The rise and fall of The SNP.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

37 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

How can an Ayrshire person be a weegie?

 

Same breed

[Auldbenches]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

 

It’s much more than that. She lied to parliament. She was responsible for the plot to imprison AS. Her husband has refused to appear at a parliamentary enquiry and appears to have lied to it on his previous visit. There are several hundred thousand pounds missing from party funds. Party membership has declined drastically. Policies are much more to the right than under AS and the uber woke agenda is turning people away.

           She has only one chance and that is to apologise for these acts (she will never do this) and make the May elections a plebiscite. This won’t happen though because there is little appetite for Indy amongst the current SNP hierarchy.  There’s never been a better time to go for Indy and there might never be again but the priority of the SNP seems to be the Gender Recognition Act. They are not going to vote for their own destruction.

  There may be little alternative but the SNP is not fit for office either. Many activists and supporters know this but I agree there is little knowledge or concern in the wider community nevertheless when the activists are no longer motivated the votes will dry up.

   Sturgeon will be gone very soon imo but if she does make it to the election the poor result will finish her.   Bumping Cherry makes her look weak.  Promising full disclosure and then trying to prevent it makes her look corrupt. Attacking her own supporters and members while avoiding attacking the WM government for their numerous acts of corruption and incompetence reveals her opinion on Indy. She may even win the election but she wont get Indy. There is no reason to wait for Indyref 2. We can have it if we want it.

In 9 months she has went from being regarded as one of the most respected people in uk politics to being shown up as power hungry just like the rest.

Withholding stuff pisses on the claims of a new politics in Scotland. 

Just same old party carry on.

Are party politics not just antiquated pish now? 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

I keep hearing about this "dismal" record but I have yet to hear what that is other than the "named carer" debacle.

What would you consider to be "dismal" considering they control about 30% of the powers that an Independent country would?

Meets next to none of her targets, performs no better in terms of education or health than the rest of the country and can’t manage actual pressing issues like drug deaths.

 

I doubt anyone in Scotland would do much better because they’re all roasters too but I doubt they’d do much worse either. The problem with Sturgeon is that when her sanctimonious uttering wear thin, she’s in deep trouble.

[coconut doug]

1 minute ago, Auldbenches said:

In 9 months she has went from being regarded as one of the most respected people in uk politics to being shown up as power hungry just like the rest.

Withholding stuff pisses on the claims of a new politics in Scotland. 

Just same old party carry on.

Are party politics not just antiquated pish now? 

 

Absolutely. What's the point in Indy if we can't be better than that?

[Auldbenches]

Just now, coconut doug said:

 

Absolutely. What's the point in Indy if we can't be better than that?

That's what it's about for me.  Couldn't give a shiny about nationalism in any way, just want rid off  the antiquated democracy that is Westminster.  

In my opinion we'll have a better voting system but the same party ambitions. 

This withholding stuff isn't just about the enquiry, it's eroding trust in the Scottish parliament. 

 

[Cade]

Indy would also force the Tories and Labour (and LibDems for that matter) to actually start caring about what the people of Scotland need and tailoring specific policies around that, not simply taking orders from their Westminster bosses.

It'd be good for them too, if they could only get over their colonial mindset.

[coconut doug]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

All that may be true....but the point of this thread is that the SNP is going to collapse. It isn't. Not before the elections in any case.

None of what you say above is even remotely near what the tories have done in the last 10 years. I know thats "whatabootery" but they set a precedent of doing whatever they want, delaying things, lying and hiding evidence of their corrupt dealings. Nobody that matters even cares anymore. 

My last 3 or 4 posts on here (as ridiculous as they are) just emphasises my point. THERE-IS-NO-ALTERNATIVE-OR-REAL-OPPOSITION for the SNP in Scotland (as sad as that is, it's true).

Despite what's gone on or going on there WILL be a landslide SNP victory come MAY.

And on we go.

