Summer 24 Transfers - Vargas signs 5 year deal ( updated )

[Pasquale for King]

25 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Sore sarny that one!

Easier to digest than our choices of RB these last few seasons. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Love how we throw the baby out with the bath water when we lose a game, rather than look at the 33 league games in the wider view.

[jamboinglasgow]

3 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Agreed, but a few months can be a lot at that age.  Summer in the gym!  And there's something to be said for movement and "avoiding contact" as they seem to coin it these days.

 

Would love to see the kid make an impact and that's a good point about his contract.  Works both ways though, right... if he doesnt make any impact, or isn't progressing as quickly as he or we hoped, then he might not get the move he'd hoped.  So you'd hope he keeps working away, re-signs, concentrates on his Hearts career and the riches will come... You hope.  So much of this comes down to family/agent, doesn't it.

 

He does have a 1 year option on his contract. But it does sound from snippets here that he still getting a lot of attention from down south which could turn his head. So I do think he will need to get more games next season to stay. I do also think Naismith does see him as someone who can make the step up. As you summer working in the gym and spending pre-season with the first team may make or break his time at Hearts.

[Batistuta87]

13 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Wonder if Wilson could be considered 1st team next season or it'll be a loan to build him...

I reckon he'll be B Team at least for the first half of the season. He's not long turned 17 so think it could be a wee bit early for a loan personally. 

 

[Chimp]

3 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Agreed, but a few months can be a lot at that age.  Summer in the gym!  And there's something to be said for movement and "avoiding contact" as they seem to coin it these days.

 

Would love to see the kid make an impact and that's a good point about his contract.  Works both ways though, right... if he doesnt make any impact, or isn't progressing as quickly as he or we hoped, then he might not get the move he'd hoped.  So you'd hope he keeps working away, re-signs, concentrates on his Hearts career and the riches will come... You hope.  So much of this comes down to family/agent, doesn't it.

 

Absolutely. It definitely works both ways and there's a lot to consider.

 

[JamboAl]

12 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

You said CL and Budge deserved acclaim for sticking to a sustainable plan, he wasted millions that ended up getting us relegated. That wasn’t a sustainable plan, you haven’t been able to back that up. 
CL wanted the managers job from day one, he admitted that, there wouldn’t have been any success if that had happened, hes once again down the bottom of the league.
The initial success we had and those since are undeniable, and they will be remembered well for those that now the stand has eventually been finished, way over budget with a few flaws. 
Lets hope the current SD can keep having a higher success rate with signings than his predecessor. 

Not uncommon for projects to finish over budget, eg Scottish Parliament, but even so, we are much better aligned for the future. There is no doubt CL bought what turned out to be rubbish but he had little or no elbow room money wise.  We were never going to sign Messi.  We did acquire Whelan and Damour and, with their CVs showing experience in the top 2 English divisions, we had every right to believe they would be good signings.  Alas.

[Pasquale for King]

I would imagine that Wilson, and all the rest of the players have a plan from the club nutritionist tailored to their specific needs, they should all be doing gym work on a weekly basis. Obviously some more than others. 

[Pasquale for King]

6 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Not uncommon for projects to finish over budget, eg Scottish Parliament, but even so, we are much better aligned for the future. There is no doubt CL bought what turned out to be rubbish but he had little or no elbow room money wise.  We were never going to sign Messi.  We did acquire Whelan and Damour and, with their CVs showing experience in the top 2 English divisions, we had every right to believe they would be good signings.  Alas.

Especially when you have no idea what you want to do with the space you have built, we needed benefactors money to fund it. 
He wasted millions of our money, they had plenty of elbow room, he signed TWENTY players in one season ffs and got us relegated. 
Lets just be thankful hes gone and Budge has taken a back seat, whilst our recruitment has moved onwards and considerably upwards. 

Back to the here and now. 

 

Edited April 24 by Pasquale for King

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

Especially when you have no idea what you want to do with the space you have built, we needed benefactors money to fund it. 
He wasted millions of our money, they had plenty of elbow room, he signed TWENTY players in one season ffs and got us relegated. 
Lets just be thankful hes gone and Budge has taken a back seat, whilst our recruitment has moved onwards and considerably upwards. 

