Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[Unknown user]

40 minutes ago, RobboM said:

Cade, the scope is wider than Freedom of Movement for Workers ,  under the "Citizens Rights Directive"
From wiki

 

I think you're splitting hairs a bit, being a student and being rich enough that you don't need work are included, but basically it's workers, and the point of it is indeed freedom of movement for workers. The reasonable time you mention to find work is 3 months, after that you can be forced out, although this seemingly never happens. 

[Victorian]

Tory snakes accusing Labour of a grubby tactic to woo the SNP with suggestions of allowing indyref2.    Selling out the union to grab power,  blah blah.     Howls of Scotland breaking away as the cost of Corbyn's premiership.

 

Ehhh... if Scotland gets indyref2 and votes to become independent,     that's ****ing democracy in action.     A choice put in front of the people and a verdict arrived at.    Through a valid democratic process.     If Scotland doesn't want indyref2 or independence then a remain vote will result.

 

Tory reptiles... anti-democratic fascists.

[Victorian]

Swinson is a lying ******* and is causing trouble for no reason.     A completely dishonest opposition to a viable proposal on a bogus premise that does not exist in reality.      What a ****ing imbecile.

[dobmisterdobster]

13 minutes ago, Victorian said:

Tory snakes accusing Labour of a grubby tactic to woo the SNP with suggestions of allowing indyref2.    Selling out the union to grab power,  blah blah.     Howls of Scotland breaking away as the cost of Corbyn's premiership.

 

Ehhh... if Scotland gets indyref2 and votes to become independent,     that's ****ing democracy in action.     A choice put in front of the people and a verdict arrived at.    Through a valid democratic process.     If Scotland doesn't want indyref2 or independence then a remain vote will result.

 

Tory reptiles... anti-democratic fascists.

Plaid will want a referendum for Wales as part of the deal. It all comes at a price.

[dobmisterdobster]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

Swinson is a lying ******* and is causing trouble for no reason.     A completely dishonest opposition to a viable proposal on a bogus premise that does not exist in reality.      What a ****ing imbecile.

Two reasons.

1. Lib Dems rely on soft Tory voters in places like Outer London who won't be pleased if they put JC in power.
2. Lib Dems have gained a lot of voters from Labour by painting JC as a closet brexiteer. Working with him would kill that narrative and their momentum in the polls. They want to scapegoat JC and Labour as enabling a Tory not deal brexit.

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, dobmisterdobster said:

Plaid will want a referendum for Wales as part of the deal. It all comes at a price.

 

It's not a price.     It's legitimate democratic process.      People opposing a referendum that is arrived at via a devolved parliament's majority view are simply anti-democracy.    

 

The SNP could seek a fresh mandate for a referendum via the next Holyrood election.     They could campaign on a clear 'back us or sack us' ticket.      At the moment that would still likely be rebuffed by the Tories.      There is no understanding of the democratic independence roadmap in the Tory party.     Their philosophy is that the choice of independence should not be devolved to the Scottish people and the devolved parliament.     Democracy denial.    Authoritarianism.     Overlordship.

[Victorian]

4 minutes ago, dobmisterdobster said:

Two reasons.

1. Lib Dems rely on soft Tory voters in places like Outer London who won't be pleased if they put JC in power.
2. Lib Dems have gained a lot of voters from Labour by painting JC as a closet brexiteer. Working with him would kill that narrative and their momentum in the polls. They want to scapegoat JC and Labour as enabling a Tory not deal brexit.

 

She isn't anywhere near clever enough to pull off the act.    People will see straight through the evasive interview with Krishnan Guru Murthy on C4.    She had no credible argument for her bogus premise.

[kila]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

If you are old enough to be retired you know that people from the UK travelled, studied, worked and retired in Europe long before we joined the EU. Indeed long before the EU existed. As now it was always a small and largely privileged minority who did so.

As for your friend and  former work colleague leaving the UK because of Brexit … there is absolutely no reason why she and her husband have to leave because of Brexit. Since the leave vote the number of EU citizens living in the UK has increased by 100,000. I suspect if and when we leave it will continue to increase.

