Arrests for racial abuse at Tynecastle

[Bridge of Djoum]

44 minutes ago, redm said:

 

Plus we hadn’t even finished with the stander uppers versus sitter downers, the section G’ers v Section N’ers, the Sport Are Troopers v pacifists or the Hello Helloers versus the non-Hello Helloers, never mind the non-sectarian lyric splinter group. ?

 

We don’t have enough time or bandwidth for new warring factions.

Regime change required in that case.

 

 

 

 

[redm]

4 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

Regime change required in that case.

 

 

 

 

 

[...a bit disco]

2 hours ago, Jodami said:

Excellent post. We can spend day after day on here splitting hairs on the definition of fascism but it impacts nothing. The moulding of these kids has already happened and they now believe the nonsense they've been fed. Anyone that denies that this is the case has never attended an away game in the last 2/3 seasons. 

 

Seconded.

 

This horse speaks the truth.

[oi oi]

8 hours ago, Thomaso said:

 

I would hate to live in a world where we had no "British armed forces".

No armies = no wars

[oi oi]

39 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

How ******* old is your car?

Ha ha. My terminology probably points more to how old i am rather than my car.

[Governor Tarkin]

39 minutes ago, redm said:

We don’t have enough time or bandwidth for new warring factions.

 

Admin' should organise a Kickback Christmas night out at the Diggers so we can all smooth things over.

[haveyouheard 22]

12 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Admin' should organise a Kickback Christmas night out at the Diggers so we can all smooth things over.

That would be a scream

[JamboGraham]

6 hours ago, AndyNic said:

These halfwits are never going to change their views. You only have to look at the utter shite they regularly post on social media and listen to the disgusting stuff they shout at games. Racist, sectarian or bigoted views are not welcome at Tynecastle Park and the sooner these tits are banned the better. 

 

Imagine having to explain these idiots actions to your kids? Fully grown adults shouting "black *****", "****ing paedo *******s", "Fenian *****" etc. I can't stand these pissed up racist arseholes using football as an excuse to spout their pish and if that makes me a sweetie rustler then you're the one with the problem, not me. 

 

Funny thing is, it's the young ones being 'groomed', for want of a better word, by these older guys that are more worrying. 12-18 year olds calling normal fans boring *******s because they want to sit and enjoy the game (most with their kids) and not jump about abusing players and opposition fans. It's mental.

 

Good luck eradicating the problems when the older generation pavement dancers keep egging them on to recreate their youth. It's embarrassing and yet they all think they're ****ing legends. Imagine trying to talk sense to one of these guys? Unfortunately this problem isn't going away any time soon.

 

 

 

Yup....this...

[JyTees]

15 hours ago, To Be Frank said:

 

 

Before the match kicked off the Motherwell players were warming up in that half. There’s been an incident between Mbulu and a number of Hearts fans which has led to other Motherwell players getting involved. Stewards and police have then came over to deal with the situation.

 

The reason the 20 fans thing doesn’t make sense for me is because the incident before the game only involved a few fans. My own interpretation is that that section has then been getting filmed throughout the first half while the subs ran past and that’s maybe where the song thing comes in. The Well players, in presence of the manager, have been asked to make a quick ID of the fans involved in the ore-match incident using the video. 

 

This would explain why Robinson was able to talk about having seen the video when interviewed immediately after the match and also why the Motherwell subs weren’t warming up where the away team normally would at halftime.

 

Basing this on things I know did happen and what others have said. ??

 

Thanks for that Frank. Certainly the media's reporting of 20 fans being involved hasn't helped.

[portobellojambo1]

12 minutes ago, farin said:

 

The answer is yes, 1 of the accused tweeted that he’d been bailed & was denying the charges against him though. 

 

I heard today that of the two charged one is in their teens and the other 20 yrs old.

[Jambof3tornado]

7 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

I heard today that of the two charged one is in their teens and the other 20 yrs old.

Hopefully it will serve as a lesson to all that you cannot shout whatever you like at people in public places, thats not to codemn the accused before the courts have judged them.

 

Think I heard earlier one of the accused Chelsea fans is a 60 year old.

[Alex Kintner]

12 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

I heard today that of the two charged one is in their teens and the other 20 yrs old.

 

19yo and 20yo I believe

Edited December 11, 2018 by To Be Frank

[JamboSpur]

Scum

[Beast Boy]

3 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Allegedly, some people on this thread like this one in particular.

 

Really? That’s a pretty damning accusation.

[Tommy Brown]

Unfortunately, most players are basically, thick!

