The Sevco saga continues ...

[EH11_2NL]

4 hours ago, E6 Inc said:

How do they continue to get around FFP rules?! Lose 14m and then 11m but spent 7m on a single player. How is that allowed?!

 

This paragraph should send shivers down the spines of all Sevco fans:

 

“The Board acknowledge that the uncertainty over the level of additional funds that will be required and a lack of a binding debt facility indicate that a material uncertainty exists which may cast doubt over the Group’s ability to continue as a going concern and therefore its ability to realise its assets and discharge its liabilities in the normal course of business.”

 

Really hope they go down the drain again, and this time the SPFL and SFA have the guts to let them die forever.

Only one thing would guarantee that. ALL other top flight club's fans refusing to buy season tickets, merchandise or anything connected with their club. The club owners would then put the pressure on the bigwigs. But that won't happen because the smaller clubs want the Sevco pounds.

[Jamhammer]

Tick tick tick booooom hopefully forever this time mutants!

Ive said I don’t want to see football teams going under. I’d make an exception for these, their Glasgow opposites and, of course the Vermin

[Bainy]

The crazy thing is they have spent all these millions are in such a bad way yet they still haven't won anything!  A lot of money for failure. 

 

 

[Meadows]

Wouldn’t it be great if Newcastle bought Morelos , then said less what you owe Ashley/ SSD , here’s £5m 

[Unknown user]

48 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

Compared to Rangers; Third Lanark, Gretna and Airdrie are in rude financial health. 

 

That's what we're doing here though, comparing celtic to the rangers.

Compared to the rangers, celtic are fairly well off, they're still running at profit and have a wealthy backer who can pull all the financial moves the hun can if required. They have tens of thousands of ST holders and waiting lists, they have sponsorship deals worth something, they don't have masses of legal fees or unknown legal indebtedness and they already have the upper hand.

If I was a dirty hun I'd be pretty concerned right now.

 

[BelgeJambo]

If they have to sell Morelos to save themselves then potentially interested clubs will know they are desperate and offer a pittance to what they think he is worth

[Big Slim Stylee]

I so dislike that club and everything about it 🙁

[Jamboelite]

Hmmm i just cant see them going under again, there was a time i expected it but they seem to be able to dodge bullets.

[Bazzas right boot]

£64m loss since their re birth. 

£230m loss over 30 years I seen somewhere. 

 

Thing is, they can call All out, go bust take the 20 point admin hit and start again. 

 

They won't be liquidated again. 

 

 

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

3 hours ago, adambraejambo said:

No idea what would happen should they go tits up again. Know they got liquidated last time because the tax man was due the most. If they went into admin who would be due what. I mean are  they likely to come out of admin or go under again. They have had so many share issues I no idea where they stand. 

 

I'd bet the shareholders are wondering the same thing, as they have seen their 'investment' being diluted and diluted and diluted again.

Pretty soon if they keep having share issues, it'll cost more to print the shares than the shares are actually worth.  😄

[Bazzas right boot]

23 hours ago, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

Until now I've considered it very unlikely that administration of TRFC would lead to liquidation in the same way as it did with RFC, as the old club had that huge tax liability hanging over it, but that football debt, which would still have to be paid even if they scammed a pre-pack admin, could end up having a similar effect.

 

 

Yip, admin, take the 20pt  penalty, repeat. 

 

Utterly depressing. 

[Deevers]

On 4 November 2019 at 13:14, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

Until now I've considered it very unlikely that administration of TRFC would lead to liquidation in the same way as it did with RFC, as the old club had that huge tax liability hanging over it, but that football debt, which would still have to be paid even if they scammed a pre-pack admin, could end up having a similar effect.

It may be that Ashley and SDI are the ones to push them over the edge.  Depending  on the damages award and whether Mike wants that paid up front. 

[RobNox]

2 hours ago, Jambo-Fox said:

Why would anybody think Morelos would be good enough to play in the E Premier League?

He’s probably more suited to the first division although a struggling desperate Championship club might take a gamble on him to help them in a relegation battle. But doubt if anybody would pay more than £5 million maximum.

 

 I’ll leave you with this .... Defoe is not good enough for the E Premier League why would Bournemouth want to replace him with an inferior player?

