TYNECASTLE STADIUM UPGRADE POTENTIAL - UEFA category 4 granted ( updated/merged )

[kingantti1874]

8 hours ago, iwasthere1954 said:

Nothing to do with the design. The council put a limit on the capacity because of the tanks in the distillery. This has been pointed out on numerous occasions. 

20,000 deaths are acceptable by 25,000 deaths are not 😂

 

Bunch of morons

[Deevers]

9 hours ago, iwasthere1954 said:

Nothing to do with the design. The council put a limit on the capacity because of the tanks in the distillery. This has been pointed out on numerous occasions. 

Was there not some talk a few years ago about the distillery decommissioning these tanks and their function being moved elsewhere? If that is the case, or is planned for the future, there would be no reason why negations couldn’t not be started to buy up land at the back of the Wheatfield stand from the distillery and rebuild a bigger stand using that ground.

Edited June 23, 2022 by Deevers

[johnking123]

We would have to buy pitch and car park of the distillery.  We do that the could have a small plaza space and bigger stand at same time.

[kingantti1874]

3 minutes ago, johnking123 said:

We would have to buy pitch and car park of the distillery.  We do that the could have a small plaza space and bigger stand at same time.

If we were doing it could do the roseburn at the same time and make the pitch a couple of metres longer and wider.  Fill in that corner 

Edited June 23, 2022 by kingantti1874

[Kiwidoug]

AB stated that we were working hard to develop the 2nd floor of the msin stand for commercial purposes.  She wouldn't have sais it of it wasn't happening.

 

Looking forwar to developments.

[johnking123]

8 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

If we were doing it could do the roseburn at the same time and make the pitch a couple of metres longer and wider.  Fill in that corner 

Could do it in stages that way. Do the wheatfield first and make it cantilever.  Then later on change the roofs of Gorgie and Roseburn stands. Then you could fill corners in. Would cost the same as main stand.

[Thought Police]

13 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

Shame we couldn't have added another 1000 to the main stand when we had the chance. There's loads of space back there that hasn't been utilised.

 

I tend to agree. I love the main stand but I remember being disappointed at the time that it was essentially just a like for like of the other stands. I understand wanting the symmetry and keeping the enclosed space, but definitely could have looked at a two-tier model.

[Newton51]

2 minutes ago, Thought Police said:

I tend to agree. I love the main stand but I remember being disappointed at the time that it was essentially just a like for like of the other stands. I understand wanting the symmetry and keeping the enclosed space, but definitely could have looked at a two-tier model.

I’m similar that I love the main stand but thought we would be trying to get capacity closer to 25k tho read about limits due to distillery nearby. I do agree that should be only hearts but maximising away income shouldn’t be easily dismissed 

[KyleLafferty]

We shouldn’t be thinking about increasing the stadium unless for a few years we continue these season ticket sales. If we have a shite season etc then it will go back down. It’s got to be consistent.

[A_A wehatethehibs]

3 minutes ago, Thought Police said:

I tend to agree. I love the main stand but I remember being disappointed at the time that it was essentially just a like for like of the other stands. I understand wanting the symmetry and keeping the enclosed space, but definitely could have looked at a two-tier model.

Been said so many times, it was cost prohibitive for a number of reason including planning constraints. 
 

You get diminishing returns IE it would’ve cost an additional £20m or £30m we did not have, for not a lot of extra seats. Plus the time cost as it would take a lot longer to construct. PLUS having to knock down the pilons and totally re design the roofs of the other 2 end stands. The pilons have a maximum load they can bear. 
 

Always remember, done is better than perfect. Perfectionism stops anything from ever getting done. Look at Pittodrie. 

 

The new stand added 3500+ seats to the capacity, which is what has enabled the current growth. Without that growth we’d still be capped at 14k season tickets. The stadium Budge inherited had 16k capacity and a money pit end of life old main stand. 

 

We’ve more than doubled our hospitality capacity as well. It has added a big wedge to our revenue.

