They Can't Relegate Us (Legally)

[GorgieRules22]

1 minute ago, The White Cockade said:

No idea what I’d going to happen but I’m pretty certain if the games had all been played we’d be going down anyway

But it’s not certain so what you think might have happened is neither here nor there.

[TexasAndy]

Just now, The White Cockade said:

No idea what I’d going to happen but I’m pretty certain if the games had all been played we’d be going down anyway

It looked that way but it's hypothetical.  Football history is full of teams making late survival recoveries.  It's not like we are 10 points adrift.  

[The Roller]

3 minutes ago, The White Cockade said:

No idea what I’d going to happen but I’m pretty certain if the games had all been played we’d be going down anyway

The campaign is incomplete and the league table as it stands is based on an uneven set of fixtures. What you think may or may not have happened going forward is neither here nor there, tbh.

 

 

[OldGorgie]

19 minutes ago, The Roller said:

Who needs hibs fans trying to put the boot in when you can log on to jkb 😠

Who is the Hibs fan you are referring to.

[The Roller]

Just now, OldGorgie said:

Who is the Hibs fan you are referring to.

Listen, if I thought you were vermin, I’d call you out as vermin.

 

That you don’t seem to have the clubs back on this and many vermin will share your point of view, doesn’t mean I think you’re vermin.

 

Understand?

[Bazzas right boot]

4 hours ago, chuck berrys hairline said:

What use is an 8 team championship 😂 this solution just creates a cluster**** for leagues below ours.

 

Just null and viod the whole lot

 

 go to 3 leagues. 

Promote two other teams up to make the numbers up. 

Pretty easy tbh. 

[Bazzas right boot]

18 hours ago, Ehllhayapeh said:

Null and Void Sir Lawrence of Shanklands goal scoring exploits!!?? What madness is this?

 

Null and Void is the quickest way to financial oblivion. People will be entitled to refunds all over the shop if that happens.

 

Its got to be played out or reconstruction. Those are the fairest outcomes. You cannot punish Hearts or equally United when so much of the season is already played. And voiding is just a hornets nest of legal claims.

 

Yip, null and void when broken down isn't realty an option. 

 

Money, sponsorship, players stats. 

 

It's not champ man, where you don't save it then start again. 

 

Players are a year older as well. 

 

The season is incomplete, but games were played, celtic even won the lc. 

 

Prize money needs sorted 

 

Prize money needs sorted and even if the lc campaign cannot be completed, the 3 sc games might be able to be played. 

 

League reconstruction with Celtic awarded title (* season finished early due to pandemic) is the way that seems to mitigate almost all legal opposition. 

[fabienleclerq]

Let's be honest they will wait on the other leagues in particular down south before following suit. 

 

If it was me I would look at expanding the league's (even for a year if that's what it took). If you are top you win it, if you are bottom etc you stay up. 

 

It punishes the least amount of teams. There's no way to make everyone happy, the huns can claim its a tainted title for a comfort blanket. 

[frankblack]

39 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Yip, null and void when broken down isn't realty an option. 

 

A team can be winning 9-0 and have 3 players sent off, but if the game is abandoned, none of that counts when it is replayed.

 

39 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

Money, sponsorship, players stats. 

 

It's not champ man, where you don't save it then start again. 

 

Players are a year older as well. 

 

The season is incomplete, but games were played, celtic even won the lc. 

 

LC was concluded so that can stand, but the other points are incorrect other than sponsorship.

 

39 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

Prize money needs sorted 

 

Prize money needs sorted and even if the lc campaign cannot be completed, the 3 sc games might be able to be played. 

 

Prize money can be paid out on current positions.  Don't see where the 3 SC games could fit into a new season's calendar.

 

39 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

League reconstruction with Celtic awarded title (* season finished early due to pandemic) is the way that seems to mitigate almost all legal opposition. 

 

Agreed - the only outstanding issue is TV deals and season ticket money.  Some may want their money back for games not played.

[frankblack]

16 minutes ago, fabienleclerq said:

Let's be honest they will wait on the other leagues in particular down south before following suit. 

