Accounts

[stirlo]

32 minutes ago, HopeDiouf said:

Elephant in the room is the stadium size.  The main blocker to future growth.

Hotel/Bar/Hospitality all great ways to squeeze a bit more out of what we have.  But stadium size is the blocker to real growth.  I'm sure they know this.

 

You are spot on. A lot of the chat about whether this is a good or indifferent set of accounts misses the point IMO. If we want to break well clear of Hibs and Aberdeen from a turnover point of view and start making some sort of inroads in the direction of the Old Firm, stadium capacity is absolutely the fundamental issue. The hotel is all well and good but I can't imagine it's going to be a game-changer for us in terms of turnover.

 

I'm not saying that in 10 years time we could be playing in front of 40,000, but what we do know is that there is considerably more demand for season tickets than the stadium can currently accommodate. There needs to be some sort of road-map in terms of where we go next on stadium capacity. 

 

[Smithian]

My main thought is I no longer believe the Main Stand should be called the Budge Stand. It should be called the Budge-Anderson Stand.

[Boris5115]

1 minute ago, Smithian said:

My main thought is I no longer believe the Main Stand should be called the Budge Stand. It should be called the Budge-Anderson Stand.

Maybe you could incorporate the FOH in the name too as it is well deserving of all who contribute. 

[Sooks]

2 minutes ago, Smithian said:

My main thought is I no longer believe the Main Stand should be called the Budge Stand. It should be called the Budge-Anderson Stand.

We should call it “ Imperious “

[boag1874]

21 hours ago, Spellczech said:

We'll be in good shape when we start doing better in the transfer arena

This is true - it's an area that we've come up short in for a long while - hopefully we start to play the game a bit more starting with this January window where we try to get the guys with 12-18 months left on their deals to extend & if they don't then we see what offers we can get for them in Summer. Also if the stories about the Hickey sell on clause are true hopefully we've learned a lesson from that & push for a % deal in future.

[Dazo]

1 minute ago, Sooks said:

We should call it “ Imperious “

Or “ the elephant “

[AndyNic]

The FOH Budge Anderson PHM Stand

[stuart500]

3 minutes ago, Smithian said:

My main thought is I no longer believe the Main Stand should be called the Budge Stand. It should be called the Budge-Anderson Stand.

Ann's middle name is apparently Winnie.

 

So I'm told it's going to be The Ann Winnie Budge Stand...

[Boris5115]

9 minutes ago, stirlo said:

 

You are spot on. A lot of the chat about whether this is a good or indifferent set of accounts misses the point IMO. If we want to break well clear of Hibs and Aberdeen from a turnover point of view and start making some sort of inroads in the direction of the Old Firm, stadium capacity is absolutely the fundamental issue. The hotel is all well and good but I can't imagine it's going to be a game-changer for us in terms of turnover.

 

I'm not saying that in 10 years time we could be playing in front of 40,000, but what we do know is that there is considerably more demand for season tickets than the stadium can currently accommodate. There needs to be some sort of road-map in terms of where we go next on stadium capacity. 

 

I'd love to see it but I think any expansion of Tynecastle is very difficult to achieve. ie where would the funding come from. Also if it was possible then pitch size would have to be addressed aswell. Just can't see it happening tho. 

[stirlo]

1 minute ago, Boris5115 said:

I'd love to see it but I think any expansion of Tynecastle is very difficult to achieve. ie where would the funding come from. Also if it was possible then pitch size would have to be addressed aswell. Just can't see it happening tho. 

 

I agree with you. I think the only way to increase capacity significantly at Tynecastle would be to purchase more surrounding land and totally rebuild the stadium. I can't help thinking though that a lot of people just have their head in the sand about the capacity issue - and that it will need to be addressed at some point if we have any ambitions of really progressing as a club in the medium to long term.

[AndyNic]

4 minutes ago, Boris5115 said:

I'd love to see it but I think any expansion of Tynecastle is very difficult to achieve. ie where would the funding come from. Also if it was possible then pitch size would have to be addressed aswell. Just can't see it happening tho. 

