Israel and Palestine

[Luckies1874]

2 minutes ago, Felix Lighter said:

 

"These people are fanatical, irrational, illogical, cannot be reasoned with."

You've basically described yourself there. If you're a Hearts fan I'm Santa Clause. That you have nearly 3,000 posts on the Orange Man Bad thread speaks volumes. 

Here's the thing, if the Orange Man had left $70 Billion worth of military gear to the Taliban or recently gifted $6 Billion to Iran you'd be going doolally. 

 

Ouch. Well said. 

[JFK-1]

52 minutes ago, Felix Lighter said:

 

"These people are fanatical, irrational, illogical, cannot be reasoned with."

You've basically described yourself there. If you're a Hearts fan I'm Santa Clause. That you have nearly 3,000 posts on the Orange Man Bad thread speaks volumes. 

Here's the thing, if the Orange Man had left $70 Billion worth of military gear to the Taliban or recently gifted $6 Billion to Iran you'd be going doolally. 

 

You don't even know what you're talking about do you? You're rambling all over the place. Is it Israel is it an obsession with me is it Trump?

 

Okay let's try your first one, tell me what's irrational and illogical about me.

 

You're either just not even going to try by acting as if that were never said to babble on to some other meaningles tangent. Or say something really absurd. Prove me wrong.

 

I'm caustic, irrational and illogical is what you're being then projecting it. Seen that before.

[Felix Lighter]

4 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

You don't even know what you're talking about do you? You're rambling all over the place. Is it Israel is it an obsession with me is it Trump?

 

Okay let's try your first one, tell me what's irrational and illogical about me.

 

You're either just not even going to try by acting as if that were never said to babble on to some other meaningles tangent. Or say something really absurd. Prove me wrong.

 

I'm caustic, irrational and illogical is what you're being then projecting it. Seen that before.

 

I've been around JKB for the best part of twenty years, I learned a long time ago not to post when I'm drunk.

[Lovecraft]

 

 

It will sadly never, ever end until there is one totally dominant religion.

 

Or none.

 

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

17 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

 

I can assure you what they hit was indeed the homes of Hamas militants

17 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

 

   
 

when one over-sized emoji just isn’t enough

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

[JFK-1]

Just now, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

   
 

when one over-sized emoji just isn’t enough

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

Yeah stick to smileys, that's your level isn't it, non speaker. Now go to ignore and play with smileys months.

 

In fact do more I won't even see, I'm reliably informed ignored people continue trying g to talk to me for months. That will give you something to do.

[JFK-1]

1 hour ago, Felix Lighter said:

 

I've been around JKB for the best part of twenty years, I learned a long time ago not to post when I'm drunk.

 

You drunk now? Exactly like I predicted, babble vacuous drivel then when it's questioned act like it never happened.

 

Get out of my sight into ignore with the smiley simpleton. You can be Beavis to his Butthead

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

2 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Yeah stick to smileys, that's your level isn't it, non speaker. Now go to ignore and play with smileys months.

 

In fact do more I won't even see, I'm reliably informed ignored people continue trying g to talk to me for months. That will give you something to do.

oh no not again “the ignore button”
 

 

 

this time from the head of the CIA or whatever the body is that has the assurance on these retaliatory attacks on the heads of Hamas

 

“all the targets successfully hit ? yeah I think so I just need to get assurance from the top man but he’s posting on kickback at the moment”

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

5 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

…..,,, with the smiley simpleton.

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

1 hour ago, Lovecraft said:

 

 

It will sadly never, ever end until there is one totally dominant religion.

 

Or none.

 

 

 

None sounds good to me.  Not gonna happen, though.  People are too gullible.

[Tazio]

3 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Show me constantly lashing out. I'm responding, he waffled a pile of shite at me. How do you suggest I respond to his shit? Applaud it?

 

2 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

You don't even know what you're talking about do you? You're rambling all over the place. Is it Israel is it an obsession with me is it Trump?

 

Okay let's try your first one, tell me what's irrational and illogical about me.

 

You're either just not even going to try by acting as if that were never said to babble on to some other meaningles tangent. Or say something really absurd. Prove me wrong.

 

I'm caustic, irrational and illogical is what you're being then projecting it. Seen that before.

 

1 hour ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Yeah stick to smileys, that's your level isn't it, non speaker. Now go to ignore and play with smileys months.

