Arrests for racial abuse at Tynecastle

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

4 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Aye cause guilty folk have never had charges dropped. 

That may be true but I'd rather have that system than a kangaroo court like on here.

[ri Alban]

Just now, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

That may be true but I'd rather have that system than a kangaroo court like on here.

Or the usual suspects who think they should be allowed to shout and sing what they want at football games. It's tradition don't you know.

 

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

2 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Or the usual suspects who think they should be allowed to shout and sing what they want at football games. It's tradition don't you know.

 

 

I don't think our usual suspects have ever sung "Stand up if you hate the blacks", have they? Changing " the blacks" to "Kickback" made far more sense even if it was utterly stupid.

[Pheasant Plucker]

On 08/12/2018 at 18:48, XB52 said:

Had to be season holders as we don't sell  match tickets for lower N

 

On 08/12/2018 at 18:52, Dagger Is Back said:

 

Not necessarily so. Lots of empty seats today, free access to different areas within the main stand.

 

Let’s not offer half truths shall we?

 

Not helpful in the slightest

Ignore him mate, he's a hobo troll.

Speaking of which..

On 08/12/2018 at 18:52, To Be Frank said:

Arsehole behind us spent the game verbally abusing Mitchell, Clare and Djoum then had a go at Bigirimana when he came on. Sure there’s a theme there but just can’t see it ?

 

On 08/12/2018 at 18:55, Nookie Bear said:

 

You don’t have to make up stuff to drive home your case. 

 

Everyone on here is disgusted with what happened. 

Just reading the thread and thats twice now hes done this, Nookie. Bizarre. EtA - he then adds this-

"Nothing racist, just interesting those were the four players he chose to berate"

Edited December 23, 2018 by Pheasant Plucker
Added comment

[The Real Maroonblood]

11 hours ago, bobsharp said:

 

I would not argue with your statement I have been too long removed from Tynecastle attendance. However if I appeared at Tynecastle went to a turnstile and was told I could not enter, and was told theres no reason I would be taking the matter to another authority, the Club have every right to operate their facility as they see fit, but basic rights must be maintained and I think this would require in 2018 some better reason than "becausee".

I’ve stated this a few times.

Any place which is licensed people can be refused entry and no reason.given.

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

I don't think our usual suspects have ever sung "Stand up if you hate the blacks", have they? Changing " the blacks" to "Kickback" made far more sense even if it was utterly stupid.

It was the 80s, I'm sure banana throwing and monkey noises were used.

Edited December 23, 2018 by ri Alban

[ri Alban]

5 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I’ve stated this a few times.

Any place which is licensed people can be refused entry and no reason.given.

Correct.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

39 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

It was the 80s, I'm sure banana throwing and monkey noises were used.

Yep, 30 odd years ago is entirely relevant.

[ri Alban]

13 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Yep, 30 odd years ago is entirely relevant.

Personally I don't see the difference from calling someone a black ....... or a Fenian .... 30 odd years ago or now. Same folk passing on their views of the world to the next set of gullible twats. Usually from their demented Fathers and Uncles, but Mothers are just as bad.

 

You keep fighting the injustice of the poor put upon Alf Garnetts who support us. ✌️ Peace!

 

 

 

I'm not arguing GK, just talking. 

Edited December 23, 2018 by ri Alban

[Pheasant Plucker]

 

17 hours ago, RDC1 said:

Folk still desperate for this to be true. Sad. 

 

 

17 hours ago, JyTees said:

So all that shit about an incident before the game and a different one during the game was...shit? Surely not?

 

It's almost like some folk wanted this to have happened. ?

 

Are you there Frank?

 

16 hours ago, dannymack said:

Incredibly true, very sad, pathetic and shallow that some folk can't accept the truth but continually thrive on looking for an ounce of evidence to prosecute.

 

15 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

They’re seething. 

Imagine having a life so devoid of meaning. 

 

Agreed. I'm actually really ashamed by the way this has been handled by the club and fellow fans.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

41 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Personally I don't see the difference from calling someone a black ....... or a Fenian .... 30 odd years ago or now. Same folk passing on their views of the world to the next set of gullible twats. Usually from their demented Fathers and Uncles, but Mothers are just as bad.

 

You keep fighting the injustice of the poor put upon Alf Garnetts who support us. ✌️ Peace!