 

From today's Daily Record

I know I shouldn't, but I can't help but laugh.

 

[haveyouheard 22]

7 hours ago, JamboSpur said:

Scum

Have they been found guilty ??

 

You are no better for me  with that comment

[ri Alban]

10 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Admin' should organise a Kickback Christmas night out at the Diggers so we can all smooth things over.

[Thomaso]

14 hours ago, oi oi said:

No armies = no wars

 

John Lennon had the same dream - unfortunately we do not live in that world....

[i8hibsh]

15 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Admin' should organise a Kickback Christmas night out at the Diggers so we can all smooth things over.

 

 

Just a normal Saturday night in Bensons.

[Governor Tarkin]

28 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Just a normal Saturday night in Bensons.

 

Used to like it when it was the Bal - al.

Handy for knocking on the door at 3am and getting in to the lock-in when I was a student staggering back from the town.

 

Bensons not so much.

[JyTees]

5 hours ago, haveyouheard 22 said:

Have they been found guilty ??

 

You are no better for me  with that comment

 

Boy frequents ER. He's got it tough.

[JudyJudyJudy]

6 hours ago, Tommy Brown said:

Unfortunately, most players are basically, thick!

 

From today's Daily Record

I know I shouldn't, but I can't help but laugh.

 

Yeah a few players are definitely not the brightest sparks,,,Jamie Walker was never the most eloquent when interviewed after a  match  

[redm]

17 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Admin' should organise a Kickback Christmas night out at the Diggers so we can all smooth things over.

 

 

 

 

[ali_jambo]

On 11/12/2018 at 12:07, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Not suggesting you in any way, as I know you are well educated but would you at least admit that the term 'fascism' is being  overused? This is to say it is being used by many who truly do not understand the term, and that is to say it's real meaning.

 

For example, ‘Antifa’ are by far and away and without the slightest shadow of doubt the most fascist organisation right now in the western world.  How can that compute?  As soon as anyone sees someone with views on immigration, race, homeless, welfare, nationalism, capitalism etc they are accused of being fascist.  This is a nonsense.

 

Fascism has absolutely nothing to do with being right wing, in-fact, historically it has always been imposed from the left.  Antifa do not support any opposing political view -   this is easily the most fascist existence on the planet.

 

Now, let us go into pride in country and race. Everybody should be proud of their race and country.  Again, we have antifa – predominantly white angry millennials who negatively prejudice anyone with opinions, wealth and white skin.  Not only is this fascist it is racist.  Do you honestly know anyone on the planet who is not proud of their country of origin?  It seems to be only shut down when it is a white person from the big bad west who is proud.  How is this acceptable?  There are almost no exceptions since the dawn of time that a political leader has not been a proud nationalist, President Trump is no exception but guess what……………..you guessed it…………….he is a fascist for being so.

 

Not one country on the planet (200 approx) has open borders.  Not one.  When anyone from a Western predominantly white country wishes to maintain this they are branded (by the far left)……you guessed it………………..fascist and racist.   Do you not see how ridiculous this is?

 

State/ general overall control, and one ruler is next up for disection, who in the Capitalist Western world wishes for this?  State control is outrageous and kinda why I started to lean towards Conservative from a very early age.  The only people in the Western world who are all about control are Antifa. 

 

I see absolutely zero fascism in the West outwith Antifa.  Not Tommy Robinson, not Donald Trump (the two usual textbook accusations), no-one except these masked anarchic thugs I see shutting down everyone who dares to have a view.  Now I am not saying not being fascist makes someone a good guy, Tommy Robinson may be a complete ***** – I have never met him and have no desire to but what he is not is a fascist.  I realise this is not the TR thread so I will not go any further with it but it is just a rant regarding this bloody term that is on every street corner and on ever square inch of social media in the West in 2018.  I am sick to the back teeth of hearing it. 

 

Rant over - peace

The basis of this rant is a complete nonsense and shows zero understanding of a) fascism, b) antifa and c) race

 

The US last year had a number of marches where people openly and confidently held up swastikas, as well as te symbols of other avowedly fascist groups (WAR, Traditionalist Workers PArty, KKK, NSM, National Front, National Policy Institute). One of these people drove his car into counter-protestors (antifa) where a young woman was killed. For opposing fascism.

 

Two-thirds of US domestic terrorism is linked to the far-right. https://www.splcenter.org/20180723/terror-right

 

Look at the aims of fascist/Nazi parties which are gaining ground across the US and Europe. This is real fascism. You have said you see 'Zero fascism in the West' outside Antifa. This is staggeringly myopic and ignorant.

