General Election 2019

[Justin Z]

24 minutes ago, 132goals1958 said:

 

Yep it can be a cruel business. Naivety contributed to her downfall but I genuinely think her heart is in the right place so the cut and thrust of politics is probably not for her.

 

Nothing like your heart being in the right place when you unflinchingly launch the nukes, I guess eh?

[Boab]

1 hour ago, Ribble said:

 

We'll have to agree to disagree in that case, honestly i'm yet to meet an SNP supporter who has attempted to argue for them based on their policies, all i've ever heard is independence and england/westminster bad rhetoric, not once has an SNP supporter said to me 'what about their policies on education, the economy and health?'.

 

Even when you look at the policies listed on the SNP website they struggle to go more than a sentence before mentioning westminster/uk government/brexit, so even when they are talking about the like of the fisheries their policy still centres around  independence ratehr than what they plan to do that is better.

They are right to criticise WM.

Not just about Brexit though.

About everything, which is what I hear from Nats.

Wanting out is a consequence of that.

[132goals1958]

6 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

Nothing like your heart being in the right place when you unflinchingly launch the nukes, I guess eh?

 

No wonder I sometimes despair 😩 

[doctor jambo]

23 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

Your are conflating issues.
 

We operate a FPTP system for GE. The SNP have returned over 80% of the Scottish seats. That is the outcome of this election in Scotland. 
 

The SNP stood on a clear policy of Indy 2 and over 80% of available seats voted for it. The Scottish electorate has massively voted for a party that wishes to pursue a second Indy vote. It seems, undemocratic to deny the will of the Scottish people. 
 

The fact they didn’t claim 50% of the vote doesn’t really matter. It doesn’t change the number of seats won. % votes are interesting but have no standing in our electoral system. Whilst, they are not the only pro indepedence party in Scotland after all. 
 

However, referendums aren’t decided by polls and percentage of votes. 
 

Whether, the SNP/Yes campaign would win Indy 2 is an entirely different and the fact they failed to secure 50% of vote could be seen as a negative. Though they are definitely in the right ball park to win one. 
 

What grounds does Bojo to have refuse one? 

Same grounds as the EU ref- you had a vote, you decided.

The SNP have become the repository of the "old Labour" voters.

Blind devotion

IF labour gets its act together, then the SNP will lose ground again.

a moderate labour party under Starmer or the likes would be a real threat to the SNP

[Justin Z]

17 minutes ago, 132goals1958 said:

No wonder I sometimes despair 😩 

 

We're all in that together, at least

[maroonlegions]

Large parts of England and large parts of Scotland have just given the mandate for Indyref 2. 

 

No way can this clown in number 10 ,or is it a fridge ,ignore the % of  votes cast  for the SNP.

 

Cheers England for another 5 years of Austerity, public service cuts, NHS cuts, police cuts in  fact cuts everywhere but  for the rich and their masters 

 

Start checking out private health insurance   , that's if you can afford the premiums   , if not then pray like feck you dont get seriously  ill  cause you aint going to afford to stay alive. Back to Victorian dark days for the millions of poor, no welfare or safety nets and no NHS..

Edited December 13, 2019 by maroonlegions

[Des' Dad]

3 hours ago, Boris said:

 

Good post.

 

Tricky for Johnson though as he is on record as saying he will knock it back.

 

I suspect that the Holyrood 2021 election will be the watershed.  If an indy majority then game on.  It's a gamble, for both sides.

 

He wouldn't lie, would he? Surely not.

[jake]

17 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

Bah, appreciated, but I think oh, say @jake might have a thing or two to say about that.

 

 

 

Not at all mate.

I just love the political slaps you dish out to me.

😜

 

Tories were always going to win.

Lost 50 seats in Scotland and now Northern England.

 

I know that Scottish nationalism is different.

But nationalist voting has done Labour.

They have imo taken for granted the votes north of Watford.

And the Labour party is disdainful of your average white van man.

 

I do think this will galvanise independence feelings up here.

But the scaremongering if we go for it will be full on.

Especially (highly doubtful) if the UK untangles itself from the EU.

Hard borders etc.

 

 

[maroonlegions]

1 minute ago, Des' Dad said:

 

He wouldn't lie, would he? Surely not.

Boris talking like people lives are just a fecking  game show, aye game on right enough, sick and totally devoid of any substance of human empathy..   

 

Homophobic, racism and no morality and no human  empathy seems to be in fashion. 

[Des' Dad]

1 hour ago, Jamhammer said:

It was a one issue election and the main opposition failed to address that one issue. Fatally failing to recognise how sick and tired the public were of Brexit. As Noble as Corbyn's defence of the NHS etc was and is the people who voted leave and even a lot of remainers were only interested in Brexit.