 

We could fill in the corners.

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, Boris5115 said:

I'd love to see it but I think any expansion of Tynecastle is very difficult to achieve. ie where would the funding come from. Also if it was possible then pitch size would have to be addressed aswell. Just can't see it happening tho. 

technically it’s not really that difficult. Easiest was would be to demolish the wheatfield and the Gorgie and build a bigger L-shaped stand.
 

Funding would be of course the difficult part becuase that wouldn’t be cheap. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by kingantti1874

[boag1874]

51 minutes ago, Sooks said:

A 20 odd bedder a 20 minute walk from the West End proper ? I am going to take an absolutely wild stab in the dark and say that it will turn a profit mate  

Also a boost for conferences & private events to have accommodation on site, it all ties in together.

 

Mentioned on another thread that I guy I know who's a ST holder at Rugby Park reckoned that their hotel generated most of their off-field profits for the club, that was in Kilmarnock ffs, this is the capital city & a major tourism hub where demand for hotels can go absolutely crazy at times. It'll make us money.

[Sooks]

11 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Or “ the elephant “

album elephanti

[JamboAl]

10 minutes ago, boag1874 said:

This is true - it's an area that we've come up short in for a long while - hopefully we start to play the game a bit more starting with this January window where we try to get the guys with 12-18 months left on their deals to extend & if they don't then we see what offers we can get for them in Summer. Also if the stories about the Hickey sell on clause are true hopefully we've learned a lesson from that & push for a % deal in future.

Could you elaborate a wee bit on this.

My understanding is that we offered Hickey a new contract and he turned it down as was his right.  What exactly do you think we should have done re a better sell-on clause which as a starting point depends upon the transfer fee?

[Boris5115]

1 minute ago, kingantti1874 said:

technically it’s not really that difficult. Easiest was would be to demolish the wheatfield and the Gorgie and build a bigger L-shaped stand
 

Funding would be of course the difficult part. 

I don't think you can build a bigger Gorgie Stand with the flats at the back. Look at the shape of the existing one it's smaller at the main stand side . Whilst demolishing the Wheatfield you could widen the pitch we would be stuck with the same length. 

[Sooks]

3 minutes ago, boag1874 said:

Also a boost for conferences & private events to have accommodation on site, it all ties in together.

 

Mentioned on another thread that I guy I know who's a ST holder at Rugby Park reckoned that their hotel generated most of their off-field profits for the club, that was in Kilmarnock ffs, this is the capital city & a major tourism hub where demand for hotels can go absolutely crazy at times. It'll make us money.

In all seriousness I am reluctant to even reply to some of the stupid Hibs AF comments about our hotel . It takes a deep and commuted hatred of Heart of Midlothian Football Club to pretend to yourself that it is not going to be a big coin 

[karipidis]

1 minute ago, JamboAl said:

Could you elaborate a wee bit on this.

My understanding is that we offered Hickey a new contract and he turned it down as was his right.  What exactly do you think we should have done re a better sell-on clause which as a starting point depends upon the transfer fee?

Sell on clause was a lump sum not a %. £100k is the figure we got for Hickey. If we had put a 5% or 10% sell on fee that would have been £850k or £1.7mill. 

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, Boris5115 said:

I don't think you can build a bigger Gorgie Stand with the flats at the back. Look at the shape of the existing one it's smaller at the main stand side . Whilst demolishing the Wheatfield you could widen the pitch we would be stuck with the same length. 

Probably no more rows, maybe lose a couple even

 but offset by the fact it could be wider if you are pushing the wheatfield back, we could fill in that corner (one L-shape stand and make the wheatfield materially bigger if we have that pitch.  Think we could get to 25k but it probably costs £25million 

[Sooks]

What we really need to do is rent out a wee room for junkies like at Easter Road 

[Smithian]

38 minutes ago, Boris5115 said:

Maybe you could incorporate the FOH in the name too as it is well deserving of all who contribute. 

That would also work quite well!