Back to the here and now. 

 

He signed loads of players which became necessary when admin left us with very little money and few players.

Was he supposed to put out a 5 a side team?

He tried to build incrementally which we are also doing now but at a higher level as reflected by our greater wealth with money from Europe, james Anderson and FoH.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

15 hours ago, OTT said:

 

The absolute last thing we need is another Vargas type! He's playing out of position IIRC and still very much learning. 

 

A player like Danny Armstrong that is ready to go today is whats needed. We already have the 2nd youngest squad in the league, time to bring in some experienced heads that can ensure we're making the correct decisions in the final 3rd. I would say 70% of what Alan Forrest does is good, he gets on the ball and tries to be positive... the problem is that he's shite and makes awful decisions. Someone like Armstrong that has a proven track record of delivering in his position is what we need more than anything. He's shown he's a very competent player and can actually take corners (I swear to god, if we go into next season with McKay still taking corners....) 

 

I think its a testament to Shankland that he didn't throttle Forrest & Vargas at full time. 

 

Yeah, I like Vargas a lot and am happy he's here long term, as I think he's going to grow into a very solid player, but it's a huge issue that when Shanks goes off the boil or gets marked out of a game, we're relying on a 22 year old in his first year in Europe. I like Forrest too but he's the wrong player for an OF cup semi.

 

Fortunately the overwhelming sentiment from the club seems to be that we have enough intriguing prospects, let's get in some proven Scottish Prem grifters with a bit of room to grow.

 

In terms of who's out, Fraser, Lembikisa, and Haring being the obvious ones, I do expect Cochrane to get sold, but I also expect Rowles and Atkinson to stay. Boyce sadly is probably done, which I'm bummed about because he was so good for us on his day.  Halkett's probably 50/50—it's depressing but we can't rely on him at this point. I also think it's better than even odds that Shankland is here next year. Not banking on it, but I don't think anyone is going to offer a fee that matches his value to us, unless he absolutely tears up Europe.

 

I also really expect that players like Forrest, Devlin, and Grant will still be here, but they'll hopefully have more competition. Anyone wanting to get rid of McKay at this point needs their head examined—you can be frustrated with his performances against the OF, but we are starved for creative midfielders and he's the best one we have. Yeah, I hope Dhanda kicks on and surpasses him but I'm not looking forward to needing Grant to be on his game to have any hope of our forwards getting service.

 

Need a striker, a CH, a RB and possibly a LWB if Cochrane goes as I expect. Bair and Armstrong would be lovely if we could get them. (Although with Bair, experience tells us to be wary of Motherwell strikers with one good season scoring goals . . .)

Edited April 24 by Watt-Zeefuik

[Dazo]

3 hours ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Love how we throw the baby out with the bath water when we lose a game, rather than look at the 33 league games in the wider view.

This. Not sure if it’s lack of understanding or immaturity but talk of clear outs etc is madness. We are on course to finish closer to the OF, we are on course to finish with more points than the last time we got 3rd and finish clear by more points. If that isn’t progress I’m not sure what is to be honest. No doubt it is because everyone else is shite rather anything we have done. 

[OTT]

7 minutes ago, Watt-Zeefuik said:

 

Yeah, I like Vargas a lot and am happy he's here long term, as I think he's going to grow into a very solid player, but it's a huge issue that when Shanks goes off the boil or gets marked out of a game, we're relying on a 22 year old in his first year in Europe. I like Forrest too but he's the wrong player for an OF cup semi.

 

Fortunately the overwhelming sentiment from the club seems to be that we have enough intriguing prospects, let's get in some proven Scottish Prem grifters with a bit of room to grow.

 

In terms of who's out, Fraser, Lembikisa, and Haring being the obvious ones, I do expect Cochrane to get sold, but I also expect Rowles and Atkinson to stay. Boyce sadly is probably done, which I'm bummed about because he was so good for us on his day.  Halkett's probably 50/50—it's depressing but we can't rely on him at this point. I also think it's better than even odds that Shankland is here next year. Not banking on it, but I don't think anyone is going to offer a fee that matches his value to us, unless he absolutely tears up Europe.

