Wigan James McLean refuses to wear poppy shirt

[Maroon Sailor]

 

And those that react to him and give him such press.

 

Human nature to react to something you find disrespectful

[Rudy T]

What James McLean and others like him should do is use their status to try and help eradicate discrimination and hate from their communities. I fail to see how anyone can "respect" his views when they are clearly borne out of religious hatred and intolerance. Bloody Sunday happened in 1972, here we are 42 years later, in that 42 years there have been 1000's of atrocities across the world, thousands of innocent people slaughtered. Yet on a day when we remember the 1.7 million fallen soldiers from over 150 countries who fought in two needless wars he chooses to turn this into some sort of "my people" versus "your people" debate.

 

He states he's a peaceful guy who promotes religious tolerance - why don't you prove it and stand up and say this has to stop now! No one is forcing you to or your people to wear a poppy, but make a statement that says you'd like to bring communities together to do something on remembrance day to unite people and promote peace. Its not some fanciful happy clapping view of the world that James McLean can bring world peace but every little bit helps and if he has the status within his community as a professional footballer then do something with it. What his statement really says is I'm a complete shitebag who will be ostracised if I wear that shirt.

 

Neil Lennon a man who has endured all sorts of religious hatred in his life wore a poppy, feck me even Uwe Rosler a german had one on, so how this halfwit McLean can claim any sort of moral high ground is beyond me. Dave Whelan should have told him get it on or your out on your arse, has James McLean any idea what the IRA did in Manchester for example.......I'm certain there were people in that crowd who were effected by that bombing yet Manchester still has close links with Ireland, they don't blame the people of Ireland for what happened. It's a disgrace that this idiot has been allowed to publicly do this. Also how come if he's from the North he plays for the republic??

[Phil Dunphy]

James MacLean is a bigot, there is no doubt about that.

 

He's the worst kind of bigot too, blaming others for his bigotry. He's an absolute ******* *****.

[Dinger Bell]

Well said Rudy T.

 

Totally sums up the situation perfectly.

[doctor jambo]

Britain fought wars for many reasons.

Freedom of speech is most certainly NOT one of them.

SO to defend his actions as " we fought to give him the right to freedom of speech"

No. we didn't.

In this country we have no right to absolute freedom of speech ingrained in law.

WW1 was protecting our land grab so we could oppress other nations and deny them their liberty

WW2 was stopping ourselves being conquered

none of it has ever been about freedom of speech/civil liberties

We have never attacked anyone becuase they oppressed women/gays/blacks and so on and so forth- its just never happened

We have NEVER launched a moral war

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Britain fought wars for many reasons.

Freedom of speech is most certainly NOT one of them.

SO to defend his actions as " we fought to give him the right to freedom of speech"

No. we didn't.

In this country we have no right to absolute freedom of speech ingrained in law.

WW1 was protecting our land grab so we could oppress other nations and deny them their liberty

WW2 was stopping ourselves being conquered

none of it has ever been about freedom of speech/civil liberties

We have never attacked anyone becuase they oppressed women/gays/blacks and so on and so forth- its just never happened

We have NEVER launched a moral war

I would like your definition of "moral" for starters.

 

Oh and Britain and the Empire went to war in WWII because Poland was invaded. If Britain had declared neutrality Hitler wouldn't have bothered trying an invasion in the first place.

[Socrates]

Can I make it clear, I have no problem with people's personal choice to wear/not wear the poppy.

 

But for someone like McLean who thinks so strongly on this matter to sign for a club who are known to adorn the poppy on their shirt at this time of year and then to spit the dummy out and write a letter do sent sit right with me.

 

S others have said they work for companies who support the poppy but don't make every employee wear one to work, unfortunately McLean decided to be employed by a company who for one game a year have made it well known that the players kit for that day will have a poppy adorned on it.

 

McLean makes it an issue.

 

No, in that case, if his employers required him to wear the poppy, then they would be making it an issue. Wigan aren't requiring him to wear a poppy, but you're deliberately choosing to ignore that so you can get to be offended.

[Socrates]

Neil Lennon a man who has endured all sorts of religious hatred in his life wore a poppy, feck me even Uwe Rosler a german had one on, so how this halfwit McLean can claim any sort of moral high ground is beyond me. Dave Whelan should have told him get it on or your out on your arse, has James McLean any idea what the IRA did in Manchester for example.......I'm certain there were people in that crowd who were effected by that bombing yet Manchester still has close links with Ireland, they don't blame the people of Ireland for what happened. It's a disgrace that this idiot has been allowed to publicly do this. Also how come if he's from the North he plays for the republic??

Are you really saying that employers should be allowed to sack people because they refuse to wear a poppy?

[Say What Again]

Off topic a little, but I'd urge some folk on this thread to look around them this time next year and see just how many poppies they spot. It's been described here as 3 week poppy fever, enforced patriotism, a remembrance contest etc. While that is probably true of some people, I'd suggest it's a tiny minority. Out with threads like these and the media, nobody else seems to be caught up in this 3 week fever.

