JamboX2 Posted April 26, 2015 Posted April 26, 2015 The (or a) German view on the British election: no big ideas, parochial policies, no concept of the world beyond Britain and a nation on the verge of wrecking itself. http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/apr/26/election-2015-german-amazed-obsess-selfies-ignoring-big-issues?CMP=fb_gu Maybe a tad over the top, but it's interesting to see how things like UKIP, a referendum on the EU and the rise of the SNP is being viewed by some abroad. And how there are positives in our electoral system to view as positives.
JamboX2 Posted April 26, 2015 Posted April 26, 2015 Why do you say that ? For the rights and wrongs of many politicians there are some who are genuinely very good at their job and have a lot to offer their nation. Douglas Alexander is one I count as offering that. Whilst Scottish Labour is clearly not flavour of the month on here, nor the Liberal Democrats, they do both provide Scotland some first class representatives - Alexander, Kennedy, Campbell, Begg, Jamieson, Murphy to name a few. Many of these people, and more of them, have represented their constituents and Scotland and the UK well over time. And if they are swept away by popular demand of the people then that is democracy, but it is a loss to Scotland being represented by knowledgeable, capable and hardworking men and women. There is dross, elected and seeking election, in all parties. Mhairi Black does not strike me as a being capable of doing her job well. For the sake of Paisley (never thought I'd say that) I hope she proves me wrong. But she said it in the off in her interview there, "it's not me, it's what the SNP are saying". The narrative they have founded is a good one, if not very similar to those they are opposed to and my fear is many good and effective politicians of all parties, and those looking for seats (the Scottish Greens for one) will be lost to people not fit for it. I'm also skeptical here because SNP selection processes have shown in the recent Holyrood session to have let people clearly unable to be an MSP and who have bad back stories. See the ex-Dunfermline MSP for that. This week we've seen Neil Hay in Edinburgh South West be shown to be unfit for his candidacy and no action taken. I hope on the day Scotland votes how it wants. But I think this SNP juggernaut will let some unfit people in and kick out some excellent MPs who've gave Scotland and their constituents a great service. Mhairi Black does not strike me as capable of doing the job well, she'll be a great SNP mouthpiece but not a great MP. And as a Labour voter I've seen plenty mouthpieces in Scotland to know one when I see one.
JamboAl Posted April 26, 2015 Posted April 26, 2015 NIMBYs and the green belt brigade should be told to **** off. This is in the national interest, and, in my view, the state should directly intervene. If relaxing planning laws and more construction brings down the value of more expensive properties then that's pretty much a stealth inheritance tax - something the lefties should like. Have you read anything at all about the effects of rent controls? It's not good. Introduce rent controls now and landlords will simply not upkeep properties. Profits will be down, and where else are people going to move? There's a shortage of properties. Rent controls are a populist sticking plaster, at best. Surely if the values of property reduced it would be the exact opposite of a stealth IHT. You read too much Tory propaganda when you say landlords will simply not upkeep properties. What are they going to do with them? Let them rot? Doubt it. Sell them? Good that will reduce prices even further as the market is flooded with landlords offloading property otherwise going derelict.
paleredfox Posted April 26, 2015 Posted April 26, 2015 "It is a loss to Scotland" What Scotland? Your Scotland from a subjective viewpoint or a Scotland from an objective viewpoint? Anyone and everyone can make a subjective case and viable point based on their own interpretation, narrative and experience. The true virtue is being objective and putting aside subjectivity rather than spieling post after post of regurgitated content.
dobmisterdobster Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The (or a) German view on the British election: no big ideas, parochial policies, no concept of the world beyond Britain and a nation on the verge of wrecking itself. http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/apr/26/election-2015-german-amazed-obsess-selfies-ignoring-big-issues?CMP=fb_gu Maybe a tad over the top, but it's interesting to see how things like UKIP, a referendum on the EU and the rise of the SNP is being viewed by some abroad. And how there are positives in our electoral system to view as positives. Call it parochial if you will. Most people in Britain don't care about the EU or their beef with Putin. None of the mainstream parties have called for more integration with the EU. The answer to the West Lothian question is federalism. It's blindingly obvious to an outsider like him. It's a system that works perfectly fine in countries in Europe and around the world. But Labour have always been the main obstacle. Calling it "independence via the back door" among other things. This has to change during the next parliament.
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 So after Osborne's blatant attempt to reinflate house prices with Help to Buy, Labour now proposes to abolish stamp duty on first time purchases under ?300k. A vote - winner? Probably. Adding more distortions to the housing market? Meh.