 

I also really expect that players like Forrest, Devlin, and Grant will still be here, but they'll hopefully have more competition. Anyone wanting to get rid of McKay at this point needs their head examined—you can be frustrated with his performances against the OF, but we are starved for creative midfielders and he's the best one we have. Yeah, I hope Dhanda kicks on and surpasses him but I'm not looking forward to needing Grant to be on his game to have any hope of our forwards getting service.

 

Need a striker, a CH, a RB and possibly a LWB if Cochrane goes as I expect. Bair and Armstrong would be lovely if we could get them. (Although with Bair, experience tells us to be wary of Motherwell strikers with one good season scoring goals . . .)

 

I'm interested in what we might be looking at for Cochrane. I'm hoping that we get in or around £2m. He's still very young and is English which surely counts in his (and our) favour. 

 

Every part of me is saying to invest that money whatever it is in acquiring Danny Armstrong & Luke McCowan/ trying Rangers for Scott Wright. 

 

We're painstakingly close to having an excellent forward line, we just need players that are able to work on Shanklands wavelength. 

 

We have Penrice coming in for Cochrane anyway, and with Kingsley & Rowles both able to play on the left, I don't think we really need to worry too much about our LB situation (even more so given Naismith seems to want a back 4 which would play more in Kingsleys favour.

 

I've always considered Devlin an excellent ball winner, likewise Beni but Cantwell and Lundstrom got the freedom of Hampden park last week. With Beni leaving anyway, I wonder if we need to look at another ball winner/midfield enforcer type. 

 

Then there is RB... my god there is RB  - Need to find another Mikey Smith type since we're likely to be playing with a back 4 next season. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

2 minutes ago, Dazo said:

This. Not sure if it’s lack of understanding or immaturity but talk of clear outs etc is madness. We are on course to finish closer to the OF, we are on course to finish with more points than the last time we got 3rd and finish clear by more points. If that isn’t progress I’m not sure what is to be honest. No doubt it is because everyone else is shite rather anything we have done. 

Demand for instant gratification, add impatience to the other 2. 

 

No panic, stick to the task. The 3 we have signed could be good Sunday players, Forrest of that ilk too, but if we add some quality as European and Old Firm players, we could be very good if we continue on what has generally been an upward curve.

 

Losing semi finals is unpleasant, probably even more than finals, it will warp minds, we do need quality, absolutely, but we dont throw away what got us here, ready to progress again

[Watt-Zeefuik]

7 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

I'm interested in what we might be looking at for Cochrane. I'm hoping that we get in or around £2m. He's still very young and is English which surely counts in his (and our) favour. 

 

Every part of me is saying to invest that money whatever it is in acquiring Danny Armstrong & Luke McCowan/ trying Rangers for Scott Wright. 

 

We're painstakingly close to having an excellent forward line, we just need players that are able to work on Shanklands wavelength. 

 

We have Penrice coming in for Cochrane anyway, and with Kingsley & Rowles both able to play on the left, I don't think we really need to worry too much about our LB situation (even more so given Naismith seems to want a back 4 which would play more in Kingsleys favour.

 

I've always considered Devlin an excellent ball winner, likewise Beni but Cantwell and Lundstrom got the freedom of Hampden park last week. With Beni leaving anyway, I wonder if we need to look at another ball winner/midfield enforcer type. 

 

Then there is RB... my god there is RB  - Need to find another Mikey Smith type since we're likely to be playing with a back 4 next season. 

 

**** me, I totally forgot about Penrice. Of course, the combo of him, Kingsley, and Rowles is totally fine.

 

As for offers for Cochrane, I think £2m is probably the ceiling but I think £1.5m should be totally doable. He can definitely play at the upper end of the Championship down there and who doesn't need a good LB?

 

I remain unconvinced that Beni is definitely leaving. I think the tendency around here is to see a player hesitate and say, "right, they're gone." I think a lot of them genuinely don't want to think about it during the season. Beni is obviously considering it but I'd still give him a one in three chance of checking his options and deciding he wants to stay.

