...a bit disco Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Cryptic? john james? @sitonfence 5m5 minutes agoMore A Sporting Integrity Veto : The SPL votes in full with Duncan Fraser's e-mail being the most revealing. Watch this space Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 The deal between Worthington and Law Financial, a firm set up by Whyte also included obtaining the book, film and television rights to the two takeovers of The Rangers Football Club in 2011 and 2012. Now, there's some foresight; figuring that the takeover may result in a saga that would be worthy of a book or a film. It's almost as if he knew... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartsofgold Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Here's a thought. If, and it's a massive unlikely if, they are stripped of the titles then surely they would have to repay ALL the prise money they were awarded for winning said titles and cups? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieholt Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Here's a thought. If, and it's a massive unlikely if, they are stripped of the titles then surely they would have to repay ALL the prise money they were awarded for winning said titles and cups? How? They are in liquidation FFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartsofgold Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 How? They are in liquidation FFS Well the SPFL/SFA seem to regard them as the same club for honours purposes so why not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Grimes Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Here's a thought. If, and it's a massive unlikely if, they are stripped of the titles then surely they would have to repay ALL the prise money they were awarded for winning said titles and cups? That's likely why the authorities are so keen to avoid title stripping, even more than any perceived bias - it could open the floodgates for damages claims. Best option would be to strip the titles and declare the club a new one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Here's a thought. If, and it's a massive unlikely if, they are stripped of the titles then surely they would have to repay ALL the prise money they were awarded for winning said titles and cups?They'd have to prize that from RFC's cold dead hands. Arf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 17, 2017 Share Posted July 17, 2017 Cryptic? john james? @sitonfence 5m5 minutes ago More A Sporting Integrity Veto : The SPL votes in full with Duncan Fraser's e-mail being the most revealing. Watch this space https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/16/neil-doncaster-the-cover-up-mc/comment-page-1/ ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/16/neil-doncaster-the-cover-up-mc/comment-page-1/ ? I assume, this one. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/18/the-anatomy-of-a-cover-up/ Interesting reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Lyon Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Scottish football corrupt at the core! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 I assume, this one. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/18/the-anatomy-of-a-cover-up/ Interesting reading. Scandalous ! That must have gone up since the one I posted the link to ... This poll at Stripthetitles is gathering which teams are supported by pollsters ... https://stripthetitles.wordpress.com/2017/07/18/poll-which-team-do-you-support/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllyjamboDerbyshire Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Here's a thought. If, and it's a massive unlikely if, they are stripped of the titles then surely they would have to repay ALL the prise money they were awarded for winning said titles and cups? That would be impossible, but regardless, there is no excuse for not stripping titles unfairly won! The only way that prize money would become a problem is if it was decided to re-asign titles, in which case every club will have to move up one place (and be entitled to additional prize money that just isn't there) with Rangers moving to bottom position. Simply put, the only possible action would be to strip Rangers of the titles and place an asterisk against their name on each one of the cheating years! Then, every club stays in the position they finished in and no re-distribution of prize money would be required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Buaben Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 That would be impossible, but regardless, there is no excuse for not stripping titles unfairly won! The only way that prize money would become a problem is if it was decided to re-asign titles, in which case every club will have to move up one place (and be entitled to additional prize money that just isn't there) with Rangers moving to bottom position. Simply put, the only possible action would be to strip Rangers of the titles and place an asterisk against their name on each one of the cheating years! Then, every club stays in the position they finished in and no re-distribution of prize money would be required. Taking bits of tin off the club isn't really a punishment though is it. The fans have long past celebrating them. They wont really care. They will have the memories of the games and the presentation etc. That can't be stripped. They should have to pay back the money the obtained by cheating. The money that allowed them to maintain the advantage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 (edited) Taking bits of tin off the club isn't really a punishment though is it. The fans have long past celebrating them. They wont really care. They will have the memories of the games and the presentation etc. That can't be stripped. They should have to pay back the money the obtained by cheating. The money that allowed them to maintain the advantage this isn't possible and