Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Harry Potter]

Just now, Taffin said:

 

"You should stay inside your house, it's dangerous outside"...oh wait, that one is here already 😂

check the state of the pavements, good chance of falling, 😦. the cooncil should employ pavement clearing operators😂, whoosh a pig just flew past.

[GinRummy]

Just now, jonesy said:

Judging by the nick of the streets, the masks will be in the gutters.

Gets right on my tits that. Disgraceful the mask litter

[Taffin]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Judging by the nick of the streets, the masks will be in the gutters.

 

Joking aside, the mask litter and waste is a total disgrace. 

[Taffin]

Just now, jonesy said:

More than 1.5B masks will pollute oceans this year: report (nypost.com)

 

Selfish.

[GinRummy]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

More than 1.5B masks will pollute oceans this year: report (nypost.com)

Disgusting. 

[Shanks]

5 minutes ago, jonesy said:

More than 1.5B masks will pollute oceans this year: report (nypost.com)

Think we know what the real virus on this planet is. 

[Harry Potter]

21 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

 

Plus the ***** have widened the pavements increasing the risk and in general annoying the **** out me. 😡

Aye noticed that in corstorphine , st johns road.

[Harry Potter]

6 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Funnily enough, the media narrative throughout 2019 was that using plastic was akin to mass murder. Then, by April 2020 it was not wearing a mask. I'm sure they'll find something else for us to feel guilty about in 2021. Either way, who gives a hoot about marine life, eh?

Be fine soon, we will all have electric cars, 😂

[Harry Potter]

4 minutes ago, jonesy said:

The best part is that it causes more bottlenecks, thus increasing air pollution on Scotland's already-most polluted stretch of road. So the poor suckers who have enough room to walk 2m apart from each other can die from long term lung damage, rather than Covid. God bless CEC - the only places for people they're going to need are increased capacities in the cemeteries. 

Aye all that drinking in the harp and oak , more damage to the body walking out on to that polluted street.😕the traffic lights as well, its a crawl getting through that road, 20mph, lucky if

you get over 10.

[DETTY29]

I can't see how Johnson or Sturgeon can say things will be significantly better in the spring, or different.

 

Large parts of England Health Services under severe pressure (one of the major hospitals in London says average ICU Covid admission now is 58-60 yo male, no existing pre conditions, yes they will likely survive, but would never usually be in there but take up a bed for weeks) and this is just the warm up act from the start of the flu season, still got xmas, NY and vaccine positivitey dropping of guard bounces and general covid compliance fatigue to come in Feb and March.

 

With the kick in the haws from Van - Tam that in reality we could be late March or April before they will be happy no onward transmission with the vaccines, nothing much changes.  Those vaccinated will still need to wear masks, social distance with hand gelling imo becoming a norm.  If hospitality or events opens, it will still be on a very restricted numbers basis.

 

And we still haven't started the vaccine passport debate properly.

 

Or understand how long the vaccine lasts.

 

For me, it's if you want a better spring, then do as you are asked, from now.  

 

Sorry, but that is the reality. To go a full year of softly, softly and still behind the curve in where we could be, is a failure from the politicians.

 

 

Edited December 31, 2020 by DETTY29

[Victorian]

All very funny and dismissive.  Lol.  That aside,  I'm as desperate as anyone for normality.  No two ways about it though,  there will be a period of 'restrictions' beyond the vaccination phase.  Hopefully as short a time as possible.  The alternative is a prolonging of the shit we're in.  A future repeat performance even.  Nobody could bear that.  

 

I think there will be enough normality or a close enough normality upon vaccinations to make life bearable.  It wont be absolute normality though.   

 

I welcome all group-thinks and misrepresentations.  Love that shit.

 

 

 

[Justin Z]

The UK government's stellar handling of the pandemic continues.

 

 

 

[Weakened Offender]

37 minutes ago, jonesy said:

More than 1.5B masks will pollute oceans this year: report (nypost.com)

 

Humans are a trashy lot.

 

I know a guy who paddleboards up and down the Forth, dives in and takes as much away as he can. It's incredible what he lifts and posts on social media. 