 

How about their rights being diminished? Having to pay to use the NHS despite paying tax to help fund it, ineligible to vote in local elections etc.

 

 

[SE16 3LN]

6 hours ago, jumpship said:

You are wrong. 

 

Scottish Internationalist V's British Isolationist....

Delusional nonsense. While your eyes were closed the internationalists realised that the EU was a German recession away from basket case. Edinburgh moans about a few tourists for a month in the summer. Internationalist,  really 

[Don Dan]

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/german-economy-tanking-headed-for-recession-us-china-trade-war-2019-8-1028446393

 

this may focus the minds a bit more.

[Francis Albert]

51 minutes ago, kila said:

 

How about their rights being diminished? Having to pay to use the NHS despite paying tax to help fund it, ineligible to vote in local elections etc.

 

 

I hadn't heard that uk residents paying UK tax post Brexit would be denied access to the NHS. Source? As for not being eligible to vote in local elections ... again I don't know if so nor the the source but would it really drive you out of the country?

[Francis Albert]

45 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/german-economy-tanking-headed-for-recession-us-china-trade-war-2019-8-1028446393

 

this may focus the minds a bit more.

When I read this the other day it struck me as quite incredible that the future health  of the whole EU economy should be driven by the threat of terrorists to bomb number plate recognition cameras on the Northern Ireland border, the presence of which or indeed any border controls would simply not breach the terms of the Good Friday Agreement. 

 

Edited August 15, 2019 by Francis Albert

[RobboM]

2 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

If you are old enough to be retired you know that people from the UK travelled, studied, worked and retired in Europe long before we joined the EU. Indeed long before the EU existed. As now it was always a small and largely privileged minority who did so.

 

Straw man 1
I did not say that travel, work, study etc never happened. My point was the EU guaranteed this to you and I as a right.
 

Quote

As for your friend and  former work colleague leaving the UK because of Brexit … there is absolutely no reason why she and her husband have to leave because of Brexit. Since the leave vote the number of EU citizens living in the UK has increased by 100,000. I suspect if and when we leave it will continue to increase.

 

Straw man 2

I did not say they have to leave.

 

Does it not give you some pause for thought though? A couple who have been here the best part of 15 years, had every intention of continuing their life here, had contributed taxes and through their work, were denied a vote on a matter of fundamental importance to their life here, that they feel so unwelcome in a Brexit Britain that they would leave the country?

[Francis Albert]

4 minutes ago, RobboM said:

Straw man 1
I did not say that travel, work, study etc never happened. My point was the EU guaranteed this to you and I as a right.
 

 

Straw man 2

I did not say they have to leave.

 

Does it not give you some pause for thought though? A couple who have been here the best part of 15 years, had every intention of continuing their life here, had contributed taxes and through their work, were denied a vote on a matter of fundamental importance to their life here, that they feel so unwelcome in a Brexit Britain that they would leave the country?

Straw man one - a right with conditions and a right like owning a Rolls Royce which in practice is restricted to a privileged few.

Straw man two - 100,000 since the leave vote have felt welcome enough to come. Despite the leave vote.

[RobboM]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Straw man one - a right with conditions and a right like owning a Rolls Royce which in practice is restricted to a privileged few.

Straw man two - 100,000 since the leave vote have felt welcome enough to come. Despite the leave vote.

I don't know anyone who owns a Rolls Royce but know lots of people who have lived, worked or studied across the EU.
How about you Francis? More Rolls Royces? Or Nil-Nil ? 😉

[Francis Albert]

4 minutes ago, RobboM said:

I don't know anyone who owns a Rolls Royce but know lots of people who have lived, worked or studied across the EU.
How about you Francis? More Rolls Royces? Or Nil-Nil ? 😉

The Rolls Royce thing was obviously 

... well I am not sure what you call it 

... an analogy? But I did know one once ..

A bit of a shit.

[jake]

4 hours ago, RobboM said:

A campaign based on a promise of £350m a week for the NHS
A campaign based on the promise of "Take back control"

Orwellian?

😁

He shoots he scores.

Well played Robbo

[SE16 3LN]

12 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/german-economy-tanking-headed-for-recession-us-china-trade-war-2019-8-1028446393

 

this may focus the minds a bit more.

