New Stand: Ongoing work (updated)

[A_A wehatethehibs]

10 minutes ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

There's no scope behind wheat field because it's right next to a building 

 

And a very old building it is, a similar age to the old stand we just tore down in fact. There used to be similar warehouse style buildings on the site of the distillery pitch which are now gone as they relocated the vast majority of their warehousing to a huge site in West Lothian - Buildings come and go. In any case, the question of what next for Hearts is 20 plus years away ?

 

 

[Mellor]

6 minutes ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

Exactly Thomaso, what we got right now is magnificent considering its only few years ago we had the pie man telling us Tynecastle wasn't fit for purpose and wanted to move us away to pay for his mismanagement 

 

14 years ago, almost to the month:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/h/heart_of_midlothian/3329539.stm

[Fxxx the SPFL]

1 minute ago, Mellor said:

 

14 years ago, almost to the month:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/h/heart_of_midlothian/3329539.stm

Pieman=scheister 

[Neon]

1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

 

The club hasn't disclosed separate figures for the "football department".  I think we will have to wait for the publication of the 2016/17 accounts to build a better picture.

 

The turnover / wage costs / ratio for the first two seasons of AB's tenure are as follows:

2014/15  £7.018m  /  £3.798m  /  54%

2015/16  £9.967m  /  £5.520m  /  55%

 

At the last AGM, the forecast figures for 2016/17  were £10.4m   /  £5.8m  /   56% (all estimates), although AB has given an indication that the actual turnover was around £11m

 

The increase in wage costs is pretty meaningless without a breakdown as Catering was brought back in house midway through the 2014/15 season and the Retail side in February 2016, which increased wage costs.

 

AB gave the following info in the accounts last year:

Staff costs rose by £1.7m during the year. The business has continued to increase both the player and non­ player base, with average full-time employee numbers increasing from 122 to 144 during the year. Bringing the retail business in-house from February 2016 contributed to this increase. In addition, 105 part-time employees work within the hospitality area, an increase of 19 over the prior year. The business is proud to be a Living  Wage employer and implemented the increased Living Wage in November 2015.

 

It is probably a good question to ask at the AGM, "what was the football department's budget for each of the three seasons past and what is it for the current season?"  You mightn't get a straight answer though.

 

My gut feel, supported by some snippets of information and rumours I've heard, is that every £1 is a prisoner at the moment, so I wouldn't be surprised if the football budget is being squeezed because of the new stand costs.  e.g. I'm aware that the club made overtures towards bringing HYDC "in house" a few months ago, together with its existing funds and fundraising capacity, but my understanding is that the offer was turned down as the club couldn't guarantee that the funds would be ring-fenced for youth/academy projects.

 

 

Thanks FF.

 

So we have now

 

Maintenance reduction

Catering brought indoors

Retail controlled by us now

Far more hospitality options (soon)

Increase in capacity and ST pricing.

 

Remarkable turn around tbh, pity we don't have a break down on player costs/salaries.

 

 

Future is very bright.

[i8hibsh]

2 minutes ago, neonjambo said:

Thanks FF.

 

So we have now

 

Maintenance reduction

Catering brought indoors

Retail controlled by us now

Far more hospitality options (soon)

Increase in capacity and ST pricing.

 

Remarkable turn around tbh, pity we don't have a break down on player costs/salaries.

 

 

Future is very bright.

 

 

Cheaper electricity due to the glass facade.  Less lighting required - all adds up.

[Neon]

2 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Cheaper electricity due to the glass facade.  Less lighting required - all adds up.

Offset by price of window cleaners sadly !

[BigC]

14 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

And a very old building it is, a similar age to the old stand we just tore down in fact. There used to be similar warehouse style buildings on the site of the distillery pitch which are now gone as they relocated the vast majority of their warehousing to a huge site in West Lothian - Buildings come and go. In any case, the question of what next for Hearts is 20 plus years away ?

 

 

 

If you look on Google Maps & street view, the buildings don't actually overlap and they also don't have windows, so you wouldn't need to worry about blocking light. 

 

You would have to work with & pay the distillery because they currently own the land, but it is more doable than say, filling in the corners.

[Jambo92]

bit late to the party but the beauty of Tynecastle is that it is a full house of proper fans, visiting players mention how claustraphobic it is to play at a full Tynie.  I would much rather have a full house every week with 20k then 25k will empty patches around until the big games. 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

22 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

And a very old building it is, a similar age to the old stand we just tore down in fact. There used to be similar warehouse style buildings on the site of the distillery pitch which are now gone as they relocated the vast majority of their warehousing to a huge site in West Lothian - Buildings come and go. In any case, the question of what next for Hearts is 20 plus years away ?

 

 

Difference with old stand we tore down was ours

[Sarah O]

PIcs or update on stand OR GTFO

[Buffalo Bill]

1 hour ago, Lucille's Thirsty said:

 

This season we ain’t pulling up trees BB.