[Nucky Thompson]

7 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

The UK government's stellar handling of the pandemic continues.

 

 

 

All 4 chief medical officers from the devolved nations agreed on it

[Nucky Thompson]

17 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

 (one of the major hospitals in London says average ICU Covid admission now is 58-60 yo male, no existing pre conditions, 

 

 

Do you have a source for this?

[manaliveits105]

2 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

All 4 chief medical officers from the devolved nations agreed on it

Yes I heard Jean freedman say it on radio this morning but dont let the truth get in the way of toary bashing fantasists 

[DETTY29]

5 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Do you have a source for this?

I'll see if its on BBC Sounds.  Phone in with Nicky Campbell between 9 & 10 and a doctor-physician called in.

 

Edit - of course there is several ways to determine 'average'

Edited December 31, 2020 by DETTY29

[Weakened Offender]

4 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Do you have a source for this?

 

4 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Do you have a source for this?

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55396901

[CJGJ]

By allowing up to 12 weeks before getting a second dose it means millions more can be vaccinated and have some protection before having to get that second dose

 

Things are not set on stone and changes will happen as we learn more...this is an example

[alanjambo]

16 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

The UK government's stellar handling of the pandemic continues.

 

 

 

 

Dreadful but not unexpected.  My Sister is a district nurse in Birmingham and my brother in law is a Medical Engineer at Heartlands hospital there.  They were both told, before Christmas, that they'd be getting their first dose on the 29th December.  Then it was cancelled because there aren't enough.  Turns out that it's the NHS Managers that are getting the vaccine before them.  They were not happy.

 

 

[DETTY29]

51 minutes ago, Shanks said:

Think we know what the real virus on this planet is. 

Selfishness and always will be.

[Nucky Thompson]

5 minutes ago, Weakened Offender said:

 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55396901

Cheers.

It's a wee bit vague and selective reporting though.

Men over 50, some overweight but not all of them

 

[Costanza]

8 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

All 4 chief medical officers from the devolved nations agreed on it

They did, although it would appear a lot of UK Doctors don't agree with this decision.

Firstly, they didn't consent to a single dose with no evidence of the effectiveness.

Secondly, Pfizer have said there is no evidence on effectiveness of the second dose after 12 weeks. 

Thirdly, tens of thousands of elderly and vulnerable patients will have to be contacted to have appointments cancelled which is a huge exercise and likely pretty distressing for some of them.

 

My wife who works in the NHS (in wards and house visits) was due her second dose next week and is pretty deflated by this change in tack.

[Nucky Thompson]

12 minutes ago, CJGJ said:

By allowing up to 12 weeks before getting a second dose it means millions more can be vaccinated and have some protection before having to get that second dose

 

Things are not set on stone and changes will happen as we learn more...this is an example

It's the unions stirring the shit again.

[Nucky Thompson]

2 minutes ago, Costanza said:

They did, although it would appear a lot of UK Doctors don't agree with this decision.

Firstly, they didn't consent to a single dose with no evidence of the effectiveness.

Secondly, Pfizer have said there is no evidence on effectiveness of the second dose after 12 weeks. 

Thirdly, tens of thousands of elderly and vulnerable patients will have to be contacted to have appointments cancelled which is a huge exercise and likely pretty distressing for some of them.

 

My wife who works in the NHS (in wards and house visits) was due her second dose next week and is pretty deflated by this change in tack.

They are damned if they do and damned if they don't. 

 

I though the evidence was that one shot gave you 80% protection for 3 months

[Taffin]

11 minutes ago, Costanza said:

They did, although it would appear a lot of UK Doctors don't agree with this decision.

Firstly, they didn't consent to a single dose with no evidence of the effectiveness.

Secondly, Pfizer have said there is no evidence on effectiveness of the second dose after 12 weeks. 

Thirdly, tens of thousands of elderly and vulnerable patients will have to be contacted to have appointments cancelled which is a huge exercise and likely pretty distressing for some of them.

