No Idle Talk Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Gards said: Supergran....well there we are. Someone who put her own personal money upfront to save the club from oblivion. Someone who found like minded investors to work with the club to raise it from the cesspit of Wonga and Co. Someone who continues to work tirelessly to do the best for the club - albeit makes mistakes at times. But yeh...supergran....wonderful Take the high road mate. It's not worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said: https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/sport/football/robbie-neilsons-hearts-tactics-laid-19866925 Robbie explaining why we keep playing with two holding midfielders. He does seem to be sending out contradictory messages about his tactics. Not long ago he said he wants his Hearts team to play 4-4-2, here he is essentially telling us it will be 4-2-3-1 for the rest of the season. I can't imagine winning the centre of midfield area will be any less important next season when we are facing stiffer opposition. So when exactly will we see this 4-4-2 ideal he spoke of? From the News 13th Jan: “I always believe Hearts should have two good full-backs who get forward, they should have two strong centre-halves, they should have a ball-winner and a ball player in the middle of the park, they should have two wide players who run at opponents and deliver crosses.“ From the article you link: The need for two defensive midfielders has been questioned, but Neilson explained why that area of the park was key in the way he wants his team to play. “But if you have three v two against you in that central area, it makes it very difficult to pick up that second ball because you’re already 50% down from the opposition. “So you have to make sure you secure that central area before you go and play.“ An utter charlatan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will-i-am-a-jambo Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said: https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/sport/football/robbie-neilsons-hearts-tactics-laid-19866925 Robbie explaining why we keep playing with two holding midfielders. He does seem to be sending out contradictory messages about his tactics. Not long ago he said he wants his Hearts team to play 4-4-2, here he is essentially telling us it will be 4-2-3-1 for the rest of the season. I can't imagine winning the centre of midfield area will be any less important next season when we are facing stiffer opposition. So when exactly will we see this 4-4-2 ideal he spoke of? It's all a clever ploy by Neilson to bamboozle the opposition but instead he's probably just bamboozling his own players! In all seriousness l suspect Robbie doesn't know his best midfield yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo2524 Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Two wingers! What good (not great) team in Scottish/English football have current success with 2 wingers? full backs create width not somebody standing wide (stationary) waiting for the ball. Rangers - Kent not really a winger. Two full backs run into wide space. Celtic - full backs provide width Hibs - Boyle appears more central Aberdeen - Used to play Hayes and McGinn but not now Man City - Sterling and Mahrez can play wide but the front five generally interchange. Liverpool - full backs Man Utd/Spurs/Arsenal - no real wingers Playing two wide men invariably means you will have great difficulty controlling/dominating any game. This is proven even in our poor quality league. When we gain promotion it will become almost impossible. Modern full backs and intelligent mobile midfielders and forwards move into the wide space to provide the width in most successful teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 5 hours ago, jambo2524 said: Two wingers! What good (not great) team in Scottish/English football have current success with 2 wingers? full backs create width not somebody standing wide (stationary) waiting for the ball. Rangers - Kent not really a winger. Two full backs run into wide space. Celtic - full backs provide width Hibs - Boyle appears more central Aberdeen - Used to play Hayes and McGinn but not now Man City - Sterling and Mahrez can play wide but the front five generally interchange. Liverpool - full backs Man Utd/Spurs/Arsenal - no real wingers Playing two wide men invariably means you will have great difficulty controlling/dominating any game. This is proven even in our poor quality league. When we gain promotion it will become almost impossible. Modern full backs and intelligent mobile midfielders and forwards move into the wide space to provide the width in most successful teams. Spot on and been saying this for years. What club uses an out and out winger these days? FFS all this talk about wingers beating the full back and delivering crosses for the big striker. It’s embarrassing. The guy is a dinosaur and a bullshitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 7 hours ago, will-i-am-a-jambo said: It's all a clever ploy by Neilson to bamboozle the opposition but instead he's probably just bamboozling his own players! In all seriousness l suspect Robbie doesn't know his best midfield yet. Or more likely, he doesn't have his best midfield yet and won't until the next transfer window Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinRummy Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 People have got a point and, though I thought I’d like us playing with two wingers, I really don’t. I do think it’s probably more to do with poor form from our wingers than anything else though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 22 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said: Spot on and been saying this for years. What club uses an out and out winger these days? FFS all this talk about wingers beating the full back and delivering crosses for the big striker. It’s embarrassing. The guy is a dinosaur and a bullshitter. This whole period under Robbie will be a waste of time. Another complete rebuild will be required once he goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 17 minutes ago, The Treasurer said: Or more likely, he doesn't have his best midfield yet and won't until the next transfer window Ah yes, the mythical Next Transfer Window. This time next year, Rodney... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingantti1874 Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 18 minutes ago, GinRummy said: People have got a point and, though I thought I’d like us playing with two wingers, I really don’t. I do think it’s probably more to do with poor form from our wingers than anything else though. we don’t play to help wingers. Time and again they are facing up to 2 and sometimes 3 players, they will never look good . The problem is the full backs rarely get up to support them or beyond to create space for them to play in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Much of the short term malaise in the team could be cured if Neilson would tell Boyce to play further up the park and turn defenders rather than coming back for the ball in the centre circle. None of the other parts of the team will work until that happens. Boyce compresses the game and reduces the options for all of the other players particularly as we have none who want to go past him. Next I'm looking for a big effort to move on many of the old slow players in the summer. Another massive squad