The wrong design decisions were made in the early 1990s. The stadium as-is in terms of realistic cost, has been maximised to its potential. The next project would be new Gorgie / Wheatfield. 

[davemclaren]

4 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Been said so many times, it was cost prohibitive for a number of reason including planning constraints. 
 

You get diminishing returns IE it would’ve cost an additional £20m or £30m we did not have, for not a lot of extra seats. Plus the time cost as it would take a lot longer to construct. PLUS having to knock down the pilons and totally re design the roofs of the other 2 end stands. The pilons have a maximum load they can bear. 
 

Always remember, done is better than perfect. Perfectionism stops anything from ever getting done. Look at Pittodrie. 

 

The new stand added 3500+ seats to the capacity, which is what has enabled the current growth. Without that growth we’d still be capped at 14k season tickets. The stadium Budge inherited had 16k capacity and a money pit end of life old main stand. 

 

We’ve more than doubled our hospitality capacity as well. It has added a big wedge to our revenue.

The wrong design decisions were made in the early 1990s. The stadium as-is in terms of realistic cost, has been maximised to its potential. The next project would be new Gorgie / Wheatfield. 

The 1990 decisions were made driven by cost as well. Plus the fact there were no land expansion options then and we had a hard time limit due to the Taylor report.  We’ve done not too bad though imo. 

[D4nny_]

"Heart of Midlothian have the ability to add more lights to accommodate changing regulations or have the ability to install specialist lights and management software to enable the light shows common at many large stadiums."

 

Disco Lights!

[A_A wehatethehibs]

Just now, davemclaren said:

The 1990 decisions were made driven by cost as well. Plus the fact there were no land expansion options then and we had a hard time limit due to the Taylor report.  We’ve done not too bad though imo. 

You are right but I just can’t fathom how the pylon design saved much cost vs a cantilever design. It cannot have saved that much. We’ll never know. But we do know that it has added at least £10m onto the cost of expanding the other side of the ground with a new wheatfield. As you’d need to put a new roof on the 2 end stands which adds cost while adding nothing to capacity.

[davemclaren]

54 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

You are right but I just can’t fathom how the pylon design saved much cost vs a cantilever design. It cannot have saved that much. We’ll never know. But we do know that it has added at least £10m onto the cost of expanding the other side of the ground with a new wheatfield. As you’d need to put a new roof on the 2 end stands which adds cost while adding nothing to capacity.

don’t you need somewhere behind the stands to balance the cantilevers? We are totally hemmed in, apart from the main stand. 

[Thomaso]

2 hours ago, Thought Police said:

I tend to agree. I love the main stand but I remember being disappointed at the time that it was essentially just a like for like of the other stands. I understand wanting the symmetry and keeping the enclosed space, but definitely could have looked at a two-tier model.

Fans were throwing their hands up in horror at spending £22m - imagine if we had built a two tier model? 🙈

[Thomaso]

42 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

don’t you need somewhere behind the stands to balance the cantilevers? We are totally hemmed in, apart from the main stand. 

Correct Dave. There just wasn’t enough space behind the three previous stands to accommodate a canteliver design.

[Fort Vallance]

2 hours ago, Thought Police said:

I tend to agree. I love the main stand but I remember being disappointed at the time that it was essentially just a like for like of the other stands. I understand wanting the symmetry and keeping the enclosed space, but definitely could have looked at a two-tier model.

And then you could see the castle from the Skyline lounge without standing on a chair.😁

[johnking123]

1 hour ago, davemclaren said:

don’t you need somewhere behind the stands to balance the cantilevers? We are totally hemmed in, apart from the main stand. 

Not really dave. Depends on the design you want. It's the top half that tends to hangover.

[iwasthere1954]

5 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

20,000 deaths are acceptable by 25,000 deaths are not 😂

 

Bunch of morons

Exactly my thoughts.

[Wee Mikey]

2 hours ago, D4nny_ said:

"Heart of Midlothian have the ability to add more lights to accommodate changing regulations or have the ability to install specialist lights and management software to enable the light shows common at many large stadiums."

 

Disco Lights!