 

My wife who works in the NHS (in wards and house visits) was due her second dose next week and is pretty deflated by this change in tack.

 

Maybe people were right to be wary of the whole process?

[ri Alban]

Who's scaremongering exactly. Listen to the let it rip mob talking absolute shite, just to make themselves feel hard as Feck. We get it, yer no getting telt by naebdie, right. 👍

[redjambo]

1 hour ago, GinRummy said:

No chance imo. Maybe for a bit but by this time next year the masks will be in the bin. 

 

Indeed.

[Weakened Offender]

2 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Who's scaremongering exactly. Listen to the let it rip mob talking absolute shite, just to make themselves feel hard as Feck. We get it, yer no getting telt by naebdie, right. 👍

 

Most people use the word 'scaremongering' when they're too stupid to argue the point. This thread is a perfect example. 

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Weakened Offender said:

 

Most people use the word 'scaremongering' when they're too stupid to argue the point. This thread is a perfect example. 

I can't really be arse with the bullshit from the don't tell me what to do Brigade. It those types that are spreading the fecking thing. 

[DETTY29]

45 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Do you have a source for this?

Re-checked and the consultant said average age of person in ICU is 58-60 year old male.

 

Trying to find out if it was Covid specific.

[OBE]

8 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Who's scaremongering exactly. Listen to the let it rip mob talking absolute shite, just to make themselves feel hard as Feck. We get it, yer no getting telt by naebdie, right. 👍

 

LIR mob could save themselves an enormous amount of time just cut "n" pasting...ever so predictable.

[Weakened Offender]

4 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

I can't really be arse with the bullshit from the don't tell me what to do Brigade. It those types that are spreading the fecking thing. 

 

They're actual vermin, pal. 

[Costanza]

25 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

They are damned if they do and damned if they don't. 

 

I though the evidence was that one shot gave you 80% protection for 3 months

I think the issue is this statement from Pfizer:

 

“Data from the phase 3 study demonstrated that, although partial protection from the vaccine appears to begin as early as 12 days after the first dose, two doses of the vaccine are required to provide the maximum protection against the disease, a vaccine efficacy of 95%. There are no data to demonstrate that protection after the first dose is sustained after 21 days"

[Taffin]

😂😂

 

I don't know what triggered it but the shark has been jumped on this page.

 

Surely it wasn't the stuff about the single doses? That appears to have come from a doctor with a degree who we're told to take everything as 100% fact from them...or is that not the case anymore?

[Costanza]

20 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Maybe people were right to be wary of the whole process?

Not following what you mean exactly. Are you referring to the approval process or the actual rollout?

[Taffin]

11 minutes ago, Costanza said:

Not following what you mean exactly. Are you referring to the approval process or the actual rollout?

 

The rollout. People were concerned about the safety of the vaccine but were reassured by the explanation that no corners were being cut and that nothing would be authorised that was unsafe. If (and it's a big if) the tweet earlier in this thread is accurate, then we aren't following what was authorised and undermines that reassurance.

Edited December 31, 2020 by Taffin

[Nucky Thompson]

16 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

Re-checked and the consultant said average age of person in ICU is 58-60 year old male.

 

Trying to find out if it was Covid specific.

No worries

cheers

[Nucky Thompson]

13 minutes ago, Costanza said:

I think the issue is this statement from Pfizer:

 

“Data from the phase 3 study demonstrated that, although partial protection from the vaccine appears to begin as early as 12 days after the first dose, two doses of the vaccine are required to provide the maximum protection against the disease, a vaccine efficacy of 95%. There are no data to demonstrate that protection after the first dose is sustained after 21 days"

Ah right. Maybe it was the Oxford vaccine that had the data for 80% protection for 3 months.

 

[FWJ]

2 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

... And advocating continued restrictions. 

 

I worry about where it will end, Jonesy. Restrictions for this, restrictions for that. It's all for your own good you know. 🤷‍♂️

Restrictions are nothing new.

Seat belts, crash helmets, speed & parking.

Licensing hours in pubs and on the sale of alcohol. Public consumption of alcohol.