 

And yes, RB. I still like Natty and think he did fairly well last Sunday (except the opener which no one did well on), but to me he's a fine RWB and a decent second choice at RB but goodness there is a gaping hole there. (I think Spittal will see time at RWB as well but we'll see).

 

Still need another CH. As much as I've rooted for Sibbick, he's just not progressed.

[Dazo]

14 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Demand for instant gratification, add impatience to the other 2. 

 

No panic, stick to the task. The 3 we have signed could be good Sunday players, Forrest of that ilk too, but if we add some quality as European and Old Firm players, we could be very good if we continue on what has generally been an upward curve.

 

Losing semi finals is unpleasant, probably even more than finals, it will warp minds, we do need quality, absolutely, but we dont throw away what got us here, ready to progress again

Absolutely, couple of quality additions will see us progress again imo. 

[soonbe110]

6 minutes ago, Watt-Zeefuik said:

 

**** me, I totally forgot about Penrice. Of course, the combo of him, Kingsley, and Rowles is totally fine.

 

As for offers for Cochrane, I think £2m is probably the ceiling but I think £1.5m should be totally doable. He can definitely play at the upper end of the Championship down there and who doesn't need a good LB?

 

I remain unconvinced that Beni is definitely leaving. I think the tendency around here is to see a player hesitate and say, "right, they're gone." I think a lot of them genuinely don't want to think about it during the season. Beni is obviously considering it but I'd still give him a one in three chance of checking his options and deciding he wants to stay.

 

And yes, RB. I still like Natty and think he did fairly well last Sunday (except the opener which no one did well on), but to me he's a fine RWB and a decent second choice at RB but goodness there is a gaping hole there. (I think Spittal will see time at RWB as well but we'll see).

 

Still need another CH. As much as I've rooted for Sibbick, he's just not progressed.

What club is going to pay £1.5m for a player that couldn’t get a game for Hearts in arguably their biggest game of the season? He will be away and we will be lucky to get half that amount. 

[OTT]

13 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

What club is going to pay £1.5m for a player that couldn’t get a game for Hearts in arguably their biggest game of the season? He will be away and we will be lucky to get half that amount. 

 

Lets wait and see before talking down the valuation of our players eh. 

 

Market value on Transfermarkt is £1.2m, given they use metrics to calculate value, its not unfair to think around the £1.5m mark. That is chicken feed for a mid to high placed Championship side, which likely will be his destination. 

[jamboinglasgow]

34 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Demand for instant gratification, add impatience to the other 2. 

 

No panic, stick to the task. The 3 we have signed could be good Sunday players, Forrest of that ilk too, but if we add some quality as European and Old Firm players, we could be very good if we continue on what has generally been an upward curve.

 

Losing semi finals is unpleasant, probably even more than finals, it will warp minds, we do need quality, absolutely, but we dont throw away what got us here, ready to progress again

 

It is a bit annoying how one disappointing result and suddenly half the team is terrible and need shifted again.

 

The team does need some changing, but we cant keep ripping things up and starting again. I would argue also that all it takes is a couple really decent players, or players that fit a certain something we are missing and you can see the level of the existing players rise.

 

The squad has demonstrated a lot of good this season. Our points total from our last 23 games is almost the same as the Old Firm, we have got to two semis etc. So the squad needs that little more that makes it even better. If we have player on Sunday who made better choices up front we could have won for example.

[soonbe110]

10 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Lets wait and see before talking down the valuation of our players eh. 

 

Market value on Transfermarkt is £1.2m, given they use metrics to calculate value, its not unfair to think around the £1.5m mark. That is chicken feed for a mid to high placed Championship side, which likely will be his destination. 

Why don’t we wait before talking up the values of our players.  Jeez, he isn’t even the best left back at Hearts. Transfermarkt  is the same as you and I when it comes to valuations - pure speculation and in a lot of cases pie in the sky stuff. 

[Batistuta87]

19 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Lets wait and see before talking down the valuation of our players eh. 

 

Market value on Transfermarkt is £1.2m, given they use metrics to calculate value, its not unfair to think around the £1.5m mark. That is chicken feed for a mid to high placed Championship side, which likely will be his destination. 