 

In fact do more I won't even see, I'm reliably informed ignored people continue trying g to talk to me for months. That will give you something to do.

 

1 hour ago, JFK-1 said:

 

You drunk now? Exactly like I predicted, babble vacuous drivel then when it's questioned act like it never happened.

 

Get out of my sight into ignore with the smiley simpleton. You can be Beavis to his Butthead

Nope. No lashing out from you at all. Or is this you just pointing out to people they don’t have as finely tuned an intellect as you? 

[JFK-1]

10 minutes ago, Tazio said:

Nope. No lashing out from you at all. Or is this you just pointing out to people they don’t have as finely tuned an intellect as you? 

 

Correct about no lashing out, I'm dishing out suitable response to people clearly trying to mess with me, did you miss that bit? You just pick out my responses ses but never what I'm responding to? Are you trying to mess with me?

 

A finely tuned intellect? That's really what you come up with here after entirely ignoring what I'm responding to?

 

What about the genius who said I was illogical etc. then when asked for an example days he doesn't post when drunk, immediately after posting like a drunk. Did you miss all that?

[Lovecraft]

14 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Correct about no lashing out, I'm dishing out suitable response to people clearly trying to mess with me, did you miss that bit? You just pick out my responses ses but never what I'm responding to? Are you trying to mess with me?

 

A finely tuned intellect? That's really what you come up with here after entirely ignoring what I'm responding to?

 

What about the genius who said I was illogical etc. then when asked for an example days he doesn't post when drunk, immediately after posting like a drunk. Did you miss all that?

Mate, you wanna step back a wee bit from posting.

 

 

[JFK-1]

1 minute ago, Lovecraft said:

Mate, you wanna step back a wee bit from posting.

 

 

 

I'm not posting, I'm responding to people quoting me. You wanna have a word with them?

[Lovecraft]

Just now, JFK-1 said:

 

I'm not posting, I'm responding to people quoting me. You wanna have a word with them?

Don't get involved.  Just take a step back back.

 

 

[JFK-1]

2 hours ago, Lovecraft said:

Don't get involved.  Just take a step back back.

 

 

 

I think I frequently do, or maybe push back would be more descriptive. I dump anything talking while saying nothing into ignore, that stops it. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

Western governments so horrified by the Palestinian attack on Israel are also the governments that are remaining silent as Israel turns off the electricity to the prison that is Gaza - again in supposed "retaliation". 

The collective punishment of two million Palestinians in Gaza, dependent on Israel for power because Israel surrounds and controls every aspect of their lives in the enclave, is a war crime. 
 

https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/gaza-israel-west-hypocrisy-jailbreak-stomach-turning
 

A good article explaining the reality for ordinary Palestinians of the war crimes currently taking place against them by Israel and are being misreported by the West and supported by countries such as the UK.

[Malinga the Swinga]

8 hours ago, the posh bit said:

 

I don't doubt that there is a lot of truth in everything you have posted here. It's a great post. 

 

Does it pain you when you read the same folk posting about the war in the Ukraine and quasi wars and 'Murica and all that?

It does, although I don't get Murica bit.

There's no grey areas anymore, it's either pro Israel or pro Palestine, pro Ukraine or pro Russia.

These are massively complicated geo political events, folk have worked for years to try and resolve them and got nowhere so why would here by different.

Much like the US political thread, the ones on our governments and the ones on any religious stuff, and any thread at all, it goes round and round and not one person ever changes their view. 5% are fanatically against something, 5% are fanatically for it while 90% wish it had never happened at all.

For that reason, I'll step out and leave to the fanatics.

[AlphonseCapone]

Iran denying direct involvement in actually helping with this assault rather than simply being supportive and the US also saying they've seen no evidence. That might be true or both sides might be trying to avoid this spreading wider.

 

Everyone knows that the Israeli response is going to be massive, the rhetoric that it is their 9/11 is obviously setting up for whatever response they're going to do. The US has sent an aircraft carrier to the Eastern Med and some other ships as a deterrent. And they will be presumably speaking to other countries in the area including Iran behind the scenes. Will the conversation to Iran be that you can say what you like publicly but if you allow Hezbollah to get involved in this then we'll also step in or is that a move the US wouldn't risk?

