Wage cut for players and staff (Statement on 24/4)

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

10 minutes ago, Suso Santana said:

 

For the even harder of being able to think.. Money has been pumped into the club by the fans and spent on utter shite. 

Yes, the current situation has been un expected but so was relegation to the absolute muppets in control of our football team. 

Every club is going to suffer now, but we will be suffering more than we should be. 

Get it yet?

So, if we were sitting 3rd or 4th thIs announcement would not exist? Is that your claim?

[Last Laff]

1 hour ago, Big Slim Stylee said:

 

As you yourself always do on here 😀 Tragic 

😳

[Last Laff]

36 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

He definitely would not have been included if we had paid up his contract 3 months ago!

Thank heavens he he stayed then  

[Last Laff]

1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

Yeah that was in the article I showed a clip from, we exited admin a month later 👍🏽.

Yeah, so Stevo got let go with a year left during admin  anyway.....  

[Suso Santana]

15 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

So, if we were sitting 3rd or 4th thIs announcement would not exist? Is that your claim?

 

You're either at the wind up or thick as mince. 

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

4 minutes ago, Suso Santana said:

 

You're either at the wind up or thick as mince. 

 

It’s like this - if we hadn’t signed shite players then we’d have signed better players. We wouldn’t have more money, we’d just be in a much better league position.

 

Budge still needs to **** off on account of her woeful management but not because of coronavirus. This is unforeseen.

[Unknown user]

1 hour ago, Des Lynam said:

Interesting article.....

 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11790/9308779/hearts-owner-ann-budge-insists-the-days-of-reckless-spending-are-over-at-tynecastle

 

Obviously we didn’t budget for a global pandemic but the fact we’ve clearly allowed the wages to get out of control again is a worry. 

56% of turnover compared to an industry standard of 65% is out of control?

[...a bit disco]

24 minutes ago, Scottie Wanshot. said:

Any luck Stendel will leave. 

 

🙃

[colinmaroon]

6 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

“I thought she would be looking ahead, summing up the situation and doing what she thinks is right for the survival of the club, because that’s what she’s doing – it’s about making sure the club is still here after the virus.

“These are peculiar circumstances. We don’t know the end result. I know what it’s like to operate with a cash flow when you’re dependent on weekly and monthly income.

“This is different when – say it’s the weather, even postponing just one game, the income from that game is budgeted to pay your wages. So I understand the problem the club has now.

“Ann is looking at the situation, thinking, ‘We’ve already missed games and we don’t know when the picture will change. It could be two weeks, two months or even longer – so we need to do something right now.’

“To me that does seem to be the right thing to do.

“To wait too long and not do anything could be more dangerous for the sustainability of the club. Ann is right to do what she thinks is necessary now.”

 

Bryan Jackson.

 

https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/sport/bryan-jackson-backs-hearts-ceo-ann-budge-over-wage-cut/

 

 

Who is Bryan Jackson compared to the gurus of Kickback?

 

 

[colinmaroon]

4 minutes ago, Smithee said:

56% of turnover compared to an industry standard of 65% is out of control?

 

 

If it wasn't so tragic the knee-jerk, ill-informed opinions on here would be hilarious.

 

 

[colinmaroon]

39 minutes ago, Suso Santana said:

 

For the even harder of being able to think.. Money has been pumped into the club by the fans and spent on utter shite. 

Yes, the current situation has been un expected but so was relegation to the absolute muppets in control of our football team. 

Every club is going to suffer now, but we will be suffering more than we should be. 

Get it yet?

 

I told you so!

 

 

[hmfc_liam06]

Where's the ITK'ers with the inside scoop from the players?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

12 minutes ago, Suso Santana said:

 

You're either at the wind up or thick as mince. 

 

It's a straightforward question. You're bitching about the team performance. I'm asking you if a better team performance would have avoided this. Yes or No?

[sac]

 

The pay cut is not scheduled to take effect until April, by which time the remaining games might get the green light to take place starting at the beginning of let’s say, Early June.

