New Stand: Ongoing work (updated)

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

Just now, Francis Albert said:

And that accounts even if true (we forgot about the need for a TV studio or we didn't actually need one?) for 6-7m extra? Bollox. 

Ok it's bollox! A at least tried to answer your question 

[SUTOL]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

And that accounts even if true (we forgot about the need for a TV studio or we didn't actually need one?) for 6-7m extra? Bollox. 

 

We weren't going to incorporate the TV studio in the stand, and it wasn't part of the original 'budget' anyway.

Also works in other stands, not sure if that also includes the Wheatfield under-croft that was the shop and ticket office when the new stand construction was going on. 

[been here before]

Oh-oh watch out everyone... he's been out walking again...

 

 

greenginger 01:37 PM Today 

Originally Posted by greenlex:
Talking to a work colleague today. He lives in McLeod St. His block of flats has sustained damage during the construction to the tune of 80k. There’s a bun fight going on about who pays for the repairs. It happened during the driving of the piles.

Had a look at this on my way past this morning.

The bulge in the front of the tenement has increased, and a second floor sash and case window, where the bulge is most pronounced, has separated from the stone surround. There is about a 4 inch gap between the wooden casement and the stonework with a chance the whole thing could fall to the street below.

Has your work colleague had any updates as to how the building will be repaired ?

Edited November 12, 2018 by been here before

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

6 minutes ago, SUTOL said:

 

We weren't going to incorporate the TV studio in the stand, and it wasn't part of the original 'budget' anyway.

Also works in other stands, not sure if that also includes the Wheatfield under-croft that was the shop and ticket office when the new stand construction was going on. 

Cost includes works in wheatfield undercroft 

[Francis Albert]

2 hours ago, Thomaso said:

 

At an early stage of the project there was massive criticism of the architect on here by some - specifically the design of the glazed façade. In defence of him I pointed out the cost, programme, logistical, and Building Regulations requirements that dictated his particular design for the frontage.

Regretfully later on in the project it became obvious that there were some design flaws on other aspects that may have led the Club to bring in new Architects to complete the fit-out 

I don't remember too much criticism if the facade though my description of it as like a 70s office block did seem to upset some

 

 I stand by that description - a very nice 70s office block and looks great but not the architectural gem that would divert the tourist sightseeing buses that some OTT comments suggested.

 

The concourse and other back stage areas look OK to me but could do with some decoration - even the Wheatfield 20 odd years ago included plaques with the stories of club legends. But that will be cheap and is not a priority. The front facing the real action is superb but using  some of the Plaza  space on McLeod Street to provide additional seating with a lower rake would have been more forward looking and ambitious if planning permission permitted.

 

[1971fozzy]

I love the stand and the concourse.  

I have ultimate faith in Ann Budge also. 

 

Some folk 

 

[Jammy T]

I did say the procurement model was risky.

 

Got slated for it I recall.

Edited November 12, 2018 by Jammy T

[Mikey1874]

People's houses must be palaces.  

 

Although it is said people criticise things they tend to be alike to.

 

Encouraging news that the remainder is to be fitted out well. 

 

Stadium looking great. 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

4 years ago we could only have dreamed of the stadium we've now got! Brand new stand we thought we'd never see! Our own museum, memorial garden , after all those years lying empty the wheatfield undercroft finally being finished , new pitch with new undersoil heating system installed , various other stadium improvements and still some find something to moan about

[Francis Albert]

14 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Will you be attending the agm FA?

No but I will as before submit a few questions if there is the facility to do so. 

[Bull's-eye]

 

 

1 minute ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

4 years ago we could only have dreamed of the stadium we've now got! Brand new stand we thought we'd never see! Our own museum, memorial garden , after all those years lying empty the wheatfield undercroft finally being finished , new pitch with new undersoil heating system installed , various other stadium improvements and still some find something to moan about

 

Still nae big screens and slipper racks. 

 

No Olde Blue Eyes music in the Shitters either. Disgrace. 

[fabienleclerq]

Plenty positives but plenty of what seem amateur mistakes also.

 

We seemed to be surprised by how much space we had, how's that even possible? The toilet situation to begin with was a shambles, it's been rectified though. The design of the directors box and press box were strange choices, especially the entrance/exit and also the view from the top weren't what we expected. £18m is a huge investment and is getting to the point it might've made sense getting a new stadium!