 

 

 

I'm not arguing GK, just talking. 

The point being, these guys said nothing about black people. Being stupid isn't a crime, yet.

[portobellojambo1]

2 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

The point being, these guys said nothing about black people. Being stupid isn't a crime, yet.

 

Indeed.

 

I think this decision will be a huge kick in the baws for some posters on here, who were looking for them to be hung, drawn and quartered pre trial.

[blairdin]

7 hours ago, jambocub said:

What did this group say that Ott?

 

Not so much what they said, but the tone and way there were saying it.

 

Mitchell was having a 'mare. He wasn't alone. When they vociferously pointed out there were to too many of his feckin type at the club and him being the feckin worst, I personally don't think they meant lazy Englishman or disinterested loan players - albeit I can't prove that. I found it uncomfortable. 

 

I wasn't alone - an older chap to my right with a young kid (10ish maybe) asked them to tone it down shortly aftervthe the ordering off and he got a mouthful from them in return.

 

It was a group of 3/4 young lads in a crowd of 1,000 +. A small barely significant minority. The main reason I tuned into it later in the game was because pre match about they'd been chatting among themselves about the lad charged following the Motherwell game not getting any further action. 

Edited December 23, 2018 by blairdin

[Alex Kintner]

7 hours ago, jambocub said:

Let's be clear there is no evidence to suggest they are guilty nothing nada nixie

 

You can’t charge someone with zero evidence ??

 

6 hours ago, Big Slim Stylee said:

He's a long time, reasoned poster. He feels uncomfortable enough to write to the club and it's not a stretch to understand what he's intimating. Why do you have a problem with that?

 

Not difficult to work out wht JyTees feels so strongly about this subject

[Alex Kintner]

So has there been any confirmation from anywhere that the PF aren’t proceeding with this?

[Dagger Is Back]

38 minutes ago, To Be Frank said:

 

You can’t charge someone with zero evidence ??

 

 

Not difficult to work out wht JyTees feels so strongly about this subject

 

Re your first point. You’d think that would be a foundation of a fully functional judicial system wouldn’t you? 

 

Not always the case sadly.

[Alex Kintner]

9 minutes ago, Dagger Is Back said:

 

Re your first point. You’d think that would be a foundation of a fully functional judicial system wouldn’t you? 

 

Not always the case sadly.

 

It’s impossible to charge anybody without any form of evidence or corroboration. Police officers can’t just say “My gut tells me he did it, Sarge. I’m going to charge him.”

[XB52]

So after all this we now have a big argument where nobody has a clue what was said/done and nobody has a clue if the alleged perpetrators have been cleared or not. just another ordinary day on kickback.

[Dagger Is Back]

1 hour ago, To Be Frank said:

 

It’s impossible to charge anybody without any form of evidence or corroboration. Police officers can’t just say “My gut tells me he did it, Sarge. I’m going to charge him.”

 

Probably best that we agree to disagree Frank, lest it appear that I'm hassling you

 

My stance is based on two incidents that happened three years ago, when the 'evidence' used to wrongly arrest a guy, was that he wore the same colour of coat as the guy they were after.

 

Since then my belief that PS always act professionally and honestly in all cases, was consigned to the same shelf as the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus.

 

Inevitably, as in all walks of life, PS has it's share of bigots, incompetents and those with agendas

 

 

Edited December 23, 2018 by Dagger Is Back

[jake]

55 minutes ago, To Be Frank said:

 

It’s impossible to charge anybody without any form of evidence or corroboration. Police officers can’t just say “My gut tells me he did it, Sarge. I’m going to charge him.”

That's pretty naive mate.

[Boab]

2 hours ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

Indeed.

 

I think this decision will be a huge kick in the baws for some posters on here, who were looking for them to be hung, drawn and quartered pre trial.

 

Yip. Always best to let due process run it's course. 

That way, you don't end up looking like a tit !

Edited December 23, 2018 by Boab

[Alex Kintner]

48 minutes ago, Dagger Is Back said:

 

Probably best that we agree to disagree Frank, lest it appear that I'm hassling you

 

My stance is based on two incidents that happened three years ago, when the 'evidence' used to wrongly arrest a guy, was that he wore the same colour of coat as the guy they were after.