This is probably more Hope than expectation but might provide everyone at the club some comfort over their livelihoods.

[Suso Santana]

1 minute ago, colinmaroon said:

 

I told you so!

 

 

 

No offence, but i'm no even sure who you are. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

2 minutes ago, sac said:

 

The pay cut is not scheduled to take effect until April, by which time the remaining games might get the green light to take place starting at the beginning of let’s say, Early June.

This is probably more Hope than expectation but might provide everyone at the club some comfort over their livelihoods.

No chance of early june

 

[colinmaroon]

1 minute ago, Suso Santana said:

 

No offence, but i'm no even sure who you are. 

 

 

It was a general statement to the thread, because I definitely haven't a clue who you are.

 

 

PS If it helps, read the post previous to the one you quoted.

 

[Beast Boy]

2 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

Interesting article.....

 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11790/9308779/hearts-owner-ann-budge-insists-the-days-of-reckless-spending-are-over-at-tynecastle

 

Obviously we didn’t budget for a global pandemic but the fact we’ve clearly allowed the wages to get out of control again is a worry. 

[Malinga the Swinga]

If some so these posters were around when we were in admin, they would have wanted rid of Bryan Jackson as he would have been doing everything wrong and taking too long. We are lucky to have said posters as I realise there are always people who are thicker than me.

[Footballfirst]

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

[Jambo-Fox]

Hearts are lucky to have a CEO with the finger on the pulse who is taking pro-active action(s) before it’s too late!

 

💙Queen Ann💙

[gashauskis9]

4 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

He’ll be a busy bugger once other clubs come out and cut deeper than us.  

[JamboAl]

2 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

I'm not impressed by FW's grasp of the English language;

HMFC have not IMPOSED a wage cut: they have ASKED them.

[Don Dan]

The players’ union says its members realise the difficulties caused by the coronavirus shutdown and will consider “reasonable” requests to reduce their salaries but they want to see details of club finances when making decisions.

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

Fraser Wishart could of course come out and offer direct leadership to the players showing empathy and understanding of people's everyday problems. He and his union could be out there, making contacts with clubs offering solutions. 

 

Instead, he opens his mouth and says nothing.

[upgotheheads]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ann-budge-can-steer-hearts-through-latest-crisis-fans-may-struggle-help-warns-bryan-jackson-2502051

 

A very interesting take by someone we should listen to.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

7 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

No but he is suggesting ways in which this could work

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 minute ago, upgotheheads said:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ann-budge-can-steer-hearts-through-latest-crisis-fans-may-struggle-help-warns-bryan-jackson-2502051

 

A very interesting take by someone we should listen to.

Hard not to laugh at the bit about “expecting some pro activity” from Budge

[Gmcjambo]

One of two scenarios is true? 

 

1). Our financial management has been responsibke and our owner is 1st to take action, being bold and doing the right thing given the potential long term impacts. 

2). The club has been mismanaged financially,    relatively we are less robust that the other clubs and the owner has had to take desperate measures more quickly than other SPL clubs. 

 

I really don't know which is true as I'm not an expert but I think other clubs may regret not taking action sooner the longer this goes on.     So I'll give AB the benefit of the doubt and hope she is taken action that is seen as string leadership further down the line. 

[Vlad Magic]

8 minutes ago, Gmcjambo said:

One of two scenarios is true? 

 

1). Our financial management has been responsibke and our owner is 1st to take action, being bold and doing the right thing given the potential long term impacts. 

2). The club has been mismanaged financially,    relatively we are less robust that the other clubs and the owner has had to take desperate measures more quickly than other SPL clubs. 

 

I really don't know which is true as I'm not an expert but I think other clubs may regret not taking action sooner the longer this goes on.     So I'll give AB the benefit of the doubt and hope she is taken action that is seen as string leadership further down the line. 

What if we haven’t been mismanaged financially?