 

If it was me I would look at expanding the league's (even for a year if that's what it took). If you are top you win it, if you are bottom etc you stay up. 

 

It punishes the least amount of teams. There's no way to make everyone happy, the huns can claim its a tainted title for a comfort blanket. 

 

Down south isn't a great example.  They may well be in big trouble with the size of their TV contracts, whereas our current deals were pretty insignificant by comparison.

Edited April 2, 2020 by frankblack

[TorinoJambo]

3 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

A team can be winning 9-0 and have 3 players sent off, but if the game is abandoned, none of that counts when it is replayed.

 

 

LC was concluded so that can stand, but the other points are incorrect other than sponsorship.

 

 

Prize money can be paid out on current positions.  Don't see where the 3 SC games could fit into a new season's calendar.

 

 

Agreed - the only outstanding issue is TV deals and season ticket money.  Some may want their money back for games not played.

I remember my all time hero Denis Law scoring 6 against Luton in the FA Cup. The game was abandoned and they lost 3-1, Denis scored the one!

[TorinoJambo]

My view is this. I am certain the beaks want reconstruction to fit the pyramid idea but have been afraid to bite the bullet. This will be their chance without accepting real responsibility for it. Watch this space.

[fabienleclerq]

15 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Down south isn't a great example.  They may well be in big trouble with the size of their TV contracts, whereas our current deals were pretty insignificant by comparison.

 

The TV companies will need the football when it kicks off again so they'll work something out. 

 

My point was more about no one up here having the balls to say this is what we are going to do because xyz. They will wait and mirror other associations. 

[Shanks]

I can't see this season being voided I'm afraid, surely the better option would be to cancel next season or delay next season?  Next season is a season that hasn't started yet (much like wimbledon etc) so it is easy to cancel.

 

The fairest way will be to complete this season and then take it from there.

[OldGorgie]

1 hour ago, The Roller said:

Listen, if I thought you were vermin, I’d call you out as vermin.

 

That you don’t seem to have the clubs back on this and many vermin will share your point of view, doesn’t mean I think you’re vermin.

 

Understand?

Your first comment was pathetic. The second post was cowardly.  Now away and report me to your mummy.

[Bazzas right boot]

22 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

A team can be winning 9-0 and have 3 players sent off, but if the game is abandoned, none of that counts when it is replayed.

 

 

LC was concluded so that can stand, but the other points are incorrect other than sponsorship.

 

 

Prize money can be paid out on current positions.  Don't see where the 3 SC games could fit into a new season's calendar.

 

 

Agreed - the only outstanding issue is TV deals and season ticket money.  Some may want their money back for games not played.

 

Not sure that is applicable to what is happening now tbh. 

There is a rule tha covers that. 

For this, there isn't. 

 

Fair point. 

Sponsorship is a big issue tho 

 

I am sure 3 games could be fit in, but tbh there are other issues as well. 

 

 

Yes, and tbh I can pretty much guarantee the only thing holding up league expansion is the OF and the, need for thier 4 games. 

[Bazzas right boot]

8 minutes ago, Longshanks said:

I can't see this season being voided I'm afraid, surely the better option would be to cancel next season or delay next season?  Next season is a season that hasn't started yet (much like wimbledon etc) so it is easy to cancel.

 

The fairest way will be to complete this season and then take it from there.

 

 

Said that at the start of this 

 

Even announce next season as a shorter season in advance. 

Next season starts January through to June or something. 

 

TV, gate, sponsorshio money becomes an issue tho this season and next. 

[David McCaig]

10 minutes ago, Longshanks said:

I can't see this season being voided I'm afraid, surely the better option would be to cancel next season or delay next season?  Next season is a season that hasn't started yet (much like wimbledon etc) so it is easy to cancel.

 

The fairest way will be to complete this season and then take it from there.

Are you seriously proposing cancelling all football until July 2021 bar the remaining 8 games of this season?  

 

What is fair about resuming this season with each side potentially having an entirely new team?

 

Calling the league based on a snapshot in time based on an unbalanced fixture list is the worst option of all?