 

Since then my belief that PS always act professionally and honestly in all cases, was consigned to the same shelf as the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus.

 

Inevitably, as in all walks of life, PS has it's share of bigots, incompetents and those with agendas

 

 

 

Fair enough mate

 

33 minutes ago, jake said:

That's pretty naive mate.

 

Or perhaps I’m assuming the rest of Police Scotland have the same procedures and systems as the police I work with?

[7628mm]

1 hour ago, XB52 said:

So after all this we now have a big argument where nobody has a clue what was said/done and nobody has a clue if the alleged perpetrators have been cleared or not. just another ordinary day on kickback.

You have pretty much nailed it dude.

JKB don't you just love it.

The spat re "Packie" Bonner is outstanding as you will no doubt have seen.

 

 

[Bridge of Djoum]

8 minutes ago, 7628mm said:

You have pretty much nailed it dude.

JKB don't you just love it.

The spat re "Packie" Bonner is outstanding as you will no doubt have seen.

 

 

I'm calling him ''Brown Person Bonner'' until further notice.

[Sharpie]

12 hours ago, sadj said:

Its no different to a nightclub a reason does not need to be provided. 

 

I accept totally what you say, I suppose my problem is living in a different culture and wrongly using that to make a point. I am not being racist I am stating a fact, should a black man attend a club or a game here, and be told you are being refused access to this facility, and we have no reason for doing so, the immediate reaction would be its because of race and color.There would be a media blitz, and considerable criticism. I am surprised that the U.K with the diversity of backgrounds now still maintain that type of policy that refusal of service or attendance can be so simply invoked. Please understand I am not contradicting or disputing what you or others have said, I am just totally amazed that such a situation in this day and age exists.

 

,

[Beast Boy]

17 hours ago, blairdin said:

I overheard a group of lads talking about this at Pittodrie today, saying they were pleased the lad who'd been charged had got off with it. They were a few rows behind me. Fair enough. 

 

I think Mitchell chucked it today, he wanted to get sent off IMHO. There's no excuse for that. He has to do his job. He shirked it today.

 

Before that, in the second half, the vitriol the same group were directing at Mitchell was disgusting. Now, Mitchell was shocking today, he deserved pelters and got plenty from me, but my impression was he was getting special treatment from this particular group, for some reason. There was no excuse for that either.

 

I'm a placid guy, I don't look or want to involve myself in stuff, but I felt uncomfortable enough that I will be emailing the club to confirm what seat I was in and what I thought of what was going on behind me. It was OTT, regardless of how bad Mitchell was. 

 

7 hours ago, blairdin said:

 

Not so much what they said, but the tone and way there were saying it.

 

Mitchell was having a 'mare. He wasn't alone. When they vociferously pointed out there were to too many of his feckin type at the club and him being the feckin worst, I personally don't think they meant lazy Englishman or disinterested loan players - albeit I can't prove that. I found it uncomfortable. 

 

I wasn't alone - an older chap to my right with a young kid (10ish maybe) asked them to tone it down shortly aftervthe the ordering off and he got a mouthful from them in return.

 

It was a group of 3/4 young lads in a crowd of 1,000 +. A small barely significant minority. The main reason I tuned into it later in the game was because pre match about they'd been chatting among themselves about the lad charged following the Motherwell game not getting any further action. 

 

Too many of his ****ing type at the club?

 

They sound intelligent as ****. Maybe they are high flying geneticists?

[JyTees]

7 hours ago, To Be Frank said:

 

You can’t charge someone with zero evidence ??

 

 

Not difficult to work out wht JyTees feels so strongly about this subject

 

Please explain Frank.

[Beast Boy]

Just now, JyTees said:

 

Please explain Frank.

 

Just a stab in the dark here, but you are very predictable in your stance on topics such as these. Maybe that’s what he meant? ?

[Bridge of Djoum]

1 minute ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Just a stab in the dark here, but you are very predictable in your stance on topics such as these. Maybe that’s what he meant? ?

Concur.

[JyTees]

1 minute ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Just a stab in the dark here, but you are very predictable in your stance on topics such as these. Maybe that’s what he meant? ?

 

What's my stance? That Hearts supporters shouldn't be thrown under a bus because of some unfounded allegations and a bit of kickback creative hearsay?