 

You missed that choice 👍

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 minutes ago, Vlad Magic said:

What if we haven’t been mismanaged financially?

 

You missed that choice 👍

Was that not option 1?

[Footballfirst]

19 minutes ago, upgotheheads said:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ann-budge-can-steer-hearts-through-latest-crisis-fans-may-struggle-help-warns-bryan-jackson-2502051

 

A very interesting take by someone we should listen to.

 

His views on what AB is doing have been discussed earlier in the thread, but not his views on the abilities of fans to respond to crises such as we are experiencing. It suggests to me that he may have general reservations about the capability of fan owned clubs to raise the funds required.

 

Coincidentally, the latest "Price of Football" podcast published earlier today was an interview with Neil Doncaster. In that interview he questions the suitability of fan owned models for full time clubs in Scotland.    (it seems to work ok in Germany) 

 

If you want to listen to that part of the discussion, it starts about 18' 15" in.

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-price-of-football/id1482886394#episodeGuid=7aee614a-2ee4-487e-aa81-e1508bd46651

 

It comes across as though he doesn't like fan ownership for clubs of Hearts size. 

Edited March 19, 2020 by Footballfirst

[Gmcjambo]

3 minutes ago, Vlad Magic said:

What if we haven’t been mismanaged financially?

 

You missed that choice 👍

1st point, no?  Which is we have been responsibly managed.... 

[Malinga the Swinga]

Just now, Footballfirst said:

 

His view on what AB is doing have been discussed earlier in the thread, but not his views on the abilities of fans to respond to crises such as we are experiencing. It suggests to me that he may have general reservations about the capability of fan owned clubs to raise the funds required.

 

Coincidentally, the latest "Price of Football" podcast published earlier today was an interview with Neil Doncaster. In that interview he questions the suitability of fan owned models for full time clubs in Scotland.    (it seems to work ok in Germany) 

 

If you want to listen to that part of the discussion, it starts about 18' 15" in.

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-price-of-football/id1482886394#episodeGuid=7aee614a-2ee4-487e-aa81-e1508bd46651

 

It comes across as though he doesn't like fan ownership for clubs of Hearts size. 

Think it comes across he doesn't like fans or Hearts.

[StevenNaismith]

From what I’ve heard, most players in the squad are happy to compromise in the short term but some have asked to receive the money they’ll be giving up at some point in the future, be that in a lump sum or staggered payments over the remainder of their contracts. There’s a few who have point blank refused though. Interesting times ahead. Many more clubs will follow our lead over the next week or so.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Just now, Malinga the Swinga said:

Think it comes across he doesn't like fans or Hearts.

Doncaster is the Allan Preston of football administration. Plus he still looks like a mutant.

[Gambo]

Has Ann got ahead of the game re FFP.

 

If clubs are still going to pay full whack on wages for 2 or 3 months with no income in that time, their % of wages to turnover is going to change quite a bit.

Edited March 19, 2020 by Gambo

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 minutes ago, StevenNaismith said:

From what I’ve heard, most players in the squad are happy to compromise in the short term but some have asked to receive the money they’ll be giving up at some point in the future, be that in a lump sum or staggered payments over the remainder of their contracts. There’s a few who have point blank refused though. Interesting times ahead. Many more clubs will follow our lead over the next week or so.

To those who have point blank refused, cheerio and don't let the door hit you when you leave. To those who accept, thanks and to the others, let's see if we can deal. 

[Suso Santana]

44 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

 

 

It was a general statement to the thread, because I definitely haven't a clue who you are.

 

 

PS If it helps, read the post previous to the one you quoted.

 

I cannae even read mate. 

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 minute ago, Gambo said:

Has Ann got ahead of the game re FFP.

 

If clubs are still going to pay full whack on wages for 2 or 3 months with no income in that time, their % of wages to turnover is going to change quite a bit.

No sensible and fair organisation would penalise small to medium clubs with FFP rules during an economic tsunami whilst ignoring what larger clubs do on an everyday basis.

