New manager incoming ( merged )

[Bazzas right boot]

31 minutes ago, David Black said:

Firstly they are surviving that's the point and it's true Hibs may have to sell a couple of players, but at least they have 2 to sell.

 

Great, let's make thing worst just because. 

 

We sold Hickey last season for the best part of £2m as well. 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

32 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

I thought all the stuff creating an increase in turnover is there to help us grow as well as survive? 

The foh money shouldn't be use as emotional blackmail regarding the club not surviving because of it.  

Won't this increase in turnover not lead to even more revenue? 

So no reason to play the club will die card if someone wants to make a stance by withholding their pledges? 

Budge should never get a free reign with the foh money as she hasn't shown she can utilise it.  She hasn't done it with all the money the club have had do far.  

It's not her money . 

 

 

Covid is a unique situation. 

 

I want us to be in a financially as strong situation as possible on our return to the top flight. 

I'm not convinced that removing her at this time is helpful in any way. 

 

 

[Auldbenches]

Just now, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Covid is a unique situation. 

 

I want us to be in a financially as strong situation as possible on our return to the top flight. 

I'm not convinced that removing her at this time is helpful in any way. 

 

 

I'm talking out with the pandemic.  When fans say they are disillusioned about the running of the club, the emotional blackmail of the club dying is used.  If that is the ca then the board aren't doing things properly.

Would the club die without foh donations?  I'm talking in normal times?

Do you think she should get a free reign with the foh money like she has requested?  She hasn't shown she has handled the clubs money well enough to have earned that.

Why keep her on?  I can't see what she is bringing g to the club just now.  I'm taking about us progressing financially and on the park.  If doing well financially, then the foh money won't be needed for general running costs. 

[Yoda]

1 hour ago, AndyNic said:

Bob's not going anywhere.

 

 

 

 

McCulloch got a stiffy thinking about 2 more years at Budge's holiday camp.

[davemclaren]

4 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

I'm talking out with the pandemic.  When fans say they are disillusioned about the running of the club, the emotional blackmail of the club dying is used.  If that is the ca then the board aren't doing things properly.

Would the club die without foh donations?  I'm talking in normal times?

Do you think she should get a free reign with the foh money like she has requested?  She hasn't shown she has handled the clubs money well enough to have earned that.

Why keep her on?  I can't see what she is bringing g to the club just now.  I'm taking about us progressing financially and on the park.  If doing well financially, then the foh money won't be needed for general running costs. 

The club board get a free reign with the FoH money because that’s what the FoH members approved. 

[Auldbenches]

Just now, davemclaren said:

The club board get a free reign with the FoH money because that’s what the FoH members approved. 

Hopefully a new club board soon as this one has squandered millions.   

You think this board have done well with the resources they've had? 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Auldbenches said:

Hopefully a new club board soon as this one has squandered millions.   

You think this board have done well with the resources they've had? 

I think we should have done better as a club, particularly on the playing side, with the money spent in the last five years. 

[Auldbenches]

Just now, davemclaren said:

I think we should have done better as a club, particularly on the playing side, with the money spent in the last five years. 

Off the field we haven't been doing that well with it either.  Where is the value for money spent? 

[sadj]

56 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

How does every other club survive? 

 

Aberdeen expect a £6m loss

Utd have reported a almost £4m loss. 

Celtic were in the media saying they have burnt through over halve of thier cash reserves. 

Rangers have issued iirc 2 share issues this year. 

I think I seen it reported Killie taken the £1m loan from the government. 

Hibs were in the media saying they will be selling players in the summer. 

 

 

This years account will reveal all. 

 

We need to do more than survive as well. 

 

 

 

 

 

Hibs have also made insurance claims and cut wages and still not cleared all wages they were supposed too , laid off staff etc. 
 

United were talking about offloading Mellon and a number of players to try and keep afloat.

 

I agree with Dave though about FoH funds and would like the club not to include any potential income in projections but its difficult. If you said only use for special projects it discourages payments. Saying its for players only would have the effect it already does on here. Tough balance , one Id like to see FoH discuss more and maybe put back to the members but with a more indepth look at the uses. Maybe funding youth , women etc just to troll some posters 😉

[DH1986]

19 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Covid is a unique situation. 