should be removed from any discussions, only helps in muddying the waters. which team from which round that oldco beat do you give the cups/prize money to ? they cheated going by the games, official rules that teams before and since have been punished with. all the tainted wins should be amended to signify that the honours have been rescinded for breaking the rules. to say that they wont feel the pain is nonsense, their suffering and threatening everyone as it is and its not even on the cards yet Edited July 18, 2017 by reaths17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughesie27 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Not exactly related to the current demise but I wasn't about to make a whole new thread on it. The Sun writing an article about a player scoring a free kick in training. https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1297174/rangers-winger-daniel-candeias-nets-stunning-free-kick-as-bruno-alves-enjoys-first-training-session/?utm_source=TWITTER&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=SprnklrSUNOrganic&UTMX=Editorial:scotsunsport:FBImage:Statement:Sport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Buaben Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 (edited) this isn't possible and should be removed from any discussions, only helps in muddying the waters. which team from which round that oldco beat do you give the cups/prize money to ? they cheated going by the games, official rules that teams before and since have been punished with. all the tainted wins should be amended to signify that the honours have been rescinded for breaking the rules. to say that they wont feel the pain is nonsense, their suffering and threatening everyone as it is and its not even on the cards yet Grassroots football should benefit with the money. Okay maybe they may feel the pain of losing it but i still dont think taking the cups out the trophy room is a punishment to the club. Edited July 18, 2017 by Prince Buaben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Green Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Rangers have been fined by UEFA for the behaviour of their fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Rangers have been fined by UEFA for the behaviour of their fans. At least there won't be another offence for a while Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWJ Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Not exactly related to the current demise but I wasn't about to make a whole new thread on it. The Sun writing an article about a player scoring a free kick in training. https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1297174/rangers-winger-daniel-candeias-nets-stunning-free-kick-as-bruno-alves-enjoys-first-training-session/?utm_source=TWITTER&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=SprnklrSUNOrganic&UTMX=Editorial:scotsunsport:FBImage:Statement:Sport More nice / reassuring news from the Weegia to keep their OF readers happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 imagine lobbing missiles at guys that don't even play football for a full time living... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armageddon Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Not exactly related to the current demise but I wasn't about to make a whole new thread on it. The Sun writing an article about a player scoring a free kick in training. https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1297174/rangers-winger-daniel-candeias-nets-stunning-free-kick-as-bruno-alves-enjoys-first-training-session/?utm_source=TWITTER&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=SprnklrSUNOrganic&UTMX=Editorial:scotsunsport:FBImage:Statement:Sport Hahahahahahahaha that's unbelievable!!! I heard he also farted in the bath after it - that's covered in a 6 page pull out in tomorrows Sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllyjamboDerbyshire Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Taking bits of tin off the club isn't really a punishment though is it. The fans have long past celebrating them. They wont really care. They will have the memories of the games and the presentation etc. That can't be stripped. They should have to pay back the money the obtained by cheating. The money that allowed them to maintain the advantage I'd say the removal of titles is of far greater significance to Rangers supporters than the thought of any money that might be lost, regardless of the dead status of their old club. However, even if there was no upset caused, for anyone, by the removal of the offending titles, there is no reason, at all, for not acknowledging the severity of their cheating by changing the records of football. They celebrated the winning of those titles, big time, now let them greet about losing them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftBack Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Not exactly related to the current demise but I wasn't about to make a whole new thread on it. The Sun writing an article about a player scoring a free kick in training. https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/1297174/rangers-winger-daniel-candeias-nets-stunning-free-kick-as-bruno-alves-enjoys-first-training-session/?utm_source=TWITTER&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=SprnklrSUNOrganic&UTMX=Editorial:scotsunsport:FBImage:Statement:Sport Sometimes you might think the criticism of the MSM for fawning to the old firm is unfair and maybe a bit of jealousy from other fans...and then you read an article like this and realise sports journalism in this country is as dead as a parrot... What a truly, truly embarassing piece - I wonder if someone like Hugh McIlvenney has ever tried to sell an article like that to a paper 'Boss, we have footage of a truly stunning freekick by a Rangers player and Ill write up 500 words' 'Great - didnt realise they were playing' 'No it wasnt a match they were just training.' 