 

£1.5-£2M is about the minimum I would expect for a player like Cochrane. 

 

[OTT]

1 minute ago, soonbe110 said:

Why don’t we wait before talking up the values of our players.  Jeez, he isn’t even the best left back at Hearts. Transfermarkt  is the same as you and I when it comes to valuations - pure speculation and in a lot of cases pie in the sky stuff. 

 

Transfer valuations being subjective? Well colour me shocked  

 

Whenever transfer values are brought up, you're always steaming in to play whack a mole on anyone trying to talk up our players. Its like the idea that someone would give us 7 figures is somehow ridiculous. Its like Scottish cringe on steriods. 

 

Alex Cochrane is 23 years old and an excellent investment for a team like Blackburn or Ipswich etc. £1.anything million is a bloody good deal for the buying club. If they can't afford sub £2m, then they're shopping in the wrong market. 

 

[OTT]

Just now, Batistuta87 said:

 

£1.5-£2M is about the minimum I would expect for a player like Cochrane. 

 

 

As would most sensible people.. its not like we'd be selling him to a league 1 side.. Blackburn and Burnley were the quoted teams interested in him in January.

 

[Dazo]

22 minutes ago, jamboinglasgow said:

 

It is a bit annoying how one disappointing result and suddenly half the team is terrible and need shifted again.

 

The team does need some changing, but we cant keep ripping things up and starting again. I would argue also that all it takes is a couple really decent players, or players that fit a certain something we are missing and you can see the level of the existing players rise.

 

The squad has demonstrated a lot of good this season. Our points total from our last 23 games is almost the same as the Old Firm, we have got to two semis etc. So the squad needs that little more that makes it even better. If we have player on Sunday who made better choices up front we could have won for example.

Good post JiG. We have already added what looks like on paper more chance creators and scorers for next season. Couple more to that will see us okay. 

[RustyRightPeg]

24 minutes ago, jamboinglasgow said:

 

It is a bit annoying how one disappointing result and suddenly half the team is terrible and need shifted again.

 

The team does need some changing, but we cant keep ripping things up and starting again. I would argue also that all it takes is a couple really decent players, or players that fit a certain something we are missing and you can see the level of the existing players rise.

 

The squad has demonstrated a lot of good this season. Our points total from our last 23 games is almost the same as the Old Firm, we have got to two semis etc. So the squad needs that little more that makes it even better. If we have player on Sunday who made better choices up front we could have won for example.

 

The squad yes. The individuals who weren't up to it on Sunday, repeat offenders or not first picks over the last year or so.  

[TheBigO]

8 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

 

£1.5-£2M is about the minimum I would expect for a player like Cochrane. 

 

Me too.  Contract situations can change things but I hope the club these days is of a mind to say "ach we'd rather keep him a year than sell due to contract length".  Stick our chest out a bit.  Plenty players go for big money with a year left.

 

Personally hope he signs up again.  Always do when he's good, and Alex is good.

[Drylaw Hearts]

54 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Absolutely, couple of quality additions will see us progress again imo. 

Why just a couple ?

 

We’re going to have money to spend….so let’s spend it on improving as many areas of the team as possible.

 

If that means moving out 6 to 8 and replacing them what’s the issue ?

 

 

[Dazo]

Just now, Drylaw Hearts said:

Why just a couple ?

 

We’re going to have money to spend….so let’s spend it on improving as many areas of the team as possible.

 

If that means moving out 6 to 8 and replacing them what’s the issue ?

 

 

Well I guess to what end ? Finish even more 3rd ? We’ve already added 3 so another couple is 5 players to an already strong squad. 

[Batistuta87]

25 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Why don’t we wait before talking up the values of our players.  Jeez, he isn’t even the best left back at Hearts. Transfermarkt  is the same as you and I when it comes to valuations - pure speculation and in a lot of cases pie in the sky stuff. 

 

 

Its far from pie in the sky or "pure speculation" and is in fact industry recognised with a lot of solid professional research behind their figures. They have scouts and analysts - both professional and voluntary - all across the world feeding data and analytics in to them, and they use actual market analysis and actual club accounts for the financial side of things.