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

Just now, fabienleclerq said:

Plenty positives but plenty of what seem amateur mistakes also.

 

We seemed to be surprised by how much space we had, how's that even possible? The toilet situation to begin with was a shambles, it's been rectified though. The design of the directors box and press box were strange choices, especially the entrance/exit and also the view from the top weren't what we expected. £18m is a huge investment and is getting to the point it might've made sense getting a new stadium!

And the guy who designed it lost his job 

[Rudy T]

17 minutes ago, been here before said:

Oh-oh watch out everyone... he's been out walking again...

 

 

greenginger 01:37 PM Today 

Originally Posted by greenlex:
Talking to a work colleague today. He lives in McLeod St. His block of flats has sustained damage during the construction to the tune of 80k. There’s a bun fight going on about who pays for the repairs. It happened during the driving of the piles.

Had a look at this on my way past this morning.

The bulge in the front of the tenement has increased, and a second floor sash and case window, where the bulge is most pronounced, has separated from the stone surround. There is about a 4 inch gap between the wooden casement and the stonework with a chance the whole thing could fall to the street below.

Has your work colleague had any updates as to how the building will be repaired ?

 

Has anyone ever verified this is true? That and his lack of building warrants mantra?

[Mikey1874]

The nursery looks good 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

1 minute ago, Rudy T said:

 

Has anyone ever verified this is true? That and his lack of building warrants mantra?

It's load of rubbish

[Francis Albert]

2 minutes ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

And the guy who designed it lost his job 

As did the chief operating officer who was resposible for overseeing the project (and ordering the seats apparently). But hey any adverse comments are just because people like to moan!

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, fabienleclerq said:

Plenty positives but plenty of what seem amateur mistakes also.

 

We seemed to be surprised by how much space we had, how's that even possible? The toilet situation to begin with was a shambles, it's been rectified though. The design of the directors box and press box were strange choices, especially the entrance/exit and also the view from the top weren't what we expected. £18m is a huge investment and is getting to the point it might've made sense getting a new stadium!

 ? About 60m aye. 

[J.T.F.Robertson]

21 minutes ago, been here before said:

Oh-oh watch out everyone... he's been out walking again...

 

 

greenginger 01:37 PM Today 

Originally Posted by greenlex:
Talking to a work colleague today. He lives in McLeod St. His block of flats has sustained damage during the construction to the tune of 80k. There’s a bun fight going on about who pays for the repairs. It happened during the driving of the piles.

Had a look at this on my way past this morning.

The bulge in the front of the tenement has increased, and a second floor sash and case window, where the bulge is most pronounced, has separated from the stone surround. There is about a 4 inch gap between the wooden casement and the stonework with a chance the whole thing could fall to the street below.

Has your work colleague had any updates as to how the building will be repaired ?

 

With any luck it'll "fall to the street below" when he's on one of his reconnaissance trips. 

 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

As did the chief operating officer who was resposible for overseeing the project (and ordering the seats apparently). But hey any adverse comments are just because people like to moan!

So people were held accountable for mistakes! What else do you want to happen ? Spouting the same thing time after time not gonna make any difference, fact is we've got a new stand fit for purpose and more importantly securing our future at Tynecastle park 

[J.T.F.Robertson]

3 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

As did the chief operating officer who was resposible for overseeing the project (and ordering the seats apparently). But hey any adverse comments are just because people like to moan!

 

You're hard done by, F.A.

 

[Hearts_fan]

6 hours ago, Thomaso said:

 

Thankfully they are in the tiny minority

 

Thankfully they are.

 

Budge wouldn't be anywhere near Hearts if the cynics were the majority of the support.

 

So it follows that we'd have probably gone to the wall if most of us were such greeting-faced ungrateful moaners!

[Gizmo]

4 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

The old stand at least had natural light into the back of it.

 

The logic on here seems to be:

 

Better than the old stand or other stands = perfect

 

Something can be an improvement on something else yet still have shortcomings. 

 

I got a new car last year, it's much better than my old '57 plate but I'd still like it to have a digital mph speedometer rather than km/h but it doesn't due to poor design...nothing to do with cost. Am I still happy with it? Absolutely.