 

Israel must also be looking at Iran. If you really want to deal with militants long term then their backers and suppliers must be where you look rather than continually bombing the small area of Gaza and killing thousands of civilians. Hamas have planned this so well and they knew a counter attack by air immediately would come so it's not they won't have moved everything they can to schools and hospitals for protection. But no one, anywhere wants a direct confrontation between Israel and Iran, not even Iran I don't think, so maybe the US are using that as a bargaining chip with Iran regarding whether they will or won't keep Israel on a chain.

 

Unfortunately for ordinary folk in Gaza, no matter what, absolute devastation is coming their way and the world is likely to look away to save a widening conflict.

[il Duce McTarkin]

7 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

 

Okay let's try your first one, tell me what's irrational and illogical about me.

 

 

 

Your habitual drug use, misplaced arrogance, and propensity for poorly deployed hyperbole.

 

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by il Duce McTarkin

[Sooperstar]

1 hour ago, il Duce McTarkin said:

 

Your habitual drug use, misplaced arrogance, and propensity for poorly deployed hyperbole.

 

 

But what else?

[Dennis Reynolds]

Think someone needs a cigarette.

[Spellczech]

9 hours ago, Lovecraft said:

 

 

It will sadly never, ever end until there is one totally dominant religion.

 

Or none.

 

 

It's not merely religious. It is also tribal ie land

[That thing you do]

See it's reported Israel has no intention of negotiating for the hostages release.

 

If true, their hopes are grim as Hamas will put them right in harms way.

 

I really hope they all get back home  somehow.

 

 

[Boab]

1 hour ago, AlphonseCapone said:

Iran denying direct involvement in actually helping with this assault rather than simply being supportive and the US also saying they've seen no evidence. That might be true or both sides might be trying to avoid this spreading wider.

 

Everyone knows that the Israeli response is going to be massive, the rhetoric that it is their 9/11 is obviously setting up for whatever response they're going to do. The US has sent an aircraft carrier to the Eastern Med and some other ships as a deterrent. And they will be presumably speaking to other countries in the area including Iran behind the scenes. Will the conversation to Iran be that you can say what you like publicly but if you allow Hezbollah to get involved in this then we'll also step in or is that a move the US wouldn't risk?

 

Israel must also be looking at Iran. If you really want to deal with militants long term then their backers and suppliers must be where you look rather than continually bombing the small area of Gaza and killing thousands of civilians. Hamas have planned this so well and they knew a counter attack by air immediately would come so it's not they won't have moved everything they can to schools and hospitals for protection. But no one, anywhere wants a direct confrontation between Israel and Iran, not even Iran I don't think, so maybe the US are using that as a bargaining chip with Iran regarding whether they will or won't keep Israel on a chain.

 

Unfortunately for ordinary folk in Gaza, no matter what, absolute devastation is coming their way and the world is likely to look away to save a widening conflict.

Good post.

A tragedy for normal people.

No need for the US and Iran to face up directly. They’ll both continue as before.

The 9/11 comment tells me the Israelis will go after backers. Most likely Hezbollah in Lebanon and hit them very hard. Don’t think it will extend beyond that but it will be devastating.

[Spellczech]

1 hour ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

It does, although I don't get Murica bit.

There's no grey areas anymore, it's either pro Israel or pro Palestine, pro Ukraine or pro Russia.

These are massively complicated geo political events, folk have worked for years to try and resolve them and got nowhere so why would here by different.

Much like the US political thread, the ones on our governments and the ones on any religious stuff, and any thread at all, it goes round and round and not one person ever changes their view. 5% are fanatically against something, 5% are fanatically for it while 90% wish it had never happened at all.

For that reason, I'll step out and leave to the fanatics.

Israel/Palestine is as grey as it gets. Neither leadership is in the right.  I find it impossible to support either. Israel once tried to be tolerant but then they were the winners out of WW2 in that region (which is quite a statement in itself admittedly) although the 1948 partition plan was quite absurd - why did the UN ever think that would work? It is and is always likely to be an utter mess.

[il Duce McTarkin]

On 07/10/2023 at 14:46, Cade said:

Most people don't quite fully grasp the sheer scale of the illegal  Israeli settlements.

The darker areas of this map are under full Palestinian control.

The lighter bits are under shared control.

The lightest bits (i.e. most of the map) is under full Israeli control.