'Dont bang the door on your way out son' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jammy T Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Taking bits of tin off the club isn't really a punishment though is it. The fans have long past celebrating them. They wont really care. They will have the memories of the games and the presentation etc. That can't be stripped. They should have to pay back the money the obtained by cheating. The money that allowed them to maintain the advantage Oh it would bother them It would bother them half to death Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jammy T Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Sometimes you might think the criticism of the MSM for fawning to the old firm is unfair and maybe a bit of jealousy from other fans...and then you read an article like this and realise sports journalism in this country is as dead as a parrot... What a truly, truly embarassing piece - I wonder if someone like Hugh McIlvenney has ever tried to sell an article like that to a paper 'Boss, we have footage of a truly stunning freekick by a Rangers player and Ill write up 500 words' 'Great - didnt realise they were playing' 'No it wasnt a match they were just training.' 'Dont bang the door on your way out son' I scored a ****ing awesome overhead kick direct from a corner once. It was genuinely ridiculous. I played rugby more than football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzbomb1958 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 I also scored a stunning goal from a corner after it hit my arse and sent the goalie the wrong way,nothing reported though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Rangers have been fined by UEFA for the behaviour of their fans. nah, don't believe that "they've been punished enough" they could always no pay it, like their fine from splaf for cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IveSeenTheLight Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 nah, don't believe that "they've been punished enough" they could always no pay it, like their fine from splaf for cheating. Rangers have been fined by UEFA for the behaviour of their fans. Its absolutely indicative that this SevCo's first ever game in Europe, they have let themselves and Scottish Football down. The fine is poor, but possibly reflective of the level of clubs that compete in the 1st round throughout Europe. That said, this light slap on the wrist for first time entrants and first time offenders in Europe (they have no history) should be markedly increased should they ever darken Scottish Footballs name again. Lets hope that the rest of Scottish football can stop SevCo qualifying for Europe in the first instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Rangers currently playing St Johnstone in a friendly. Half time 0-0 Amusing cameo... St. Johnstone FC?Verified account @St_Johnstone_FC 18m18 minutes agoMore 35. Niko Kranjcar is asked to leave the pitch after screaming at the referee. 0-0. #SJFClive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diadora Van Basten Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 So according to Rod McKenzie Rangers were not charged for not paying their Tax as there is no rule that covers paying tax and not reporting payments to players to the SFA did not convey a sporting advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/10-000-rangers-fans-set-to-attend-sheffield-wednesday-friendly-1-4507193 This won't end well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 (edited) http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/10-000-rangers-fans-set-to-attend-sheffield-wednesday-friendly-1-4507193 This won't end well. I take Sheffield was closed in 2008. When Manchester was getting trashed. Edited July 18, 2017 by John Findlay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/10-000-rangers-fans-set-to-attend-sheffield-wednesday-friendly-1-4507193 This won't end well. Well that's Sheffield trashed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Brutal. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/19/the-discredited-lns-commission/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escobar PHM Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) So according to Rod McKenzie Rangers were not charged for not paying their Tax as there is no rule that covers paying tax and not reporting payments to players to the SFA did not convey a sporting advantage. yes that's my understanding of what they are now saying. 1. At the time of the EBT's there was no rule specifically preventing use of them 2. So although EBT's gave them an advantage it wasn't breaking any rule. 3. What DID break the rules was not declaring the EBT in the player registration as part of the financial package each player was on. 4. Not declaring it is a technical admin rule break and in itself did not give a sporting advantage. Morally reprehensible way of looking at it IMO Edited July 19, 2017 by Escobar PHM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DETTY29 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 yes that's my understanding of what they are now saying. 1. At the time of the EBT's there was no rule specifically preventing use of them 2. So although EBT's gave them an advantage it wasn't breaking any rule. 3. What DID break the rules was not declaring the EBT in the player registration as part of the financial package each player was on. 4. Not declaring it is a technical admin rule break and in itself did not give a sporting advantage. Morally reprehensible way of looking at it IMO Company secretary forges to double sign a form for a team sheet, game awarded to opposition. Deliberately don't disclose 60 players contracts for 14 years to the football authoritied and lie to HMRC. Then try (not very hard in attempting to either) to prove a non rule re sporting integrity / advantage when the key focus should whether registered properly. Don't challenge 'imperfect registration' as you don't know what you haven't been told. Couldn't make it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMc Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 yes that's my understanding of what they are now saying. 