 

Remember, you were the one on here telling people not to question things because the architect knew more than a bunch of simpletons on kickback (paraphrasing) prior to him being sacked and thrown under the bus for all the shortcomings in the design so I'll take you position on it all with a pinch of salt.. though I do appreciate your patience in answering questions and the insight you've given us all.

 

The thing is that our other stands, with the open concourse going round the back of all three and joining up, is pretty unique. Go inside the stand at Fir Park or any of the stands at Easter Road and they are all just enclosed bare concrete and breeze blocks. 

I guess the compromise to enable all the corporate earning facilities is worth it but I did hope that our concourse would span the four stands as I always thought it made our stands great. That said, I sat in the new stand to sample it for the Motherwell Cup match and I absolutely loved it. 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Gizmo

[Francis Albert]

2 minutes ago, Hearts_fan said:

 

Thankfully they are.

 

Budge wouldn't be anywhere near Hearts if the cynics were the majority of the support.

 

So it follows that we'd have probably gone to the wall if most of us were such greeting-faced ungrateful moaners!

Without the contributions of greeting faced moaners (or those who really care about a 6 to 7m overspend as I would prefer to call rhem) the club would not be where it is today. The new owners or their representatives need to be held to account as much as the old ... indeed maybe more as it is now or soon will be all our money that funds the club.

[fabienleclerq]

14 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

 ? About 60m aye. 

 

We are north of £18m for stadium upgrades, if we sold Tynecastle ( I'm not sure it's worth) and moved somewhere slightly cheaper and built a stadium capable of holding concerts etc then it doesn't seem too much of fantasy. 

 

Not that it matters we are e staying but if people knew the costs of this upgrade it might've swung them towards moving somewhere less restrictive.

[Independence]

1 minute ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

We are north of £18m for stadium upgrades, if we sold Tynecastle ( I'm not sure it's worth) and moved somewhere slightly cheaper and built a stadium capable of holding concerts etc then it doesn't seem too much of fantasy. 

 

Not that it matters we are e staying but if people knew the costs of this upgrade it might've swung them towards moving somewhere less restrictive.

No danger. Every penny is worth it to stay at Tynecastle our spiritual home. Why are we discussing this again? 

[XB52]

3 minutes ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

We are north of £18m for stadium upgrades, if we sold Tynecastle ( I'm not sure it's worth) and moved somewhere slightly cheaper and built a stadium capable of holding concerts etc then it doesn't seem too much of fantasy. 

 

Not that it matters we are e staying but if people knew the costs of this upgrade it might've swung them towards moving somewhere less restrictive.

Please tell me you are  just a brain dead troll and don't really believe the shite you just posted 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

2 minutes ago, Independence said:

No danger. Every penny is worth it to stay at Tynecastle our spiritual home. Why are we discussing this again? 

This 

[McCrae]

19 minutes ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

So people were held accountable for mistakes! What else do you want to happen ? Spouting the same thing time after time not gonna make any difference, fact is we've got a new stand fit for purpose and more importantly securing our future at Tynecastle park 

 

When the accounts are published we should have a better idea of how things are being financed. I think the Stadium looks great.... but would prefer to hold off any additional improvements until we can pay for it without going into debt. We need to make sure enough funding is going to the player budget. 

[fabienleclerq]

2 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Please tell me you are  just a brain dead troll and don't really believe the shite you just posted 

Are you new to the internet? I've not posted anything that could be considered a troll. 

[Independence]

40 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I don't remember too much criticism if the facade though my description of it as like a 70s office block did seem to upset some

 

 I stand by that description - a very nice 70s office block and looks great but not the architectural gem that would divert the tourist sightseeing buses that some OTT comments suggested.

 

The concourse and other back stage areas look OK to me but could do with some decoration - even the Wheatfield 20 odd years ago included plaques with the stories of club legends. But that will be cheap and is not a priority. The front facing the real action is superb but using  some of the Plaza  space on McLeod Street to provide additional seating with a lower rake would have been more forward looking and ambitious if planning permission permitted.

 

Jeez give it a rest just for say a day?

[fabienleclerq]

7 minutes ago, Independence said:

No danger. Every penny is worth it to stay at Tynecastle our spiritual home. Why are we discussing this again? 