No it won't. Remainers will simply put their fingers in the ears and chant over and over EU good, UK bad, EU good UK bad in true Orwellian style. It beggars belief how people can justify the asset stripping of Greece, the arms sales to Lithuania and the demographic destruction of Bulgaria, yet argue that leavers are deluded racists...but they do.

[Don Dan]

10 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

No it won't. Remainers will simply put their fingers in the ears and chant over and over EU good, UK bad, EU good UK bad in true Orwellian style. It beggars belief how people can justify the asset stripping of Greece, the arms sales to Lithuania and the demographic destruction of Bulgaria, yet argue that leavers are deluded racists...but they do.

 

It should though. Discerning analysts need to look deeper than the superficial hyperbole that fills the headlines. Virgin Trains just lost out to an Italian company First Trenitalia (an Italian Government owned railway) to run the very lucrative West Coast line till 2031 which also include HS2. The question is in reality is or will Brexit happen.  Add in although not an EU country yet but a Turkish Military Pension Fund has just bought British Steel.

I suspect Brexit won’t happen.  

[Justin Z]

1 hour ago, SE16 3LN said:

No it won't. Remainers will simply put their fingers in the ears and chant over and over EU good, UK bad, EU good UK bad in true Orwellian style. It beggars belief how people can justify the asset stripping of Greece, the arms sales to Lithuania and the demographic destruction of Bulgaria, yet argue that leavers are deluded racists...but they do.

 

You may find this difficult to grasp, but it's possible for human beings to hold more than one thought in their head at the same time.

[jake]

20 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

You may find this difficult to grasp, but it's possible for human beings to hold more than one thought in their head at the same time.

That's impossible.

 

You may hold several trains of though closely together.

But its physically impossible for two simultaneous thoughts to occur in your brain.

 

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by jake

[Justin Z]

9 minutes ago, jake said:

That's impossible.

 

You may hold several trains of though closely together.

But its physically impossible for two simultaneous thoughts to occur in your brain.

 

Not like you to split hairs so finely. Got that Friday feeling?

[jake]

7 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

Not like you to split hairs so finely. Got that Friday feeling?

I'm just being my usual forensic self .

........

........

😁

[Unknown user]

11 minutes ago, jake said:

That's impossible.

 

You may hold several trains of though closely together.

But its physically impossible for two simultaneous thoughts to occur in your brain.

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

[Justin Z]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

 

 

. . .

 

You've just changed my life, Smithee

[jambo89]

6 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

 

Coffee flavoured tits? 

 

Ive just had a business idea.

 

anyone want in? 

[Boris]

13 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

Coffee flavoured tits? 

 

Ive just had a business idea.

 

anyone want in? 

 

Just add the coffee...

 

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, Boris said:

 

Just add the coffee...

 

 

I saw a clip of Frankie Boyle yesterday, he normally tries a bit too hard to offend for me, but when he said Farage looks like a frog trying to escape from a scrotum I nearly sprayed my tittycoffee everywhere. 

[Boris]

1 minute ago, Smithee said:

 

I saw a clip of Frankie Boyle yesterday, he normally tries a bit too hard to offend for me, but when he said Farage looks like a frog trying to escape from a scrotum I nearly sprayed my tittycoffee everywhere. 

 

[jake]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

I'm lost for an answer on this mate.

😃

[Unknown user]

26 minutes ago, jake said:

I'm lost for an answer on this mate.

😃

 

Honestly, what do the rest of you contemplate while savouring your morning brew?

[Boof]

7 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Honestly, what do the rest of you contemplate while savouring your morning brew?

 

More of a tea man, meself...but I'm willing to have a go at thinking about titteas  

[dobmisterdobster]

3 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

It should though. Discerning analysts need to look deeper than the superficial hyperbole that fills the headlines. Virgin Trains just lost out to an Italian company First Trenitalia (an Italian Government owned railway) to run the very lucrative West Coast line till 2031 which also include HS2. The question is in reality is or will Brexit happen.  Add in although not an EU country yet but a Turkish Military Pension Fund has just bought British Steel.