 

Old Firm and the vermin will get all the roseburn as segregation will mean loss of seats.

 

There has to be a way we can find a solution to segregation but not leave empty seats like put a barrier with stewards in between. 

 

A bit like the Emirates.

 

Agree with what you're saying, though any future alternative to the current segregation tarpaulin would need to be portable due to home ticket demand.

[Ray Gin]

9 minutes ago, Jambo92 said:

bit late to the party but the beauty of Tynecastle is that it is a full house of proper fans, visiting players mention how claustraphobic it is to play at a full Tynie.  I would much rather have a full house every week with 20k then 25k will empty patches around until the big games. 

 

I'd rather have the extra £1 million a year tbh.

 

 

[Mr Sifter]

[Francis Albert]

52 minutes ago, Jambo92 said:

bit late to the party but the beauty of Tynecastle is that it is a full house of proper fans, visiting players mention how claustraphobic it is to play at a full Tynie.  I would much rather have a full house every week with 20k then 25k will empty patches around until the big games. 

No business would be achieving its potential if it thought the optimum capacity was one that ensured it always operated at 100% of capacity. That simply means throwing money away and all growth potential away.

 

Tynecastle's reputation for atmosphere long predates when we started to get full houses or almost full houses consistently. Indeed some recent seasons with full or near full houses have seen atmosphere decline dramatically.

 

I think (hope?) we will see soon that 15000 in a 20000 capacity ground will generate great atmosphere when we are playing well and winning, and shite atmosphere when we are playing as we have almost all this year.

 

The same would be true if at some future time we had 20,000 ina 25,000 capacity stadium.

 

Or if our crowds fall to 15,000 or less should we tear down one of the stands and sell the land to Tesco so we can have full house of "proper" fans??

Edited November 13, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Heartsofgold]

9 minutes ago, Mr Sifter said:

 

Nice one Mr S!!  Anyone got any updates from inside now??  Has their been significant progress on fitting the seats etc??

[alwaysthereinspirit]

13 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

No business would be achieving its potential if it thought the optimum capacity was one that ensured it always operated at 100% of capacity. That simply means throwing money away and all growth potential away.

 

Tynecastle's reputation for atmosphere long predates when we started to get full houses or almost full houses consistently. Indeed some recent seasons with full or near full houses have seen atmosphere decline dramatically.

 

I think (hope?) we will see soon that 15000 in a 20000 capacity ground will generate great atmosphere when we are playing well and winning, and shite atmosphere when we are playing as we have almost all this year.

 

The same would be true if at some future time we had 20,000 ina 25,000 capacity stadium.

 

Or if our crowds fall to 15,000 or less should we tear down one of the stands and sell the land to Tesco so we can have full house of "proper" fans??

Yes, yes we should tear a stand down if that should happen. Give it up. Just for a day at least.

[Jamboelite]

7 minutes ago, Heartsofgold said:

 

Nice one Mr S!!  Anyone got any updates from inside now??  Has their been significant progress on fitting the seats etc??

 

There was a pic yesterday which showed that whole section at the Roseburn end still missing seats but im guessing now its closed off they will be on it.

[Jamboelite]

20 minutes ago, Mr Sifter said:

 

Could you not have waited till the van moved ffs ?

[BigC]

Wahey!

 

Finally that last bit of cladding is up!

[Jambo92]

25 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

No business would be achieving its potential if it thought the optimum capacity was one that ensured it always operated at 100% of capacity. That simply means throwing money away and all growth potential away.

 

Tynecastle's reputation for atmosphere long predates when we started to get full houses or almost full houses consistently. Indeed some recent seasons with full or near full houses have seen atmosphere decline dramatically.

 

I think (hope?) we will see soon that 15000 in a 20000 capacity ground will generate great atmosphere when we are playing well and winning, and shite atmosphere when we are playing as we have almost all this year.

 

The same would be true if at some future time we had 20,000 ina 25,000 capacity stadium.

 

Or if our crowds fall to 15,000 or less should we tear down one of the stands and sell the land to Tesco so we can have full house of "proper" fans??

 

Firstly it's all about progress, we can't afford to build a stadium that holds 25,000 currently, we have managed to get it to 20,000 which is progress.  My point was though that we have a very average Premiership squad and a packed out Tynecastle can act as a 12th man, and is a better asset than a stadium that is only 3/4 full.  Currently the team needs all the help it can or crowds will naturally start to lessen.  Its not that long since we were getting 10,000 with Levein as manager so for the time being i'm happy with the stadium as it is.  An extra 5000 seats requires more maintenance, staffing etc. that's without them being sold so until there is research that proves there is a weekly demand for 25,000 tickets I wouldn't change it.  