 

 There may be a list vote alternative come the election. I'm certainly not defending the Tories but being better than them is no standard at all..

 Many Indy supporters feel betrayed. There is no reason to stall now. Its just like Labour who couldn't bring themselves to implement any redistributive policies. 

Why do you think we are not making the elections an INdy plebiscite?

[Pans Jambo]

8 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

 There may be a list vote alternative come the election. I'm certainly not defending the Tories but being better than them is no standard at all..

 Many Indy supporters feel betrayed. There is no reason to stall now. Its just like Labour who couldn't bring themselves to implement any redistributive policies. 

Why do you think we are not making the elections an INdy plebiscite?

There may be. The next elections may still be a plebiscite. Nothing official has been stated has it?

I agree on your point about just doing better than the tories but unfortunately, that's the metric we have had (to put up with) to measure against for the last 10 years.

Still, doing better whilst barely in charge of 30% of the power...imagine what we could do with 100%.

[Pans Jambo]

20 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

That's what it's about for me.  Couldn't give a shiny about nationalism in any way, just want rid off  the antiquated democracy that is Westminster.  

In my opinion we'll have a better voting system but the same party ambitions. 

This withholding stuff isn't just about the enquiry, it's eroding trust in the Scottish parliament. 

 

That may be the case but if folk turn their back on it, where do they go? Back to that shower of shite in London?

 

Unlikely if you are a supporter of something better. Best to get Indy done first and then vote for someone who doesn't talk shite! I wouldn't trust anyone with a party that's that's based in Westminster. Ever! They've had all the chances they've ever needed these last 50 years! They never change.

 

Like it or not, the best vehicle to get Independence over the line right now is the SNP. We can sort the rest once we get the keys!

[Ron Burgundy]

12 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

That may be the case but if folk turn their back on it, where do they go? Back to that shower of shite in London?

 

Unlikely if you are a supporter of something better. Best to get Indy done first and then vote for someone who doesn't talk shite! I wouldn't trust anyone with a party that's that's based in Westminster. Ever! They've had all the chances they've ever needed these last 50 years! They never change.

 

Like it or not, the best vehicle to get Independence over the line right now is the SNP. We can sort the rest once we get the keys!

The keys to a dilapidated house with no means or money to do it up.

 

If I knew for certain that my kids and I would be better off with independence then I would snap your hand off for it. I couldn't care what flag I live under or what colour/nationality it states on my passport if it meant better.

I'm just not prepared to risk it all like others would simply because they have a hatred of something.

 

And let's face it every political party is a parcel of rogues. The SNP are no different. Probably the worst at the moment, certainly in Scotland.

 

 

[Pans Jambo]

15 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

The keys to a dilapidated house with no means or money to do it up.

 

If I knew for certain that my kids and I would be better off with independence then I would snap your hand off for it. I couldn't care what flag I live under or what colour/nationality it states on my passport if it meant better.

I'm just not prepared to risk it all like others would simply because they have a hatred of something.

 

And let's face it every political party is a parcel of rogues. The SNP are no different. Probably the worst at the moment, certainly in Scotland.

 

 

You lost me at that utter rambling. 

Ireland are struggling I see.

[Ron Burgundy]

Just now, Pans Jambo said:

You lost me at that utter rambling. 

Ireland are struggling I see.

See, to a rabid hate filled nationalist my honest and genuine concerns are just rambling.

I don't give a feck how Ireland are doing, I don't live there.

[Pans Jambo]

Just now, Ron Burgundy said:

See, to a rabid hate filled nationalist my honest and genuine concerns are just rambling.

I don't give a feck how Ireland are doing, I don't live there.

390Billion + GDP and less than 5M people.

 

You may not care but you were happy to say Scotland would be worse off without Westminster. I just gave you a simple example of what is possible without Boris Johnson!

[Ron Burgundy]

Just now, Pans Jambo said:

390Billion + GDP and less than 5M people.