 

Guilty as charged.

[Nookie Bear]

18 hours ago, blairdin said:

I overheard a group of lads talking about this at Pittodrie today, saying they were pleased the lad who'd been charged had got off with it. They were a few rows behind me. Fair enough. 

 

I think Mitchell chucked it today, he wanted to get sent off IMHO. There's no excuse for that. He has to do his job. He shirked it today.

 

Before that, in the second half, the vitriol the same group were directing at Mitchell was disgusting. Now, Mitchell was shocking today, he deserved pelters and got plenty from me, but my impression was he was getting special treatment from this particular group, for some reason. There was no excuse for that either.

 

I'm a placid guy, I don't look or want to involve myself in stuff, but I felt uncomfortable enough that I will be emailing the club to confirm what seat I was in and what I thought of what was going on behind me. It was OTT, regardless of how bad Mitchell was. 

 

You were giving him pelters too? Maybe those guys are emailing about you?

[El Diez]

We’re not there yet but I refer you to my previous post some weeks ago.

 

Some people are going to look more than a tad foolish when the truth outs.

 

Some of the comments on here have been an absolute disgrace.

[Beast Boy]

12 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

What's my stance? That Hearts supporters shouldn't be thrown under a bus because of some unfounded allegations and a bit of kickback creative hearsay?

 

Guilty as charged.

 

You are immediately sceptical of any issues relating to the support, especially those connected to accusations of bad behaviour. It wasn’t actually an insult, just a pretty accurate observation.

[JyTees]

1 minute ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

You are immediately sceptical of any issues relating to the support, especially those connected to accusations of bad behaviour. It wasn’t actually an insult, just a pretty accurate observation.

 

You're correct mate. I am sceptical. Especially when I hear a group of 20 Hearts fans are accused of singing racist songs. It surprises me that there are more than a few posters on here who're quick to believe the worst and in some cases, get a little creative with their tales.

[sadj]

3 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

You're correct mate. I am sceptical. Especially when I hear a group of 20 Hearts fans are accused of singing racist songs. It surprises me that there are more than a few posters on here who're quick to believe the worst and in some cases, get a little creative with their tales.

Without getting into it for a lot of people outside the club i’d suggest that its likely for them to think its not a large step for the 20 or so to go from the sectarian to racist terms in their songs. To us they are very different , although both unacceptable but when you have a larger issue with sectarianism due to our two biggest clubs others will look in and assume the worst. There is no doubt that some of these people associated with these groups maybe as part or maybe as hangers on to them portray themselves as racist on their social media accounts. That again does not help matters. There is some who will even if Djoum scored a derby hat-trick and last second winner still say he played shit shouldn’t be in the team due to beliefs instilled in them. 

With social media being such a small part of life but having a inversely proportionate amount of influence people will be tarred by these others. People who have little brain capacity also will take the easiest route to hand out abuse , skin colour , sexual orientation etc. 

 

Its symtematic of a societal issue. If these lads are innocent of this it doesn’t change the fact that within that group there is an element that is detrimental to HMFC and we are under a lot of scrutiny from the authorities so we can’t fail to act on police or authorities advice first.

 

Kickback is it seems very protective of HMFC and keeping certain elements away from the club. Wether that is right or wrong depends on the person reading its opinion.

 

 

[Beast Boy]

40 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

You're correct mate. I am sceptical. Especially when I hear a group of 20 Hearts fans are accused of singing racist songs. It surprises me that there are more than a few posters on here who're quick to believe the worst and in some cases, get a little creative with their tales.

 

That’s all I was saying. I look at the thread title and read the OP, then say, go away and do some Christmas shopping or whatever, then pop back on to the Terrace home page and notice you are the last poster. I read down to your comment knowing pretty much exactly what you will saying in your posts and I am usually 100% on the button. The same applies to many other posters too; Frank for example.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

40 minutes ago, sadj said:

Without getting into it for a lot of people outside the club i’d suggest that its likely for them to think its not a large step for the 20 or so to go from the sectarian to racist terms in their songs. To us they are very different , although both unacceptable but when you have a larger issue with sectarianism due to our two biggest clubs others will look in and assume the worst. There is no doubt that some of these people associated with these groups maybe as part or maybe as hangers on to them portray themselves as racist on their social media accounts. That again does not help matters. There is some who will even if Djoum scored a derby hat-trick and last second winner still say he played shit shouldn’t be in the team due to beliefs instilled in them. 