rebuild required (no continuity yet). And hopefully the club management are having a proper look at the awful performance of the youth academy too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandylejambo Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 On 15/02/2021 at 15:19, davemclaren said: You would need to call an EGM of FoH and get it passed then likely call an EGM of the club. Would take months assuming you got enough votes to pass it. Wingers are good if they're really fit and can track back, ours can hardly get forward, they are only active when we are going forward, when we are defending they are missing and we're overrun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandylejambo Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 I don't know why I quoted you Dave sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinRummy Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 13 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said: we don’t play to help wingers. Time and again they are facing up to 2 and sometimes 3 players, they will never look good . The problem is the full backs rarely get up to support them or beyond to create space for them to play in I agree. I’m also nearly certain that’s deliberate. The full backs have been asked to stay back and defend, which seems ridiculously over defensive considering the central defence already have two sitting mids to help out. Despite all that, I still think our wingers are in poor form. GMS looks like he is just running through the motions, Roberts and Frear are done and Kasteneer is just in the door, but a poor first game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1971fozzy Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 48 minutes ago, GinRummy said: I agree. I’m also nearly certain that’s deliberate. The full backs have been asked to stay back and defend, which seems ridiculously over defensive considering the central defence already have two sitting mids to help out. Despite all that, I still think our wingers are in poor form. GMS looks like he is just running through the motions, Roberts and Frear are done and Kasteneer is just in the door, but a poor first game. I agree with this. He is far to defensively minded considering this league’s opposition. God only knows what it will be like in the premier league. Your last paragraph is bang on. Frear and Roberts (apart from being nowhere near good enough) had poor form and GMS has still to shine. keep hoping it will all click but for me , despite the amount of goals scored, it’s just so boring especially away from home. Irving and Halliday in the same team is zzzzzzzzzzzzz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitzroy Pointon Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Two match ban given. https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/disciplinary-outcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longbaws Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Neilson is banned for the next 2 games https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/disciplinary-outcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1971fozzy Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, Salad Fingers said: Two match ban given. https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/disciplinary-outcome can’t say it’s a surprise. Given his ranting blaming officials during and after games to mask his and the teams own performance is now both tired and expected. hopefully this will teach him that it’s not a good idea to blame everyone but yourself. The referee decisions he bleats about this season in games we f up in are nothing compared to what we witnessed and had to put up with the last few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinRummy Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 (edited) 32 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said: I agree with this. He is far to defensively minded considering this league’s opposition. God only knows what it will be like in the premier league. Your last paragraph is bang on. Frear and Roberts (apart from being nowhere near good enough) had poor form and GMS has still to shine. keep hoping it will all click but for me , despite the amount of goals scored, it’s just so boring especially away from home. Irving and Halliday in the same team is zzzzzzzzzzzzz On Irving and Halliday, RN says he wants to control the midfield. Surely the way to to that is with one holding mId and two central mids in front of him. We are losing ground to 5 man midfields fairly regularly, time for a change of set up. Edited February 19, 2021 by GinRummy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 53 minutes ago, GinRummy said: On Irving and Halliday, RN says he wants to control the midfield. Surely the way to to that is with one holding mId and two central mids in front of him. We are losing ground to 5 man midfields fairly regularly, time for a change of set up. That will be next months musings in the News. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Nookie Bear said: Ah yes, the mythical Next Transfer Window. This time next year, Rodney... The next transfer window will (hopefully) be in the Premier league, so we will be able to target better players that wouldn't be available to us in the championship. Nothing "mythical" about it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 15 minutes ago, The Treasurer said: The next transfer window will (hopefully) be in the Premier league, so we will be able to target better players that wouldn't be available to us in the championship. Nothing "mythical" about it You're living in Robbie's dreamland - we've been saying this for years and we still end up short in vital areas of the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 50 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said: You're living in Robbie's dreamland - we've been saying this for years and we still end up short in vital areas of the team. The circumstances for all teams, not just us, will be very different come the next window, with us being in a much stronger position than most teams that we would realistically be competing with for players. Whether we make full use of this remains to be seen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 1 hour ago, The Treasurer said: The circumstances for all teams, not just us, will be very different come the next window, with us being in a much stronger position than most teams that we would realistically be competing with for players. Whether we make full use of this remains to be seen I can’t why anyone would think it’s not ( all things being equal ) easier to sign better players the higher the league you are in. As you say, you can still screw it up though. Hopefully having Savage on board helps mitigate the risks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, davemclaren said: I can’t why anyone would think it’s not ( all things being equal ) easier to sign better players the higher the league you are in. As you say, you can still screw it up though. Hopefully having Savage on board helps mitigate the risks. well, just basing this on the last few years and watching the team with the 3rd biggest budget deteriorate each year and find themselves bottom of the table in March...you can appreciate the scepticism Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said: well, just basing this on the last few years and watching the team with the 3rd