 

 

Would Morelos even be allowed to play in the EPL, does he meet the criteria for a work permit down there?

[RobNox]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

Going bust (again) would be utterly humiliating for them, but would probably be the best thing for them. Clear the decks and start again. Go for youth from day one and enter the top league with kids aged 22 with 100s of appearances from League 2 through to Championship. 

 

McCoist is partly responsible for the state they are in. Wasted millions handing guys like Kevin Kyle or Fran Sandaza thousands a week to beat part time players. Obviously the charlatans that robbed them (Green and co) are also responsible but you cannot get away from how much they wasted to get to the top league. 

 

Pleasing really  

 

And another thing, according to the accounts they owe c £24m in player transfers, due to be instalments over the next 2 years (that includes the players signed after the accounts, notably Kent).  Now, unless I'm mistaken, even if they go bust, it is a condition of the SFA that they would still have to meet footballing debts if they want to continue to have a SFA licence.

 

So, who would put up money to finance a CVA knowing they would still be accountable for the footballing debt?  And if they are liquidated, who would want to buy the basket of assets and pretend to be the same club again, if they knew they would inherit the footballing debt?

[busby1985]

Let’s not forget that what ever they manage to sell Morelos for, part of the figure will have to go into paying for what they have been paying him in wages since his contract extension. His extension made him the clubs highest earner, partly with a view from Rangers that they’d only have to pay him those new wages for a month or so as they’d punt him come the summer. Mark Allen is no longer in his role, rumour is that the board backed Gerrard over Allen in regards to not selling Morelos this summer. Defoe, Morelos, Davis, Goldson, McGregor, Arfield, Jack, Kent etx all on big, big money. Mental approach to business but nothing new for Rangers. 

[Jambo-Fox]

8 minutes ago, RobNox said:

 

Would Morelos even be allowed to play in the EPL, does he meet the criteria for a work permit down there?

Good question ... I don’t know the answer but as things stand I think it’s no! However all rather academic because he’s just not good enough!

[Jambo-Fox]

2 hours ago, Mr Elwood P said:

Morelos is as good as he is ugly. A fantastic player who, unfortunately, will be sold for millions by Rangers.

🤔 ........ be sold for millions by Rangers🤷‍♂️

[Tynecastlesmychurch]

I think rangers are going to push it as close to oblivion as they feel they can until they win the league. I have a hunch that if they do win the league this year or next. Basically stopping 10 in a row. Then they'll take a much more prudent aproch for the next two or three seasons after. That or just sell Morelos, Tav and Jack for as much dough as possible to stabilise things a bit. Their model isn't sustainable. Celtic financially are so far ahead it's scary. But what might be more frightening for Rangers is us closing the gap financially.

 

Keep backing the FOH people! 

[Maple Leaf]

2 hours ago, NaturalOrder74 said:

Gerrard won’t stay if they don’t stop celtic winning the league this year, even if they win like a league cup or something it won’t be enough. I’m sure celtic still have money at their disposal while sevco are in debt trying to keep up. All Scottish clubs need to step up their game against old firm particularly sevco and it could be what kills them off for good 

 

We had our chance last Sunday.

[Jambo-Fox]

14 minutes ago, Deevers said:

It may be that Ashley and SDI are the ones to push them over the edge.  Depending  on the damages award and whether Mike wants that paid up front. 

Probably correct! And that might be Dave Kings plan ie once the SDI ‘damages’ payment is confirmed take Rangers into Admin so that he ‘wins’ by not having to pay SDI / Ashley!  And probably has an Admin Pre Pact agreed so he carries on without the debt! Nightmare scenario!

[Unknown user]

10 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

Probably correct! And that might be Dave Kings plan ie once the SDI ‘damages’ payment is confirmed take Rangers into Admin so that he ‘wins’ by not having to pay SDI / Ashley!  And probably has an Admin Pre Pact agreed so he carries on without the debt! Nightmare scenario!

 

That can only happen with the agreement of creditors unlinked to the club, and of course people who've had their loans converted to shares don't count as unlinked. If they don't have that they could be liquidated, or the assets sold to start yet another new club.

[Mr Elwood P]

20 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

🤔 ........ be sold for millions by Rangers🤷‍♂️

You don’t think he will be sold for millions?