The tragic thing is that this victory is a Trojan horse for Johnson and his ilk to destroy the NHS and wage war on the disadvantaged. I fully expect to see much more, "Scroungers, communists, loony lefties, Indy Whingers" etc in the popular press along with a rise in racism, Islamaphobia and right wing nonsense. 

Another sad day for Scotland but that's democracy for you.

A sad day for democracy. What will future elections be like when the Tories proved in this one that the best way to win is to cheat and lie your way into Westminster.

[maroonlegions]

12 minutes ago, Des' Dad said:

A sad day for democracy. What will future elections be like when the Tories proved in this one that the best way to win is to cheat and lie your way into Westminster.

The day will come when people will no longer be taken for fools.

 

Sadly it will take the resurgence of Victorian like poverty and destitution for millions  that forces a new way..

 

Capitalism is in affect cannibalism and some day soon there will be nothing left to exploit and devour.     

 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2019 by maroonlegions

[maroonlegions]

 

[Governor Tarkin]

53 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

 

a moderate labour party under Starmer or the likes would be a real threat to the SNP

 

This would be my preferred option.

[Roxy Hearts]

1 hour ago, doctor jambo said:

Same grounds as the EU ref- you had a vote, you decided.

The SNP have become the repository of the "old Labour" voters.

Blind devotion

IF labour gets its act together, then the SNP will lose ground again.

a moderate labour party under Starmer or the likes would be a real threat to the SNP

I'm ex Labour. Absolutely no chance of voting for a WM party again, especially Labour. They died with John Smith. 

[John Findlay]

Jim Murphy being interviewed by Andrew Neil just after 5am. Murphy saying Labour trying to put a foot in both camps as in not sure they want independence from the UK for Scotland or Brexit. Question then put to Jim what would you advise Boris Johnson to do when Nicola Sturgeon comes asking for Indyref2?

Jim's answer. It's not upto me to advise him. I'm not in frontline politics anymore. That in that answer is the Labour party summed up. Spineless, clueless and not a clue what about they want. Leadership severely lacking for them both north and south of the border. They wonder why they were wiped out in Scotland and hammered in England.

[Justin Z]

 

My, oh my, oh my, how familiar this feels.

[Mikey1874]

 

5 hours ago, Boris said:

 

Good post.

 

Tricky for Johnson though as he is on record as saying he will knock it back.

 

I suspect that the Holyrood 2021 election will be the watershed.  If an indy majority then game on.  It's a gamble, for both sides.

 

Boris has already refused it.

 

Reported  by Reuters.

[Maple Leaf]

Several posts removed.

 

 

1. Always treat fellow members with respect and courtesy. Abuse is not permitted.

[Maroon Sailor]

Looks like The Sturge knew she was out of order

 

She has now apologised, saying: 'Sorry, I got overexcited.' Speaking to Sky News, she said it was an 'understandably, excited reaction' - and offered Ms Swinson her sympathy. 

 

'I understand more than most, the pressures and the challenges of leadership and to lose her seat tonight when she's lead her party through this campaign will be a bitter blow for her,' she said. 

[ri Alban]

6 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Looks like The Sturge knew she was out of order

 

She has now apologised, saying: 'Sorry, I got overexcited.' Speaking to Sky News, she said it was an 'understandably, excited reaction' - and offered Ms Swinson her sympathy. 

 

'I understand more than most, the pressures and the challenges of leadership and to lose her seat tonight when she's lead her party through this campaign will be a bitter blow for her,' she said. 

Tell Jo, unlike Nicola, I'm not sorry.

 

Edited December 13, 2019 by ri Alban

[Boab]

5 minutes ago, Roxy Hearts said:

I'm ex Labour. Absolutely no chance of voting for a WM party again, especially Labour. They died with John Smith. 

That’s your choice and I respect it.

I’ll stick with it.

When Independence comes, a socialist government will take us forward.

 

[Justin Z]

8 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Looks like The Sturge knew she was out of order

 

She has now apologised, saying: 'Sorry, I got overexcited.' Speaking to Sky News, she said it was an 'understandably, excited reaction' - and offered Ms Swinson her sympathy. 

 

'I understand more than most, the pressures and the challenges of leadership and to lose her seat tonight when she's lead her party through this campaign will be a bitter blow for her,' she said. 

 

This was within like 60 seconds of the camera catching her reaction as she was set to be interviewed.

[Jamhammer]

13 minutes ago, Boab said:

That’s your choice and I respect it.

I’ll stick with it.

When Independence comes, a socialist government will take us forward.