 

And I'd remind you that this map is of what's left of Palestine; it's not even Israel.

 

This is not just one or two heidbangers setting up a wee camp here and there.

It's a systematic assimilation and hostile takeover.

The Palestinians are living on reservations in their own country FFS.

 

Israel says it does not condone illegal settlements but at the same time sends its soldiers to take part under the guise of "protecting Israeli citizens" then builds roads connecting the settlements under the same shitey excuse.

Whenever Israel talks of "peace" what they really mean is "victory".

 

It should be obvious to anyone that the two-state solution is dead and has been for about thirty years.
The UN and the rest of the world has simply sat back and let it happen.

I'm sure that Israel will eventually take over all of the West Bank and the remaining Palestinians will be forced off the land.

Israel is a dangerous military theocracy run by racist fundamentalists.

Any Palestinian remaining will be living in a horrible apartheid state.

 

They pretty much do anyhow, since Israel controls the electricity, government coffers, telephone exchange and postal service of the Palestinian authority already.

 

Israel was supposed to be "the only safe haven for Jews"

And somewhere along the line it turned into "a safe haven ONLY for Jews" 

 

But as I said, Hamas and the other militant organisations only make things worse; they wreck the international goodwill and sympathy which the Palestinian cause deserves and give the Israelis an excuse for excessive reprisals and accelerations of settlement building. 

 

 

 

Excellent post.

 

11 hours ago, doctor jambo said:

Normal headed people just want to live in peace with their neighbours.

Work, live and exist without threat.

Most couldn’t even give a shiny shit about borders or government as long as they stop being killed.

Factions playing risk with real people .

More thousands killed , and no victor in sight.

More hatred bred .

More graves in the sand.

I hate the games our masters play.

 

This.

 

10 hours ago, Luckies1874 said:

How did the US and Israeli intelligence services have no idea about this attack?  It seems incredible there would be no intel, almost improbable in fact. 

 

Is it beyond the realms of possibility that these attacks were allowed to happen in order to justify the response? Netanyahu and his ilk need to consolidate their hold on power.

 

2 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

It does, although I don't get Murica bit.

There's no grey areas anymore, it's either pro Israel or pro Palestine, pro Ukraine or pro Russia.

These are massively complicated geo political events, folk have worked for years to try and resolve them and got nowhere so why would here by different.

Much like the US political thread, the ones on our governments and the ones on any religious stuff, and any thread at all, it goes round and round and not one person ever changes their view. 5% are fanatically against something, 5% are fanatically for it while 90% wish it had never happened at all.

For that reason, I'll step out and leave to the fanatics.

 

This is your best post on Kickback.

[JudyJudyJudy]

This 

[Spellczech]

5 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

This 

Conflict doesn't mean there is equal footing - Ukraine is not equal with Russia; Argentina was not equal with the UK (though logistics made it a bit more equal). The above is just propaganda BS - probably written by one J.Corbyn

Edited October 9, 2023 by Spellczech

[Gundermann]

36 minutes ago, Dennis Reynolds said:

Think someone needs a cigarette.

I think they need a pull of something else.

[Gundermann]

8 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Conflict doesn't mean there is equal footing - Ukraine is not equal with Russia; Argentina was not equal with the UK (though logistics made it a bit more equal). The above is just propaganda BS - probably written by one J.Corbyn

 

You may quibble over the definition of 'conflict' but that graphic explains matters fairly well. What in it is wrong?

 

Worth remembering Israel's beginnings and the capture and murder of two British soldiers. I also recall the Brits over there being horrified at the Israeli massacres of Palestinian civillians.

[Des Lynam]

6 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

This 

I would have to disagree. They are surrounded by neighbours who openly talk about the destruction of Israel. Hamas refuse to negotiate. They are stuck in a furious cycle of hatred that’s beyond comprehension. Just blaming Israel is too simplistic. They both have reasonable enough claims to the land. Maybe gifting the land wasn’t a great idea by the British after the Second World War. 

[Spellczech]

3 minutes ago, Gundermann said:

 

You may quibble over the definition of 'conflict' but that graphic explains matters fairly well. What in it is wrong?

 

Worth remembering Israel's beginnings and the capture and murder of two British soldiers. I also recall the Brits over there being horrified at the Israeli massacres of Palestinian civillians.