[ColJT22]

Cheating again. Spend £7million in the summer despite debts. Glad we have Ann running our club, astute and diligent, getting the club back on track off the pitch. 

[Jambo-Fox]

21 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

You don’t think he will be sold for millions?

THB or VND?  🇹🇭 Baht or 🇻🇳 Dong?

 

I just think he is high risk and not very good! He is certainly not worth the inflated figures he is being ‘advertised’ for by the compliant Sevco press. Can’t really see him going to a better league or level than the Premier SPFL.

[Mr Elwood P]

34 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

THB or VND?  🇹🇭 Baht or 🇻🇳 Dong?

 

I just think he is high risk and not very good! He is certainly not worth the inflated figures he is being ‘advertised’ for by the compliant Sevco press. Can’t really see him going to a better league or level than the Premier SPFL.

I think you’ll be embarrassed by this post, in the next transfer window or two  ....

They spent a million on him. He will go for 10 times that at an absolute minimum. 

[Deevers]

16 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

I think you’ll be embarrassed by this post, in the next transfer window or two  ....

They spent a million on him. He will go for 10 times that at an absolute minimum. 

Or that's what the MSM media will tell us. 

[alwaysthereinspirit]

21 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

I think you’ll be embarrassed by this post, in the next transfer window or two  ....

They spent a million on him. He will go for 10 times that at an absolute minimum. 

Is there any other country in world football were two teams are catered to by both the association running it and game officials?

If not then he has no chance of doing elsewhere what he does here in Scotland. 

[FruitJuice]

5 minutes ago, alwaysthereinspirit said:

Is there any other country in world football were two teams are catered to by both the association running it and game officials?

If not then he has no chance of doing elsewhere what he does here in Scotland. 

Our game is basically corrupt because of those two.  If it wasn't for hearts, I'd be liberated from the sham that is Scottish football.  Not far off that stage as it is.  The next thirty years is them sharing the league title and the rest of us hoping for a cup win.  We even have a TV deal that guarantees four old firm games even though the split can't promise that.  I'd love it to at least resemble some sort of competition.  No chance of that in out culture.  

Edited November 5, 2019 by FruitJuice

[doctor jambo]

6 minutes ago, alwaysthereinspirit said:

Is there any other country in world football were two teams are catered to by both the association running it and game officials?

If not then he has no chance of doing elsewhere what he does here in Scotland. 

Spain.

Italy.

The shenanigans of the big teams there make your eyes bleed

[Mr Elwood P]

28 minutes ago, Deevers said:

Or that's what the MSM media will tell us. 

Pretty clear he’s a very good player. Very similar scoring rate to Dembele who has done well at Lyon and is being touted for a massive move to the EPL.

 

22 minutes ago, alwaysthereinspirit said:

Is there any other country in world football were two teams are catered to by both the association running it and game officials?

If not then he has no chance of doing elsewhere what he does here in Scotland. 

Think his behaviour has been vastly improved this season? Worth remembering he’s only 23. What age was Suarez when he was running about biting folk?

[Bazzas right boot]

23 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

Our game is basically corrupt because of those two.  If it wasn't for hearts, I'd be liberated from the sham that is Scottish football.  Not far off that stage as it is.  The next thirty years is them sharing the league title and the rest of us hoping for a cup win.  We even have a TV deal that guarantees four old firm games even though the split can't promise that.  I'd love it to at least resemble some sort of competition.  No chance of that in out culture.  

 

 

I agree. 

👀👀👀

[Blackie the Cat]

31 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

Our game is basically corrupt because of those two.  If it wasn't for hearts, I'd be liberated from the sham that is Scottish football.  Not far off that stage as it is.  The next thirty years is them sharing the league title and the rest of us hoping for a cup win.  We even have a TV deal that guarantees four old firm games even though the split can't promise that.  I'd love it to at least resemble some sort of competition.  No chance of that in out culture.  

Absolutely, totally agree on all counts. 

[fabienleclerq]

1 hour ago, Jambo-Fox said:

THB or VND?  🇹🇭 Baht or 🇻🇳 Dong?

 

I just think he is high risk and not very good! He is certainly not worth the inflated figures he is being ‘advertised’ for by the compliant Sevco press. Can’t really see him going to a better league or level than the Premier SPFL.