 

I was thinking about this today. Would be odd if we got independence and the SNP lost the first general election after it. Bit like Churchill getting emptied after WWII

[Francis Albert]

3 minutes ago, Jamhammer said:

I was thinking about this today. Would be odd if we got independence and the SNP lost the first general election after it. Bit like Churchill getting emptied after WWII

If and when independence happens the SNP becomes redundent.

[The Real Maroonblood]

28 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Looks like The Sturge knew she was out of order

 

She has now apologised, saying: 'Sorry, I got overexcited.' Speaking to Sky News, she said it was an 'understandably, excited reaction' - and offered Ms Swinson her sympathy. 

 

'I understand more than most, the pressures and the challenges of leadership and to lose her seat tonight when she's lead her party through this campaign will be a bitter blow for her,' she said. 

Thoughts and prayers for Swinson at this difficult time.

[Francis Albert]

Watching some of the post election coverage Ian Murray despite the dodgy facial hair came across as the nearest to a normal human being of all the politicians on display. Probably the secret of his success.

[ri Alban]

So when's his first feck up? And what?

[redjambo]

6 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

If and when independence happens the SNP becomes redundent.

 

Just for info, it's "redundant", FA. As a party with independence as its main remit, that will be true. But it does have other policies and I'm sure will also reshape itself accordingly in the new climate. The SNP will carry on, but almost certainly without the level of support it has experienced in recent years.

[Francis Albert]

11 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Just for info, it's "redundant", FA. As a party with independence as its main remit, that will be true. But it does have other policies and I'm sure will also reshape itself accordingly in the new climate. The SNP will carry on, but almost certainly without the level of support it has experienced in recent years.

Thanks for the correction to.my spelling.

[ri Alban]

55 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Looks like The Sturge knew she was out of order

 

She has now apologised, saying: 'Sorry, I got overexcited.' Speaking to Sky News, she said it was an 'understandably, excited reaction' - and offered Ms Swinson her sympathy. 

 

'I understand more than most, the pressures and the challenges of leadership and to lose her seat tonight when she's lead her party through this campaign will be a bitter blow for her,' she said. 

What's Swinson oan aboot with the glass ceiling. Thatcher, May, Merkel, Sturgeon etc... Jo you're not breaking any barriers and you've not been beaten because you're a woman. Take the complex and put it in the bin. Your arrogance cost you.

Edited December 13, 2019 by ri Alban

[redjambo]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Thanks for the correction to.my spelling.

 

Thanks for taking it well, FA. I just can't help myself.

[Mikey1874]

3 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What's Swinson oan aboot with the glass ceiling. Thatcher, May, Merkel, Sturgeon etc... Jo you're not breaking any barriers and you've not been beaten because you're a woman. Take the complex and put it in the bin. Your arrogance cost you.

 

Somehow she consistently lost support every time she was on tv.

 

Local people saying she lost out by never actually being in her own constituency. 

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, ri Alban said:

What's Swinson oan aboot with the glass ceiling. Thatcher, May, Merkel, Sturgeon etc... Jo you're not breaking any barriers and you've not been beaten because you're a woman. Take the complex and put it in the bin. You're arrogance cost you.

 

I can't understand the whole thing to be honest, ri. If it had been Labour who had won the seat and Sturgeon cheered like that at Swinson's demise then I can see that it would have been disrespectful. But Sturgeon was cheering one of her own candidates beating a very high-profile candidate to win the seat - as they say, nothing to see here, move along.

[Francis Albert]

15 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What's Swinson oan aboot with the glass ceiling. Thatcher, May, Merkel, Sturgeon etc... Jo you're not breaking any barriers and you've not been beaten because you're a woman. Take the complex and put it in the bin. Your arrogance cost you.

Agreed. Her humiliation was nothing to do with her gender. Any more than  the previous Lib Dem's leader's was. Or the one before that. When I said the one before that I was thinking about that other nonentity Tim Farron. Vince Cable was a cut above him.and Swinson .

Edited December 13, 2019 by Francis Albert

[redjambo]

Just now, Mikey1874 said:

 

Somehow she consistently lost support every time she was on tv.

 

Local people saying she lost out by never actually being in her own constituency. 

 

I don't mind the Lib Dems as much as some on here, but I never took to Swinson. Not just her policy decisions and her voting record, but also her whole demeanour. She didn't seem relaxed and assured enough, came over as a bit too cocky. A country mile away from someone like her predecessor, Vince Cable.

[redjambo]

Just now, Barack said:

Whose turn is it now? They've all had a go now haven't they? Some more than once.

 

 

Given that Lib Dem rules state that the party leader has to be an MP, they don't have much choice!

[graygo]

5 hours ago, weehammy said:

Quite correct.
2019 result:

SNP/independence (probably including some anti-Boris tactical votes)

45%

Non-SNP/against independence

55%

 

Same as 2014 referendum. Where’s the ‘mandate’?