biggest budget deteriorate each year and find themselves bottom of the table in March...you can appreciate the scepticism I can but, regardless, it’s still easier to get better players the higher the league you are in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Just now, davemclaren said: I can but, regardless, it’s still easier to get better players the higher the league you are in. More expensive, not necessarily better. Anyway, all hypothetical 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo2524 Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 6 hours ago, kingantti1874 said: we don’t play to help wingers. Time and again they are facing up to 2 and sometimes 3 players, they will never look good . The problem is the full backs rarely get up to support them or beyond to create space for them to play in The full backs are arriving in congested space where wingers are already being marked. Real wingers as we are trying to play do not exist in modern game as too easy to nullify. The use of the space where wingers used to be (10-20 years ago) is what good teams use to their advantage when attacking that space from full back, midfield, or forward positions. Intelligent use of the space supplies width. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambonian Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 Neilson wants attacking fullbacks....great. Why the need for five or six wingers then? In a 4-4-2 you need one of the wide players to be a winger and becoming a forward turning it into a 4-3-3. MacDonald used to do this 4-4-2/4-3-3 thing with Colquhoun, Jeffries would do it if he changed shape from a three-man defence to a four and used Neil McCann in a 4-4-2/4-3-3. This way the fullbacks can concentrate on defending, nullifying opposition wide players/wingers as they used to. In the 4-3-3 you have a defensive midfielder, passing midfielder and an attacking midfielder. The fullbacks cover defensively if one of the central defenders is caught out of position, as does the defensive midfielder stepping back. No need for complications, just let players be who they are and let them get on with it without confusing them with over-thought tactics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 7 hours ago, Nookie Bear said: You're living in Robbie's dreamland - we've been saying this for years and we still end up short in vital areas of the team. If we've been saying it for years, then give Robbie more than 4/5 months in the championship under Covid to sort it out. Robbie isn't to blame for the last few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StirlingJambo Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 First stint in charge- 58.5% win ratio Second stint- 73.9% We’re winning games, something we’ve not been able to do the last 3/4 years 🤷🏻♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Dongcaster Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Bump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Neil Dongcaster said: Bump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott980612 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Neil Dongcaster said: Bump This thread will probably still be here this time next year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sertse Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 How long until people see the writing on the wall? Getting beaten by or scraping wins against tin pot teams when our wage budget is probably well over 100x higher than theirs. That's a management problem I'm afraid and as soon as we get out of this league he needs gone. This is ****ing atrocious and not the club Hearts should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo51 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Wighton gets a 2nd... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveins Battalion Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 FFS how much longer do we have to suffer this pish, years and years now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Just now, Sertse said: How long until people see the writing on the wall? Getting beaten by or scraping wins against tin pot teams when our wage budget is probably well over 100x higher than theirs. That's a management problem I'm afraid and as soon as we get out of this league he needs gone. This is ****ing atrocious and not the club Hearts should be. He is well and truly out of his depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Reynolds Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 He left us in 2nd last time though! How anyone can defend this pish is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Has he gone yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sertse Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 And one other thing... the people saying 'a wins a win' or 'can't win them all' are absolutely ****ing mental. We should be absolutely hammering every single team in this league. 3rd best team in Scotland? Not with this management we aren't and we won't be for some time. How can you have the likes of Gordon, Boyce, Naismith, GMS, Smith and Kingsley all in the same team and struggle to win against part time teams? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Sertse said: And one other thing... the people saying 'a wins a win' or 'can't win them all' are absolutely ****ing mental. We should be absolutely hammering every single team in this league. 3rd best team in Scotland? Not with this management we aren't and we won't be for some time. How can you have the likes of Gordon, Boyce, Naismith, GMS, Smith and Kingsley all in the same team and struggle to win against part time teams? This would be the best time to punt him but unfortunately it won’t happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said: This would be the best time to punt him but unfortunately it won’t happen. Agreed. Really don’t want him to get another transfer window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisg8 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Take you shite hair and shite suits and get to **** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamgerrard Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 robbie is 100% the wrong manto take us forward needs emptied Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valois No1 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Robbie go now. Useless manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ToqueJambo Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Who would people replace Neilson with after his less than 20 games out of interest? What serious manager would take a job at a club that sacks their manager miles clear at the top of the league? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cudworth23 Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 26 shots 5 on target we need a center forward who can score goals and can hit the frigging target Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sertse Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, The Grim Reaper said: Agreed. Really don’t want him to get another transfer window. He signed so much dross with no money I dread to think the absolute shite he'd sign with money we'd miss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Thor Posted February 20, 2021 Share Posted February 20, 2021 Neilson-ball. 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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