 

Yippee!!! All that's needed then is a new post-Scott Wison disco themed playlist and it'll be party time down Gorgie.

 

1st up should be Ottowan D.I.S.C.O with amended lyrics; e.g.:-

 

Singing ''D" - "Dump the H1b5"
Singing "I" - "I'm a Jambo"
Singing "S" - "Super Skácel"
Singing "C" - "Craig Gordon"
And "O, Oh, Oh" ....

 

 

[Thomaso]

43 minutes ago, johnking123 said:

Not really dave. Depends on the design you want. It's the top half that tends to hangover.

I think you need steelwork at the rear to counter balance the hangover of the roof. We did not own enough land to the rear of the three stand to accommodate the overhang.

[johnking123]

1 minute ago, Thomaso said:

I think you need steelwork at the rear to counter balance the hangover of the roof. We did not own enough land to the rear of the three stand to accommodate the overhang.

That is true. The wheatfield was pushed right up against the old distillery building.  We could do it now. But any building will need purchase of land. 

[Wee Mikey]

A lot of the chat has been about how to support the roof structure, so how about this as a left-field solution?:-

 

Remove the existing roofs and replace them with an all-weather lightweight covering that allows enough light. Something like Dynamic Earth; surely retractable with modern technology.

 

Just a thought ...

 

 

 

[johnking123]

Posted this before.  Was to expensive it the time or really do think next build will be away from tynecastle.

[cruzabic]

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

[Phil D. Corners]

25 minutes ago, Wee Mikey said:

A lot of the chat has been about how to support the roof structure, so how about this as a left-field solution?:-

 

Remove the existing roofs and replace them with an all-weather lightweight covering that allows enough light. Something like Dynamic Earth; surely retractable with modern technology.

 

Just a thought ...

 

 

 

Bayer Leverkusen took roofs off their stands and out a big circular roof on. Looks great.   

[GBJambo]

4 minutes ago, cruzabic said:

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

Plastics? Have a word with yourself 🤦🏻
 

They have committed to a season ticket 

[Phil D. Corners]

8 minutes ago, cruzabic said:

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

 

[Wee Mikey]

7 minutes ago, Phil D. Corners said:

Bayer Leverkusen took roofs off their stands and out a big circular roof on. Looks great.   

 

Photo?

[Wee Mikey]

12 minutes ago, cruzabic said:

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

 

Are you the son of the Pieman?

[Herbert.]

11 minutes ago, cruzabic said:

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

 

 

Nowhere in Edinburgh is really, any available space is getting new housing or student flats. I think we're stuck at Tynecastle and unless we spent a few seasons at murrayfield so we can demolish the 3 old stands there's not going to be any change.

[Sooks]

Gorgie gets a raw deal it is no where near as bad an area as some people like to make out I have nothing but fond memories of my time living there

[Phil D. Corners]

4 minutes ago, Wee Mikey said:

 

Photo?

[The Tackle]

5 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Gorgie gets a raw deal it is no where near as bad an area as some people like to make out I have nothing but fond memories of my time living there

Never lived there but I went to Tynecastle High school and I used to drink in Gorgie. It’s not actually a bad area. I have fond memories of it too

[Sooks]

1 minute ago, The Tackle said:

Never lived there but I went to Tynecastle High school and I used to drink in Gorgie. It’s not actually a bad area. I have fond memories of it too

 

Totally theres nothing wrong with it 

[Wee Mikey]

8 minutes ago, Phil D. Corners said:

 

Yup, something like that could be done.

[OTT]

50 minutes ago, cruzabic said:

We sell out like 3 times a season...until we sell out every week for 5 years there's no point in having a bigger stadium. We don't need bigger just because we've had a wee uptake from the plastics who only come back when we're winning. They'll all soon be gone when we haven't won the league by Christmas.

 

ALSO, if we are ever going to move, it will be away from gorgie as the area isn't fit for purpose.