Psychedelicropcircle Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Bisto-phobia.....The fear of being slung of the gravy train and falling arse over tit down the electrol embankment of doom into the jabby nettles of political oblivion. News net Scotland. The statement of the campaign!
aussieh Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 So Scottish Labour telling porky pies on offical policy. But thats alright eh.
aussieh Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Another scraping from the bottom of the barrel of Scottish life or as it is better known, an SNP election candidate. I hope all you boys are looking forward to the lowest of the low representing you and your cult in Westminster in a couple of weeks. http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/572961/Bigoted-language-shame-would-be-SNP-MP Mind you, that's all he'll be doing. Now that you've effectively been locked out of any decision making by the Tories and Labour, guys like this will have plenty of time on their hands down south to catch up on their tweeting and other social media hobbies. Well played Nicola and co. Hello TJ, where've you been hiding.Anyway back to business. As oppose to what, Fraudsters and Kidney fiddlers?
JamboX2 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/04/why-arent-plaid-cymru-surging Not a bad wee article comparing Plaid and the SNP.
TheMaganator Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/secret-dossier-lays-bare-snp-push-for-indyref-1-3755156 SNP MPs will use their time at Weatminster pushing for another referendum? Surely not.
JamboX2 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Call it parochial if you will. Most people in Britain don't care about the EU or their beef with Putin. None of the mainstream parties have called for more integration with the EU. The answer to the West Lothian question is federalism. It's blindingly obvious to an outsider like him. It's a system that works perfectly fine in countries in Europe and around the world. But Labour have always been the main obstacle. Calling it "independence via the back door" among other things. This has to change during the next parliament. Federalism can only be achieved with Welsh, English and Northern Irish consent to reducing the role of Westminster in their affairs. It is not for one part with less than a tenth of the population of the UK to force that on the rest. Whilst I think that it is the best option the SNP are not the party to achieve it. All federal systems have a strong centre holding things together, the SNP don't want that and its hard to see why they'd go for it as it'd likely derail their plans for independence. The article is good because there's only so much sticking plasters you can have to stem talking about big issues. Britain should be in the EU and the anti-EU mob should be faced down strongly. Our politicians do need to review our role in the world. And they do also need to stop making it all about 1000 extra this and that will solve that and this.
JamboX2 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 "It is a loss to Scotland" What Scotland? Your Scotland from a subjective viewpoint or a Scotland from an objective viewpoint? Everyone's opinions on politics and how the nation should be run are subjective. The SNPs, Labour, Tory etc. What Scotland should be like to all can be summed up with general words and many will agree with them. But its still a subjective choice in an election between different visions of Scotland. Anyone and everyone can make a subjective case and viable point based on their own interpretation, narrative and experience. The true virtue is being objective and putting aside subjectivity rather than spieling post after post of regurgitated content. Surely loosing intelligent and hard working MPs of any party is not a great thing to see for Scotland objectively?
Guest Trapper John Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Hello TJ, where've you been hiding. Anyway back to business. As oppose to what, Fraudsters and Kidney fiddlers? You mean the Labour candidates you said you'd vote for when Scotland becomes free?
RosscoC Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The seethe level is steadily increasing on here as we get closer to polling day. There are going to be some epic meltdowns. Cannot wait.
Guest Trapper John Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/secret-dossier-lays-bare-snp-push-for-indyref-1-3755156 SNP MPs will use their time at Weatminster pushing for another referendum? Surely not. They'll have to do something to pass the time when they're down there. Pretty dull life being frozen out. Poor things.
TheMaganator Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The seethe level is steadily increasing on here as we get closer to polling day. There are going to be some epic meltdowns. Cannot wait. I think the good guys have accepted that Scotland will shame herself and send 45+ SNP MPs to Westminster - whose sole aim is to agitate and cause grievance to allow them to re-run their failed referendum. Whilst the rest of us work towards making the country better - your mob will try and break it apart.
aussieh Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 You mean the Labour candidates you said you'd vote for when Scotland becomes free?The very ones jye.
Psychedelicropcircle Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Trapper John quote October 14. Come may all this Indy shite will be forgotten.... Almost as good as Jim Iwontloseasingleseattothesnp Murphy! Hopefully that wee lassie pumps Doogie and saves mag half his life hunting Msm for all things negative SNP!