 

He's gonna go for millions, he's got a ridiculous scoring rate despite his god awful attitude. Someone like Newcastle will take a punt on him. 

[alwaysthereinspirit]

41 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

Spain.

Italy.

The shenanigans of the big teams there make your eyes bleed

This is the type of answer I was hoping for. That's 4 teams Morelos will never see. That was my point. He wont go to the same type set up he enjoys here so will never be the same player. He'll be wound up like a clock in other countries.

[Mysterion]

1 hour ago, Deevers said:

Or that's what the MSM media will tell us. 

They will and we’ll all know that if it’s that amount they’ll be paid in tranches.

 

if it’s under £10mill - good chance it’s been discounted and paid up front so they can balance the books.

[Jambo-Fox]

44 minutes ago, alwaysthereinspirit said:

This is the type of answer I was hoping for. That's 4 teams Morelos will never see. That was my point. He wont go to the same type set up he enjoys here so will never be the same player. He'll be wound up like a clock in other countries.

Totally agree - he would not even get a kick of the ball in the top flight divisions of England Spain Germany France or Spain!

 

Why have some got such a big Morelos love in?? And tout him for over £10, £20 + million?

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Jambo-Fox said:

Totally agree - he would not even get a kick of the ball in the top flight divisions of England Spain Germany France or Spain!

 

Why have some got such a big Morelos love in?? And tout him for over £10, £20 + million?

 

He's a good player, young, been scoring consistently for some time now. Definitely worth a punt for a mid to lower level epl team IMO

[AllyjamboDerbyshire]

3 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Yip, admin, take the 20pt  penalty, repeat. 

 

Utterly depressing. 

That 'football debt' figure could have far reaching consequences, just like the tax debt did. They would also have to miss out on European competition for a couple of seasons at least due to EUFA's FFP regulations and have offloaded their best players - unless they manage to wangle a pre-pack admin, but regardless, they would still have that £24.5m to pay. In effect, they will almost be as unattractive to a buyer as RFC was back in 2012.

[RobNox]

12 minutes ago, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

That 'football debt' figure could have far reaching consequences, just like the tax debt did. They would also have to miss out on European competition for a couple of seasons at least due to EUFA's FFP regulations and have offloaded their best players - unless they manage to wangle a pre-pack admin, but regardless, they would still have that £24.5m to pay. In effect, they will almost be as unattractive to a buyer as RFC was back in 2012.

 

And if they ended up in liquidation, the only way to avoid the £24.5m liability would be to return as a new club.  If they wanted to pretend to be the same club again, they would have to accept the footballing debt.  If not, they have to be treated as a new club and start at the bottom again.

[FruitJuice]

25 minutes ago, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

That 'football debt' figure could have far reaching consequences, just like the tax debt did. They would also have to miss out on European competition for a couple of seasons at least due to EUFA's FFP regulations and have offloaded their best players - unless they manage to wangle a pre-pack admin, but regardless, they would still have that £24.5m to pay. In effect, they will almost be as unattractive to a buyer as RFC was back in 2012.

There is no better man than the one who brings you hope.   I love you!!  Seriously  it looks like they need a fair bit of luck to survive this.  Would they have the brass neck to have another share issue soon? 

They cant rely on that forever.  

[brunoatemyhamster]

1 hour ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

He's gonna go for millions, he's got a ridiculous scoring rate despite his god awful attitude. Someone like Newcastle will take a punt on him. 

His scoring rate is meh in reality. 

Dembele went for £20 million because he scored goals in the CL regular, and also pished our league, scoring for fun and hat tricks against The Rangers. 

His record in Europe this season is padded with 5 goals or something against that team from Gibraltar. 

He still hasn't scored  against Celtic. 

He has potential, no doubt about it. 

But if that £15 million bid was real, they would have snapped their hand off for it. 

Dembele was also younger IIRC. 

Morelos is also protected here. 

£10 m at the very most and anyone is still taking a huge risk. 

[FruitJuice]

Do you think Celtic will make as much from the dembele sell on clause as they will for morelos.  Cant stand the green cheek but the blue cheek must be sick of them always pulling something out the bag.  

[frankblack]

6 hours ago, Paul Shark said:

Doesn't matter but Div 2 clubs are rubbing their hands at the windfall they'll bring playing them next season.