 

You may not care but you were happy to say Scotland would be worse off without Westminster. I just gave you a simple example of what is possible without Boris Johnson!

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

6 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

This is the point. If you want change, you have to prove the merits of that change.

 

Otherwise it’s no different to Brexit

[Pans Jambo]

5 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

By the way, who's "bitter and hate filled"?  

[Pans Jambo]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

This is the point. If you want change, you have to prove the merits of that change.

 

Otherwise it’s no different to Brexit

Why that comparison? Brexit? Did folk think they would have more "cash in their hand" if they left the EU?

[Ron Burgundy]

Just now, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

This is the point. If you want change, you have to prove the merits of that change.

 

Otherwise it’s no different to Brexit

Also if Scotland voted for and got independence I would be praying for it to be a success not wishing it failed to prove how right I was.

The people who are actively hoping the country fails cos they didn't want Brexit are clearly not right in the head.

[Auldbenches]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

That may be the case but if folk turn their back on it, where do they go? Back to that shower of shite in London?

 

Unlikely if you are a supporter of something better. Best to get Indy done first and then vote for someone who doesn't talk shite! I wouldn't trust anyone with a party that's that's based in Westminster. Ever! They've had all the chances they've ever needed these last 50 years! They never change.

 

Like it or not, the best vehicle to get Independence over the line right now is the SNP. We can sort the rest once we get the keys!

People won't turn away from it because of snp infighting, but they lose a lot if voters as soon as we cross the line.  

Which party do you trust up here if you look at tbe Salmond enquiry?  

It's beginning to look like it's nothing to do with being based in Westminster.  

[manaliveits105]

1 hour ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Also if Scotland voted for and got independence I would be praying for it to be a success not wishing it failed to prove how right I was.

The people who are actively hoping the country fails cos they didn't want Brexit are clearly not right in the head.

This thread proves that 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

Why that comparison? Brexit? Did folk think they would have more "cash in their hand" if they left the EU?

That was the narrative behind the Leave campaign, yes

[Nookie Bear]

1 hour ago, Ron Burgundy said:

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

 

Many are already worse off due to tax.

[Pans Jambo]

4 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Many are already worse off due to tax.

Who?

[Dazo]

8 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Who?

Tax payers in Scotland. 

Edited February 2, 2021 by Dazo

[Adam_the_legend]

6 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Who?

Anyone that earns £43k-£50k is worse off in Scotland than rUK for a start. 

[Pans Jambo]

35 minutes ago, Adam_the_legend said:

Anyone that earns £43k-£50k is worse off in Scotland than rUK for a start. 

MOST of Scottish taxpayers (55%) pay the same or less than rUK.

Its a myth that we pay a lot more than rUK.

Only folk who earn a lot higher than average pay slightly more for:

Free personal care for those who need it (regardless of age).

Free prescriptions.

Better NHS Pay.

Lowest council tax in the UK.

Free Bus passes (& concessionary bus passes).

Free University places.

Free feminine sanitary products in schools & colleges.

Mitigated the Bedroom Tax.

No more bridge tolls.

Free Childcare up to 16hours/week for all 3-4 yr olds.

Free School Meals for Primary 1-3 (being extended to P4 shortly).

Keeping Scottish Water public (water charges £46/year cheaper than rUK).

Free Baby box to all who want one

 

Seems a decent deal to me...Unless you're a tory and dont like looking after bairns, the sick and the old folk.

(Well I say free but we all pay for it in our taxes...well at least the 45% highest paid do).

 

 

[Pans Jambo]

51 minutes ago, Adam_the_legend said:

Anyone that earns £43k-£50k is worse off in Scotland than rUK for a start. 

Band	Income Range	Rate
Basic Rate	Over £14,667 - £25,296	20%
Intermediate Rate	Over £25,296 - £43,662	21%
Higher Rate	Over £43,662 - £150,000*	41%
Top Rate	Over £150,000**	46%

 

On a £33,000 salary you pay around £58 a year more in Scotland than rUK.

