Boris Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 41 minutes ago, JackLadd said: Why should I allow somebody that can't buy a drink or watch a film with swearing an equal say in a once in a generation decision? 16 year old leave school, work and pay tax. No taxation without representation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackLadd Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Boris said: 16 year old leave school, work and pay tax. No taxation without representation! Pay tax my bahookie. What 16 y/o earns over £11,850? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 4 hours ago, JamboX2 said: Wales was not really a unified nation though. It was a set of warring clans and princes under a high king. It was never comparable to a unified state like Scotland. It is regardless of that now a country. There was never a Germany before 1870. It was a different grouping of small states all independent. A unified India barely existed before empire. Again a variety of kingdoms. The fact something was or was not once independent doesn't make a country a country. Yeah Wales is a funny one to be fair, but they do have a distinct culture and language history, and were ruled seperately as a principality, albeit a vassal state. I don't get what point you're making with Germany and India though, they're nothing like the same. When they became sovereign states they became countries, no matter what they were before. That's the other definition of a country- a sovereign state. If northern Ireland had become a sovereign state it would also undoubtedly be a country, but it has no language, cultural or political history of its own and has never been a sovereign state. Like I said, it's debatable, and let's be honest, the debate isn't that interesting! But I'd say Wales is and NI isn't myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Murray Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 9 hours ago, Hasselhoff said: In other news, anyone see Sturgeon's channel 4 interview? https://mobile.twitter.com/channel4news/status/1005087122246782976. This is the only thing that matters to her, how could she not have the numbers in her head? She wanted to avoid the question but luckily this new channel 4 Scotland correspondent isn't like usual journalists like Brian Taylor or Andrew Marr and actually asks difficult questions. Say what you want about Alec Salmond, and many do, but he would never have been caught out like that. When your whole political life has been about independence, and you have recently commissioned a two years in the making report regarding Independence, surely you would expect to have a rough idea of the start up cost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 29 minutes ago, Adam Murray said: Say what you want about Alec Salmond, and many do, but he would never have been caught out like that. When your whole political life has been about independence, and you have recently commissioned a two years in the making report regarding Independence, surely you would expect to have a rough idea of the start up cost? Fair point, although if you don't know what is coming in via your share of assets, it's hard to say what something is going to cost. I. E. Those assets could pay for set up costs or at least contribute to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pablo Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 39 minutes ago, Adam Murray said: When your whole political life has been about independence, and you have recently commissioned a two years in the making report regarding Independence, surely you would expect to have a rough idea of the start up cost? She knows that the realities of the report's findings aren't exactly a vote winner, or likely to persuade more to the YES side. That's why she sat on it for so long and attempted to make it's release as low key as possible. She'll be desperate for this to go away and get back to pointing her finger at Westminster for anything and everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 That was a bit embarrassing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Murray Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Boris said: Fair point, although if you don't know what is coming in via your share of assets, it's hard to say what something is going to cost. I. E. Those assets could pay for set up costs or at least contribute to them. Tend to disagree with that Boris, if they can claim, in the report, that Scotland could emulate the best performing economies in the world, and generate an extra £4100 per person, then they surely must have, and by they I mean the people at the head of the SNP, a rough idea of the start up cost of an Independent Scotland. It's all very '£350 million to the NHS' to me, happy to engage on the possible plus side, but not so much on the possible negatives it may bring, which I suppose is MP's, of all parties, to a tee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpship Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 12 hours ago, Doogz said: Or alternatively: Those who care about the potential negative consequences of independence and want to make an informed decision to guarantee the best future for themselves, their families & country as a whole. Those who are so focused on arbitrary political/geographical boundaries that they'll ignore the facts and figures, refuse to openly debate issues and attempt to belittle anyone who doesn't share their "vision". Or.. It's people from Scotland that don't want to be ruled by those who think is OK to start wars on lies, sell arms to everyone and anyone, facilitating mass murder around the world.. And those who pretend it doesn't happen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 hour ago, jumpship said: Or.. It's people from Scotland that don't want to be ruled by those who think is OK to start wars on lies, sell arms to everyone and anyone, facilitating mass murder around the world.. And those who pretend it doesn't happen... Or ..... Those that focus on anything negative and blame Westminster for it all while happily ignoring all the positive things they've also been part of... and can't accept that the Scottish politicians are just as capable of lying etc. And those capable of analysis of facts to come up with a more balanced, rational view of the world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 As I understand it: 1. Scotland is a country 2. England is a country 3. Wales is a Principality 4. Northern Ireland is a Province Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: As I understand it: 1. Scotland is a country 2. England is a country 3. Wales is a Principality 4. Northern Ireland is a Province Wales isn't a principality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 Just now, Smithee said: Wales isn't a principality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Does he rule Wales? Why don't you have a read of the last couple of pages and try and educate yourself .... Once you've done that those questions are still waiting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpship Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 57 minutes ago, Doogz said: Or ..... Those that focus on anything negative and blame Westminster for it all while happily ignoring