 

Clubs and players themselves use it too. Especially smaller clubs who might not have big scouting networks and paid services like WyScout etc. They will use Transfermrkt for a very basic assessment of a player's value, and will quickly be able to tell if that player is at or around their level. I've seen players offering themselves to clubs and going "here's my Transfermrkt profile"... It's not going to be 100% accurate because its all estimates - but there is some solid work and research goes into those figures and the estimates are regarded as being fairly accurate within the industry. 

 

Edited April 24 by Batistuta87

[HopeDiouf]

3 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Well I guess to what end ? Finish even more 3rd ? We’ve already added 3 so another couple is 5 players to an already strong squad. 

Depends what we're aiming for really.  We've shown the current lot are good enough to be well clear in 3rd, but not good enough to win us semi finals in Glasgow against OF.  

Edited April 24 by HopeDiouf

[Dazo]

2 minutes ago, HopeDiouf said:

Depends what we're aiming for really.  We've shown the current lot are good enough to be well clear in 3rd, but not good enough to win us semi finals in Glasgow against OF.  

Think you need a bit of luck and your players to perform on the day. I’m not sure simply adding players from the market we are in will add any guarantees on winning semi’s against the OF. Quality wasn’t the problem on the day, bottle maybe. 

[HopeDiouf]

3 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Think you need a bit of luck and your players to perform on the day. I’m not sure simply adding players from the market we are in will add any guarantees on winning semi’s against the OF. Quality wasn’t the problem on the day, bottle maybe. 

Agree with that.  However, I guess my point is, some of our players are perfectly adequate for getting 3rd, but come up short v old firm.  Whether they need replaced or not, depends on how much we are really aiming for.  e.g. do you risk trying to replace the the likes of Forrest or Rowles, to try and get better, or do you accept they are a big part of what got us 3rd.

[Dazo]

1 minute ago, HopeDiouf said:

Agree with that.  However, I guess my point is, some of our players are perfectly adequate for getting 3rd, but come up short v old firm.  Whether they need replaced or not, depends on how much we are really aiming for.  e.g. do you risk trying to replace the the likes of Forrest or Rowles, to try and get better, or do you accept they are a big part of what got us 3rd.

Aye that’s a fair point but I guess it comes down to affordability. Can we afford the players to give us as good as you can get guarantee in football that we would win semi’s. I’m not sure what it would cost square that off. 

[kingantti1874]

4 minutes ago, HopeDiouf said:

Agree with that.  However, I guess my point is, some of our players are perfectly adequate for getting 3rd, but come up short v old firm.  Whether they need replaced or not, depends on how much we are really aiming for.  e.g. do you risk trying to replace the the likes of Forrest or Rowles, to try and get better, or do you accept they are a big part of what got us 3rd.

No way of be releasing these guys. We should however be looking to strengthen in every position meaning

 

start. > bench > sell 

 

unless of course we get a decent offer and they want to leave 

Edited April 24 by kingantti1874

[HopeDiouf]

Just now, Dazo said:

Aye that’s a fair point but I guess it comes down to affordability. Can we afford the players to give us as good as you can get guarantee in football that we would win semi’s. I’m not sure what it would cost square that off. 

yes I was going to say - I think you're point about the market we are shopping in is a good one.  If we try to replace the likes of a Rowles or Forrest - with the market we shop in - there's no guarantee we don't end up signing someone worse and going backwards instead.

[soonbe110]

17 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

 

 

Its far from pie in the sky or "pure speculation" and is in fact industry recognised with a lot of solid professional research behind their figures. They have scouts and analysts - both professional and voluntary - all across the world feeding data and analytics in to them, and they use actual market analysis and actual club accounts for the financial side of things.

 

Clubs and players themselves use it too. Especially smaller clubs who might not have big scouting networks and paid services like WyScout etc. They will use Transfermrkt for a very basic assessment of a player's value, and will quickly be able to tell if that player is at or around their level. I've seen players offering themselves to clubs and going "here's my Transfermrkt profile"... It's not going to be 100% accurate because its all estimates - but there is some solid work and research goes into those figures and the estimates are regarded as being fairly accurate within the industry. 