 

I want us to be in a financially as strong situation as possible on our return to the top flight. 

I'm not convinced that removing her at this time is helpful in any way. 

 

 

So.....

 

You want to keep the person who has overseen the shockingly wasteful spending of millions and millions of pounds so we can be as financially strong as possible.

 

Em.....Ok.

[sadj]

2 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

Off the field we haven't been doing that well with it either.  Where is the value for money spent? 

Off the field? The infrastructure put in place has almost doubled turnover hasn’t it? 

[JamboAl]

10 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

The club board get a free reign with the FoH money because that’s what the FoH members approved. 

I think he meant a free rein.  I know she's sometimes called Queen Ann but.....

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

Off the field we haven't been doing that well with it either.  Where is the value for money spent? 

Mainly in the new stand and other associated infrastructure. It was necessarily a rushed high risk undertaking. 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, JamboAl said:

I think he meant a free rein.  I know she's sometimes called Queen Ann but.....

Ah, missed that. 😄

[Jambo61]

4 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

Season ticket money was all gone months ago. 

But it was an income and lasts as long as normal seasons surely?

[Jim Panzee]

2 hours ago, David Black said:

But how does every other club survive without this additional income. It certainly helps the shortfall but , it also highlights that we do not live within our means, which we are supposed to do. This inference that the club needs this money to help it survive is really emotional blackmail. If the club has to rely on outside donations maybe those responsible for us being where we are should put their hands in their pockets due to their total mis-handling of the club.  

Would imagine other clubs are borrowing money left right and centre to survive.

 

we aren’t - but the key is what we do with our resources.

 

RN will start next season. 
 

we’ll be annoyed at ‘somehow’ being top 4

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Jim Panzee said:

Would imagine other clubs are borrowing money left right and centre to survive.

 

we aren’t - but the key is what we do with our resources.

 

RN will start next season. 
 

we’ll be annoyed at ‘somehow’ being top 4

We are borrowing from Ann it would appear. 

[davemclaren]

3 minutes ago, Jambo61 said:

But it was an income and lasts as long as normal seasons surely?

Most of our other income streams will have collapsed though. 

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, David Black said:

Firstly they are surviving that's the point and it's true Hibs may have to sell a couple of players, but at least they have 2 to sell.

How do you know they are surviving?  They could be getting propped up by wealthy donors and they're not likely to tell you.

Also if they do sell players would that not weaken their team for next season?  Is that your way forward

[heartmussel]

31 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Covid is a unique situation. 

 

I want us to be in a financially as strong situation as possible on our return to the top flight. 

I'm not convinced that removing her at this time is helpful in any way. 

 

 

Correct👍

[Newton51]

We need every penny going into recruitment next season. Wasting money on paying off the management staff seems not worth it. Every penny counts 

[Ethan Hunt]

2 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Most of our other income streams will have collapsed though. 

They same with every club.
 

This should be a hard lesson learned. Millions were undoubtedly squandered and we should be in a far better finanical, infrastructure and playing position than we are. Any reasonable person would - rightly - expect more than a return to the Championship and a below average squad for the amount of money invested and spent. 

[DETTY29]

14 minutes ago, sadj said:

Off the field? The infrastructure put in place has almost doubled turnover hasn’t it? 

And the additional revenues allowed for significant scope increase to then generate more as well as increase football budget*.

 

As long as the additional spending  doesn't cut 'footballing' budget then it doesn't bother me as such.

 

Indeed, I'm so pissed off with how these additional revenues are spent by the footballing department, I'd be more inclined to cut what they are given until they show they can spend it more wisely to focus their minds. 

 

* Until someone comes along and says 'well actually if you check the accounts, in real terms the footballing budget has reduced and we would have been better sticking with the old stand and little additional revenue initiatives'

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by DETTY29

[JamboAl]

3 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Most of our other income streams will have collapsed though. 

You cannot assessl the damage until the relevant accounts are published.