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The seethe level is steadily increasing on here as we get closer to polling day. There are going to be some epic meltdowns. Cannot wait. Indeed. Tory or Labour minority government - check SNP left on the sidelines - check
dobmisterdobster Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Federalism can only be achieved with Welsh, English and Northern Irish consent to reducing the role of Westminster in their affairs. It is not for one part with less than a tenth of the population of the UK to force that on the rest. Whilst I think that it is the best option the SNP are not the party to achieve it. All federal systems have a strong centre holding things together, the SNP don't want that and its hard to see why they'd go for it as it'd likely derail their plans for independence. The article is good because there's only so much sticking plasters you can have to stem talking about big issues. Britain should be in the EU and the anti-EU mob should be faced down strongly. Our politicians do need to review our role in the world. And they do also need to stop making it all about 1000 extra this and that will solve that and this. England and Scotland could be provinces. Wales and Northern Ireland could be territories. Or if the UK doesn't want to change, Scotland could work out a similar agreement to that of the Isle of Man or Channel Islands. The SNP are the only party proposing this kind of constitutional change. The UK is sticking plasters on Scotland, never mind the EU. Holyrood was a kiddies' Elastoplast on a wound that required stitches.
jambo1185 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Thats a great article on Plaid X2, thanks for posting.
IMac Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 England and Scotland could be provinces. Wales and Northern Ireland could be territories. Or if the UK doesn't want to change, Scotland could work out a similar agreement to that of the Isle of Man or Channel Islands. The SNP are the only party proposing this kind of constitutional change. The UK is sticking plasters on Scotland, never mind the EU. Holyrood was a kiddies' Elastoplast on a wound that required stitches. That just is not true.
dobmisterdobster Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 That just is not true. What part of my post are your referring to?
RosscoC Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 I think the good guys have accepted that Scotland will shame herself and send 45+ SNP MPs to Westminster - whose sole aim is to agitate and cause grievance to allow them to re-run their failed referendum. Whilst the rest of us work towards making the country better - your mob will try and break it apart. Soz.
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Only 37% of the electorate were sufficiently motivated to vote for independence. Would you accept "No" means NO after two ballots, 3 ballots, 4 ballots? But, even if you could conjure up another 14%, what then? Do you accept that those who voted "No" could press for another vote and attempt to overturn the result? The question was put to the people and the people answered with a "No" and that should be that "for a generation". No currency, no oil, no plan but we will be better off. Fantasy. And only 46% bothered to vote for the Union. So by your own stats, No hasn't won a majority either.
deesidejambo Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 And only 46% bothered to vote for the Union. So by your own stats, No hasn't won a majority either. So you are suggesting Yes won the referendum?
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 So you are suggesting Yes won the referendum? Of course not, but if figures are used to show a 37% Yes vote, it should equally be made apparent that NO never secured a majority of the electorate either. Elsewhere https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/04/19/tories-are-losing-both-air-war-and-ground-war/
Cade Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 "The SNP are shite" "Naw they urnae" "aye they ur" "naw they urnae" This thread is a total abortion
IMac Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 What part of my post are your referring to? The SNP are the only party proposing this kind of constitutional change. the SNP are not offering constitutional change. They want increased devolution and then they will talk about the next step in 2016. Only one party advocates a federal state.
2NaFish Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Of course not, but if figures are used to show a 37% Yes vote, it should equally be made apparent that NO never secured a majority of the electorate either. Elsewhere https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/04/19/tories-are-losing-both-air-war-and-ground-war/ Think you need to edit that link, Boris. There seems to be an extra / at the end which messes it up.
IMac Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Just looking at the todays Opinium poll. Interesting that the undecided isn't being reported. They have 15% as far as i can tell that are undecided and will vote. Still a lot to play for. Would be nice if the parties would talk issues and not worry about post vote negotiations until we know what the the numbers are.
jack D and coke Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The anti Scottish agenda gathers pace I see.
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 ImageUploadedByTapatalk1430122873.908120.jpg The anti Scottish agenda gathers pace I see. It's unbelievable the anti-Scottish sentiment being whipped up by the right wing media. So much for democracy, huh?
deesidejambo Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Of course not, but if figures are used to show a 37% Yes vote, it should equally be made apparent that NO never secured a majority of the electorate either. Elsewhere https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/04/19/tories-are-losing-both-air-war-and-ground-war/ I know, I was being mischevous just to annoy you. The underlying point is that Yes still seem to claim that somehow, they are the "45" and represent that as 45% of the Country. It isn't. Anyone who did not vote has no mandate either way so we are left with those who did vote to represent the countries wishes. And that was 55%. You shoudl not use non-voters as evidence that neither side had a majority. More of this on May 7th I expect.