Smoking.

 

Our lives are bound by rules, legal and social.

[Enzo Chiefo]

2 hours ago, Victorian said:

 

You're wrong and putting the cart before the horse.  You want a kind of normality to return and there's nothing wrong with that.  But we'll all get our normality back after the virus has been driven to very low levels.  Vaccinations alone will never be sufficient to do it.  Vaccinations will eliminate the bulk of virus but only a period of further suppression will finish the job.  The last thing we need is a sufficiently large enough reservoir of virus continuing to circulate.  It presents a real threat of future,  vaccine escaping strains coming along.

 

Normality.. yes.  Instantaneous normality.. no.  Demanding instant normality jeopardises any normality.

No, being wrong and you disagreeing are not the same thing. The problem is that sections of the population have been conditioned,  hoodwinked and controlled in different measures, in to a belief that Covid should be micromanaged on a daily basis.

If we agree that it will always be there in some form and that the most vulnerable are protected, we treat Covid like any other illness or risk. Flu can kill 20k in a bad year, despite vaccinations. We don't lock people up to avoid that situation.  If we closed schools, decimated the hospitality industry and told everyone to download a govt app and wear a mask then perhaps we could "save lives " from flu. Should we?? No, absolutely not, unless we enjoy living in a totalitarian one party state like China. 

That's our starting point, so Covid becomes like any other virus, it may spread but it will run out of vulnerable people to infect and will come up against people who either aren't susceptible to it or can fight it off without even knowing they have it. It will eventually burn itself out as any meaningful threat. Life has to return to normal at the earliest opportunity and for some, that will mean huge psychological hurdles to clear but continuing to advocate that the population stop living to "save lives" is not sustainable.  We need to ditch asymptomatic testing - had anybody ever heard of this pre-Covid - daily updates etc and put this virus in perspective. 

[frankblack]

1 hour ago, Harry Potter said:

Aye noticed that in corstorphine , st johns road.

 

And yet they will be blaming the vehicles for air pollution in St John's Road.

 

Those left-wing car-hating nutjobs in the clowncil have been using Covid to force through a number of insane road measures in other areas like Ferry Road, and had to back down in making East Craigs a no-car zone when residents got lawyered up.

[DETTY29]

3 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

No worries

cheers

It would seem to be bizarre to talk about Covid, then throw in not directly relevant curve ball.

 

 But I'm getting the feeling the ICU ward staff have hit the end of their tether (As we all have) and that's not good for folk that need to be on the ball pretty much all the time.

[DETTY29]

6 minutes ago, FWJ said:

Restrictions are nothing new.

Seat belts, crash helmets, speed & parking.

Licensing hours in pubs and on the sale of alcohol. Public consumption of alcohol.

Smoking.

 

Our lives are bound by rules, legal and social.

Even freedom of speech, freedom of press come with restrictions to stop us acting highly irresponsibly, nastily.

 

But politicians need to consider balance too.

Edited December 31, 2020 by DETTY29

[Governor Tarkin]

10 minutes ago, FWJ said:

Restrictions are nothing new.

Seat belts, crash helmets, speed & parking.

Licensing hours in pubs and on the sale of alcohol. Public consumption of alcohol.

Smoking.

 

Our lives are bound by rules, legal and social.

 

Great. We should definitley have some more then.

[FWJ]

1 minute ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Great. We should definitley have some more then.

Restrictions are applied and eased all the time.

[Governor Tarkin]

6 minutes ago, FWJ said:

Restrictions are applied and eased all the time.

 

Thanks for the heads up. 

[redjambo]

Scottish numbers: 31 December 2020

Summary

• 2,622 new cases of COVID-19 reported [+577]
• 28,295 new tests for COVID-19 that reported results – 10.1% of these were positive [+8,573; -1.2%]
• 68 new reported deaths of people who have tested positive [+25]
• 70 people are in intensive care with recently confirmed COVID-19 [+1]
• 1,174 people are in hospital with recently confirmed COVID-19 [+41]

[redjambo]

Per-100,000 case rates today around the boards. Very elevated compared to pre-Christmas levels.