 

Interesting thing for me is that 16 - 18 year olds are allowed a vote in a referendum, last time there was over 100,000 such voters and 71% of them voted for independence.

So yesterday's "same" figures are minus this demographic which might make the difference.

[Cade]

SNP: 47/59 seats (80%); 45.0% popular vote. No mandate, back in your box.

 

Tories: 365/650 seats (56%); 43.6% popular vote. Landslide, massive mandate.

 

Loving me some unionist logic today.

[Roxy Hearts]

1 hour ago, Boab said:

That’s your choice and I respect it.

I’ll stick with it.

When Independence comes, a socialist government will take us forward.

 

Fair enough. 

[Class of 75]

5 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

Gina Millar and Joanna Cherry and hovering in the wings to put the skids under Brexit. It’s more difficult for them now though Boris has a big majority. 

Seriously? Unbelievable 

[ri Alban]

40 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Interesting thing for me is that 16 - 18 year olds are allowed a vote in a referendum, last time there was over 100,000 such voters and 71% of them voted for independence.

So yesterday's "same" figures are minus this demographic which might make the difference.

His sums don't add up either. The greens received 1% , taking it to 46%, plus a few Labour for independence in there too. But if 45% isn't a mandate, we better have General Elections until one party gains 50%+1.

[ri Alban]

When's the Russian report being released?

[XB52]

3 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

Boris has already refused it.

 

Reported  by Reuters.

We haven't asked yet

[Cade]

9 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

When's the Russian report being released?

LOL as if.

Boris has the majority to run roughshod over everything unless the Supreme Court can stop him.

[XB52]

35 minutes ago, Class of 75 said:

Seriously? Unbelievable 

Seriously? No, just in Dannie's head. Unbelievable? Yes it is as it's not true. Brexit will happen on the 31st January. Well, it will start then, God knows when it will be finished

[Don Dan]

See the Antifa thugs are fighting the police tonight outside Downing Street. You unfortunately see glimpses of this attitude on here when people vent their spleen at democracy.  
 

[Don Dan]

28 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Seriously? No, just in Dannie's head. Unbelievable? Yes it is as it's not true. Brexit will happen on the 31st January. Well, it will start then, God knows when it will be finished

No it’s not just in my head both these people have history in using the courts to stop Brexit. They will do it again. Watch this space.

[Don Dan]

34 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Seriously? No, just in Dannie's head. Unbelievable? Yes it is as it's not true. Brexit will happen on the 31st January. Well, it will start then, God knows when it will be finished

Gina Miller has told the BBC that her fight against Brexit is still far from over, as she revealed how Remainers will next try to halt Boris Johnson’s deal. However, the arch-Remainer admitted that Boris Johnson's resounding victory meant that Remainers could no longer rely on Parliament to wreck Britain's departure from the EU. Mr Johnson won a landslide victory last night, after the Conservatives swept aside Labour in its traditional Red Wall heartlands.

 

Brexit may or may not happen on the 31st January ( I hope it won’t by the way). 
The facts are the Remainer’s (I am one) will not give in and will resort to using the courts the get their way. Note Miller and Cherry will use the courts and as you know have done in the past to get their way and over turn Brexit. 
Sturgeon will also run to the courts now Boris has told her No to a second referendum. 
 

 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Dannie Boy said:

Gina Miller has told the BBC that her fight against Brexit is still far from over, as she revealed how Remainers will next try to halt Boris Johnson’s deal. However, the arch-Remainer admitted that Boris Johnson's resounding victory meant that Remainers could no longer rely on Parliament to wreck Britain's departure from the EU. Mr Johnson won a landslide victory last night, after the Conservatives swept aside Labour in its traditional Red Wall heartlands.

 

Brexit may or may not happen on the 31st January ( I hope it won’t by the way). 
The facts are the Remainer’s (I am one) will not give in and will resort to using the courts the get their way. Note Miller and Cherry will use the courts and as you know have done in the past to get their way and over turn Brexit. 
Sturgeon will also run to the courts now Boris has told her No to a second referendum. 
 

 

 

Ken.   Swines.    Nashing away off to the courts to try to deny democracy.    Nashing off to the courts to try to get democracy.

 

Oh wait...

[Don Dan]

2 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Ken.   Swines.    Nashing away off to the courts to try to deny democracy.    Nashing off to the courts to try to get democracy.

 

Oh wait...

I’ve given up waiting.
Anyway enjoy your five years of Tory government democratically elected, I know it hurts you but that’s life in a democracy. I have to suffer the SNP who I never voted for but I live in a democracy and make the best of it any way I can.