 We've over spent massively and this is a forum, you know how they work?

[Gizmo]

1 minute ago, Independence said:

Jeez give it a rest just for say a day?

Almost worthless having the repetitive moaners on ignore as they inevitably get quoted. His grand idea to make the stand rake shallower, thus ruining the atmosphere and view lines is a corker, tho. 

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, Independence said:

Jeez give it a rest just for say a day?

I don't post every day. When I do I try to make some sort of point about what I am replying to or commenting on. 

Rather than simply telling another poster to shut up.

 

 

[blairdin]

Is the overspend not less to do with underestimating the cost of what we set out to do, and more to do with adapting and improving on what we set out to do? 

 

If this is the case, I'm less concerned about the rise in cost...

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, blairdin said:

Is the overspend not less to do with underestimating the cost of what we set out to do, and more to do with adapting and improving on what we set out to do? 

 

If this is the case, I'm less concerned about the rise in cost...

I think Thomaso has made it clear that it is mainly about underestimating the cost of what we set out do because we trusted the original architect's guesstimate of the cost. 

[davemclaren]

47 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

No but I will as before submit a few questions if there is the facility to do so. 

?

[davemclaren]

47 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

No but I will as before submit a few questions if there is the facility to do so. 

?

[1971fozzy]

24 minutes ago, Independence said:

No danger. Every penny is worth it to stay at Tynecastle our spiritual home. Why are we discussing this again? 

 

Spot on

[SUTOL]

13 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I think Thomaso has made it clear that it is mainly about underestimating the cost of what we set out do because we trusted the original architect's guesstimate of the cost. 

 

The £1million pitch wasn't in the guesstimate.

 

Neither was the works in the Wheatfield, Gorgie and Roseburn stands, the fans bar,  the TV studio, the big screens, or other stuff I've not mentioned.

[By the light]

17 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I think Thomaso has made it clear that it is mainly about underestimating the cost of what we set out do because we trusted the original architect's guesstimate of the cost. 

 

I’m surprised you’re not more famous given how perfect you must be at absolutely everything you do in life.

 

Folk make mistakes, no one died. Get over it and your crusade.

[Beast Boy]

1 hour ago, Rudy T said:

 

Has anyone ever verified this is true? That and his lack of building warrants mantra?

 

I’m prepared to wager that the only “bulge” in the vicinity is in his crusty undercrackers, as he stares angry and aroused at our beautiful stadium.

[jambali]

4 hours ago, Thomaso said:

 

The seated areas in the new stand are finished.  The internal fit-out to the dressing rooms and corporate areas will not effect your current viewing of the match - unless your going to move stands of course?

I thought there were plans to alter the directors bit? Also if people can leave at the back - that will help

Edited November 12, 2018 by jambali

[Hearts_fan]

36 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I think Thomaso has made it clear that it is mainly about underestimating the cost of what we set out do because we trusted the original architect's guesstimate of the cost. 

 

Thomaso has offered some wonderful first-hand insights into the redevelopment which have been appreciated by everyone I would assume. 

 

However, if you Francis Albert are genuinely interested in the financials of the project, why not take on board what Ann Budge has to say on the matter of increased costs:

 

“Once we had the main stand open, we slowed things down because when we fully understood the scale of what we were undertaking, we realised that we had the opportunity to do something really special.

– Ann Budge

 

“To do it full justice we wanted to fit it out to the highest standards possible, hence an increased spend on fit-out costs but, as everyone can see, the results are worth it.

– Ann Budge

 

“A new structure, with an increased capacity, meant more demands placed upon power supplies and other facilities. We therefore constructed a new plant room underneath the Roseburn Stand undercroft, which will service the stadium’s needs for years to come.

– Ann Budge

 

“The key for me was listening to the supporters and the sponsors, as they too saw what we had, and they too fully realised the potential and asked for more.

– Ann Budge

 

“We are trying to ensure that what we end up with is what we need and not what we thought we needed when we looked at the original plans in an office in our old admin building some three or four years ago.

– Ann Budge

 

“The key objective to me is that our redeveloped stadium meets the needs of our fans and the business needs of the club, such that we can continue to grow and compete as a major force in Scottish football, as a major hospitality and conference destination in Edinburgh and as a major hub for the community.