 

Scotland 48 [+11].

 

Dumfries & Galloway 77 [+15], Shetland 70 [+39], Borders 68 [+25], Ayrshire 61 [+23], Greater Glasgow 57 [+5], Tayside 57 [+26], Lanarkshire 56 [+11].

 

Grampian 44 [+13], Lothian 42 [+14], Fife 27 [-2], Forth Valley 25 [-6], Highland 25 [+4].

 

Western Isles 4 [=], Orkney 0 [=].

[Mikey1874]

37 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

The rollout. People were concerned about the safety of the vaccine but were reassured by the explanation that no corners were being cut and that nothing would be authorised that was unsafe. If (and it's a big if) the tweet earlier in this thread is accurate, then we aren't following what was authorised and undermines that reassurance.

 

 

 GOV.UK

Press release

Statement from the UK Chief Medical Officers on the prioritisation of first doses of COVID-19 vaccines

Joint clinical advice from the 4 UK Chief Medical Officers on the prioritisation of first doses of the coronavirus (COVID-19) vaccines.

Published 30 December 2020

From:

Department of Health and Social Care

 

 

It is excellent news that the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) has today authorised the AstraZeneca (Oxford) vaccine for deployment across the UK.

The MHRA authorisation includes conditions that the AstraZeneca (Oxford) vaccine should be administered in 2 doses, with the second dose given between 4 and 12 weeks after the first. The MHRA has also clarified that for the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine, the interval between doses must be at least 3 weeks. For both vaccines, data provided to MHRA demonstrate that while efficacy is optimised when a second dose is administered, both offer considerable protection after a single dose, at least in the short term. For both vaccines the second dose completes the course and is likely to be important for longer term protection.

The Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI) has subsequently recommended that as many people on the JCVI priority list as possible should sequentially be offered a first vaccine dose as the initial priority. They have advised that the second dose of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine may be given between 3 to 12 weeks following the first dose, and that the second dose of the AstraZeneca (Oxford) vaccine may be given between 4 to 12 weeks following the first dose. The clinical risk priority order for deployment of the vaccines remains unchanged and applies to both vaccines. Both are very effective vaccines.

The 4 UK Chief Medical Officers agree with the JCVI that at this stage of the pandemic prioritising the first doses of vaccine for as many people as possible on the priority list will protect the greatest number of at risk people overall in the shortest possible time and will have the greatest impact on reducing mortality, severe disease and hospitalisations and in protecting the NHS and equivalent health services. Operationally this will mean that second doses of both vaccines will be administered towards the end of the recommended vaccine dosing schedule of 12 weeks. This will maximise the number of people getting vaccine and therefore receiving protection in the next 12 weeks.

Based on JCVI’s expert advice, it is our joint clinical advice that delivery plans should prioritise delivering first vaccine doses to as many people on the JCVI Phase 1 priority list in the shortest possible timeframe. This will allow the administration of second doses to be completed over the longer timeframes in line with conditions set out by the independent regulator, the MHRA and advice from the JCVI. This will maximise the impact of the vaccine programme in its primary aims of reducing mortality and hospitalisations and protecting the NHS and equivalent health services.

The JCVI has also amended its previous highly precautionary advice on COVID-19 vaccines and pregnancy or breastfeeding. Vaccination with either vaccine in pregnancy should be considered where the risk of exposure SARS-CoV2 infection is high and cannot be avoided, or where the woman has underlying conditions that place her at very high risk of serious complications of COVID-19, and the risks and benefits of vaccination should be discussed. Those who are trying to become pregnant do not need to avoid pregnancy after vaccination, and breastfeeding women may be offered vaccination with either vaccine following consideration of the woman’s clinical need for immunisation against COVID-19. The UK Chief Medical Officers agree with this advice.

See the press release on the second COVID-19 vaccine authorised by the medicines regulator and the government statement about the Oxford University/AstraZeneca vaccine being authorised by the 

 

 

 

 

 

© Crown copyright

Edited December 31, 2020 by Mikey1874