Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Enzo Chiefo]

6 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

It seems everyone can do as they please and live their lives. As long as they don't play in my street. 

Covid doesn't exist apparently, well just wait til it chaps your door, dunderheids. 

RiA, For most folks, Covid will be nowhere near your door and even if it did , you probably wouldn't even hear it.  It tends to knock on the doors of hospitals and care homes. Others actively try to break into Covid's home and that's where the problem lies.

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

25 minutes ago, jonesy said:

To be honest, it hasn't felt like there has been much of a strategy at all. Firefighting is reactionary and panicked, and we've been in this hellish situation for almost a year. There's no sign that either government (or indeed, many across Europe) has the balls or the imagination to come up with much better. 

 

Just to be contrary - whodathunkit! - your point in the last paragraph is what I was getting at about things being overly simplified. Yes, a life saved is a good thing. But that's only because we have daily death figures rolling in with some kind of morbid obsession. The actual consequences of lockdown are that for each job lost, the knock-on effect can and will be brutal - resulting in long term suffering. Whether you view that suffering to be worse than someone vulnerable or who has already exceeded the average life expectancy potentially picking up the virus is the conundrum. There are no easy decisions in that regard, but the government seems to be attempting to make the easiest (take care of the stats and leave the next government to pick up the pieces) rather than the most effective.

 

1 life saved on the telly 2 lives lost off the telly unfortunately equates to 1 life saved for a lot of people

 

that lady scientist who someone uploaded an interview with about 100 pages back is also on video saying potentially 130 million dead from hunger due to global lockdowns - is that factored in to folks perspective? - I’d guess not and possibly understandably so but is one type of major thing people are missing when they go pro-lockdown crazy on the back of 35 reported covid deaths

 

no easy answers tho

 

maybe should have gone the swedish route - in fact due to our lockdown being half-assed and late (don’t believe me then check the experts view about 300 pages back) and the late introduction of wrongly-worn face masks - it has been suggested we have effectively gone the Swedish route we just don’t realise it but with a multitude more pain (with more to come) - we’ve taken the cons from the Swedish route and the cons from the lockdown route without fully comprehending it - read it in yetis are aliens monthly obvs

 

 

 

 

[redjambo]

Today's Battle of the Lothians (per-100,000 case stats):

 

West 31, City 18, Mid 8, East 7.

[Enzo Chiefo]

3 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Don't lower yourself, Enzo. 👍

Cheers Guv👍

[Enzo Chiefo]

11 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Yep, fingers crossed with the vaccine.

 

The part in bold interests me. It really is like a domino effect - and one wonders what would have happened if the CV19 hadn't originated/first been discovered/manufactured in a totalitarian state.

 

Yip, all because someone in a far away land decided to pop out for some bat and chips.

[Shanks said no]

1 hour ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I would rather we go into tier 2.

 

Am I missing something but what is so great about tier 2? Obviously you can have a drink with food but other than that what else do you gain from it?

 

Its better than tier 3 and some people may be able to go back to work and off furlough, like Mrs F, but I can't see the huge advantage.

 

Restaurants, cafes, pubs and bars can open outdoors for the consumption of food and alcoholic drinks. Last entry is 21:30 and all venues must be closed and all customers off the premises by 22:30. So unless I want to sit outside in Edinburgh drinking, even I'm not that desperate, what's in it for me?

 

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

48 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Not once you can get a pint in EH, but not in G.

If that happened it would be a miracle.

[Captain Sausage]

Anyone thinking restrictions will ease for Christmas is delusional. It makes absolutely no sense from a public health perspective to allow mass gatherings all over the shop at Christmas. Any good the restrictions we are currently enduring will be wasted for one day. 
 

We’ll be having a socially distanced Christmas this year. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

 

Am I missing something but what is so great about tier 2? Obviously you can have a drink with food but other than that what else do you gain from it?

 

Its better than tier 3 and some people may be able to go back to work and off furlough, like Mrs F, but I can't see the huge advantage.