 

Good problem to have when you have multiple deserving namesakes for a stand.

[August Landmesser]

35 minutes ago, AndyNic said:

 

We could fill in the corners.

 

34 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

technically it’s not really that difficult. Easiest was would be to demolish the wheatfield and the Gorgie and build a bigger L-shaped stand.
 

Funding would be of course the difficult part becuase that wouldn’t be cheap. 

HW...

HW...

HWFG!

 

[boag1874]

21 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Could you elaborate a wee bit on this.

My understanding is that we offered Hickey a new contract and he turned it down as was his right.  What exactly do you think we should have done re a better sell-on clause which as a starting point depends upon the transfer fee?

Its been widely discussed that instead of a sell on fee % ie 10% of his next transfer fee (10-25% seems to be the benchmark so that might even be a bit modest) we instead had a fixed fee 6 figure payment for any future transfer out of Bologna when we sold him to them. He went for £14m with £4m in add ons so we could potentially have lost out on about an extra million, he was always going to go for about 8 figures & had a massive future

[Pasquale for King]

6 hours ago, Sooks said:

No worries mate I was probably a bit narkier than was necessary too so sorry  

No problem 👍🏽

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, I.T.K said:

 

 

Like our accounts... Kev is a good one. 

I’m probably more in the know on this. 

[Unknown user]

1 hour ago, Sooks said:

What we really need to do is rent out a wee room for junkies like at Easter Road 

 

They call it an executive box

[Bull's-eye]

Things move quick down at Tynecastle these days.

 

Sack the board, staff, basically everyone one week. One win and a decent set of accounts and now we need a bigger stadium a week later.

 

😆😆😆😆😆😆😆

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, boag1874 said:

Its been widely discussed that instead of a sell on fee % ie 10% of his next transfer fee (10-25% seems to be the benchmark so that might even be a bit modest) we instead had a fixed fee 6 figure payment for any future transfer out of Bologna when we sold him to them. He went for £14m with £4m in add ons so we could potentially have lost out on about an extra million, he was always going to go for about 8 figures & had a massive future

Does that mean it's accurate or just guesswork?

A sell-on fee is something that is agreed between the buying and selling club.  If we had insisted on something unsuitable to Bologna, they might have told us to get stuffed and Hickey could have stayed here.  If then he sustained a serious injury (like Souttar) the club would have been criticised for not accepting the offer that was on the table.

Sometimes one simply has to make a judgment and let the devil take the hindmost.  It's not a rehearsal.

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, Smithian said:

My main thought is I no longer believe the Main Stand should be called the Budge Stand. It should be called the Budge-Anderson Stand.

We should have a sponsor for all the Stands and the stadium.

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, boag1874 said:

Its been widely discussed that instead of a sell on fee % ie 10% of his next transfer fee (10-25% seems to be the benchmark so that might even be a bit modest) we instead had a fixed fee 6 figure payment for any future transfer out of Bologna when we sold him to them. He went for £14m with £4m in add ons so we could potentially have lost out on about an extra million, he was always going to go for about 8 figures & had a massive future

It looks like we got 10% of the transfer fee we sold him for somehow, we were in an extremely poor bargaining position through nobody at the clubs fault. 

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, Sooks said:

In all seriousness I am reluctant to even reply to some of the stupid Hibs AF comments about our hotel . It takes a deep and commuted hatred of Heart of Midlothian Football Club to pretend to yourself that it is not going to be a big coin 

I don’t think we really have much to compare a hotel in Gorgie too unfortunately, Kilmarnock had one i think but that was a while back. Ex Man U players have a hotel near OT but thats a different level obviously. I don’t think we’ll know until it opens really. 

[chrisyboy7]

4 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

Probably no more rows, maybe lose a couple even

 but offset by the fact it could be wider if you are pushing the wheatfield back, we could fill in that corner (one L-shape stand and make the wheatfield materially bigger if we have that pitch.  Think we could get to 25k but it probably costs £25million 

We just spent this so if it was possible once it can be again 

[mitch41]

Bottom line is is out Hearts first team going to be improved to a level where we make 3rd easily and get to another Scottish Cup final maybe beating Rangers at Hampden for once. 