[Francis Albert]

15 minutes ago, alwaysthereinspirit said:

Yes, yes we should tear a stand down if that should happen. Give it up. Just for a day at least.

I thought that was the logic of the post I was replying to. Better a ground full of "proper" fans than one just 75% full ... or containing 25% of "improper fans". Maybe I misunderstood.

[Jambof3tornado]

17 minutes ago, Jamboelite said:

 

Could you not have waited till the van moved ffs ?

No. Its his van. Free advertising!!

[heartsfc_fan]

38 minutes ago, Mr Sifter said:

Nice cheers.

Can't quite tell, but how much more cladding has to go in? Looks nearly done?

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

What time do we open up Sunday?

[Mr Sifter]

18 minutes ago, Jamboelite said:

 

Could you not have waited till the van moved ffs ?

 

I suppose I could have, but that probably would've just pissed off the fare in the back even more?

[Francis Albert]

10 minutes ago, Jambo92 said:

 

Firstly it's all about progress, we can't afford to build a stadium that holds 25,000 currently, we have managed to get it to 20,000 which is progress.  My point was though that we have a very average Premiership squad and a packed out Tynecastle can act as a 12th man, and is a better asset than a stadium that is only 3/4 full.  Currently the team needs all the help it can or crowds will naturally start to lessen.  Its not that long since we were getting 10,000 with Levein as manager so for the time being i'm happy with the stadium as it is.  An extra 5000 seats requires more maintenance, staffing etc. that's without them being sold so until there is research that proves there is a weekly demand for 25,000 tickets I wouldn't change it.  

I have no problem with the 20,000 capacity. In itself it doesn't mean that Tynecastle will be a "twelfth man" or that the old capacity wouldn't  be as much of a twelfth man if the team was offering something to enthuse about on the pitch.

 

The fact is the atmosphere can and often has been great in a 3/4 or even 1/2 full stadium and has often been crap in a full stadium. In fact given the current level of performance having a full stadium just means more jeers anger and abuse.

 

If at some time in the future we can justify increasing capacity further it won't be on the basis that we can always guarantee filling it. There is no guarantee after all we will get 20,000 every week in the "new" Tynecastle.

Edited November 13, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Mr Sifter]

4 minutes ago, heartsfc_fan said:

Nice cheers.

Can't quite tell, but how much more cladding has to go in? Looks nearly done?

Tiny wee bit still to do, nearest the floodlights. Not much left to be done. 

[Hearts_fan]

1 hour ago, neonjambo said:

Offset by price of window cleaners sadly !

 

That's £100 K we could have spent on heated seats for the new stand. 

[J.T.F.Robertson]

8 hours ago, Braminho said:

plenty sore heads this morning, 30,000 seater . What are the chances of just enjoying the new stand just now without people moaning

 

Slim.

 

[Thomaso]

35 minutes ago, Jambo92 said:

 

Firstly it's all about progress, we can't afford to build a stadium that holds 25,000 currently, we have managed to get it to 20,000 which is progress.  My point was though that we have a very average Premiership squad and a packed out Tynecastle can act as a 12th man, and is a better asset than a stadium that is only 3/4 full.  Currently the team needs all the help it can or crowds will naturally start to lessen.  Its not that long since we were getting 10,000 with Levein as manager so for the time being i'm happy with the stadium as it is.  An extra 5000 seats requires more maintenance, staffing etc. that's without them being sold so until there is research that proves there is a weekly demand for 25,000 tickets I wouldn't change it.  

 

Let's hope we are not going back to these days then!! 

[mitch41]

3 hours ago, Thomaso said:

 

 

Get off that "Levein bashing train" mitch!! 

When have i ever had a go at my big pal Craig. And how do you know i'm on the train ?

[Thomaso]

31 minutes ago, heartsfc_fan said:

Nice cheers.

Can't quite tell, but how much more cladding has to go in? Looks nearly done?

 

They need to finish the cladding/roof end so they can get those big scissor lifts out of there. 

Finish the escape stair,  level, hard core, and tarmac access for away fans, then fit security fencing and gates...........

[Jambo92]

My post wasn't a dig at anyone or saying the atmosphere is only good if it is full, I remember Dinamo Zagreb in Europa League years ago, it was electric and was shocked when i saw the attendance of 11,500 or so - my original post was more a positive post about looking forward to our new and improved stadium, I don't believe there is a need to debate just now for a 25K seater was my point.  Maybe 3-4 years time though!

31 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I have no problem with the 20,000 capacity. In itself it doesn't mean that Tynecastle will be a "twelfth man" or that the old capacity wouldn't  be as much of a twelfth man if the team was offering something to enthuse about on the pitch.

 

The fact is the atmosphere can and often has been great in a 3/4 or even 1/2 full stadium and has often been crap in a full stadium. In fact given the current level of performance having a full stadium just means more jeers anger and abuse.

