jake Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I honestly have no idea what you are on about. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Alphonse. I was trying to say life and wellbeing is measured by more than oil reserve currency Etc etc. Its a joke . Sorry im on the downturn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 The question for me is...if this came from the SNP's own 'growth commission' and it is accurate then why not bury it but instead announce it? Something in it's timing. Nicola is up to something. No way would she knowingly release anything negative unless it suits her plans. Because the full report hasn't been released yet. However, Andrew Wilson (ex-SNP MSP) who is chairing it has long said the SNP policy here has been bogus. He is also going to report (and its leaking) that the growth strategy and economic plan put forward in 2014 was absolutely atrocious. All based on sky high oil prices which collapsed and an economic agenda which would've been poor. I'd expect a much more austere campaign from the SNP next time out. It'll be played to the heart not the mind. And importantly it'll attack Brexit. In short, this campaign will be much more centre-right leaning in sound than the last one. It may also explain why Swinney was ditched from Finance for Education. Shunt him into a pet project (albeit a hard brief given recent reports on falling standards and teaching numbers) and off the economy where he ballsed up with Eck in 2014. No, this campaign will be centred around Sturgeon, Robertson, Joanna Cherry, Derek MacKay and one or two SNP MPs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 The top video is what you want to watch, unless the BRITISH BC changed the link, John Swinney putting Kezia on toast. Kezia went with the wrong questions (Education would've been better given the SNP lost a vote on it this week and he's Education Minister) however Swinney answred 0 questions and looked unhinged. Are the SNP on Scotland's side with falling education standards and increasingly fragile situations in health? I'm not interested in Scotland. I'm concerned for its people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Because the full report hasn't been released yet. However, Andrew Wilson (ex-SNP MSP) who is chairing it has long said the SNP policy here has been bogus. He is also going to report (and its leaking) that the growth strategy and economic plan put forward in 2014 was absolutely atrocious. All based on sky high oil prices which collapsed and an economic agenda which would've been poor. I'd expect a much more austere campaign from the SNP next time out. It'll be played to the heart not the mind. And importantly it'll attack Brexit. In short, this campaign will be much more centre-right leaning in sound than the last one. It may also explain why Swinney was ditched from Finance for Education. Shunt him into a pet project (albeit a hard brief given recent reports on falling standards and teaching numbers) and off the economy where he ballsed up with Eck in 2014. No, this campaign will be centred around Sturgeon, Robertson, Joanna Cherry, Derek MacKay and one or two SNP MPs. There is logic in this. The economic argument is flimsy and they have already said they won't use oil as a revenue basis next time round. Agreed Brexit will be the focus but their problem will be convincing voters that Scotland will get a free pass back into the EU. That is far from as certain as some think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnold Rothstein Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Sort of right about this time. [emoji2] So 50% of those who voted? Not even close to being the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 So 50% of those who voted? Not even close to being the same thing. You think whatever you want sunshine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnold Rothstein Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 You think whatever you want sunshine. Them's the facts spaceface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 You think whatever you want sunshine. No. You are. Given 72% of the population constitute the electorate and the number who vote is never 100% of the electorate it cannot be said 50% of Scotland voted SNP. 50% of the voting electorate did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Them's the facts spaceface. No. You are. Given 72% of the population constitute the electorate and the number who vote is never 100% of the electorate it cannot be said 50% of Scotland voted SNP. 50% of the voting electorate did. Kids these days...everything on a plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 50% of the voting electorate is massive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 (edited) 50% of the voting electorate is massive! It's game over. Only hope is the postal vote fiddling. Empire v2.0 is finished. Like Rangers FC. Edited March 10, 2017 by Space Mackerel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Every house in the U.K. is ?62,000 in debt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Every house in the U.K. is ?62,000 in debt. Nae bother al work a sayterday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Nae bother al work a sayterday Better get the overtime sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Space makeral. Silhouette and shadows Its no game. barry tune . Money is wprthless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Alphonse. I was trying to say life and wellbeing is measured by more than oil reserve currency Etc etc. Its a joke . Sorry im on the downturn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Every house in the U.K. is ?62,000 in debt. Mine