Our other income streams will have collapsed but we have had the benefit of furlough etc while a lot of our normal costs such as stewarding/police, temporary staff wages etc have disappeared or reduced substantially.  This pandemic didn't just hit Hearts but I fancy that in relative terms we will come out of this in better shape than most other clubs.

[DH1986]

Just now, Newton51 said:

We need every penny going into recruitment next season. Wasting money on paying off the management staff seems not worth it. Every penny counts 

So we should allow RN & Co to waste more money on signing guys like Stewart, Popescu, Frear, Roberts and Kastaneer.......

 

I suspect it would be cheaper to offload the managerial team now than let them sign a bunch of players who we’ll no doubt try and move on within a year.

 

[maroonedinbriz]

5 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Working for Ann Budge seems to be like working in a public sector job with similar levels of performance and job protection.

Fact check - the civil service shrank by 19% between 2010 and 2016. This number has increased slightly each year since the Brexit referendum as departments attempt to reorganise and implement the changes to laws and rules which resulted.  No longer is it a job for life.

[JamboAl]

1 minute ago, DH1986 said:

So we should allow RN & Co to waste more money on signing guys like Stewart, Popescu, Frear, Roberts and Kastaneer.......

 

I suspect it would be cheaper to offload the managerial team now than let them sign a bunch of players who we’ll no doubt try and move on within a year.

 

You're definitely right re these signings.

In your 2nd paragraph, you're really asking a fair question which is

Can we afford to sack them or can we afford not to?

Time will tell.

[sadj]

13 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

And the additional revenues allowed for significant scope increase to then generate more as well as increase football budget*.

 

As long as the additional spending  doesn't cut 'footballing' budget then it doesn't bother me as such.

 

Indeed, I'm so pissed off with how these additional revenues are spent by the footballing department, I'd be more inclined to cut what they are given until they show they can spend it more wisely to focus their minds. 

 

* Until someone comes along and says 'well actually if you check the accounts, in real terms the footballing budget has reduced and we would have been better sticking with the old stand and little additional revenue initiatives'

 

Couldn’t have put it better myself 👍🏻

[stevie1874]

27 minutes ago, sadj said:

Off the field? The infrastructure put in place has almost doubled turnover hasn’t it? 

That’s what I thought, once the stand is fully kitted out it should make us money but if we’re struggling ie this year then the FOH money is something other clubs don’t have. My small bit per month is till I pop my clogs and I’d hope everybody else feels the same so going forward this should put us in a strong position if it’s used wisely? 

[stevie1874]

32 minutes ago, sadj said:

Off the field? The infrastructure put in place has almost doubled turnover hasn’t it? 

That’s what I thought, once the stand is fully kitted out it should make us money but if we’re struggling ie this year then the FOH money is something other clubs don’t have. My small bit per month is till I pop my clogs and I’d hope everybody else feels the same so going forward this should put us in a strong position if it’s used wisely? 

[davemclaren]

12 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

You cannot assessl the damage until the relevant accounts are published.

Our other income streams will have collapsed but we have had the benefit of furlough etc while a lot of our normal costs such as stewarding/police, temporary staff wages etc have disappeared or reduced substantially.  This pandemic didn't just hit Hearts but I fancy that in relative terms we will come out of this in better shape than most other clubs.

I certainly hope you are correct. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

15 minutes ago, DH1986 said:

So we should allow RN & Co to waste more money on signing guys like Stewart, Popescu, Frear, Roberts and Kastaneer.......

 

I suspect it would be cheaper to offload the managerial team now than let them sign a bunch of players who we’ll no doubt try and move on within a year.

 

These players were signed with remaining budget to bolster a Championship squad on a reduced budget. 

 

Really not too difficult to understand they are below standard, did we need to squander money to win the League? Absolutely not,  maybe congratulations due for not pissing away money like Rangers did on the lower League. 

[Auldbenches]

39 minutes ago, sadj said:

Off the field? The infrastructure put in place has almost doubled turnover hasn’t it? 

So no need to use foh money for general purposes if we are getting extra income from this increase?

My main point is that people shouldn't be accusing others of potentially killing the club if they stop their pledges.  

That has been used as emotional blackmail on here.