[kingantti1874]

Just now, mitch41 said:

Bottom line is is out Hearts first team going to be improved to a level where we make 3rd easily and get to another Scottish Cup final maybe beating Rangers at Hampden for once. 

out turnover will be back to about £16m next season and the sheep will breach £20m . 

[1971fozzy]

The stadium extension thing has been done to death.  

[mitch41]

33 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

out turnover will be back to about £16m next season and the sheep will breach £20m . 

So we’re going to be relying on 3rd, winning the SCup, FOH, massive sales from hospitality, the bar, restaurants and hotel, full houses from now until the end of the season. I just hope the money gets put to good use……..on Hearts 1st team.

[Thomaso]

8 hours ago, stirlo said:

 

You are spot on. A lot of the chat about whether this is a good or indifferent set of accounts misses the point IMO. If we want to break well clear of Hibs and Aberdeen from a turnover point of view and start making some sort of inroads in the direction of the Old Firm, stadium capacity is absolutely the fundamental issue. The hotel is all well and good but I can't imagine it's going to be a game-changer for us in terms of turnover.

 

I'm not saying that in 10 years time we could be playing in front of 40,000, but what we do know is that there is considerably more demand for season tickets than the stadium can currently accommodate. There needs to be some sort of road-map in terms of where we go next on stadium capacity. 

 

Last I heard we have over 3,500 on the waiting list for season tickets. If we had more capacity to accommodate the waiting list alone that would generate over £1.2m extra revenue a year (3,500 x say £350).

[Armageddon]

After the hotel then the focus should be on our own private training facility.

[Wee Mikey]

10 minutes ago, Armageddon said:

After the hotel then the focus should be on our own private training facility.

 

What?

 

You think that's more urgent than a spa and an infinite pool?

 

Shame on you.

[Pasquale for King]

8 hours ago, stuart500 said:

Ann's middle name is apparently Winnie.

 

So I'm told it's going to be The Ann Winnie Budge Stand...

😆👍🏽👏🏾

[Marty-man]

1 hour ago, Wee Mikey said:

 

What?

 

You think that's more urgent than a spa and an infinite pool?

 

Shame on you.

 

The spa and infinite pool will generate income

[stirlo]

8 hours ago, Thomaso said:

Last I heard we have over 3,500 on the waiting list for season tickets. If we had more capacity to accommodate the waiting list alone that would generate over £1.2m extra revenue a year (3,500 x say £350).

 

The club reported the waiting list as being even higher than that back in the summer - but however big the waiting list, as all of us who are long-time supporters know, supporting a football club is a habit, so a high proportion of those people on the waiting list are folk who once they get used to spending their Saturday afternoons watching Hearts, are unlikely to lose that habit for a long time. It's very frustrating that the club is effectively having to turn people away who could become regular attendees for years to come.

Edited November 16, 2023 by stirlo

[jambo89]

19 hours ago, red said:

Love how you forgot the rest.......

Who did I forget then? Alex Cochrane and Stephen Humphrys? I’d say they also improved the squad. 
 

Alan Forrest, Jorge Grant are debatable, Kio I’ll grant you. 
 

But I’m interested in why you think there’s players weren’t an improvement on the last squad. 

[soonbe110]

8 hours ago, Thomaso said:

Last I heard we have over 3,500 on the waiting list for season tickets. If we had more capacity to accommodate the waiting list alone that would generate over £1.2m extra revenue a year (3,500 x say £350).

It would be quite a bit less than that when vat is deducted and the fact that a fair chunk of the tickets would be o65 and kids   Also reduced further when the value of any walk-up tickets that the 3,500 would have bought if they didn’t have seasons tickets. I’m assuming a good number of the waiting list currently buy walk-ups, could be wrong though. 

[TexasAndy]

10 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

The stadium extension thing has been done to death.  

Yes but it's just a debate about how we can jump a level and get a bit closer to the uglies.  Impossible maybe, improbable yes but there's no harm in reaching upwards.