 

Therefore null and void is the only sensible option and also the fairest option as anything else is based on guesswork and good fortune in terms of the fixture list.

[Dazo]

4 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Said that at the start of this 

 

Even announce next season as a shorter season in advance. 

Next season starts January through to June or something. 

 

TV, gate, sponsorshio money becomes an issue tho this season and next. 

Glaring omission from that scenario. 

[FWJ]

Maybe they could shorten next season by simply playing 1x home and 1x away fixture?

[Shanks]

1 minute ago, David McCaig said:

Are you seriously proposing cancelling all football until July 2021 bar the remaining 8 games of this season?  

 

What is fair about resuming this season with each side potentially having an entirely new team?

 

Calling the league based on a snapshot in time based on an unbalanced fixture list is the worst option of all?

 

Therefore null and void is the only sensible option and also the fairest option as anything else is based on guesswork and good fortune in terms of the fixture list.

 

Voiding this season is the fairest option, really?  would you be saying that if we were top of the league?

[David McCaig]

Yes, I would.  A League campaign is all about planning to last the duration of that season and in the case of the SPL, that is 38 games.  Awarding promotion and relegation on the basis of a beneficial fixture list is quite clearly the least fair option of all.

 

I've already given an example for ourselves whereby if we had played St Mirren twice at home instead of twice away we would probably be above them in the table.  

 

The examples further down the League are even more inequitable, Partick Thistle 2 points adrift with a game in hand, Falkirk 1 point adrift of Raith - but with a home game against them on the last day of the season.

 

The League is unfinished and there is no realistic option of completing it before Scottish player contracts expire at the end of May.  Any solution has to be one of least harm to the clubs involved ie. no club is left in a worse position than they were.  There are two ways of doing this, either you declare the season null and void, or you expand the Leagues and award promotion with no relegation.  However, with expansion you are once again rewarding clubs based on an incomplete fixture list.

 

Therefore, the logical solution is to declare the unfinished 2019/2020 season null and void... no one goes up and no one goes down.

 

 

[sac]

3 hours ago, AlimOzturk said:

Wimbledon, the Olympics, the Euros and many other huge sporting events have been cancelled so the idea that football can continue in any shape or form over the next 3 months Is pure Dreamland stuff. Footballers will be needing a pre season as well because you can't just throw them into football as due to Covid 19 they won't have been able to train properly. That's just reckless and recipe for injury. Also, players are out of contract and clubs will be financially unable to sign replacements ATM. 

 

SPFL need to make decisions so clubs can prepare. This season must be made null and void. There is no other choice

Think the players union also said that even games behind closed doors would not be an option as the safety of the players could not be guaranteed & insurance would not cover it.

[martoon]

7 minutes ago, FWJ said:

Maybe they could shorten next season by simply playing 1x home and 1x away fixture?

 

A 22 game season, or 26 if it's a 14 club league, would open up the title to others. Still a long shot, I suppose, but a decent, injury free Aberdeen/Hearts etc., with a storming start, could go all the way in such a short season. To say nothing of Rangers. 

 

Celtic would hate the idea. 

 

Let's dae it. 😂

[jock _turd]

34 minutes ago, Longshanks said:

I can't see this season being voided I'm afraid, surely the better option would be to cancel next season or delay next season?  Next season is a season that hasn't started yet (much like wimbledon etc) so it is easy to cancel.

 

The fairest way will be to complete this season and then take it from there.

Depends on what you term as fair. I would say that it is possible to do that BUT and it is a major caveat teams should only be able to play players that were signed to them in this current season. I really cannot see this plan being a goer it puts football into a hiatus for a long time... having said that what if we are not past this pandemic by then...

Edited April 2, 2020 by jock _turd

[The Roller]

37 minutes ago, OldGorgie said:

Your first comment was pathetic. The second post was cowardly.  Now away and report me to your mummy.

[martoon]

4 minutes ago, The Roller said:

 

He looks a wee bit like John Millar. 