The club should be self sufficient and this money being an added bonus. 

 

 

[DETTY29]

16 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

These players were signed with remaining budget to bolster a Championship squad on a reduced budget. 

 

Really not too difficult to understand they are below standard, did we need to squander money to win the League? Absolutely not,  maybe congratulations due for not pissing away money like Rangers did on the lower League. 

I still believe we have a core of very good players.

 

The key question as part of the 'footballing' review I'd be saying to whoever is:-

 

What will you give me with at most, 3 new first 11 players coming in?

 

And what do you give me with 5, but 10 must go?

 

 

 

 

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

I still believe we have a core of very good players.

 

The key question as part of the 'footballing' review I'd be saying to whoever is:-

 

What will you give me with at most, 3 new first 11 players coming in?

 

And what do you give me with 5, but 10 must go?

 

 

 

 

Can you name the good players in “the core”??

[Boof]

1 hour ago, David Black said:

Firstly they are surviving that's the point and it's true Hibs may have to sell a couple of players, but at least they have 2 to sell.

 

Who's going be buying if everyone's in the same boat post-COVID?

[NANOJAMBO]

18 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

So no need to use foh money for general purposes if we are getting extra income from this increase?

My main point is that people shouldn't be accusing others of potentially killing the club if they stop their pledges.  

That has been used as emotional blackmail on here.

The club should be self sufficient and this money being an added bonus. 

 

 

Exactly. 

[DETTY29]

3 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

Can you name the good players in “the core”??

Gordon

Souttar

Smith

Kingsley

Haring

Boyce

Naismith (as cover)

MacEneff

Gnanduillet

Halliday

GMS

 

Without too much thought.

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by DETTY29

[Agentjambo]

4 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

Gordon

Souttar

Smith

Kingsley

Haring

Boyce

Naismith (as cover)

MacEneff

Gnanduillet

Halliday

GMS

 

Without too much thought.

 

How big a squad would you have?

[DETTY29]

6 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

How big a squad would you have?

As a first choice 11.

 

About 11.

 

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by DETTY29

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

As a first choice 11.

 

About 11.

 

 

 

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

As a first choice 11.

 

About 11.

 

 

Squad I said...is that your starting 11??

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, DH1986 said:

So.....

 

You want to keep the person who has overseen the shockingly wasteful spending of millions and millions of pounds so we can be as financially strong as possible.

 

Em.....Ok.

 

Nah, I'm willing to give the current set up of 

New ceo

jj

Savage

Neilson and co  or whoever is in charge

a chance to build on promotion.

 

I  also do not see any way that removing Budge improves us on the football park and I am not ignorant to the financial fall out of Covid and the realities of getting Hearts to the top end of the league again.

It's not that radical a thought process.

 

If Budge was to leave and their was a financial plan in place to cover this seasons financial gap and next season financial gap then she can leave, I have little interest in who owns us as long as they are are not running up big debts. If Budge goes and we have all the bases covered I am for it. No one on  here as given me any confidence that if she leaves we will be in a better place financially or strategically at this current time.

Nothing across the multiple threads gives me confidence  that- if we lose Budge, pay off the existing mgt  set up that we will then have the  finances to pay her loans  off ( should she want them paid), fill any covid financial gap, hire a new mgt team and support them adequality in the transfer market to get us to the top 4 and playing the brand of football demanded by some on here.

If she leaves and this is all in order, then great. however This elusive football guru waiting to spend millions  on us does not exist, if he/ she does- get them on board. I am for it.

 

 

[DETTY29]

6 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

 

Squad I said...is that your starting 11??

No.

 

My point rather badly put is that we need either RN or whoever is coming in not just to say I need another xyz players.

 

We need to see some better coaching to get more out of players we have many of whom quite frankly outside of Gordon and Boyce we haven't this year.

 

It's been too much of an excuse window after window after window that a wad of new players are needed.

 

'What is your confidence levels in your ability to improve footballers'

Edited April 25, 2021 by DETTY29

[Agentjambo]

2 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

No.

 

My point rather badly put is that we need either RN or whoever is coming in not just to say I need another xyz players.