With social media being such a small part of life but having a inversely proportionate amount of influence people will be tarred by these others. People who have little brain capacity also will take the easiest route to hand out abuse , skin colour , sexual orientation etc. 

 

Its symtematic of a societal issue. If these lads are innocent of this it doesn’t change the fact that within that group there is an element that is detrimental to HMFC and we are under a lot of scrutiny from the authorities so we can’t fail to act on police or authorities advice first.

 

Kickback is it seems very protective of HMFC and keeping certain elements away from the club. Wether that is right or wrong depends on the person reading its opinion.

 

 

There's a lot of truth in that and within it, there is a lot of rationale as to why some people were almost bloodthirsty in metaphorically hanging, drawing and quartering these individuals. I hope that some people learn not to dive in with both feet after this but given how they are deflecting the issue rather than admit they were wrong, I doubt it.

[davemclaren]

59 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

You're correct mate. I am sceptical. Especially when I hear a group of 20 Hearts fans are accused of singing racist songs. It surprises me that there are more than a few posters on here who're quick to believe the worst and in some cases, get a little creative with their tales.

Re this alleged incident, I wasn’t actually near it so heard nothing but hopefully plod will do the right thing, one way or other.

 

I have heard groups of Hearts fans sing the ‘Edinburgh is Beautiful’ song previously ( not in the stadium ) which is indeed racist. Given this it wouldn’t be a total shock to me for something similar to happen in the ground. 

[Boab]

1 minute ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

There's a lot of truth in that and within it, there is a lot of rationale as to why some people were almost bloodthirsty in metaphorically hanging, drawing and quartering these individuals. I hope that some people learn not to dive in with both feet after this but given how they are deflecting the issue rather than admit they were wrong, I doubt it.

 

No chance of that, Geoff. 

[JyTees]

1 hour ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

That’s all I was saying. I look at the thread title and read the OP, then say, go away and do some Christmas shopping or whatever, then pop back on to the Terrace home page and notice you are the last poster. I read down to your comment knowing pretty much exactly what you will saying in your posts and I am usually 100% on the button. The same applies to many other posters too; Frank for example.

 

Fair enough. But doesn't really have anything to do with what Frank was suggesting/insinuating.

 

 

"Not difficult to work out wht JyTees feels so strongly about this subject"

 

What is it he's worked out? I'm intrigued. 

[jake]

4 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

Fair enough. But doesn't really have anything to do with what Frank was suggesting/insinuating.

 

 

"Not difficult to work out wht JyTees feels so strongly about this subject"

 

What is it he's worked out? I'm intrigued. 

He is insinuating you are racist.

 

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

34 minutes ago, jake said:

He is insinuating you are racist.

 

 

Indeed but knows that straight out saying it is against the rules as well as being defamatory.

[Beast Boy]

34 minutes ago, jake said:

He is insinuating you are racist.

 

 

That’s a bit of an assumption. What makes you think that? 

[jake]

Just now, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Indeed but knows that straight out saying it is against the rules as well as being defamatory.

It may be against the rules and defamatory .

It hasn't stopped posters levelling the accusation against me.

 

Lazy stuff imo.

And usually resorted to when the argument is lost.

 

[jake]

Just now, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

That’s a bit of an assumption. What makes you think that? 

My opinion.

 

[Alex Kintner]

Just now, jake said:

My opinion.

 

 

Your opinion is wrong and offensive ??

[Beast Boy]

Just now, jake said:

My opinion.

 

 

Oh. I never got that. You appeared to state a fact, not an opinion. Thought I must have missed something. 

[jake]

Just now, To Be Frank said:

 

Your opinion is wrong and offensive ??

Is it .

Why don't you explain to jytees then.

[jake]

Just now, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Oh. I never got that. You appeared to state a fact, not an opinion. Thought I must have missed something. 

You are being very silly now.

 

[Alex Kintner]

Just now, jake said:

Is it .

Why don't you explain to jytees then.

 

Thought it was pretty obvious. Don’t let that get in the way of you steaming in with both feet with wrong assumptions stated as fact though ??