At £50,000 salary you pay around £1500 more in Scotland than rUK.

 

If you're on £50k or above you must be struggling and if you are...stop buying shite you cant afford!

[manaliveits105]

So much for Kates most important budget in the history of devolution 

[Dazo]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

Band	Income Range	Rate
Basic Rate	Over £14,667 - £25,296	20%
Intermediate Rate	Over £25,296 - £43,662	21%
Higher Rate	Over £43,662 - £150,000*	41%
Top Rate	Over £150,000**	46%

 

On a £33,000 salary you pay around £58 a year more in Scotland than rUK.

At £50,000 salary you pay around £1500 more in Scotland than rUK.

 

If you're on £50k or above you must be struggling and if you are...stop buying shite you cant afford!

So people pay more tax as was said. Didn’t need the party political broadcast.  👍

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

That's it in a nutshell for me too.  They are selling a dream not a reality. 

 

It's like religion, you need to have faith that the land of milk and honey exists, but will only find out for sure if and when you get there. 

 

Independence would lead to years more of economic uncertainty - that's indisputable. 

 

After a global financial crisis, we've had a decade of political bollocks with referenda, elections and Brexit.  Right now we are all trying to survive the biggest health/economic crisis to hit the planet in 100 years.

 

I'd quite like some sort of stability for a wee while if its not to much to ask.

 

 

Edited February 2, 2021 by Candy

[speaker]

9 minutes ago, Candy said:

That's it in a nutshell for me too.  They are selling a dream not a reality. 

 

It's like religion, you need to have faith that the land of milk and honey exists, but will only find out for sure if and when you get there. 

 

Independence would lead to years more of economic uncertainty - that's indisputable. 

 

After a global financial crisis, we've had a decade of political bollocks with referenda, elections and Brexit.  Right now we are all trying to survive the biggest health/economic crisis to hit the planet in 100 years.

 

I'd quite like some sort of stability for a wee while if its not to much to ask.

 

 

My thoughts exactly.

[Lord Inglis]

5 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

If the SNP prove I will have more cash in my hand and my kids will have better prospects I would bite their hand off. They can't though so I won't gamble. 

 

Agree. They need to spend more time selling the economic benefits (if they exist) before I start voting for something in the name of 'self-determination' which seems to be the latest buzz phrase. 

[Guest]

Just now, Lord Inglis said:

Agree. They need to spend more time selling the economic benefits (if they exist) before I start voting for something in the name of 'self-determination' which seems to be the latest buzz phrase. 

Thus far they've built the movement on English/Toaries/Westminster bad.

 

 If the economic benefits do exist and are genuinely demonstrable then indy should be a skoosh. 

[Lord Inglis]

6 minutes ago, Candy said:

Thus far they've built the movement on English/Toaries/Westminster bad.

 

 If the economic benefits do exist and are genuinely demonstrable then indy should be a skoosh. 

I've actually heard some SNP supporters say they would accept 'hardship' as a price to pay for independence.

 

Yeah, very good. But I wont be. 

[Janbo1874]

39 minutes ago, Candy said:

That's it in a nutshell for me too.  They are selling a dream not a reality. 

 

It's like religion, you need to have faith that the land of milk and honey exists, but will only find out for sure if and when you get there. 

 

Independence would lead to years more of economic uncertainty - that's indisputable. 

 

After a global financial crisis, we've had a decade of political bollocks with referenda, elections and Brexit.  Right now we are all trying to survive the biggest health/economic crisis to hit the planet in 100 years.

 

I'd quite like some sort of stability for a wee while if its not to much to ask.

 

 

👏

[theshed]

31 minutes ago, Lord Inglis said:

I've actually heard some SNP supporters say they would accept 'hardship' as a price to pay for independence.

 

Yeah, very good. But I wont be. 