 

A cursory look at politics across the West will show you that actual fascist parties are gaining ground. This sort of rant, in this day and age, is unbelievable to the point of comedy.

[Geoff the Mince]

7 minutes ago, redm said:

 

 

 

 

I think certain posters would be hilarious !  

[i8hibsh]

8 minutes ago, ali_jambo said:

The basis of this rant is a complete nonsense and shows zero understanding of a) fascism, b) antifa and c) race

 

The US last year had a number of marches where people openly and confidently held up swastikas, as well as te symbols of other avowedly fascist groups (WAR, Traditionalist Workers PArty, KKK, NSM, National Front, National Policy Institute). One of these people drove his car into counter-protestors (antifa) where a young woman was killed. For opposing fascism.

 

Two-thirds of US domestic terrorism is linked to the far-right. https://www.splcenter.org/20180723/terror-right

 

Look at the aims of fascist/Nazi parties which are gaining ground across the US and Europe. This is real fascism. You have said you see 'Zero fascism in the West' outside Antifa. This is staggeringly myopic and ignorant.

 

A cursory look at politics across the West will show you that actual fascist parties are gaining ground. This sort of rant, in this day and age, is unbelievable to the point of comedy.

 

 

Here we go............................."but but but look at the far right groups".  Where did I say these groups do not exist?  

 

I have a VERY clear understanding of fascism, hence my 'rant' which details the fundamentals of it.

 

All the largest fascist dictatorships the world has seen have been ‘far left’ parties and not far right.  The association with fascism and the far right shows nothing but a poor understanding of what fascism is.

 

Antifa are highly fascist and highly dangerous.  This is not saying they are the only extreme dangerous party on the planet – they are the most fascist!

 

Take time to watch the fantastic Dinesh. Two hours very well spent.

 

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by i8hibsh

[ali_jambo]

Quote

Here we go............................."but but but look at the far right groups".  Where did I say these groups do not exist? 

Do you even read your own posts?

 

Quote

I see absolutely zero fascism in the West outwith Antifa.

 

[gerry mccauley]

21 hours ago, heatonjambo said:

 

 

Schengen 

Whatever did happen to that horse...

[ali_jambo]

4 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Here we go............................."but but but look at the far right groups".  Where did I say these groups do not exist?  

 

I have a VERY clear understanding of fascism, hence my 'rant' which details the fundamentals of it.

 

All the largest fascist dictatorships the world has seen have been ‘far left’ parties and not far right.  The association with fascism and the far right shows nothing but a poor understanding of what fascism is.

 

Antifa are highly fascist and highly dangerous.  This is not saying they are the only extreme dangerous party on the planet – they are the most fascist!

 

Take time to watch the fantastic Dinesh. Two hours very well spent.

 

 

The largest fascist dicatorship in the world was the Nazis. If you think they are left-wing then there is literally no point in continuing this debate because you are unreachable.

Similarly if you are about to make the 'communism is fascism' argument you similarly dont know what you're talking about.

Finally, Dinesh D'Souza is a mad conspiracy theorist. You have, in defending Tommy Robinson, so far admitted to being a fan of Robinson, D'Souza, and Paul Joseph Watson among others. I urge you to read some more widely respected and cited scholars on fascism. You are being led by conspiracists and charlatans.

[Jammy T]

Since when was a country having armed forces political?

[Jammy T]

38 minutes ago, ali_jambo said:

The largest fascist dicatorship in the world was the Nazis. If you think they are left-wing then there is literally no point in continuing this debate because you are unreachable.

Similarly if you are about to make the 'communism is fascism' argument you similarly dont know what you're talking about.

Finally, Dinesh D'Souza is a mad conspiracy theorist. You have, in defending Tommy Robinson, so far admitted to being a fan of Robinson, D'Souza, and Paul Joseph Watson among others. I urge you to read some more widely respected and cited scholars on fascism. You are being led by conspiracists and charlatans.

 

Hitler was a socialist but meanings change over time. 

 

Communists have however mass murdered many more people over time than right wing fascists for what it is worth 

Edited December 12, 2018 by Jammy T

[Beast Boy]

12 minutes ago, Jammy T said:

Since when was a country having armed forces political?

 

Unless they are guerrilla militia, then always. Even then they will be inextricably linked to one political party or agenda or another. 

[Seymour M Hersh]

58 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Unless they are guerrilla militia, then always. Even then they will be inextricably linked to one political party or agenda or another. 

 

So is the British Armed Forces linked to the Conservatives or Labour? After all they have served them both.