 

If at some time in the future we can justify increasing capacity further it won't be on the basis that we can always guarantee filling it. There is no guarantee after all we will get 20,000 every week in the "new" Tynecastle.

 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

I don't think we need a bigger stand just now.

 

I think it's likely we'd be better off with a bigger stand in about 10 years. For the past 35 years our attendance has been up when we're playing well and down when we're not but the overall trend has been steadily up, even accounting for years when we were limited by renovations at Tynie.

 

If we do need to expand, the obvious solution is to redevelop the Wheatfield to roughly double its capacity. IIRC there are still COMAH issues with the alcohol and maximum number of people on site at once, for evacuation times. That would need to be dealt with when the time comes.

 

But a doubling of the Wheatfield would get us to 26,000 which would be bigger than at least five current EPL stadiums, and if we averaged 22-23k would give us a significant revenue advantage over all non-OF clubs, and would likely mean our seat revenues were close to half of Rangers'.

 

I hope we get there but there's no need to worry about that before about 2025.

[The Future's Maroon]

4 hours ago, jimbrown76 said:

When are we getting inspected for the Safety Certificate?

 

Considering we (as expected) are hosting a match on Sunday, I would have thought that wouldn't be too difficult to work out!

 

This week, in case your still struggling ;-)

Edited November 13, 2017 by The Future's Maroon

[Francis Albert]

20 minutes ago, Jambo92 said:

My post wasn't a dig at anyone or saying the atmosphere is only good if it is full, I remember Dinamo Zagreb in Europa League years ago, it was electric and was shocked when i saw the attendance of 11,500 or so - my original post was more a positive post about looking forward to our new and improved stadium, I don't believe there is a need to debate just now for a 25K seater was my point.  Maybe 3-4 years time though!

 

Agree. I was just saying a ground doesn't need to be 100% full for every game to justify investment in new capacity ... but you are right it is an academic point at present.

I am more concerned about whether we can come close to selling 2000 hospitality places TBH, certainly until such time as we can offer better entertainment on the pitch.

[Francis Albert]

6 minutes ago, The Future's Maroon said:

 

Considering we are hosting a match on Sunday, I would have thought that wouldn't be too difficult to work out!

 

This week, in case your still struggling ;-)

I thought the consensus was today ... but I would have thought it had to be early this week as the inspection may identify things to be fixed.

[Footballfirst]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I thought the consensus was today ... but I would have thought it had to be early this week as the inspection may identify things to be fixed.

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

[Pistol1874]

2 hours ago, ray gets bus pass soon said:

Pieman=scheister 

.

Edited November 13, 2017 by Pistol1874

[Thomaso]

16 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Agree. I was just saying a ground doesn't need to be 100% full for every game to justify investment in new capacity ... but you are right it is an academic point at present.

I am more concerned about whether we can come close to selling 2000 hospitality places TBH, certainly until such time as we can offer better entertainment on the pitch.

 

 

What those prawn sandwich munchers???????

 

Joking apart hospitality is a big money spinner and vital to the Club.

[jambo-in-furness]

10 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

 

 

That makes far too much sense.

[Getintaethem]

Ah, the age old obsession with having a bigger one.

[King Of The Cat Cafe]

17 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

 

Pretty much this.

 

I would expect that by now the club will have been told "you will get your certificate if your do X, Y and Z".

 

My concern is the amount of time left for testing turnstiles, electrics, and sound and so on.

[Francis Albert]

11 minutes ago, Thomaso said:

 

 

What those prawn sandwich munchers???????

 

Joking apart hospitality is a big money spinner and vital to the Club.

It is only a big money spinner if it sells. 2000 seems a helluva lot to me, especially given the eye-watering cost of most of what,s on offer. Time will soon tell - fingers crossed!

[scott herbertson]

22 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

 

 

It will -certainly with the building control officers from the council. Fire brigade also and the police. The only real worries should be whether things currently being installed will do what they are supposed to (electrics, particularly)

[Jamboelite]

36 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

 

Someone noted that they have been in several times and are doing so this week as well.

 

i cant imagine its one boy turning up with a clipboard on Friday and a red pen ?

[Beats]

They red panels! What the hell were they thinking?

[The Future's Maroon]

48 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I thought the consensus was today ... but I would have thought it had to be early this week as the inspection may identify things to be fixed.

 

A few few visits this week, not sure when as on annual leave today!

 

44 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I would hope that the club has had a rolling engagement with the H&S and council bodies, i.e.some parts of the stand will have already been signed off, with specific actions being carried out in response to their observations.  

 

That is usually how it works yes, the Building Control Officers have been prepared for this for a while, as will others who require to sign things off.

[Dunks]

 

From the Hearts Main Stand Facebook page - Tom Lamb  

Edited November 13, 2017 by Dunks

[kila]