 

Thats cause they ain’t right in the head 

[Malinga the Swinga]

8 hours ago, Konrad von Carstein said:

We didn't, I ****ed up, and I blame the pandemic for days, weeks and years melting into one big gloopy mess in my brain (cell)  

 

 

Thank god for that. Thought I'd missed an election. 

[Konrad von Carstein]

2 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Thank god for that. Thought I'd missed an election. 

 

You'll miss more of those as you get olde...Oh, ELECTION  

[Space Mackerel]

6 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

The keys to a dilapidated house with no means or money to do it up.

 

If I knew for certain that my kids and I would be better off with independence then I would snap your hand off for it. I couldn't care what flag I live under or what colour/nationality it states on my passport if it meant better.

I'm just not prepared to risk it all like others would simply because they have a hatred of something.

 

And let's face it every political party is a parcel of rogues. The SNP are no different. Probably the worst at the moment, certainly in Scotland.

 

 

Ron, you’re kids are stuck on a plague infested racist little island, who can’t live abroad and who’s Empire was finished after the Suez crisis. 
Their future lies in subscribing to food banks or picking spuds for Tory landowners. And donators. 

[Dawnrazor]

7 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

Ron, you’re kids are stuck on a plague infested racist little island, who can’t live abroad and who’s Empire was finished after the Suez crisis. 
Their future lies in subscribing to food banks or picking spuds for Tory landowners. And donators. 

FFS 🤣🤣🤣

[Space Mackerel]

18 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

FFS 🤣🤣🤣

I had my Brexit voting, very anti SNP neighbour giving me a hand labouring for me at work today. I asked him how much he thought the Yookay was in debt. His answer...£50 billion  

He did admit Brexit was a complete disaster and wished he hadn’t now. ☺️

[Dawnrazor]

2 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

I had my Brexit voting, very anti SNP neighbour giving me a hand labouring for me at work today. I asked him how much he thought the Yookay was in debt. His answer...£50 billion  

He did admit Brexit was a complete disaster and wished he hadn’t now. ☺️

Did he aye.

[Space Mackerel]

Just now, Dawnrazor said:

Did he aye.

He very much did actually. 
 

Maybe Ron’s bairns could get involved in the highly profitable supply of top quality Scottish seafood to top of the range European restaurants?

 

Oh well, never mind...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55903599

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

2 hours ago, Lord Inglis said:

I've actually heard some SNP supporters say they would accept 'hardship' as a price to pay for independence.

 

Yeah, very good. But I wont be. 

It’s the trait of nationalists for as long as humans have existed. Anything is worth being able to wave a flag

[Dawnrazor]

7 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

He very much did actually. 
 

Maybe Ron’s bairns could get involved in the highly profitable supply of top quality Scottish seafood to top of the range European restaurants?

 

Oh well, never mind...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55903599

 

 

What's all this got to do with the utter pish in your first post? Or were you trying to be humorous/attention seeking?

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

It’s the trait of nationalists for as long as humans have existed. Anything is worth being able to wave a flag

What does this even mean? Did you copy it of history wifies Twitter feed? 

[Dawnrazor]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

It’s the trait of nationalists for as long as humans have existed. Anything is worth being able to wave a flag

Aye but Spacey had a pal who's a Yooninyist and he couldn't accurately say how much the UK is in debt so independence will work.

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Dawnrazor said:

Aye but Spacey had a pal who's a Yooninyist and he couldn't accurately say how much the UK is in debt so independence will work.

Maybe you could point to another highly educated Western European country who is like Greece without the sunshine? 

[Dawnrazor]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

Maybe you could point to another highly educated Western European country who is like Greece without the sunshine? 

Great Britain👍

[Space Mackerel]

Just now, Dawnrazor said:

Great Britain👍

You either mean GB AND NI or The UK? 
 

See what I mean about Unionists being a wee bit stupit? 
 

How much is the UK in debt now? Dint Google and give us all a laugh please? 😃