 

Who is it that governs FFP again?

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

12 minutes ago, StevenNaismith said:

From what I’ve heard, most players in the squad are happy to compromise in the short term but some have asked to receive the money they’ll be giving up at some point in the future, be that in a lump sum or staggered payments over the remainder of their contracts. There’s a few who have point blank refused though. Interesting times ahead. Many more clubs will follow our lead over the next week or so.

A few going on June 30 will know they are not wanted and have nothing to lose by it.

 

They will be marked in history as men of poor character,  preference to see low salary workers suffer hardship they will never know. 

 

Sitting bottom of the League too. 

 

Hope they read this 

[pettigrewsstylist]

24 minutes ago, StevenNaismith said:

From what I’ve heard, most players in the squad are happy to compromise in the short term but some have asked to receive the money they’ll be giving up at some point in the future, be that in a lump sum or staggered payments over the remainder of their contracts. There’s a few who have point blank refused though. Interesting times ahead. Many more clubs will follow our lead over the next week or so.

Cant think of any i would sweat over. Hickey for cash would be only real one 

[Maple Leaf]

57 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Fraser Wishart isn't impressed by Hearts actions, but doesn't offer an alternative.

 

https://news.stv.tv/sport/players-union-warns-clubs-on-wage-reduction-moves?top

 

Has anyone offered an alternative to what Budge is proposing?  

 

Criticising is easy, but doesn't help.

[Mr Brightside]

30 minutes ago, Gambo said:

31 minutes ago, Gambo said:

Has Ann got ahead of the game re FFP.

 

If clubs are still going to pay full whack on wages for 2 or 3 months with no income in that time, their % of wages to turnover is going to change quite a bit.

 

27 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

No sensible and fair organisation would penalise small to medium clubs with FFP rules during an economic tsunami whilst ignoring what larger clubs do on an everyday basis.

 

Who is it that governs FFP again?

There is no FFP in Scottish football so that is not the driver.

 

My take on it all is that AB thinks the break in football and income will be a lot longer than some expect possibly 3 months plus.

[Big Slim Stylee]

10 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

Has anyone offered an alternative to what Budge is proposing?  

 

Criticising is easy, but doesn't help.

Indeed. Bit sad the usual suspects will just have a vent. Then again it’s unlikely they’ll ever rise to running a business with 200-odd employees.

[Lovecraft]

Just now, BarneyBattles said:

41 clubs out of 42 are currently offering an alternative by continuing to pay full wages. 

Let's see how long that lasts.

 

Hopefully they don't spend their 1.5Million too quickly.

 

 

[1971fozzy]

14 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

41 clubs out of 42 are currently offering an alternative by continuing to pay full wages. 

that’ll last a matter of days .

not many of these 41 clubs will have cash reserves.

If I lose my income then I can’t pay my mortgage and bills after a short period.

 

[JamboAndrew]

27 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

Has anyone offered an alternative to what Budge is proposing?  

 

Criticising is easy, but doesn't help.

 

It baffles me that anyone can see what we are doing as anything but responsible and sensible.

 

Running a business needs forward thinking and swift action in times of crisis. It's not that hard.

 

Stop with the personality politics and sly digs. Unless you can either sensibly show an alternative, or prove that the club has been mismanaged, then I can't see how you can't get behind this.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

2 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

All 41 have lasted longer than us. I know others will follow but sorry, I’m not seeing this as a master stroke in financial planning from Hearts by needing to do this 6 days after fixtures were suspended. 
 

 

I've no problem with Hearts going first. Imagine St Mirren, say, had done it. The chat on here would have been to deduct them 15 points. Then we would looked like right dicks when we did the same.

[davemclaren]

4 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

All 41 have lasted longer than us. I know others will follow but sorry, I’m not seeing this as a master stroke in financial planning from Hearts by needing to do this 6 days after fixtures were suspended. 
 

 

You can only really judge it when the football restarts.