I disagree. If you’re selling out every game you’re losing revenue as presumably people aren’t able to get tickets. You also have a supply and demand problem with the ticket price. What happens when more casual fans give up because they don’t want to spend silly money on a crap seat? Beyond that, I think you’re setting a very difficult bar to reach. Selling out against Ross county or St Mirren and Livi is a tough ask. But if we’re selling out against the OF, Hibs and Aberdeen and carrying over a decent % of that into those less appealing games I think that’s a positive sign. 
 

What I will concede is that there is a line between big enough to grow into and too big and for the sake of season ticket sales, there maybe is something in some degree of scarcity. 
 

If the stadium could be increased up to say 23k, I think we’d be striking the right balance. But there is a host of problems with further expansion as others have pointed out. 
 

I think we’re heading towards a pretty difficult conversation about the stadium if these problems cannot be overcome. 

[Wee Mikey]

46 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Totally theres nothing wrong with it 

 

And quite a lot going for it too.

[A_A wehatethehibs]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

I disagree. If you’re selling out every game you’re losing revenue as presumably people aren’t able to get tickets. You also have a supply and demand problem with the ticket price. What happens when more casual fans give up because they don’t want to spend silly money on a crap seat? Beyond that, I think you’re setting a very difficult bar to reach. Selling out against Ross county or St Mirren and Livi is a tough ask. But if we’re selling out against the OF, Hibs and Aberdeen and carrying over a decent % of that into those less appealing games I think that’s a positive sign. 
 

What I will concede is that there is a line between big enough to grow into and too big and for the sake of season ticket sales, there maybe is something in some degree of scarcity. 
 

If the stadium could be increased up to say 23k, I think we’d be striking the right balance. But there is a host of problems with further expansion as others have pointed out. 
 

I think we’re heading towards a pretty difficult conversation about the stadium if these problems cannot be overcome. 

 

We’re not heading for any difficult conversations. The conversation is as follows: We’re staying at Tynecastle, as-is, in it’s current form, with zero major changes to the stadium for the foreseeable future, but a few minor upgrades such as big screens. Beginning, middle and end of conversation.
 

The club are still only now getting these new revenues ramped up to full power, and getting these increased revenues investing toward the squad.

 

Say what you want with Levein, it is a fact that the club had a reduced budget for 3 seasons due to the stadium work and the squad paid the price, a lethal cocktail combined with  his own incompetence which was obviously 90% of

the problem. But that 10% of the problem was, budget wise money was going to pay for the stand. And then COVID mess happened and the bloody stadium was empty for a year. 

 

So what that means is it’s only now we’re seeing what the full potential is.
 

Neilson & Savage has subsequently come in and post lockdown, they are only now getting Tynecastle Park up at full power with the strong sales this year. 
 

So the main stand expansion +3500 capacity increase, and within that a doubling of hospitality, this current upgrade is still current and very very relevant to our club, we have just finished this project including the last stages of the interior as well. It lhas enabled what could potentially be the biggest season ticket sales and biggest average attendence at Tynecastle in more than 30 years going back to 1992. Plus it will definitely be the biggest sales of hospitality as well as that’ll be near enough the only way to get a ticket. We could potentially average over 19k depending how results go. We will also have the biggest number of sell out fixtures in a season at Tynecastle since 2004 with 4 home European group stage ties guaranteed as well. The stadium as-is is fantastic and will power our club for the next decade minimum. Probably 2 decades. 
 

So folks should, in the immediate term, stop engaging with unrealistic fantasies about filling corners or new wheatfield stands etc,  it is not happening any time soon, unless we manage to miraculously qualify for the champions league group stage and net £40m - that’s the type of minimum sum needed to pay for a meaningful redevelopment of wheatfield. Thats 40 years of FoH money. Or 10 successive years of getting in Europa groups and possibly getting to knockouts a couple of times.
 

Realistically it’s all about cementing ourselves above Hibs and above Aberdeen.
 

That’s what Tynecastle of today offers us the chance to do. Hibs are in a panic to try to copy Tynecastle and catch up, but their facilities are simply not in the same class. Aberdeen are just ****ed. We’ve got a decade worth of the advantage over them 2 clubs and if we keep that lead we will move ahead of them on player sales as well. 