[Beast Boy]

Just now, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

So is the British Armed Forces linked to the Conservatives or Labour? After all they have served them both.

 

Not linked to either, they are directed by the government however. Politicians. I am being a little bit pedantic tbf.

[Seymour M Hersh]

3 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Not linked to either, they are directed by the government however. Politicians. I am being a little bit pedantic tbf.

 

I read you post like you were somehow saying the Armed Forces themselves were political. When in fact they only the pawns of their political masters and not political in themselves.

Edited December 12, 2018 by Seymour M Hersh

[jake]

1 hour ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Unless they are guerrilla militia, then always. Even then they will be inextricably linked to one political party or agenda or another. 

That's just wrong .

 

Never mind

 

Edited December 12, 2018 by jake

[Beast Boy]

1 minute ago, jake said:

That's just wrong .

 

 

Cool. I was being pedantic tbf, so I’m not that fussy about arguing about it. Merely pointing out that the armed forces are directed by politicians. Therefor they are political. Obviously the armed forces of this country are not aligned with one party, but whichever party is in government, generally controls them. War and conflict are decided by politics.

[Koolkeith]

3 hours ago, Jammy T said:

 

Hitler was a socialist but meanings change over time. 

 

Communists have however mass murdered many more people over time than right wing fascists for what it is worth 

That may have happened, but it’s not really relevant to what’s happening now. We’ve right wing fans, who are explicitly racist and bigoted. They’ve displayed this in public. 

[Musemic]

 

4 hours ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Unless they are guerrilla militia, then always. Even then they will be inextricably linked to one political party or agenda or another. 

 

The head of the British Armed Forces is HM The Queen so, by definition, no political affiliation.

[ali_jambo]

14 hours ago, Jammy T said:

 

Hitler was a socialist but meanings change over time. 

 

Communists have however mass murdered many more people over time than right wing fascists for what it is worth 

No he wasn't. This is basic stuff. The name of the party was the National Socialists. This was intentionally to try and gain left wing working class support.

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, ali_jambo said:

No he wasn't. This is basic stuff. The name of the party was the National Socialists. This was intentionally to try and gain left wing working class support.

Mental that you actually have to point this out. 

[Beast Boy]

20 hours ago, Musemic said:

 

 

The head of the British Armed Forces is HM The Queen so, by definition, no political affiliation.

 

So who were the guys that were “released without charge” then?

[maroonlegions]

[Sraman]

20 hours ago, Musemic said:

 

 

The head of the British Armed Forces is HM The Queen so, by definition, no political affiliation.

 

The head of, in fact, scratch that, the owner of parliament just happens to be HM The Queen so, by your definition, politics has no political affiliation. The fact that we have an HM The Queen is political, the fact that we are a country is political.

[JyTees]

2 hours ago, maroonlegions said:

 

Where's that quote taken from? The Viz?

[Pasquale for King]

On 12/12/2018 at 18:36, Jammy T said:

 

Hitler was a socialist but meanings change over time. 

 

Communists have however mass murdered many more people over time than right wing fascists for what it is worth 

Hitler and Stalin thought they were socialists but their actions proved they were not.

[Haken]

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 18:33, Jammy T said:

Since when was a country having armed forces political?

 

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 18:49, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Unless they are guerrilla militia, then always. Even then they will be inextricably linked to one political party or agenda or another. 

 

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 19:48, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

So is the British Armed Forces linked to the Conservatives or Labour? After all they have served them both.

 

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 19:50, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Not linked to either, they are directed by the government however. Politicians. I am being a little bit pedantic tbf.

Well, they're not ppolitical in the same way that the Civil Service isn't political.  Both are paid for by the tax payer and funded by the State.  The fact that we have a Ministry of Defence is something of a clue.  The armed forces are not political, but they operate under political direction - that direction is given by the government of the day and agreed by Parliament.

[Beast Boy]

48 minutes ago, Haken said:

 

 

 

Well, they're not ppolitical in the same way that the Civil Service isn't political.  Both are paid for by the tax payer and funded by the State.  The fact that we have a Ministry of Defence is something of a clue.  The armed forces are not political, but they operate under political direction - that direction is given by the government of the day and agreed by Parliament.

 

Yeah, that is the point I was trying to make. ?

[...a bit disco]

6 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Hitler and Stalin thought they were socialists but their actions proved they were not.

 

Tbf, Stalin was a rabid communist, which is as totalitarian as fascism in it's own way.

[Beast Boy]

Not sure the communists in 1930s Germany were overly enamoured with Hitler and his chums... seem to recall their relationship floundering somewhat after a positive start. ?