 

We both know that a players transfer fee is determined by what a club is willing to pay for him and what his current club is willing to accept.    Nothing more nothing less.  I’d be surprised if they use a website as a guide.  There’s at least  5-10 factors in play in a transfer deal, some of which transfermarkt have absolutely no knowledge of.  It’s maybe based on some  data, some rough guesses and also little or no knowledge so yes, speculation when all taken together. 

[martoon]

Steady, season upon season, improvement is the policy and, with it, a gradual rise in our wage structure.

 

It's not a short term, quick fix strategy but, considering Stevie's only been HC for a year, we've already taking strides toward our ultimate goal.

 

With patience, I firmly believe that, say, 3 years from now, we'll be seen as a real third force in Scotland and not just a "best of the rest".

 

I also believe we'll be beating the OF more (home and away wins vs. Celtic already, dont forget) and taking them on at Hampden in semi's and finals and winning some.

 

Better this, than the reckless days of Vlad or the quicksand foundations that the Hibby is building his future hopes on.

 

The future's maroon.

 

I cannae wait. 😊

 

 

Edited April 24 by martoon

[soonbe110]

37 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Transfer valuations being subjective? Well colour me shocked  

 

Whenever transfer values are brought up, you're always steaming in to play whack a mole on anyone trying to talk up our players. Its like the idea that someone would give us 7 figures is somehow ridiculous. Its like Scottish cringe on steriods. 

 

Alex Cochrane is 23 years old and an excellent investment for a team like Blackburn or Ipswich etc. £1.anything million is a bloody good deal for the buying club. If they can't afford sub £2m, then they're shopping in the wrong market. 

 

Disagree.  We don’t sell players for those amounts. Virtually never have.  And as for transfermarkt, well.  Vargas is there at £500k - do you think we paid that for him? 
Devlins valuation on there is £800k - do you honestly believe clubs are queueing up to pay that amount for him? 

[RustyRightPeg]

3 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Disagree.  We don’t sell players for those amounts. Virtually never have.  And as for transfermarkt, well.  Vargas is there at £500k - do you think we paid that for him? 
Devlins valuation on there is £800k - do you honestly believe clubs are queueing up to pay that amount for him? 

 

Why do you not think we'd get good money for Cochrane?

 

Other clubs in the country are able to sell for 7 figures. Why can't we?

[jamboinglasgow]

41 minutes ago, RustyRightPeg said:

 

The squad yes. The individuals who weren't up to it on Sunday, repeat offenders or not first picks over the last year or so.  

 

I am not saying there isn't some players who can be moved out for others. It was more the number of players people are wanting rid of. I do think there is some players who need to face their weaknesses and shape up on it.

[Rods]

Danny Armstrong seems to fit the clubs signing policy or what we have been told anyway that we will look to players who are coming into their peak.

 

I wonder if Killie would accept a cash + Forrest swap for Armstrong. However I think Armstrong himself might fancy a tilt at England and earn some big bucks.

[Batistuta87]

28 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

We both know that a players transfer fee is determined by what a club is willing to pay for him and what his current club is willing to accept.    Nothing more nothing less.  I’d be surprised if they use a website as a guide.  There’s at least  5-10 factors in play in a transfer deal, some of which transfermarkt have absolutely no knowledge of.  It’s maybe based on some  data, some rough guesses and also little or no knowledge so yes, speculation when all taken together. 

Its absolutely nothing to do with transfer fees - its estimated market values. They are completely different.

And I can guarantee you 100% that some clubs and players absolutely do use it.

 

Edited April 24 by Batistuta87

[kingantti1874]

7 minutes ago, Rods said:

Danny Armstrong seems to fit the clubs signing policy or what we have been told anyway that we will look to players who are coming into their peak.

 

I wonder if Killie would accept a cash + Forrest swap for Armstrong. However I think Armstrong himself might fancy a tilt at England and earn some big bucks.

Did he not come here from wolves? Not sure he’s at that level tbh.  

[jr ewing]

1 hour ago, Batistuta87 said:

 

£1.5-£2M is about the minimum I would expect for a player like Cochrane. 