1. At the time of the EBT's there was no rule specifically preventing use of them 2. So although EBT's gave them an advantage it wasn't breaking any rule. 3. What DID break the rules was not declaring the EBT in the player registration as part of the financial package each player was on. 4. Not declaring it is a technical admin rule break and in itself did not give a sporting advantage. Morally reprehensible way of looking at it IMO That's their defence. However, it completely ducks the improperly registered players aspect. Teams have been kicked out the cup for improperly registering one player. The Huns whole team was improperly registered for years. The semantic shift to "imperfectly" registered is a smokescreen. It is a binary concept. You have either properly registered your player, or you have not. The precident is that you get kicked out the competition for not registering all your players correctly. The SFA/SPFL cannot now bring in a sliding scale of how imperfectly players are registered to suit their agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Brutal. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/19/the-discredited-lns-commission/ Indeed. Brutal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) I would strip them of all trophies won during the cheating years. Then this version of them would be punted out the league. Unfortunately I'm not in charge. Edited July 19, 2017 by John Findlay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxteth O'Grady Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 I assume, this one. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/18/the-anatomy-of-a-cover-up/ Interesting reading. The SFA and SPFL are corrupt to the core Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 SPFL Board nominees. Will be voted at the AGM on 24 July. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pans Jambo Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 I assume, this one. https://johnjamessite.com/2017/07/18/the-anatomy-of-a-cover-up/ Interesting reading. So. Basically then. Having EBT's = Unfair competitive advantage Not telling the SPL/SFA that Rangers were using EBT's = No unfair advantage because it would have been the same if they HAD told the SPL/SFA about using them anyway WTF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxteth O'Grady Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 SPFL Board nominees. Will be voted at the AGM on 24 July. What are the odds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 What are the odds? Aye http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-verge-place-spfl-board-10831888.amp Abandon all hope... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) SPFL Board nominees. Will be voted at the AGM on 24 July. Or, as Level 5 the Daily Record puts it... Daily Record Sport?Verified account @Record_Sport 32s33 seconds agoMore Rangers on verge of place on SPFL board as Celtic chief Peter Lawwell decides against standing for re-election http://dlyr.ec/oQA1be Edited July 19, 2017 by ...a bit disco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllyjamboDerbyshire Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 So according to Rod McKenzie Rangers were not charged for not paying their Tax as there is no rule that covers paying tax and not reporting payments to players to the SFA did not convey a sporting advantage. What I find so ridiculous in McKenzie's reasoning is that he seems to be suggesting that payments made outwith a players contract are only a problem if tax is payable on them. I can see no difference between paying by EBTs, taxable or not, and handing over envelopes stuffed with cash. Indeed, add in the fact that the money made it's way into the player's hands via an offshore account, and it becomes even more like the shenanigans at FIFA. The simple fact is that Rangers made payments to players they should not have made under the rules of Scottish football, the fact it was part of a tax dodge only makes it worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgeJambo Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Or, as Level 5 the Daily Record puts it... Daily Record Sport?Verified account @Record_Sport 32s33 seconds ago More Rangers on verge of place on SPFL board as Celtic chief Peter Lawwell decides against standing for re-election http://dlyr.ec/oQA1be I wonder why Celtic are not putting forward any representation! Are they content that the chairman is in their back pocket already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWJ Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Company secretary forges to double sign a form for a team sheet, game awarded to opposition. Deliberately don't disclose 60 players contracts for 14 years to the football authoritied and lie to HMRC. Then try (not very hard in attempting to either) to prove a non rule re sporting integrity / advantage when the key focus should whether registered properly. Don't challenge 'imperfect registration' as you don't know what you haven't been told. Couldn't make it up. I'm not being an arse but I take it you mean 'forgets' rather than 'forges'? It really is beyond a joke. The media should be shouting this from the rooftops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riccarton3 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 I'm not being an arse but I take it you mean 'forgets' rather than 'forges'? It really is beyond a joke. The media should be shouting this from the rooftops. Don't worry, Richard Gordon and the Sportsound team will be all over it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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