I suspect Brexit won’t happen.  

FirstGroup is Scottish. Its a consortium between them and Trenitalia. They won the contract because they put in the best bid supposedly.

Won't make much difference to passengers and bugger all to do with brexit.

[jake]

2 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

Just to be clear.

 

Coffee and Tits are two separate things.

The word "and "proves this.

 

😎

 

[jake]

1 hour ago, Boris said:

 

Just add the coffee...

 

Although this may disprove my last post

[ri Alban]

2 hours ago, jake said:

I'm just being my usual forensic self .

........

........

😁

Must be why criminals are happy, if you're the investigator. 

 

 

 

[ri Alban]

2 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

Bollocks, right now I'm thinking about tits AND coffee

2 cups to start the day.

[RobboM]

2 hours ago, jambo89 said:

 

Coffee flavoured tits? 

 

Ive just had a business idea.

 

anyone want in? 

229 pages of bickering over Brexit and finally someone has a post everyone can get behind

..... except for Jake 😉

 

[Justin Z]

4 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

D cups to start the day.

 

Fixed

[Unknown user]

14 minutes ago, jake said:

Just to be clear.

 

Coffee and Tits are two separate things.

The word "and "proves this.

 

😎

 

 

Three, really

[jake]

5 minutes ago, RobboM said:

229 pages of bickering over Brexit and finally someone has a post everyone can get behind

..... except for Jake 😉

 

🤣 

Two nil to Robbo

[jake]

1 minute ago, Smithee said:

 

Three, really

Ffs Smithee.

🙂

[jake]

12 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Must be why criminals are happy, if you're the investigator. 

 

 

 

Anarchy mate 

[RobboM]

6 minutes ago, jake said:

🤣

Two nil to Robbo

 

[Don Dan]

34 minutes ago, dobmisterdobster said:

FirstGroup is Scottish. Its a consortium between them and Trenitalia. They won the contract because they put in the best bid supposedly.

Won't make much difference to passengers and bugger all to do with brexit.

 

My point is we are still working with the Europeans despite the mad push to tell them to bolt. 

[Francis Albert]

46 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

My point is we are still working with the Europeans despite the mad push to tell them to bolt. 

Who is telling the Europeans to bolt? Doesn't the First Group/Trenitalia consortium show that despite the Brexit scares European and UK companies will continue to work together and invest respectively in the UK and Europe.

 

The UK and USA both invest heavily in each others industries and always have. We are not a part of an economic and political union with the USA.

[Don Dan]

Just now, Francis Albert said:

Who is telling the Europeans to bolt? Doesn't the First Group/Trenitalia consortium show that despite the Brexit scares European and UK companies will continue to work together and invest respectively in the UK and Europe.

 

The UK and USA both invest heavily in each others industries and always have. We are not a part of an economic and political union with the USA.

 

You are correct Francis. That’s the irony of Brexit. We don’t want you but please help run our railways. 

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

You are correct Francis. That’s the irony of Brexit. We don’t want you but please help run our railways. 

Who says "we don't want you"?

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

4 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

You are correct Francis. That’s the irony of Brexit. We don’t want you but please help run our railways. 

They're also a nationalised train Company, Trenitalia. Our's isn't. Sad. 

[Mikey1874]

19 hours ago, Victorian said:

Tory snakes accusing Labour of a grubby tactic to woo the SNP with suggestions of allowing indyref2.    Selling out the union to grab power,  blah blah.     Howls of Scotland breaking away as the cost of Corbyn's premiership.

 

Ehhh... if Scotland gets indyref2 and votes to become independent,     that's ****ing democracy in action.     A choice put in front of the people and a verdict arrived at.    Through a valid democratic process.     If Scotland doesn't want indyref2 or independence then a remain vote will result.

 

Tory reptiles... anti-democratic fascists.

 

Yeah

 

Number 1 Tory reptile being Jo Swinson

 

The 'stop Brexit' grand coalition hasn't really got going because likes of Jo Swinson don't seem to want to deal with the Labour front bench. See also Caroline Lucas' moderate white woman's Cabinet. 

 

Anyway see what happens.