 

The club is only at the very beginning of the journey with the current, fully completed Tynecastle Park. 

Edited June 23, 2022 by A_A wehatethehibs

[Bongo 1874]

 

 

[King Of The Cat Cafe]

1 hour ago, Sooks said:

Gorgie gets a raw deal it is no where near as bad an area as some people like to make out I have nothing but fond memories of my time living there

 

Good point.  We should remember that maybe just 30 years ago there were parts of Edinburgh with a worse reputation than Gorgie has now.

 

Creeping gentrification has brought places up at a rapid pace.  Increasing property prices are bound to push people out.  Indeed, we are already seeing prices increasing in EH11 - up 16 per cent in a year in figures I have seen, with an average of c£230,000.

 

 

[Zico]

10 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

We’re not heading for any difficult conversations. The conversation is as follows: We’re staying at Tynecastle, as-is, in it’s current form, with zero major changes to the stadium for the foreseeable future, but a few minor upgrades such as big screens. Beginning, middle and end of conversation.
 

The club are still only now getting these new revenues ramped up to full power, and getting these increased revenues investing toward the squad.

 

Say what you want with Levein, it is a fact that the club had a reduced budget for 3 seasons due to the stadium work and the squad paid the price, a lethal cocktail combined with  his own incompetence which was obviously 90% of

the problem. But that 10% of the problem was, budget wise money was going to pay for the stand. And then COVID mess happened and the bloody stadium was empty for a year. 

 

So what that means is it’s only now we’re seeing what the full potential is.
 

Neilson & Savage has subsequently come in and post lockdown, they are only now getting Tynecastle Park up at full power with the strong sales this year. 
 

So the main stand expansion +3500 capacity increase, and within that a doubling of hospitality, this current upgrade is still current and very very relevant to our club, we have just finished this project including the last stages of the interior as well. It lhas enabled what could potentially be the biggest season ticket sales and biggest average attendence at Tynecastle in more than 30 years going back to 1992. Plus it will definitely be the biggest sales of hospitality as well as that’ll be near enough the only way to get a ticket. We could potentially average over 19k depending how results go. We will also have the biggest number of sell out fixtures in a season at Tynecastle since 2004 with 4 home European group stage ties guaranteed as well. The stadium as-is is fantastic and will power our club for the next decade minimum. Probably 2 decades. 
 

So folks should, in the immediate term, stop engaging with unrealistic fantasies about filling corners or new wheatfield stands etc,  it is not happening any time soon, unless we manage to miraculously qualify for the champions league group stage and net £40m - that’s the type of minimum sum needed to pay for a meaningful redevelopment of wheatfield. Thats 40 years of FoH money. Or 10 successive years of getting in Europa groups and possibly getting to knockouts a couple of times.
 

Realistically it’s all about cementing ourselves above Hibs and above Aberdeen.
 

That’s what Tynecastle of today offers us the chance to do. Hibs are in a panic to try to copy Tynecastle and catch up, but their facilities are simply not in the same class. Aberdeen are just ****ed. We’ve got a decade worth of the advantage over them 2 clubs and if we keep that lead we will move ahead of them on player sales as well. 

 

The club is only at the very beginning of the journey with the current, fully completed Tynecastle Park. 

Now this is a good post. 👏👏👏

[Sooks]

1 minute ago, King Of The Cat Cafe said:

 

Good point.  We should remember that maybe just 30 years ago there were parts of Edinburgh with a worse reputation than Gorgie has now.

 

Creeping gentrification has brought places up at a rapid pace.  Increasing property prices are bound to push people out.  Indeed, we are already seeing prices increasing in EH11 - up 16 per cent in a year in figures I have seen, with an average of c£230,000.