 

Restaurants, cafes, pubs and bars can open outdoors for the consumption of food and alcoholic drinks. Last entry is 21:30 and all venues must be closed and all customers off the premises by 22:30. So unless I want to sit outside in Edinburgh drinking, even I'm not that desperate, what's in it for me?

 

 

 

It’s not ideal but it would obviously get us closer to tier 1.

[Shanks said no]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

It’s not ideal but it would obviously get us closer to tier 1.

 

OK a step in the right direction, I'll accept that. It might actually bolster some flagging resolve if we could see light at the end of the tunnel.

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

 

OK a step in the right direction, I'll accept that. It might actually bolster some flagging resolve if we could see light at the end of the tunnel.

👍

[theshed]

13 minutes ago, Captain Sausage said:

Anyone thinking restrictions will ease for Christmas is delusional. It makes absolutely no sense from a public health perspective to allow mass gatherings all over the shop at Christmas. Any good the restrictions we are currently enduring will be wasted for one day. 
 

We’ll be having a socially distanced Christmas this year. 

 

Yes the 16 day circuit breaker from October is lasting every so slightly longer 

[steve123]

51 minutes ago, redjambo said:

Today's Battle of the Lothians (per-100,000 case stats):

 

West 31, City 18, Mid 8, East 7.

Hate to say it but looks like edinburgh going up 

[Brighton Jambo]

29 minutes ago, Captain Sausage said:

Anyone thinking restrictions will ease for Christmas is delusional. It makes absolutely no sense from a public health perspective to allow mass gatherings all over the shop at Christmas. Any good the restrictions we are currently enduring will be wasted for one day. 
 

We’ll be having a socially distanced Christmas this year. 

It will ease to allow people to go into each other’s houses.  Up to three households.  
 

If it doesn’t hundreds of thousands of people who until now have been compliant will decide willingly to ignore the rules.   What the government will know is once they have done that once it is a dangerous precedent as psychologically they have decided the governments restrictions aren’t worth following.  
 

My wife and I along with my parents haven’t knowingly broken a single rule that I can think of.  We are going to there’s for Xmas with the kids no matter what anyone says.  Thousands of families will do the exact same as us.  

[GinRummy]

48 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

 

Am I missing something but what is so great about tier 2? Obviously you can have a drink with food but other than that what else do you gain from it?

 

Its better than tier 3 and some people may be able to go back to work and off furlough, like Mrs F, but I can't see the huge advantage.

 

Restaurants, cafes, pubs and bars can open outdoors for the consumption of food and alcoholic drinks. Last entry is 21:30 and all venues must be closed and all customers off the premises by 22:30. So unless I want to sit outside in Edinburgh drinking, even I'm not that desperate, what's in it for me?

 

 

 

You can have food and drink indoors up to 6pm in tier 2. My pal in Dunfermline went out with his mate got two pub meals and 6 pints each. That sounds like a nice afternoon

[graygo]

29 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

It will ease to allow people to go into each other’s houses.  Up to three households.  
 

If it doesn’t hundreds of thousands of people who until now have been compliant will decide willingly to ignore the rules.   What the government will know is once they have done that once it is a dangerous precedent as psychologically they have decided the governments restrictions aren’t worth following.  
 

My wife and I along with my parents haven’t knowingly broken a single rule that I can think of.  We are going to there’s for Xmas with the kids no matter what anyone says.  Thousands of families will do the exact same as us.  

 

Wow, you must take the birth of the baby jebus really seriously.

[GinRummy]

Just now, graygo said:

 

Wow, you must take the birth of the baby jebus really seriously.

Jebus Christ! 😀

[Captain Slog]

4 hours ago, Victorian said:

 

It's not a case of expectations.  It's a matter of volume of workload.  Personnel and capacity is finite.  Time is finite.  The total of covid + routine care is also finite but capacity will only ever meet demand when demand is regulated over time.  Too great a volume of covid per day/week/month prevents resources being devoted to routine care.   Regulated covid enables some routine care to continue.  Victims of either deserve a chance of care and we cannot allow a situation where a hospital cannot accomodate seriously ill people.  Ambulances queues outside hospitals.  People dying at home due to no ambulances available,  etc.