 

Plus add ons 

[Drylaw Hearts]

51 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Well I guess to what end ? Finish even more 3rd ? We’ve already added 3 so another couple is 5 players to an already strong squad. 

But why not keep going ?

 

What we going to keep the money for ?

 

You never know……we might just bring in enough higher quality players to get beyond a semi-final and win a Cup again.

 

That is the end we should all be striving for…..surely ?

[Rods]

6 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

Did he not come here from wolves? Not sure he’s at that level tbh.  

 

Ah I was not aware of that one @kingantti1874 excellent knowledge. 

 

Hopefully we can do something then and bring him in as I would imagine Aberdeen/Hibs will be interested. 

[kingantti1874]

3 minutes ago, Rods said:

 

Ah I was not aware of that one @kingantti1874 excellent knowledge. 

 

Hopefully we can do something then and bring him in as I would imagine Aberdeen/Hibs will be interested. 

oh definitely mate, hopefully we have the funds and he fancies a crack at Europe.  Surely we are a better option than those 2

of course, nothing to stop him going back to England either but I think it’s lower third champ at the very best maybe top of league one.  Watched the Leicester and Leeds games the last couple of days and he certainly isn’t at that level 

 

Edited April 24 by kingantti1874

[LarrysRightFoot]

36 minutes ago, Rods said:

Danny Armstrong seems to fit the clubs signing policy or what we have been told anyway that we will look to players who are coming into their peak.

 

I wonder if Killie would accept a cash + Forrest swap for Armstrong. However I think Armstrong himself might fancy a tilt at England and earn some big bucks.

Armstrong was down south as a youngster and it didn’t work out but couldn’t blame him for following the money if the chance came up. 
 

He’s worked to get into the position that clubs will no doubt be looking at him again. 
 

Killie won’t sell on the cheap but he’s turning 27 this year and if an offer comes in for him I’m sure he’ll want to go as he knows he won’t have many more opportunities. The same can be said about McCowan (though he wasn’t down south as a youngster).

 

Comparisons can also be made with Shanks who will be 29 this year. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

2 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

What club is going to pay £1.5m for a player that couldn’t get a game for Hearts in arguably their biggest game of the season? He will be away and we will be lucky to get half that amount. 

 

Can only assume you've not paid close attention to the fees paid for players from other clubs in Scotland in the past few years. £1.5m is very little for clubs chasing promotion to the EPL. Aberdeen got £2m plus addons for Ross McCrorie on the back of 33 appearances in his final season. £1.5m for Cochrane is hardly a big ask.

 

Money-wise our biggest two games were against PAOK and he started both.

[Dayman]

3 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

What club is going to pay £1.5m for a player that couldn’t get a game for Hearts in arguably their biggest game of the season? He will be away and we will be lucky to get half that amount. 

Performing at Hampden doesn’t equate to a good player. Matt Doherty had a shocker in the 5-1 and was sold for £14m+ million, albeit he was in Scotland on loan.

 

He’s a young, athletic and versatile player but that isn’t what adds most to his value.

 

Cochrane was well thought of at Brighton but wasn’t seen to be good enough for the first team, which isn’t an awful thing considering their current level. This added onto the fact that he is English, really helps inflate a value

 

You may not think he is a £2million player, but he probably will sell for that or more, given the above info. He’s up there with as one of our most valuable assets I’d say.

 

McKenna went for £5 million, that would have been £10 million if he was born 200 miles south! 

[Uncle Buck]

8 hours ago, Deviskan said:

Boyce is nowhere near good enough, I’d also sell/release McKay personally. 
 

Halkett, too injury prone…so would consider releasing him as well.

 

Grant for me is also clinging onto staying with the squad by his fingernails…but i’d not be too fussed if he went too.

 

Tagawa, really needs a run of games now to see if he does have anything…so a decision can be made on him before next season.

 

Forrest: I’m still astonished we renewed his contract…the guy is the epitome of a headless chicken, runs a lot…skips by people but has pretty much no end product 90% of the time. 

A fit Boyce, McKay and Halkett are up there with our most important players. I’m hoping they get over their injury issues next season. Forrest also has most assists for us this season with 5. Grant is second with 4. Would seem strange to get rid of them too.