all the positive things they've also been part of... and can't accept that the Scottish politicians are just as capable of lying etc. And those capable of analysis of facts to come up with a more balanced, rational view of the world! Deaths of 100S of 1000s is just negative talk. And anyway, we gave India Roads... starved the population of India to do it, but they still got roads. Is that better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, Doogz said: Does he rule Wales? Why don't you have a read of the last couple of pages and try and educate yourself .... Once you've done that those questions are still waiting! "Does he rule Wales" Bless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, jumpship said: Deaths of 100S of 1000s is just negative talk. And anyway, we gave India Roads... starved the population of India to do it, but they still got roads. Is that better? Not really, but about as good as it gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 10 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Wales still isn't a principality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: "Does he rule Wales" Bless. Sorry, it appears I accidentally asked you a question. Quick, avoid answering it or you may end up looking stupid..... Oops, too late! Bless! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Smithee said: Wales still isn't a principality I'm sure the Welsh nationalists will agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpship Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, Doogz said: Not really, but about as good as it gets. In truth mate, I really do fine it hard to understand anyone's pride of the British empire.. http://listverse.com/2014/02/04/10-evil-crimes-of-the-british-empire/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Doogz said: Sorry, it appears I accidentally asked you a question. Quick, avoid answering it or you may end up looking stupid..... Oops, too late! Bless! ? You are getting over excited Doogz, you only made a statement last post but one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said: I'm sure the Welsh nationalists will agree. Do you even know what a principality is? You could always check on google? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said: You are getting over excited Doogz, you only made a statement last post but one. Think you'll find "Does he rule Wales?" is a question.... The question mark ie ? is a clue! Bless! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Doogz said: Do you even know what a principality is? You could always check on google? I thought you were on this thread to find out about the economics of an independent Scotland? You're just clogging it up with mindless drivel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: I'm sure the Welsh nationalists will agree. It doesn't matter, by the definition of the word Wales isn't a principality. As I know you're not thick as **** and given your predilection for a noise up, I'll just leave it there as you already know this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said: I thought you were on this thread to find out about the economics of an independent Scotland? You're just clogging it up with mindless drivel. Oh but Spacey I do so enjoy our little chats - my favourite bit is your complete inability to answer any questions ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Smithee said: It doesn't matter, by the definition of the word Wales isn't a principality. As I know you're not thick as **** and given your predilection for a noise up, I'll just leave it there as you already know this. I only gave you my understanding of the 4 constituent parts that make up the current UK. I don't think there was much wrong in what I said. Why would it say GB and NI then on certain official docs etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Doogz said: Oh but Spacey I do so enjoy our little chats - my favourite bit is your complete inability to answer any questions ? I have given 3 good pieces of info for you to read and make up your own mind, all FOC too. Did you watch the SNP conference today and what NS said in her closing speech? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 17 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: You're just clogging it up with mindless drivel. Seriously? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said: I have given 3 good pieces of info for you to read and make up your own mind, all FOC too. Do they answer my questions - nope. You accuse me of clogging up the board with mindless drivel yet you ask me a question but don't even have the common decency to clarify it or answer a reciprocal question. I'm happy to engage in debate with anyone and have them try to inform me about things I may not understand. I'm also quite happy to call you out on the nonsense you post and your lack of ability to enter into a discussion on a subject you're supposedly passionate about. 1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said: Did you watch the SNP conference today and what NS said in her closing speech? No, was it anything interesting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 1 minute ago, Doogz said: Do they answer my questions - nope. You accuse me of clogging up the board with mindless drivel yet you ask me a question but don't even have the common decency to clarify it or answer a reciprocal question. I'm happy to engage in debate with anyone and have them try to inform me about things I may not understand. I'm also quite happy to call you out on the nonsense you post and your lack of ability to enter into a discussion on a subject you're supposedly passionate about. No, was it anything interesting? I really don't have the time to educate you Doogz on everything you do not understand. Good luck though on your endeavours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: I really don't have the time to educate you Doogz on everything you do not understand. Good luck though on your endeavours. I can at least understand Wales is a country not a Principality (the clue is it's not ruled by a Prince). I also understand why it would be difficult for you to find the time to educate me but I hope you do at least find some time to attempt to educate yourself though.... I'll be just fine without your help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 7 minutes ago, Doogz said: I can at least understand Wales is a country not a Principality (the clue is it's not ruled by a Prince). I also understand why it would be difficult for you to find the time to educate me but I hope you do at least find some time to attempt to educate yourself though.... I'll be just fine without your help? I'm pretty well educated Doogz, thanks all the same pal. I got 7 O levels and Higher mafs too. N.B stay away from reading Effie Deans blogs that Trapper posted. Twitter banned her/his/it shite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 6 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: I'm pretty well educated Doogz, thanks all the same pal. I got 7 O levels and Higher mafs too. N.B stay away from reading Effie Deans blogs that Trapper posted. Twitter banned her/his/it shite. "O levels" - that surprises me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Doogz