 

That's the real bigger picture.  The stark reality that resources can't cope with a realistic level of demand that will outstrip it unless the government's strategy continues to firefight.

 

There is a wider picture to take account of the economic and employment consequences.  It looks pretty harrowing tbf.  But the government is correctly judging that a life saved has more value than a job saved.  It has to.  It can only hope to deal with the aftermath of the health and economic wasteland later.

That sums it up for me

[Captain Slog]

Just now, Captain Slog said:

That sums it up for me

Oh, and i lost my job, but id rather that than infect people if id caught

[Malinga the Swinga]

For people who are interested, Channel 4 have programme on Monday night, 9pm, on how the government lost control of Covid and country. Can imagine a few won't be looking forward to it as we are promised report on the firms making millions on virus crisis. 

[Malinga the Swinga]

3 hours ago, ri Alban said:

The west going into tier 4 this week by the sound of it. 

Decision being made few weeks too late. Held off and held off but the figures have remained pretty steady. If they had made this decision weeks ago, then they could be reducing and coming down instead of upward trajectory. 

Don't think Edinburgh and Lothian will be going down though, which is bit of a shame but need to wait and see. 

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, Captain Sausage said:

Anyone thinking restrictions will ease for Christmas is delusional. It makes absolutely no sense from a public health perspective to allow mass gatherings all over the shop at Christmas. Any good the restrictions we are currently enduring will be wasted for one day. 
 

We’ll be having a socially distanced Christmas this year. 

If government don't want to look stupid, then they will announce lifting of any restrictions on Christmas day, or at least from 10am to 8pm. If not they will face public revolt as grandparents, parentsand families will be meeting up regardless of what some miserable PM or FM says. 

[AlimOzturk]

Been doing agency shifts doing delivery work for a while now until buisness starts picking up again  

 

What I have noticed more than anything that despite telling you about their Covid protocols absolutely none of the companies I have worked for have actually been implementing them. Have done work for Sainsbury’s, Tesco, Yodel and Waitrose as well as several chippies. 
 

They simply don’t give a shit. They just want the stuff delivered. 

[GinRummy]

32 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

Been doing agency shifts doing delivery work for a while now until buisness starts picking up again  

 

What I have noticed more than anything that despite telling you about their Covid protocols absolutely none of the companies I have worked for have actually been implementing them. Have done work for Sainsbury’s, Tesco, Yodel and Waitrose as well as several chippies. 
 

They simply don’t give a shit. They just want the stuff delivered. 

Any deliveries I’ve had they’ve left them on my step and retreated to the end of the path (about 8 metres). The exception to that was when I ordered an Indian and the boy handed me it. Wasn’t expecting him to do that so I didn’t have a mask on.

[CJGJ]

2 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

Anyone thinking restrictions will ease for Christmas is delusional. It makes absolutely no sense from a public health perspective to allow mass gatherings all over the shop at Christmas. Any good the restrictions we are currently enduring will be wasted for one day. 
 

We’ll be having a socially distanced Christmas this year. 

We are not guided by public health....we are guided by a mixture of health, economy and to be blunt self interest

 

Decisions made if about health only would be a total lockdown for 3 months

 

It's not possible to do this and keep public behaviour in check as well as pay for the needs of the population re health and all other needs re social services etc

 

There will be a Christmas relaxation...just how long is open to question but it will happen because it will be ignored by the public and you can have all the rules/laws you want but if they are not obeyed they are useless

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 hour ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

If government don't want to look stupid, then they will announce lifting of any restrictions on Christmas day, or at least from 10am to 8pm. If not they will face public revolt as grandparents, parentsand families will be meeting up regardless of what some miserable PM or FM says. 

Covid19 will take the day off because of f*****g Xmas day.

That's not a go at you.

Edited November 14, 2020 by The Real Maroonblood

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Covid19 will take the day off because of f*****g Xmas day.