[Haken]

When you think of all the major events being cancelled (such as the Edinburgh Festival), it really brings into focus what a shitshow Scottish football is where governing bodies cant make a decision because it will either upset Celtic or upset Rangers.  No one should kid themselves that anyone else matters in this.

[Bazzas right boot]

 Belguim league decided. 

 

Brugge declared as champions, standings as they are. 

 

Can't find out if teams demoted/ relagated tho. 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

28 minutes ago, Haken said:

When you think of all the major events being cancelled (such as the Edinburgh Festival), it really brings into focus what a shitshow Scottish football is where governing bodies cant make a decision because it will either upset Celtic or upset Rangers.  No one should kid themselves that anyone else matters in this.

 

 

100%

[GorgieRules22]

1 minute ago, Smith's right boot said:

 Belguim league decided. 

 

Brugge declared as champions, standings as they are. 

 

Can't find out if teams demoted/ relagated tho. 

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 Belguim league decided. 

 

Brugge declared as champions, standings as they are. 

 

Can't find out if teams demoted/ relagated tho. 

 

 

 

[Zico]

Just now, GorgieRules22 said:

 

 

They only had one league game left as they then have a playoff for the title and Europa places. 

[Beast Boy]

14 minutes ago, GorgieRules22 said:

 

 

This really is the only sensible option. I am convinced this is what will happen here too.

[dav1e]

Rantic will agree the way forward, probably relegating us in the process, If the blazers had any sense they would void the season and restructure, this option is the simplest. 

 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

6 hours ago, OldGorgie said:

It’s fairly obvious from the West Coast gossip that the SPFL is going to declare the season finished with Celtic becoming Champions and us relegated. Dundee Utd will get promoted and they deserve it, otherwise it makes a mockery of sport. Do we deserve to get relegated? 

 

If we are bottom after the last game or lose a playoff, yes. Now, no.

 

We deserved to win the title in 85/86 and most people thought we had it in the bag after beating D Utd 3-0 away 3 games before the end of the season. Most thought we just had to turn up at Dundee and collect our point and there was no way Celtic would score all the goals they needed even if we lost. How did that turn out?

[Guest ToqueJambo]

1 hour ago, Longshanks said:

 

Voiding this season is the fairest option, really?  would you be saying that if we were top of the league?

 

Would you consider a title "won" after 30 games to be a real title? So we won the league in 86 after all! Finishing it is the fairest way, followed by league reconstruction, followed by abandoning and voiding it (and effectively replaying it next season). Turning the league into a 30-game league suddenly with no play-offs and leaving European places up in the air because the cup hasn't finished is by far the worst solution. It's not even a good financial solution for anyone really apart from maybe Dundee Utd and Hamilton.

 

Narrator: "The next day the SPFL awarded the title to Celtic and relegated Hearts."

Edited April 2, 2020 by ToqueJambo

[Guest ToqueJambo]

5 hours ago, His name is said:

I was thinking about the league situation, given the fact that rangers are so far behind and have been playing so poorly, they could actually come out of this looking like the 'bigger man' by conceding the league.

 

I then thought about the situation if it was us and hibs in the same situation. 

 

Would you be happy to conceded? Would you be happy if the club conceded? 

 

 

 

The thing about the title is I don't know why any Celtic fan would want the title in these circumstances. Celtic win the league every year and have done for what the last 8 or 9 years. They will again for the next 8 or 9 years. Of all the clubs in the world, the "loss" of a title through voiding the season, Celtic would get the least sympathy. Most of their fans would probably just shrug, knowing they'll just win it next season. IT's nothing like Liverpool, who haven't won it for ages. Or Dundee Utd who have gambled financially on going up. Celtic will gain nothing if they get it now and lose nothing if they don't.

 

All Celtic seems to care about is their 9 or 10 in a row or whatever it is and getting one over Rangers. If they get awarded this "title" it will always have an asterix. Not only will it not be a real title but it would stop their 9/10 in a row as it wouldn't;t be a proper winning streak. So they'd need to start again.

 

It makes no odds to me if Celtic get awarded the title this year or not. If they do they can argue about if it's a real title with Rangers fans for all eternity. But it baffles me that any Celtic fan would actually want the "30-game title" in these circumstances.