 

We need to see some better coaching to get more out of players we have many of whom quite frankly outside of Gordon and Boyce we haven't this year.

 

It's been too much of an excuse window after window after window that a wad of new players are needed.

 

'What is your confidence levels in your ability to improve footballers'

I don’t think Neilson has it in him to improve any player.

[Jambo61]

1 hour ago, davemclaren said:

Most of our other income streams will have collapsed though. 

Get that but he was making out no income apart from FoH!

So, best guess we are making a loss, but partially mitigated by ppv/ lower costs and furlough income etc!

No?

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, DH1986 said:

So we should allow RN & Co to waste more money on signing guys like Stewart, Popescu, Frear, Roberts and Kastaneer.......

 

I suspect it would be cheaper to offload the managerial team now than let them sign a bunch of players who we’ll no doubt try and move on within a year.

 

 

Are 2/3 of them not loan signings and one is a keeper that will never play unless Gordon is out.

Popescu had top flight experience and filled a void until Souttar was back, top quality centre halves with the future in mind cannot be easy to attract in a reduced Championship campaign. Really shouldn't need to explain that tbh.

 

Savage is now having an input into transfers as highlighted by the Gnando and McEneff signings.

We also have a bunch of out of contract players and are now in the top flight so we will attract better quality.

Last time RN and his signings had us 3rd on promotion, this time they got us promotion. Not all that bad when the sum of the parts are put together.

 

 

[DETTY29]

8 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

I don’t think Neilson has it in him to improve any player.

And that is the pressure I want the board to put on him.

 

We need to stop the cycle of  bringing in a whole new team (and 3 subs) each season because the players aren't deemed good enough by the manager, who has brought them in.

 

At some point we need the manager to take measures to make some players better whether it be coaching or identifying that some players are better suited elsewhere on the pitch to where even they think they are at their most effective.

Edited April 25, 2021 by DETTY29

[Rods]

5 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Nah, I'm willing to give the current set up of 

New ceo

jj

Savage

Neilson and co  or whoever is in charge

a chance to build on promotion.

 

I  also do not see any way that removing Budge improves us on the football park and I am not ignorant to the financial fall out of Covid and the realities of getting Hearts to the top end of the league again.

It's not that radical a thought process.

 

If Budge was to leave and their was a financial plan in place to cover this seasons financial gap and next season financial gap then she can leave, I have little interest in who owns us as long as they are are not running up big debts. If Budge goes and we have all the bases covered I am for it. No one on  here as given me any confidence that if she leaves we will be in a better place financially or strategically at this current time.

Nothing across the multiple threads gives me confidence  that- if we lose Budge, pay off the existing mgt  set up that we will then have the  finances to pay her loans  off ( should she want them paid), fill any covid financial gap, hire a new mgt team and support them adequality in the transfer market to get us to the top 4 and playing the brand of football demanded by some on here.

If she leaves and this is all in order, then great. however This elusive football guru waiting to spend millions  on us does not exist, if he/ she does- get them on board. I am for it.

 

 

 

I can see where you are coming from but you faltered at the point that I have highlighted.

 

Budge has been setting a low bar since us romping the championship and Robbie has confirmed yet again the low target our football side has been set.  The players like in the previous few season can relax and try and push on for top six after the year. Meanwhile our fans suffer with unacceptable defeats. 

 

Top six is not a target, top six is a cop out. This target is lead by budge and happily accepted by Neilson. Its a loser mentality.

 

 

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

And that is the pressure I want the board to put on him.

 

We need to stop the cycle of  bringing in a whole new team (and 3 subs) each season because the players aren't deemed good enough by the manager, who has brought them in.

 

At some point we need to the manager to take measures to make some players better whether it be coaching or identifying that some players are better suited elsewhere on the pitch to where even they think they are at their most effective.

Do you really think Ann or anyone on the board have the football noose to put the pressure on him?Its the safest job in football and his arrogance and back handed remarks and cockiness recently just proves he knows he is invincible.

File under C.Levein.

[HighTimes]

9 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Popescu had top flight experience and was a void until Souttar was back

 

 

 Fixed one of the errors in your post for you.