isn't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 No its a report of something negative from the guardian regarding brexit. Boris you seem clued up. Its a ###### joke the way the so called left protect an organistion thats so anti working class. But the Guardian didn't write it! They merley reported what someone else has opined. Had the Express or Mail printed it, the report would have been the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 No. You are. Given 72% of the population constitute the electorate and the number who vote is never 100% of the electorate it cannot be said 50% of Scotland voted SNP. 50% of the voting electorate did. But it's votes that count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo lodge Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 But it's votes that count. Except in the 2013 referendum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo lodge Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Except in the 2013 referendum. Should read 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Except in the 2013 referendum. Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Kezia went with the wrong questions (Education would've been better given the SNP lost a vote on it this week and he's Education Minister) however Swinney answred 0 questions and looked unhinged. Are the SNP on Scotland's side with falling education standards and increasingly fragile situations in health? I'm not interested in Scotland. I'm concerned for its people. You have a point, but perhaps these would be better addressed in an independent Scotland? The electorate seem to think that the SNP are doing alright, given the figures in the STV local election poll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 You have a point, but perhaps these would be better addressed in an independent Scotland? The electorate seem to think that the SNP are doing alright, given the figures in the STV local election poll. But is that not their problem? If they are doing well for Scotland under the current arrangement then why vote for Indy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Except in the 2013 referendum. Should read 2014 Exactly. So that was it, never to be discussed again? Sorry, a throwaway line about once in a generation... If you were around in 1939 you must have been raging at Chamberlain. "But you said Peace in our time!!!" Things change (Materially!) and so too does politics. As it happens, if there is another referendum I think No will win again. Margin may be tighter, but still doubt Yes will win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 But is that not their problem? If they are doing well for Scotland under the current arrangement then why vote for Indy? Because they feel they could maybe do even better as an independent nation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 So that was it, never to be discussed again? Sorry, a throwaway line about once in a generation.. Yep, that's the one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Yep, that's the one. But then elected on a promise if material change. And we now have material change. As I've posted before, without Brexit there would be no 2nd indy ref. The Conservative and Unionist Party, in an attempt to sort out their own party failings, have gambled the country's future. How ironic that they may be responsible for the breakup of the Union. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Because they feel they could maybe do even better as an independent nation? On what basis? I explain the difference I voting percentage between the elections and Ref as those peeps, like me, who are happy to have SNP to represent them in Westminster but not therefore requiring Independence. The one doesn't necessarily justify the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 But then elected on a promise if material change. And we now have material change. As I've posted before, without Brexit there would be no 2nd indy ref. The Conservative and Unionist Party, in an attempt to sort out their own party failings, have gambled the country's future. How ironic that they may be responsible for the breakup of the Union. Exactly. DC rolled the dice one too many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 So that was it, never to be discussed again? Sorry, a throwaway line about once in a generation... If you were around in 1939 you must have been raging at Chamberlain. "But you said Peace in our time!!!" Things change (Materially!) and so too does politics. As it happens, if there is another referendum I think No will win again. Margin may be tighter, but still doubt Yes will win. It wasn't a throwaway line though. It was repeated over and over again so often thatvnow there's a YouTube video of it. It was a key part of SNPs campaign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 On what basis? I explain the difference I voting percentage between the elections and Ref as those peeps, like me, who are happy to have SNP to represent them in Westminster but not therefore requiring Independence. The one doesn't necessarily justify the other. I'm not saying that it does. Conversely there will those who vote SNP because they want independence, or people like myself who would vote YES but have voted Labour at recent elections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 It wasn't a throwaway line though. It was repeated over and over again so often thatvnow there's a YouTube video of it. It was a key part of SNPs campaign. Converse project fear - this is the only chance you'll get so carpe diem people. Oh but wait, Cameron has served up round two on a plate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 It's interesting hearing the (correct) assassination of the last white paper for the 2014 referendum, as this somehow holds any substance for a future ref. Personally, I'll make my vote based on the arguments put forward if/when the next ref is called. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Yep, that's the one. It was Salmond that said it and not Sturgeon. But regardless, when did this become a country where one person could dictate to the rest of us? If I want independence then I won't shut up about it because Salmond deemed it so. It's my life, my freedom and rights to demand whatever I want when I want, not a politician. I might never get it but that's different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 It's interesting hearing the (correct) assassination of the last white paper for the 2014 referendum, as this somehow holds any substance for a future ref. Personally, I'll make my vote based on the arguments put forward if/when the next ref is called. There's hope for you yet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 If you were around in 1939 you must have been raging at Chamberlain. "But you said Peace in our time!!!" That's another one of those commonly misquoted lines - it was actually "peace for our time" - and I think the majority of people were raging at Chamberlain. However, I do think there is too much focus on the 'once in a generation' comment although it is understandable that people want to move on from the neverendum situation we've pretty much been in since 2014 : if they go ahead with another referendum in 2018 they should give clearer detail on when or under what conditions any future referendum will take place, should that vote fail. To be honest, I'm not convinced the SNP really want the vote in 2018 - previously we were told they wanted to see Pro-indy at 60% in the polls before they would want another vote. I think they're trying to force May to delay it until after Brexit so they have something else to blame WM for. But then elected on a promise if material change. And we now have material change. As I've posted before, without Brexit there would be no 2nd indy ref. The Conservative and Unionist Party, in an attempt to sort out their own party failings, have gambled the country's future. How ironic that they may be responsible for the breakup of the Union. For me, we don't have material change until Brexit is completed and more sensible approach for Scotland would be to see where we are post-Brexit so we can make a more informed decision about how the country should move forward then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deesidejambo Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 That's another one of those commonly misquoted lines - it was actually "peace for our time" - and I think the majority of people were raging at Chamberlain. However, I do think there is too much focus on the 'once in a generation' comment although it is understandable that people want to move on from the neverendum situation we've pretty much been in since 2014 : if they go ahead with another referendum in 2018 they should give clearer detail on when or under what conditions any future referendum will take place, should that vote fail. To be honest, I'm not convinced the SNP really want the vote in 2018 - previously we were told they wanted to see Pro-indy at 60% in the polls before they would want another vote. I think they're trying to force May to delay it until after Brexit so they have something else to blame WM for. For me, we don't have material change until Brexit is completed and more sensible approach for Scotland would be to see where we are post-Brexit so we can make a more informed decision about how the country should move forward then. This is correct but they seem to kept on about Autumn 2018 so they will be under pressure from the dafties to deliver on that. The smarter Nats will know it's better to shut up till they get to 60% but the horse has bolted bow they set a date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 For me, we don't have material change until Brexit is completed and more sensible approach for Scotland would be to see where we are post-Brexit so we can make a more informed decision about how the country should move forward then. This is correct but they seem to kept on about Autumn 2018 so they will be under pressure from the dafties to deliver on that. The smarter Nats will know it's better to shut up till they get to 60% but the horse has bolted bow they set a date. Is the premise not that by Autumn 2018 we will have a fair idea of what the Brexit settlement will look like, given it wil be 18 months down the lin eout of the 2 year exit period? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 It was Salmond that said it and not Sturgeon. But regardless, when did this become a country where one person could dictate to the rest of us? If I want independence then I won't shut up about it because Salmond deemed it so. It's my life, my freedom and rights to demand whatever I want when I want, not a politician. I might never get it but that's different. It was just one of the lies spouted by both sides in the run up to the referendum, used to lull people into a false security that this would be it for another 30 or so years, through away remark my arse, a calculated statement. You're rights to fight for independence is something I'd never want to inhibit, just as the right for people to fight to remain as part of the union should also be equally respected. I'm sure I've seen Nicola Sturgeon say that it should also be a "once in a generation" vote also? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Is the premise not that by Autumn 2018 we will have a fair idea of what the Brexit settlement will look like, given it wil be 18 months down the lin eout of the 2 year exit period? The way Brexit has been handled so far I'm not convinced we'll have a clear idea of the impacts until well after negotiations are completed. We've been told 2 years but it could take longer ..... and everything so far has taken longer than expected. I wouldn't be surprised if the process is impacted by the elections this year in France, Netherlands & Germany - never mind the calls for 2nd vote here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 It was just one of the lies spouted by both sides in the run up to the referendum, used to lull people into a false security that this would be it for another 30 or so years, through away remark my arse, a calculated statement. You're rights to fight for independence is something I'd never want to inhibit, just as the right for people to fight to remain as part of the union should also be equally respected. I'm sure I've seen Nicola Sturgeon say that it should also be a "once in a generation" vote also? Maybe so but as much as folk like us would rather just hear the truth, that isn't what happens in the political world. Look at that bus during the Brexit referendum! I've all the respect in the world for all the decent unionists that make up the majority. We see the path to progress through different lenses, that's all. I've got nothing but contempt for any unionists or nationalists who use the referendum and debate to showcase narrowminded views or hate for others. She might have said it at some point but I don't remember. The comment that is usually referred to is the one from Salmond I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack D and coke Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 The way Brexit has been handled so far I'm not convinced we'll have a clear idea of the impacts until well after negotiations are completed. We've been told 2 years but it could take longer ..... and everything so far has taken longer than expected. I wouldn't be surprised if the process is impacted by the elections this year in France, Netherlands & Germany - never mind the calls for 2nd vote here.Not a bad point. I've always said the SNP should've held their tongue a bit. The Dutch and the French could possibly leave and the Italians are getting twitchy about the EU also. It could totally unravel and then where does that leave them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Not a bad point. I've always said the SNP should've held their tongue a bit. The Dutch and the French could possibly leave and the Italians are getting twitchy about the EU also. It could totally unravel and then where does that leave them? I'll still want independence even if the EU breaks up. The Indy movement was in operation way before the creation of the EU. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderstruck Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 A throwaway line? Hardly that as it is in the Edinburgh Agreement. Both Salmond and Sturgeon made frequent reference to it and no amount of revisionism by the Rev of Bath and others changes that. The most famous use of the phrase was the Andrew Marr interview when Salmond also said (with no small measure of pomposity) that he would be standing up his Negotiation Team on 19th Sept 2014. Feast your eyes... https://youtu.be/6HyUmDuPa6g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Maybe so but as much as folk like us would rather just hear the truth, that isn't what happens in the political world. Look at that bus during the Brexit referendum! I've all the respect in the world for all the decent unionists that make up the majority. We see the path to progress through different lenses, that's all. I've got nothing but contempt for any unionists or nationalists who use the referendum and debate to showcase narrowminded views or hate for others. She might have said it at some point but I don't remember. The comment that is usually referred to is the one from Salmond I believe. Yeah, I'd always associated that as a Salmond quote but a quick search found an interview NS ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24147303 ) In the last 30 seconds she uses 'once in a generation' & 'once in a lifetime' and said this is what the SNP has always said. Still, I don't think an answer in an interview needs to become the official party policy - I would just like them to be clearer about this in future if there is a vote in 2018. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 A throwaway line? Hardly that as it is in the Edinburgh Agreement. Referring to the "once in a lifetime"? I've tried to find that in The Edinburgh Agreement, but can't. Which section is it in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Referring to the "once in a lifetime"? I've tried to find that in The Edinburgh Agreement, but can't. Which section is it in? Game set n match Boris. Well played. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderstruck Posted March 10, 2017 Share Posted March 10, 2017 Referring to the "once in a lifetime"? I've tried to find that in The Edinburgh Agreement, but can't. Which section is it in? Semantics. The clear intent was to signify that the vote would settle the matter for some considerable time. In fact, Salmond referred to the earlier gap between referendums (18 years) in his interview in the final few days before 18 Sept 14. Did you look at the video? Sturgeon seems to have no difficulty interchanging "generation" and "lifetime". Indeed, she said both so often that is baffling that some posters have no recollection of her saying it at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.