 

 

Totally I like the place and it irritates me when people confuse not pretentious with rough

[gordon simpson]

2 hours ago, Wee Mikey said:

 

Are you the son of the Pieman?

that is exactly what i thought also 

[kingantti1874]

There is enough room to support the roof without the trusses, cantilever is one we could also use a cable stay which opens up loads of possibilities. 
 

not impossible! But yes of course expensive 
 

[OTT]

54 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

We’re not heading for any difficult conversations. The conversation is as follows: We’re staying at Tynecastle, as-is, in it’s current form, with zero major changes to the stadium for the foreseeable future, but a few minor upgrades such as big screens. Beginning, middle and end of conversation.
 

The club are still only now getting these new revenues ramped up to full power, and getting these increased revenues investing toward the squad.

 

Say what you want with Levein, it is a fact that the club had a reduced budget for 3 seasons due to the stadium work and the squad paid the price, a lethal cocktail combined with  his own incompetence which was obviously 90% of

the problem. But that 10% of the problem was, budget wise money was going to pay for the stand. And then COVID mess happened and the bloody stadium was empty for a year. 

 

So what that means is it’s only now we’re seeing what the full potential is.
 

Neilson & Savage has subsequently come in and post lockdown, they are only now getting Tynecastle Park up at full power with the strong sales this year. 
 

So the main stand expansion +3500 capacity increase, and within that a doubling of hospitality, this current upgrade is still current and very very relevant to our club, we have just finished this project including the last stages of the interior as well. It lhas enabled what could potentially be the biggest season ticket sales and biggest average attendence at Tynecastle in more than 30 years going back to 1992. Plus it will definitely be the biggest sales of hospitality as well as that’ll be near enough the only way to get a ticket. We could potentially average over 19k depending how results go. We will also have the biggest number of sell out fixtures in a season at Tynecastle since 2004 with 4 home European group stage ties guaranteed as well. The stadium as-is is fantastic and will power our club for the next decade minimum. Probably 2 decades. 
 

So folks should, in the immediate term, stop engaging with unrealistic fantasies about filling corners or new wheatfield stands etc,  it is not happening any time soon, unless we manage to miraculously qualify for the champions league group stage and net £40m - that’s the type of minimum sum needed to pay for a meaningful redevelopment of wheatfield. Thats 40 years of FoH money. Or 10 successive years of getting in Europa groups and possibly getting to knockouts a couple of times.
 

Realistically it’s all about cementing ourselves above Hibs and above Aberdeen.
 

That’s what Tynecastle of today offers us the chance to do. Hibs are in a panic to try to copy Tynecastle and catch up, but their facilities are simply not in the same class. Aberdeen are just ****ed. We’ve got a decade worth of the advantage over them 2 clubs and if we keep that lead we will move ahead of them on player sales as well. 

 

The club is only at the very beginning of the journey with the current, fully completed Tynecastle Park. 

 

I agree that the club is only now starting to get its new found revenues up to full power but I think because of the way the league is structured with expansion we could look to enhance that power even more and really leave Hibs and Aberdeen in the dust. Maybe not now, but I do think if we could lock in 14-15k season ticket sales going forward then there will come a point where the stadium is too small. The dot counts in the season ticket sales thread where families can't sit together because of how few tickets are left point this way IMO, I don't think folk go to the football not to sit with their friends and family. You can't rely only on the fans we've got right now, you've got to be looking to the future and seeing how you can get more fans through the gates. Fans like success and will turn up when a competitive team is put on the field, this seasons ticket sales prove it and that initial season of hype under Vlad where we had waiting lists backs that up too. So if Savage and Robbie keep doing what they're doing demand is going to keep rising and we're going to either need to expand or the price for a season ticket will climb. 

 

If we take selling season tickets in the roseburn that don't apply to derbies, thats a plaster on a problem. I.e those fans would otherwise be in the home end but for a lack of supply. Our current capacity is 19852, take off 3500 for the roseburn and that means our home end is 16,532. Hospitality will reduce that figure further which if we've got 15,000 season tickets means that there is less than 1500 tickets for walk ups. 