RosscoC Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 It's unbelievable the anti-Scottish sentiment being whipped up by the right wing media. So much for democracy, huh? And those on here say the SNP is guilty of equating themselves with Scotland. The critics do exactly the same thing.
jack D and coke Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 It's unbelievable the anti-Scottish sentiment being whipped up by the right wing media. So much for democracy, huh? It's disgraceful tbh. Imagine ANY Scottish paper printing something similar about the English? Imo it's bringing out what they've always thought tbh. The mask has slipped.
dobmisterdobster Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Only one party advocates a federal state. A certain Democratic Liberal party?
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 I know, I was being mischevous just to annoy you. The underlying point is that Yes still seem to claim that somehow, they are the "45" and represent that as 45% of the Country. It isn't. Anyone who did not vote has no mandate either way so we are left with those who did vote to represent the countries wishes. And that was 55%. You shoudl not use non-voters as evidence that neither side had a majority. More of this on May 7th I expect. I totally accept the 55-45 result in the referendum. Actually, as a Yes voter, I am in some ways glad No did win as I wasn't over enamoured by the SNP's inability to guide the YES campaign properly and would have thought as a party with independence as its raison d'etre, they would have had a stronger argument re Europe, economy etc. But, if people wish to use figures based on the total electorate, then for the reasons of impartiality both sides need mentioned.
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Think you need to edit that link, Boris. There seems to be an extra / at the end which messes it up. Ta. https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/04/19/tories-are-losing-both-air-war-and-ground-war How's that?
2NaFish Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Ta. https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/04/19/tories-are-losing-both-air-war-and-ground-war How's that? Looking good
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/04/26/nicola-sturgeon-calls-theresa-may-utterly-stupid_n_7146854.html# More nonsense from our Southern friends and neighbours. Question to Mag, surely as a dyed in the wool Tory, comments like May's must make you cringe and see it as counter productive?
jambo1185 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Im sure they do, which is why Davidson was trying to dismiss them yesterday as she thinks they are ridiculous.
jambo1185 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Looking good Camerons body language and attitude over the past couple of days would suggest they have realised this and are changing tactic. Too little to late, or enough to save or swing a few marginals late in the day?
deesidejambo Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Camerons body language and attitude over the past couple of days would suggest they have realised this and are changing tactic. Too little to late, or enough to save or swing a few marginals late in the day? I can see frantic phone calls to Farage to sort out some tactical voting strategies. There will of course be the late swing to the Tories as the "silent Tories" cast their vote. Labour need to make a big push in Scotland though. Cue Milliband up here in the last few days. They should bring up Prescott & Old Labour folks also.
TheMaganator Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/04/26/nicola-sturgeon-calls-theresa-may-utterly-stupid_n_7146854.html# More nonsense from our Southern friends and neighbours. Question to Mag, surely as a dyed in the wool Tory, comments like May's must make you cringe and see it as counter productive? Yes. She's a nitwit. She's also come out with some utter drivel on immigration in the recent past. However - when the SNP are talking about shaking the Westminster foundations to their core I hardly think they can then get pant-wetty about Edward VIII comments.
jambo1185 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Oooft! TNS poll has SNP up two at 54 and Labour dowm two at 22. Tories shortly to be Scotlands second party? Probably not but it would give Mags something to be happy about.
Boris Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Yes. She's a nitwit. She's also come out with some utter drivel on immigration in the recent past. However - when the SNP are talking about shaking the Westminster foundations to their core I hardly think they can then get pant-wetty about Edward VIII comments. The two are hardly similar. One is about breathing life into politics, May's comments are entirely undemocratic. Even the DUP think so! http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/apr/26/conservative-party-is-losing-our-support-over-scotland-warns-dup But, if we are to follow May's logic, any Conservative Govt lacks legitimacy too!
jack D and coke Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 The two are hardly similar. One is about breathing life into politics, May's comments are entirely undemocratic. Even the DUP think so! http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/apr/26/conservative-party-is-losing-our-support-over-scotland-warns-dup But, if we are to follow May's logic, any Conservative Govt lacks legitimacy too! Nigel Dodds speaking a lot of sense there. Personally I've been very surprised by the amount of anti scots agenda is coming from both of the main parties and like Dodds says. WM is the party of the Union not an English one lie they're using it at the moment. If Scotland sends 50 SNP Mp's that is our right and they must deal with it.
XB52 Posted April 27, 2015 Posted April 27, 2015 Oooft! TNS poll has SNP up two at 54 and Labour dowm two at 22. Tories shortly to be Scotlands second party? Probably not but it would give Mags something to be happy about. I would love the Tories to be the 2nd biggest party in Scotland. Although I disagree with a lot/most of their policies, they are consistent. Labour have gone so far to the right to try and get the Middle England vote that they are not a labour party any more.
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.