 

I think this is like when Rangers got into trouble. Celtic argued they should be punished and thrown out of the league but that was just to appease their fans. Secretly they need Rangers. Same thing here. They're just arguing for the league title to be seen to do so. They really couldn't care less though. There is zero impact for them. I honesty think secretly they don't want a "tainted" title on their record. They want a genuine 10/11/12 in a row.

Edited April 2, 2020 by ToqueJambo

[Jeff]

Club Brugge were 15 clear. Liverpool will probably be crowned after all of this

Edited April 2, 2020 by Jeff

[Last Laff]

4 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Club Brugge were 15 clear. Liverpool will probably be crowned after all of this

And correctly so.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

4 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Club Brugge were 15 clear. Liverpool will probably be crowned after all of this

 

Just learnt the Belgian league normally has MLS-style playoffs for the title. Wow. Can't see us doing that but it would be a good solution to make the league competitive.

[Jeff]

Just now, Last Laff said:

And correctly so.

 

True 22 points is far too big a gap and I reckon Pep won't be overly upset either. Interesting to see how other leagues go though

[Kiwidoug]

I know this goes round in circles but if the league is now finished then it is null and void.  Celtic were not champions.  No club was relegated.

 

Same applies in England which is clearly tough on liverpool but life is tough.  Some people are born into hibs supporting families.  Doesn't get any tougher than that.

[Last Laff]

3 minutes ago, Jeff said:

 

True 22 points is far too big a gap and I reckon Pep won't be overly upset either. Interesting to see how other leagues go though

Definitely. 

[Last Laff]

1 minute ago, Kiwidoug said:

I know this goes round in circles but if the league is now finished then it is null and void.  Celtic were not champions.  No club was relegated.

 

Same applies in England which is clearly tough on liverpool but life is tough.  Some people are born into hibs supporting families.  Doesn't get any tougher than that.

Your opinion is based solely on your football support though.  Celtic deserve the league title. The rest wouldn’t be fair.

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

This really is the only sensible option. I am convinced this is what will happen here too.

Would imagine that UEFA have ratified this decision so very likely that all other countries will follow suit. Just wait for the wailing from Govan. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

1 minute ago, Last Laff said:

And correctly so.

 

No-one, even Liverpool fans and players if they're honest, will see it as a genuine title. There won't be all the celebrations that go with it for a start. They'll take it obviously but it'll feel like the silver medalist who gets upgraded to a gold years later because it turned out the winner doped or something, or the tennis player who wins Wimbledon because their opponent goes off injured. Titles awarded this season in those circumstances will always have a caveat in the history books and opposing fans will never recognise them. They'll become a pub quiz question basically. And Liverpool are my English team. Liverpool fans can still remember a great season whatever happens, like us with 85/86.

 

[GorgieRules22]

10 minutes ago, Barack said:

Uh-oh...

The talk is no relegation so no uh-oh really.

[DETTY29]

3 hours ago, sac said:

Think the players union also said that even games behind closed doors would not be an option as the safety of the players could not be guaranteed & insurance would not cover it.

And the government at this time don't want medical staff in attendnce at sporting events.

 

Would the clubs'insurance be null and void if no doctor in attendance?

Edited April 2, 2020 by DETTY29

[Bilo74]

5 minutes ago, GorgieRules22 said:

The talk is no relegation so no uh-oh really.

 

That's not the case. There might well be relegation. Still to be decided. The thing that's confusing things in Belgium is their second division has a play off to see who gets promoted. They're currently one leg into a two leg play off. So, if the second leg can't go ahead their might be no relegation. 

 

I'm sure if we do end up getting relegated by the clowns in charge here though we'll go through the right channels. One game left in Belgium. Much, much more left here! 

Edited April 2, 2020 by Bilo74
Typo

[Jambos1983]

19 minutes ago, Last Laff said:

Your opinion is based solely on your football support though.  Celtic deserve the league title. The rest wouldn’t be fair.

No one deserves anything if the season isn't finished