 

I love the tone of your post, but I think there is room for more ambition and I think if things keep as they are there will come a point where if we can't expand the Wheatfield then the club will need to make a tough call. The fact the Distillery have quoted us a price to move the tanks in years gone by suggests there could be hope there though (you wouldn't quote a price to move them unless you were actually prepared to do so and they'll know we could only expand the Wheatfield if they sold us the pitch). 

[chrisyboy7]

2 hours ago, OTT said:

 

I agree that the club is only now starting to get its new found revenues up to full power but I think because of the way the league is structured with expansion we could look to enhance that power even more and really leave Hibs and Aberdeen in the dust. Maybe not now, but I do think if we could lock in 14-15k season ticket sales going forward then there will come a point where the stadium is too small. The dot counts in the season ticket sales thread where families can't sit together because of how few tickets are left point this way IMO, I don't think folk go to the football not to sit with their friends and family. You can't rely only on the fans we've got right now, you've got to be looking to the future and seeing how you can get more fans through the gates. Fans like success and will turn up when a competitive team is put on the field, this seasons ticket sales prove it and that initial season of hype under Vlad where we had waiting lists backs that up too. So if Savage and Robbie keep doing what they're doing demand is going to keep rising and we're going to either need to expand or the price for a season ticket will climb. 

 

If we take selling season tickets in the roseburn that don't apply to derbies, thats a plaster on a problem. I.e those fans would otherwise be in the home end but for a lack of supply. Our current capacity is 19852, take off 3500 for the roseburn and that means our home end is 16,532. Hospitality will reduce that figure further which if we've got 15,000 season tickets means that there is less than 1500 tickets for walk ups. 

 

I love the tone of your post, but I think there is room for more ambition and I think if things keep as they are there will come a point where if we can't expand the Wheatfield then the club will need to make a tough call. The fact the Distillery have quoted us a price to move the tanks in years gone by suggests there could be hope there though (you wouldn't quote a price to move them unless you were actually prepared to do so and they'll know we could only expand the Wheatfield if they sold us the pitch). 

It simply has to happen and i dont see why we cant grow to around 25/27k  This would allow the club to steadily grow further

[Thomaso]

5 hours ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

We’re not heading for any difficult conversations. The conversation is as follows: We’re staying at Tynecastle, as-is, in it’s current form, with zero major changes to the stadium for the foreseeable future, but a few minor upgrades such as big screens. Beginning, middle and end of conversation.
 

The club are still only now getting these new revenues ramped up to full power, and getting these increased revenues investing toward the squad.

 

Say what you want with Levein, it is a fact that the club had a reduced budget for 3 seasons due to the stadium work and the squad paid the price, a lethal cocktail combined with  his own incompetence which was obviously 90% of

the problem. But that 10% of the problem was, budget wise money was going to pay for the stand. And then COVID mess happened and the bloody stadium was empty for a year. 

 

So what that means is it’s only now we’re seeing what the full potential is.
 

Neilson & Savage has subsequently come in and post lockdown, they are only now getting Tynecastle Park up at full power with the strong sales this year. 
 

So the main stand expansion +3500 capacity increase, and within that a doubling of hospitality, this current upgrade is still current and very very relevant to our club, we have just finished this project including the last stages of the interior as well. It lhas enabled what could potentially be the biggest season ticket sales and biggest average attendence at Tynecastle in more than 30 years going back to 1992. Plus it will definitely be the biggest sales of hospitality as well as that’ll be near enough the only way to get a ticket. We could potentially average over 19k depending how results go. We will also have the biggest number of sell out fixtures in a season at Tynecastle since 2004 with 4 home European group stage ties guaranteed as well. The stadium as-is is fantastic and will power our club for the next decade minimum. Probably 2 decades. 
 

So folks should, in the immediate term, stop engaging with unrealistic fantasies about filling corners or new wheatfield stands etc,  it is not happening any time soon, unless we manage to miraculously qualify for the champions league group stage and net £40m - that’s the type of minimum sum needed to pay for a meaningful redevelopment of wheatfield. Thats 40 years of FoH money. Or 10 successive years of getting in Europa groups and possibly getting to knockouts a couple of times.
 