– Ann Budge

 

“Yes, we will spend more in achieving this than originally envisaged, but we will do so confident that we have the financial resources necessary.”

– Ann Budge

Read more at: https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-owner-wants-highest-standards-as-tynecastle-upgrade-costs-hit-18m-1-4827850

[Francis Albert]

16 minutes ago, Hearts_fan said:

 

Thomaso has offered some wonderful first-hand insights into the redevelopment which have been appreciated by everyone I would assume. 

 

However, if you Francis Albert are genuinely interested in the financials of the project, why not take on board what Ann Budge has to say on the matter of increased costs:

 

“Once we had the main stand open, we slowed things down because when we fully understood the scale of what we were undertaking, we realised that we had the opportunity to do something really special.

– Ann Budge

 

“To do it full justice we wanted to fit it out to the highest standards possible, hence an increased spend on fit-out costs but, as everyone can see, the results are worth it.

– Ann Budge

 

“A new structure, with an increased capacity, meant more demands placed upon power supplies and other facilities. We therefore constructed a new plant room underneath the Roseburn Stand undercroft, which will service the stadium’s needs for years to come.

– Ann Budge

 

“The key for me was listening to the supporters and the sponsors, as they too saw what we had, and they too fully realised the potential and asked for more.

– Ann Budge

 

“We are trying to ensure that what we end up with is what we need and not what we thought we needed when we looked at the original plans in an office in our old admin building some three or four years ago.

– Ann Budge

 

“The key objective to me is that our redeveloped stadium meets the needs of our fans and the business needs of the club, such that we can continue to grow and compete as a major force in Scottish football, as a major hospitality and conference destination in Edinburgh and as a major hub for the community.

– Ann Budge

 

“Yes, we will spend more in achieving this than originally envisaged, but we will do so confident that we have the financial resources necessary.”

– Ann Budge

Read more at: https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/hearts-owner-wants-highest-standards-as-tynecastle-upgrade-costs-hit-18m-1-4827850

Sorry but I am still unclear about why something that we were told would cost 11m plus 1m contingency will now cost 18m (and counting).  

What did sponsors and supporters demand more of? Adequate power to meet the requirements of a bigger stand? What did the sponsors demand and what are we getting from them in return? A lot of words there but little by way of real explanation or facts. 

[Francis Albert]

51 minutes ago, By the light said:

 

I’m surprised you’re not more famous given how perfect you must be at absolutely everything you do in life.

 

Folk make mistakes, no one died. Get over it and your crusade.

I have made lots of mistakes. I never tried the "no one died" defence.

[Hearts_fan]

51 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Sorry but I am still unclear about why something that we were told would cost 11m plus 1m contingency will now cost 18m (and counting).  

What did sponsors and supporters demand more of? Adequate power to meet the requirements of a bigger stand? What did the sponsors demand and what are we getting from them in return? A lot of words there but little by way of real explanation or facts. 

 

Good luck.

[Beast Boy]

1 hour ago, jambali said:

I thought there were plans to alter the directors bit?

 

[Mr Brightside]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

Sorry but I am still unclear about why something that we were told would cost 11m plus 1m contingency will now cost 18m (and counting).  

What did sponsors and supporters demand more of? Adequate power to meet the requirements of a bigger stand? What did the sponsors demand and what are we getting from them in return? A lot of words there but little by way of real explanation or facts. 

Seems that there are 4 reasons why:

1) Original estimate was too low;

2) Additional works have been included, pitch, tv studio, police box, wheat field undercroft;

3) We (Hearts) have changed our minds on what we want included inside the stand; and 

4) Revamping some of the areas already built.

 

None of the above is difficult to establish.

[Scnorthedinburgh]

2 hours ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

We are north of £18m for stadium upgrades, if we sold Tynecastle ( I'm not sure it's worth) and moved somewhere slightly cheaper and built a stadium capable of holding concerts etc then it doesn't seem too much of fantasy. 

 

Not that it matters we are e staying but if people knew the costs of this upgrade it might've swung them towards moving somewhere less restrictive.

Going to assume you have been drinking.

Where do you think we could.have bought land, got planning permission and built a.new ground?