 

Should they win the league, would the SPFL allow a new Div 2 club into the Champions League qualifying? 🤔

[Ex member of the SaS]

5 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

I'd bet the shareholders are wondering the same thing, as they have seen their 'investment' being diluted and diluted and diluted again.

Pretty soon if they keep having share issues, it'll cost more to print the shares than the shares are actually worth.  😄

According to the accountant Phil three names has, there are 256 million shares, the equity value implied per share would be 6p.

 

https://philmacgiollabhain.ie/2019/11/03/rugger-guy-looks-at-rifc-2019-accounts/#more-14550

Edited November 5, 2019 by Ex member of the SaS

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

That 'football debt' figure could have far reaching consequences, just like the tax debt did. They would also have to miss out on European competition for a couple of seasons at least due to EUFA's FFP regulations and have offloaded their best players - unless they manage to wangle a pre-pack admin, but regardless, they would still have that £24.5m to pay. In effect, they will almost be as unattractive to a buyer as RFC was back in 2012.

 

 

If it's all agreed tho? 

They'd minimise any football debts if that was thier plan, they'd plan it. 

 

You'd think that would end any future credit services as well but in terms of football, take the hit, still finnish second. 

 

No way the Scottish football authorities would do anything either, in fact Likley they and some clubs would back them, like they did last time. 

 

It's utterly Tragic and if it plays out I could be done with Scottish football tbh. 

 

Watch la liga and Epl on sky. 

 

I do hope your right tho. 

 

Sell Morelos, pay of football debts, bump the rest, take the points hit, still finnish second. 

 

Balance sheet and all the shares back to being all good again. 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2019 by Smith's right boot

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

He's a good player, young, been scoring consistently for some time now. Definitely worth a punt for a mid to lower level epl team IMO

 

Yip £10-£15m is a punt for them as well. 

 

Derby bought a defender for £8m this season. 

 

He'll go for a lot. 

He's also got a long contract so rangers have no issues there. 

 

He's a good wee player imo, well capable of playing at a higher level. 

 

[Deevers]

1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

If it's all agreed tho? 

They'd minimise any football debts if that was thier plan, they'd plan it. 

 

You'd think that would end any future credit services as well but in terms of football, take the hit, still finnish second. 

 

No way the Scottish football authorities would do anything either, in fact Likley they and some clubs would back them, like they did last time. 

 

It's utterly Tragic and if it plays out I could be done with Scottish football tbh. 

 

Watch la liga and Epl on sky. 

 

I do hope your right tho. 

 

Sell Morelos, pay of football debts, bump the rest, take the points hit, still finnish second. 

 

Balance sheet and all the shares back to being all good again. 

 

 

 

 

If big Mike is the major creditor, it’s hardly likely that he would accept that scenario.  He’s after his pound of flesh from the Glib and Shamelss one. I don’t think any of the spat is entirely about money. It’s more about bleeding The Rangers dry and rubbing Kings nose in it at every opportunity.

[R08813]

4 hours ago, FruitJuice said:

Our game is basically corrupt because of those two.  If it wasn't for hearts, I'd be liberated from the sham that is Scottish football.  Not far off that stage as it is.  The next thirty years is them sharing the league title and the rest of us hoping for a cup win.  We even have a TV deal that guarantees four old firm games even though the split can't promise that.  I'd love it to at least resemble some sort of competition.  No chance of that in out culture.  

I’ve never actually thought about the TV side of things before. Obviously it’s highly likely they’ll be in the top half of the split but guaranteeing that is something else... Would we be sued for breach of contract if that didn’t happen or do we have it in small print that there’s a chance this doesn’t happen?

[Paul Shark]

1 hour ago, frankblack said:

 

Should they win the league, would the SPFL allow a new Div 2 club into the Champions League qualifying? 🤔

Rhetorical questions obviously. The SPFL will no doubt be trying to give them 15 points if they go into administration! 

[IveSeenTheLight]

2 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

He'll go for a lot. 

He's also got a long contract so rangers have no issues there. 

 

He's a good wee player imo, well capable of playing at a higher level. 

 

is there an issue over international clearance to play in the EPL?

Has he played in 30% of Columbia’s games in the last two years?

That May scupper any megabucks deals to the EPL