said: "O levels" - that surprises me! Here you go mate. NHS workers get 3% pay increase as of next month. You might needthem when your head explodes. http://www.thenational.scot/news/16280545.READ__Nicola_Sturgeon_s_full_speech_at_SNP_conference/ Edited June 9, 2018 by Space Mackerel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pans Jambo Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 9 hours ago, JackLadd said: Why should I allow somebody that can't buy a drink or watch a film with swearing an equal say in a once in a generation decision? Get out the Tory Scotland HQ & get a life bud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 15 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Here you go mate. NHS workers get 3% pay increase as of next month. You might needthem when your head explodes. http://www.thenational.scot/news/16280545.READ__Nicola_Sturgeon_s_full_speech_at_SNP_conference/ Doesn't appear to have anything to do with your slightly unusual combination of O levels and a higher & doesn't answer any of the earlier questions either - the shock of you trying to change the subject couldn't give me indigestion never mind make my head explode! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 7 minutes ago, Doogz said: Doesn't appear to have anything to do with your slightly unusual combination of O levels and a higher & doesn't answer any of the earlier questions either - the shock of you trying to change the subject couldn't give me indigestion never mind make my head explode! Decent pay rise for the NHS staff though, that might entice people from down South to come up here and improve public services? Cost of living is cheaper up here so win win for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 9 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Decent pay rise for the NHS staff though, that might entice people from down South to come up here and improve public services? Cost of living is cheaper up here so win win for them? There you go asking questions again when you still have so many to answer. Can't see many moving here while the uncertainty of independence continues. Taxes are also higher here. Cost of living may be less but it would very much depend where they were moving from/to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 5 minutes ago, Doogz said: There you go asking questions again when you still have so many to answer. Can't see many moving here while the uncertainty of independence continues. Taxes are also higher here. Cost of living may be less but it would very much depend where they were moving from/to. I see what you mean Doogz, we have to Sure and Stable Brexit process that’s going swimmingly to plan so far. ? Taxes are slightly higher for me as I am in the higher tax bracket, I don’t mind the extra few quid, I think a more progressive tax system where the more affluent pay a wee bit more is a good thing, majority of core workers are actually better off though. I employ some of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: I see what you mean Doogz, we have to Sure and Stable Brexit process that’s going swimmingly to plan so far. ? Don't disagree with your assessment of Brexit - but still not sure why you're smiling about it going badly. Also, having seen what a shambles Brexit is I have any less desire to go through an even bigger change of Indy. 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Taxes are slightly higher for me as I am in the higher tax bracket, I don’t mind the extra few quid, I think a more progressive tax system where the more affluent pay a wee bit more is a good thing, majority of core workers are actually better off though. I employ some of them. Again agree, I think those that can afford it should pay more (the same thing happens in England too!). My point was that the higher tax rate may make people less likely to want to move here. So anyway- how did you end up doing O levels and a Higher? It's not even related to Indy so you can surely answer this question ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 14 minutes ago, Doogz said: Don't disagree with your assessment of Brexit - but still not sure why you're smiling about it going badly. Also, having seen what a shambles Brexit is I have any less desire to go through an even bigger change of Indy. Again agree, I think those that can afford it should pay more (the same thing happens in England too!). My point was that the higher tax rate may make people less likely to want to move here. So anyway- how did you end up doing O levels and a Higher? It's not even related to Indy so you can surely answer this question ? Same thing happens in England with regards to higher earners and tax? You sure? I thought the SG never passed on the tax codes that Westminster passed down South? https://inews.co.uk/news/scotland/scotland-income-tax-rates-different-from-england/ I ended up doing O grades and Highers because I went to school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trapper John McIntyre Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 2 hours ago, Space Mackerel said: I'm pretty well educated Doogz, thanks all the same pal. I got 7 O levels and Higher mafs too. N.B stay away from reading Effie Deans blogs that Trapper posted. Twitter banned her/his/it shite. Twitter didn't try to ban her. Her blog was hacked by Gnat nutters who tried to close her down. They failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 3 hours ago, jumpship said: Deaths of 100S of 1000s is just negative talk. And anyway, we gave India Roads... starved the population of India to do it, but they still got roads. Is that better? And railways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 3 hours ago, jumpship said: In truth mate, I really do fine it hard to understand anyone's pride of the British empire.. http://listverse.com/2014/02/04/10-evil-crimes-of-the-british-empire/ I don't. It's a dog-eat-dog world and our chaps ate their fill. The comfortable lives many of us have lived is in large part a consequence of this. Good on 'em, I say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 3 hours ago, Doogz said: Do you even know what a principality is? You could always check on google? The fish doesn't do google, mate. It's to full of nonsense apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pans Jambo Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 NHS payrise this month of 3% pa up to £80k. Get on with the day job though eh!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Trapper John McIntyre said: Twitter didn't try to ban her. Her blog was hacked by Gnat nutters who tried to close her down. They failed. “Hacked by Gnat nutters” Glad I’m not a conspiracy theorist. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpship Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 3 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said: I don't. It's a dog-eat-dog world and our chaps ate their fill. The comfortable lives many of us have lived is in large part a consequence of this. Good on 'em, I say. You cant beat a good bit of whataboutery to ease the conscience. Old firm fans are very good at that as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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