Edited November 16, 2023 by TexasAndy

[Jim Panzee]

10 hours ago, mitch41 said:

So we’re going to be relying on 3rd, winning the SCup, FOH, massive sales from hospitality, the bar, restaurants and hotel, full houses from now until the end of the season. I just hope the money gets put to good use……..on Hearts 1st team.

I'd say "hoping for" as opposed to "relying on" Mitch.

 

Think it's fair to say we have good business people on the board - so banking on and thus budgeting against those income streams is too high a risk for them.

 

re: your point in bold - I think it is. As per an earlier post on here I think, we have international standard players joining us now compared to players recruited 2-3 years ago. I've read that it can take the second season for some new players to come good - at all clubs. Lets hope that applies to us

[Ray Gin]

16 hours ago, Boris5115 said:

I don't think you can build a bigger Gorgie Stand with the flats at the back. Look at the shape of the existing one it's smaller at the main stand side . Whilst demolishing the Wheatfield you could widen the pitch we would be stuck with the same length. 

 

We'd need to widen the end stands as well though if you wanted to widen the pitch.

[TheBigO]

10 hours ago, mitch41 said:

So we’re going to be relying on 3rd, winning the SCup, FOH, massive sales from hospitality, the bar, restaurants and hotel, full houses from now until the end of the season. I just hope the money gets put to good use……..on Hearts 1st team.

I'm not sure any top business DOESN'T rely on good performance!  Where I work, we're good at what we do and invest in ourselves.  And we put big targets on ourselves.  To do that, we need to perform.

 

A top hotel, a top restaurant is the same.  You budget on occupancy, on GP, spend per heid, all of that.  And you need to maintain it.  You do that in many ways - mine was always on standards.

 

Maybe it's not the point you're making Mitch, but I want us to plan our growth on performance.  Mad to say we need to win the SC to break even of course, but I want the business to be able to absorb a bad season, but be built to expect very few of them.

4 minutes ago, Jim Panzee said:

I'd say "hoping for" as opposed to "relying on" Mitch.

 

Think it's fair to say we have good business people on the board - so banking on and thus budgeting against those income streams is too high a risk for them.

 

re: your point in bold - I think it is. As per an earlier post on here I think, we have international standard players joining us now compared to players recruited 2-3 years ago. I've read that it can take the second season for some new players to come good - at all clubs. Lets hope that applies to us

Absolutely on recruitment.  I actually can't believe how bad people think it is!!!!  When was it better is my question?  VR's first year? Yeah, OK, bit of a one-off!  JJs mid to late 90s?  Wee while ago that...

 

Christ look at our squad year on year since I duno 2013 to give 10 years.  We're improving all the time.  I'm not actually sure what people want!  Christ moaning about Kye Rowles!!

[Jim Panzee]

5 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I'm not sure any top business DOESN'T rely on good performance!  Where I work, we're good at what we do and invest in ourselves.  And we put big targets on ourselves.  To do that, we need to perform.

 

A top hotel, a top restaurant is the same.  You budget on occupancy, on GP, spend per heid, all of that.  And you need to maintain it.  You do that in many ways - mine was always on standards.

 

Maybe it's not the point you're making Mitch, but I want us to plan our growth on performance.  Mad to say we need to win the SC to break even of course, but I want the business to be able to absorb a bad season, but be built to expect very few of them.

Absolutely on recruitment.  I actually can't believe how bad people think it is!!!!  When was it better is my question?  VR's first year? Yeah, OK, bit of a one-off!  JJs mid to late 90s?  Wee while ago that...

 

Christ look at our squad year on year since I duno 2013 to give 10 years.  We're improving all the time.  I'm not actually sure what people want!  Christ moaning about Kye Rowles!!

Kye Rowles or Mihai Popescu.....

 

 

[chrisyboy7]

11 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

out turnover will be back to about £16m next season and the sheep will breach £20m . 

Verily true but the sheep need a new stadium ours fir now is finished