That's not a go at you.

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Covid19 will take the day off because of f*****g Xmas day.

I didn't say Covid would take the day off, I am saying that people will ignore regulations because they are sick to death of being lied to by a government who have lost control and respect. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I didn't say Covid would take the day off, I am saying that people will ignore regulations because they are sick to death of being lied to by a government who have lost control and respect. 

I know it just pisses me off the whole bloody thing.

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

13 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I know it just pisses me off the whole bloody thing.

 

Reckon everyone is getting pissed off with Covid and the way governments have dealt with it. 

Hopefully 2021 will bring better cheer to everyone,apart from Hibs and Celtic fans. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Reckon everyone is getting pissed off with Covid and the way governments have dealt with it. 

Hopefully 2021 will bring better cheer to everyone,apart from Hibs and Celtic fans. 

👍

[GinRummy]

17 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I know it just pisses me off the whole bloody thing.

 

Chin up mate. It’ll all be over one day and we’ll be sipping frothy beers in the sunshine and watching hearts smash hibs four times a season. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Chin up mate. It’ll all be over one day and we’ll be sipping frothy beers in the sunshine and watching hearts smash hibs four times a season. 

Well your post certainly made me smile. 

Edited November 14, 2020 by The Real Maroonblood

[GinRummy]

6 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Well your post certainly made me smile. 

👍

[coconut doug]

2 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Decision being made few weeks too late. Held off and held off but the figures have remained pretty steady. If they had made this decision weeks ago, then they could be reducing and coming down instead of upward trajectory. 

Don't think Edinburgh and Lothian will be going down though, which is bit of a shame but need to wait and see. 

 

They don't have an upward trajectory. Were you not telling us we should be opening up a few pages ago.

[frankblack]

11 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Chin up mate. It’ll all be over one day and we’ll be sipping frothy beers in the sunshine and watching hearts smash hibs four times a season. 

 

We could still do a cup hat-trick and empty them from three cups.

[GinRummy]

3 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

We could still do a cup hat-trick and empty them from three cups.

Yeah. If Dundee can win tomorrow we’d have a chance of drawing them next. Imagine that 😍

[coconut doug]

9 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Yes, it is Brian. I think we all know that "Covid" reported deaths are going to include other forms of flu, pneumonia and respiratory related deaths. I, personally, wouldn't place a lot of faith in any of the daily stats that are churned out by either of our govts. 

I would ,though, like them to explain, however, with evidence to back it up, how they expect moving areas from Tier 3 to Tier 4, will reduce the number of "cases". That is tantamount to saying that non-essential shops, hairdresses etc are the source of the spread. They are not and, like hospitality before them, they are targetting the wrong areas. Feckless people are still visiting each others homes and that will continue regardless of tiers.  The govt can't prevent that but the only way to reduce it is to open up well run, safe hospitality venues that are abiding by the rules. They need to start being honest and transparent about who is getting it, where and how? 

 

Why do y ou think there is and has been in recent months a higher infection rate in England? Do you think it might have something to do with more pubs being open in England?

 

They are not hiding anything AFAIK we have been told many times it is impossible to say for sure where people were infected in most cases. What we do know is that increased human interaction leads to increased infections. Closing the pubs cuts that interaction and reduces cases surely. Some establishments may well be heavily protected but it's not realistic to expect hospitality to offer the same levels of safety as say a care home or hospital and you know what happens in these establishments. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

25 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Why do y ou think there is and has been in recent months a higher infection rate in England? Do you think it might have something to do with more pubs being open in England?

 

They are not hiding anything AFAIK we have been told many times it is impossible to say for sure where people were infected in most cases. What we do know is that increased human interaction leads to increased infections. Closing the pubs cuts that interaction and reduces cases surely. Some establishments may well be heavily protected but it's not realistic to expect hospitality to offer the same levels of safety as say a care home or hospital and you know what happens in these establishments. 

 

comparing the interactions in hospitality to that of the interactions in a care home ....

