting more pissed off.

[I P Knightley]

Raman Bhardwaj ?@STVRaman Ally McCoist has left Hampden. Charles Green still present at SPL meeting.

 

 

 

 

 

McCoist had no business being there in the first place.

 

It wasn't a meeting for coaches and managers but for club administrators.

[rossthejambo]

I'd rather they were voted straight back in tbh.

 

Firstly it'd show us who's who in the league.

 

Secondly it stops the whole charade that is putting them in the first for a year. It's already been established that they've got to be promoted within a year so what's the point.

 

Let them in and then leave.

 

As would I. No point playing some ridiculous act by demoting them for a year to no doubt "save face".

 

If that's what they want they should man up, vote them back in and face the consequences of their actions.

[Diego10]

Raman Bhardwaj ?@STVRaman Ally McCoist has left Hampden. Charles Green still present at SPL meeting.

 

 

 

 

need to know 'who are these people' satisfied.

[colinmaroon]

Just watched Lickspittle Doncaster and, the hypocrisy of the man knows no bounds -

 

Vote "Yes" he says, "because it's not fair that other clubs suffer for the sake of one club".

 

 

I mean, how disingenuous is that?

 

It makes my skin crawl to watch and listen to that man.

 

Thank God for remote controls!

[reaths17]

the only thing Scottish League football has going for it is access to european football and local honours. Other than that an exodus for viable clubs including us is a no brainer. I put forward a plan to move to the English Leagues a few months ago and was slated I admit. The next best thing is to exploit the current situation to create a more level playing field and reverse OF domination. Thats the endgame and whatever farcical arrangements are put in place for the next year or two are negotiable. Id like to see Holyrood as well as the SFA getting involved in forcing through change includin the stranglehold of SKY never mind the ugly sisters.

 

Sporting integrity is facing a severe challenge with so much money lined up against it and getting a bigger share and handcuffs on the OF has benefits. Mind you the sporting integrity of OF bias on the pitch needs to be addressed and that is the root cause of the hatred of the OF by other fans as much if not more than religious issues.

 

 

hi Henry, how's thing's hangin

 

politicians involved, back to a 10 team league dominated by the celtic and the MK cheats

 

i'd rather involve hollywoodat least the acting might be plausible

[super_vlad]

I'd rather they were voted straight back in tbh.

 

Firstly it'd show us who's who in the league.

 

Secondly it stops the whole charade that is putting them in the first for a year. It's already been established that they've got to be promoted within a year so what's the point.

 

Let them in and then leave.

Sort of agree with this, end the whole mess, i won't be back to Scottish football ever again! The powers to be are as corrupt as the 3rd world! Brides and threats is how we do business! Not interested, sky can get to **** as well, plenty of ways to watch games I want for free rather then give those ***** more money to blackmail us!

[Pistol1874]

The crux is the wording of the contracts Pistol. If as Eldar H alluded to in an earlier post the contract says the sponsors can withdraw if rantic are no longer in Scottish football they can walk away (obviously thinking the uglies were off to the EPL or some other foreign league) then you could successfully argue that as sevco are now in the 3rd Div in Scotland they are still in Scottish football. However if as you allude to the contracts demand them in the SPL then that would be a tougher case to win. Fwiw even though Dungcaster said it I'd still have my doubts to it being the fait accompli he indicates. The man's a slime-ball.

I absolutely understand and agree with that.

 

The TV contracts are with the SPL. The clauses, as told yesterday, are for both Rangers and Celtic to be in the SPL.

 

Now these contracts were not produced for scutiny, I am merely passing on what was said.

 

I agree with others, this has been suspected for some time, yesterday's vote merely confirmed it.

 

The big question, is what do Sky, ESPN and Sport 5 intend to do if the Newco, who they see as Rangers presumably, are out of the SPL for either of 1 or more than 1 season. How much are teams losing, if a lower value but evenly distributed deal is negotiated instead?

 

I suspect Celtic, at least, know the answer to this hence the deafening and conspicuous silence.

[CMc]

Just saw Doncaster on SSN. What a ****.

 

Still peddling his financial disaster line about div3.

 

****.

[Rick Grimes]

If they delay the vote today and try and put it back into SFL hands, I can't see anything but the angry SFL chairmen getting more pissed off.

 

 

And the fans. My boss supports Partick and was going to get his eldest laddie his first season ticket this year but is holding off & talking of washing his hands of Scottish football altogether. This is a guy who has followed Scotland all over Europe and been a Partick fan through thick & thin.

 

The powers that be just don't seem to see the damage they're doing.

 

Again, I'm ******* furious....

[Feeno]

hopeful at best

 

 

 

[Flogel98]

Being deadly serious, if this goes the wrong way, I hope glad does the right thing and starts looking at taking hearts out of the Scottish game. I,d happily move to another league if I thought that that league was run fairly and equitably.

[BEE PEE]

Could it be all this talk of the vote bein delayed, financial crisis.. Sky withdrawal.. doom and gloom bein around the corner unless Sevco are in SFL1 a last deperate attempt by the corrupted and broken governing body to save itself and the old ways?!

 

Could it just be them and their media monkeys spreading doubt and fear into the clubs with financial difficulties (all clubs) and their usual way of winning the battles?

 

I HOPE SO, AND I HOPE IT FAILS!

 

If this isn't just rumours or west coast poision... then our game is dead, and it's death has surely been caused by the football mafia.. who clearly do exist!

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

Just saw Doncaster on SSN. What a ****.

 

Still peddling his financial disaster line about div3.

 

****.

 

To big to fail, in other words.