? I said exactly what in it is wrong. The basic statement - called "myth" with a big red cross...Then the statement of "fact" is also wrong: "a conflict means there is equal footing" -> no it doesn't!

 

It is no more true or factual than a conspiracy theory. It makes a statement of fact, which is not a fact and then spins from there...

Edited October 9, 2023 by Spellczech

[Gundermann]

24 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

It's not merely religious. It is also tribal ie land

 

Or on the other hand, they are/ or were the 'same' Semitic people. Arabic and Hebrew are very close. One says Saalam, the other Shalom.

 

Probably not too dissimliar to the Irish situation where you can have 'Brit Protestants' with Irish Gaelic names at war with Irish Catholics with Irish Gaelic names. See a certain Kyle Lafferty whose name is as 'fenian' (in the true sense) as any.

[doctor jambo]

2 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

I would have to disagree. They are surrounded by neighbours who openly talk about the destruction of Israel. Hamas refuse to negotiate. They are stuck in a furious cycle of hatred that’s beyond comprehension. Just blaming Israel is too simplistic. They both have reasonable enough claims to the land. Maybe gifting the land wasn’t a great idea by the British after the Second World War. 

The land gifting cannot be undone.

it just cannot.

the point also remains that Israel is a developed democracy in a hinterland of shit.

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

7 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

They both have reasonable enough claims to the land. Maybe

Both ? I world disagree . 

[JudyJudyJudy]

6 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

The land gifting cannot be undone.

it just cannot.

the point also remains that Israel is a developed democracy in a hinterland of shit.

 

 

[Des Lynam]

8 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

The land gifting cannot be undone.

it just cannot.

the point also remains that Israel is a developed democracy in a hinterland of shit.

 

As you say we are where we are regarding the land. Israel should cease from building settlements though. I fully agree with your last point. 
 

4 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

Both ? I world disagree . 

 

Oh without a doubt. There is more than enough historical evidence to allow the Jewish people to argue that fact. 

[doctor jambo]

17 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

Both ? I world disagree . 

The Jews were on the land before Islam even existed .

Whether any religion should have a homeland is another matter, but the natural response to frequent attempts at extermination was to find somewhere they could find sanctuary, and Hollywood wasn’t invented back then 🙃

[redjambo]

7 hours ago, Lovecraft said:

Mate, you wanna step back a wee bit from posting.

 

 

Not wanting to get involved, but doing it anyway, can I add my name to the folk advising @JFK-1 to calm down a bit. Usually a decent poster, he's been over-the-top with the virulence of his attacks on this thread, imo.

[JudyJudyJudy]

10 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

and Hollywood wasn’t invented back then 🙃

 

[il Duce McTarkin]

10 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Usually a decent poster, 

 

[redjambo]

Just now, il Duce McTarkin said:

 

 

Sorry, was that a bit over the top?

[JudyJudyJudy]

3 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Sorry, was that a bit over the top?

Well for a self confessed toker he seems to be blowing a gasket on this thread . Takes the heat off me though . 😂

 

 

on a serious note I just find it all depressing and I’m just going into a news blackout again regarding this situation, like I did with Ukraine . There’s nothing I can do about . 

[vegas-voss]

Sin what happens in that region.In the one hand Hamas are not right in what they are doing as it only inflicts more harm on the innocent civilians and it's not right what Israel have been allowed to do there for decades.

[highlandjambo3]

Religion eh 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

[biglaff]

I am waiting on someone using the The Protocols of the Elders of Zion as an excuse for Hamas.

[Ministryofdad]

On 08/10/2023 at 09:01, Diadora Van Basten said:

Israel kill more people than Russia, they create more refugees than Russia, they steal land like Russia but we are supposed to believe that Russia do it because they are crazy whilst Israel do it to because they are supposedly under attack. It’s utter garbage.

All European infulance fault. 

The UN allowed the Jews to take pieces of Jordan and Egypt name it Israel. Whilst drawing lines on a map to create it. 

Palestine is a region not a country. All because the bible said so. 

 

There will always be war there. 

[Herbert.]

**** them both. 1 is a terrorist run state the other is an American puppet. We should ignore them and leave them to it.

[il Duce McTarkin]

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

 

Sorry, was that a bit over the top?

 

😄👍

 

Just a wee bit, red.