 

 

[ArcticJambo]

40 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

They don't have an upward trajectory. Were you not telling us we should be opening up a few pages ago.

Their consistently high numbers transfers into ~30 deaths a day.  I wouldn't have thought that was not acceptable to those who have the ability to initiate change.

Edited November 14, 2020 by ArcticJambo

[Nucky Thompson]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

 

They don't have an upward trajectory. Were you not telling us we should be opening up a few pages ago.

Rader sounding. Someone has criticised the SG 

 

But, but, I'm not an SNP follower 

[Enzo Chiefo]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

 

Why do y ou think there is and has been in recent months a higher infection rate in England? Do you think it might have something to do with more pubs being open in England?

 

They are not hiding anything AFAIK we have been told many times it is impossible to say for sure where people were infected in most cases. What we do know is that increased human interaction leads to increased infections. Closing the pubs cuts that interaction and reduces cases surely. Some establishments may well be heavily protected but it's not realistic to expect hospitality to offer the same levels of safety as say a care home or hospital and you know what happens in these establishments. 

I honestly don't think hospitality makes any significant difference to case numbers. Official figures relating to hospitality all show that reported cases are around 3 or 4% of the total. That simply doesn't justify their closure and there isn't a furlough scheme that could ever make up the losses incurred by hospitality businesses. 

Even in lockdown, public transport,  schools, supermarkets etc will stay open so human interaction cannot be avoided, nor should it be. Govts must know where it is spreading and it will be feckless people meeting in houses for drinks, parties etc. If hospitality is closed, house parties will increase.

There is no comparison with Care homes, hospitals etc as, by definition, social distancing is impractical.  People in these institutional settings are also more susceptible to catching any infections than hospitality customers. Test, test, test in these places, staff, visitors, patients etc and cases will surely decrease

[Enzo Chiefo]

The Sun reporting that a "smoking" parcel, addressed to Sturgeon,  sparked the evacuation of the Royal Mail sorting office at Sighthill this morning.

[CJGJ]

2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The Sun reporting that a "smoking" parcel, addressed to Sturgeon,  sparked the evacuation of the Royal Mail sorting office at Sighthill this morning.

I though smoking was banned in offices

[Governor Tarkin]

12 hours ago, GinRummy said:

13 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I know it just pisses me off the whole bloody thing.

 

Chin up mate. It’ll all be over one day and we’ll be sipping frothy beers in the sunshine and watching hearts smash hibs four times a season

 

 

What a post to wake up to on a Sunday morning. Cheers Gin 🙂👍

[Victorian]

CEO of BioNTech sounding very confident that his vaccine will provide a good and persisting immune response.  Not concerned by the threat to it from the mink mutations.  Confident that it will confer a suppression of onward transmission.

 

Commercial interest there of course but it sound pretty good.

[the general]

14 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I didn't say Covid would take the day off, I am saying that people will ignore regulations because they are sick to death of being lied to by a government who have lost control and respect. 

 

Edinburgh City Centre was like a ghost town yesterday except for a couple of pubs doing takeaway pints which had mega queues 

[The Real Maroonblood]

7 minutes ago, the general said:

 

Edinburgh City Centre was like a ghost town yesterday except for a couple of pubs doing takeaway pints which had mega queues 

I’m looking forward to a pint but there’s no chance I would queue for takeaway pints.

I’ll just be grumpy until the pubs open.

[Enzo Chiefo]

1 hour ago, Brian Dundas said:

Where are you getting that from? I've never seen that figure published anywhere.

 

 

PHE figures indicated that percentage.  The Scottish Hospitality Group reported 17 cases from 1.5m visits iirc.  I don't think that anyone seriously believes that hospitality is a big source of transmission 

[frankblack]

28 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I’m looking forward to a pint but there’s no chance I would queue for takeaway pints.

I’ll just be grumpy until the pubs open.

This.

 

What goes in must come out, and in terms of city centre there is CCTV everywhere to catch you.

 

Not forgetting its getting colder and drinking cold beer in a cold temperature isn't much fun, and tends to affect your bladder more frequently.