Realistically it’s all about cementing ourselves above Hibs and above Aberdeen.
 

That’s what Tynecastle of today offers us the chance to do. Hibs are in a panic to try to copy Tynecastle and catch up, but their facilities are simply not in the same class. Aberdeen are just ****ed. We’ve got a decade worth of the advantage over them 2 clubs and if we keep that lead we will move ahead of them on player sales as well. 

 

The club is only at the very beginning of the journey with the current, fully completed Tynecastle Park. 

Spot on 👍

[SwindonJambo]

7 hours ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

We’re not heading for any difficult conversations. The conversation is as follows: We’re staying at Tynecastle, as-is, in it’s current form, with zero major changes to the stadium for the foreseeable future, but a few minor upgrades such as big screens. Beginning, middle and end of conversation.
 

The club are still only now getting these new revenues ramped up to full power, and getting these increased revenues investing toward the squad.

 

Say what you want with Levein, it is a fact that the club had a reduced budget for 3 seasons due to the stadium work and the squad paid the price, a lethal cocktail combined with  his own incompetence which was obviously 90% of

the problem. But that 10% of the problem was, budget wise money was going to pay for the stand. And then COVID mess happened and the bloody stadium was empty for a year. 

 

So what that means is it’s only now we’re seeing what the full potential is.
 

Neilson & Savage has subsequently come in and post lockdown, they are only now getting Tynecastle Park up at full power with the strong sales this year. 
 

So the main stand expansion +3500 capacity increase, and within that a doubling of hospitality, this current upgrade is still current and very very relevant to our club, we have just finished this project including the last stages of the interior as well. It lhas enabled what could potentially be the biggest season ticket sales and biggest average attendence at Tynecastle in more than 30 years going back to 1992. Plus it will definitely be the biggest sales of hospitality as well as that’ll be near enough the only way to get a ticket. We could potentially average over 19k depending how results go. We will also have the biggest number of sell out fixtures in a season at Tynecastle since 2004 with 4 home European group stage ties guaranteed as well. The stadium as-is is fantastic and will power our club for the next decade minimum. Probably 2 decades. 
 

So folks should, in the immediate term, stop engaging with unrealistic fantasies about filling corners or new wheatfield stands etc,  it is not happening any time soon, unless we manage to miraculously qualify for the champions league group stage and net £40m - that’s the type of minimum sum needed to pay for a meaningful redevelopment of wheatfield. Thats 40 years of FoH money. Or 10 successive years of getting in Europa groups and possibly getting to knockouts a couple of times.
 

Realistically it’s all about cementing ourselves above Hibs and above Aberdeen.
 

That’s what Tynecastle of today offers us the chance to do. Hibs are in a panic to try to copy Tynecastle and catch up, but their facilities are simply not in the same class. Aberdeen are just ****ed. We’ve got a decade worth of the advantage over them 2 clubs and if we keep that lead we will move ahead of them on player sales as well. 

 

The club is only at the very beginning of the journey with the current, fully completed Tynecastle Park. 

 

Post of the thread. Very well thought through and articulated. We are all Jambos and want the best for the club but some realism is needed. At present anything other than tinkering around the edges is cost prohibitive and the ethanol tank situation stops any further expansion even if we could afford it.

 

History is littered with clubs which have overstretched, tried to grow too fast and got themselves into huge financial trouble. Let’s maintain and build what we have, firmly establish ourselves as Scotland’s recognised 3rd force behind the stinky twins and we can look at it again in a few years. Talk of needing 30,000 is silly at present but could become reality in future if we continue our upward trajectory. If we ever did need that, it would probably need a move away which would be emotional turmoil for a lot of fans.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

The only disagreement I have with @A_A wehatethehibspost is that it would take 10 straight years of EL group stages. I think 4-5 would be enough given the TV revenue distributions. Since that's still extremely unlikely to happen in the near future, though, it's probably an entirely academic point.

 

Any real expansion is likely a £40m prospect and we don't have that money and likely won't any time soon.