 

I was at a funeral on Friday for a work colleague. He was ex RAF. The chapel was packed so I was standing facing all the seated people. I happened to notice 2 guys in RAF uniform weren't wearing poppies, so I looked around the rest. Of over 100 folk, I counted 3 wearing poppies.

 

In the pub yesterday the barman was wearing a poppy. I had a quick glance around and counted 2 more from around 30 customers.

 

No connection to James McLean, I just think folk are over estimating this supposed sudden explosion of poppy wearing/remembrance contests in recent years. I don't see it outwith Threads like these on football forums.

[2NaFish]

Are you really saying that employers should be allowed to sack people because they refuse to wear a poppy?

 

I find it stranger that he wants him to be banned from publicly explaining his reasons for not wearing a poppy. In fact, it's a 'disgrace' he's been allowed to explain himself.

 

All in all, it's an angry, impotent bitter rant

[Maroon Sailor]

How dare a footballer show disrespect and have to explain himself.

 

 

 

[2NaFish]

Yeah people really want to hear a complete **** like James McClean spew his bile about not wearing a poppy

 

Nobody is being forced to read an open letter. If people don't want to read it, then they won't. You want to read it. You want to be offended.

 

So much do you want to be offended, that you'll give the letter a cursory glance and then make up the content yourself and judge him on that. In summary, you want to deny him the right to an opinion but, when he has the temerity to explain himself, you'll ignore that opinion and then judge him based on your own bigotry.

 

In truth McLean probably is a bigot, but if you are going to have a go at him for that then you are a hypocrite.

[Maroon Sailor]

 

 

Nobody is being forced to read an open letter. If people don't want to read it, then they won't. You want to read it. You want to be offended.

 

So much do you want to be offended, that you'll give the letter a cursory glance and then make up the content yourself and judge him on that. In summary, you want to deny him the right to an opinion but, when he has the temerity to explain himself, you'll ignore that opinion and then judge him based on your own bigotry.

 

In truth McLean probably is a bigot, but if you are going to have a go at him for that then you are a hypocrite.

 

You honestly think he has the brains to write that letter ?

 

I'm not a bigot - I just find him disrespectful

[doctor jambo]

I would like your definition of "moral" for starters.

 

Oh and Britain and the Empire went to war in WWII because Poland was invaded. If Britain had declared neutrality Hitler wouldn't have bothered trying an invasion in the first place.

 

Moral war- we have never been to war to defend civil liberties/freedom of speech/free women from oppression/ stop homophobia/racism/ democracy and so on and so forth.

 

And , in my opinion, we went into WW2 becuase we saw where it was going this time, and who was going to be next and so forth.

It had diddly squat to do with Poland ( as evidenced by the fact at the end of the war we let Russia keep them)

[2NaFish]

You honestly think he has the brains to write that letter ?

 

I'm not a bigot - I just find him disrespectful

 

But it's based on the fact that you're not judging him based on what he's said. You're judging him based on your invented opinion of him. It's nothing but bigotry and prejudice.

[Rudy T]

 

 

Are you really saying that employers should be allowed to sack people because they refuse to wear a poppy?

 

If his reason had any merit and not based on a clear agenda of hate then no he shouldn't be sacked. Given they fly in the face of everything the sport is trying to irradiate then yes he should be. His letter explains nothing but a personal prejudice fuelled by hatred. Should that be tolerated by his club? Would you like a Hearts player to show that sort of prejudice? If you're being sucked in by this being a stance against wearing a poppy then James McLean's got one over on you. The poppy wearing is just an excuse to promote a cause which has no place in todays society, if we had a player who refused to wear a "Kick Racism Out" tee-shirt because "his people" didn't like it would you say ah well its his choice?

 

 

 

[Maroon Sailor]

 

 

 

But it's based on the fact that you're not judging him based on what he's said. You're judging him based on your invented opinion of him. It's nothing but bigotry and prejudice.

 

My invented opinion of him ?

 

What have I invented ?

 

My opinion of him is shared by a lot of people.

 

You could say he has an invented opinion of what the poppy stands for

[2NaFish]

My invented opinion of him ?

 

What have I invented ?

 

My opinion of him is shared by a lot of people.

 

You could say he has an invented opinion of what the poppy stands for

 

He has published a letter. You have dismissed the content of the letter and are now judging him by stuff you've created.

[doctor jambo]

At the end of the day it would be better if Mclean could do the decent thing and wear the poppy as a symbol of healing between the communities.

If the Queen and Martin Mcguiness could break bread together at her hoose, I'm pretty sure he could wear a poppy, and do an open letter explaing that the troubles are over, grudges should be put aside, and healing should take place

Wearing the poppy is not a political act- it is not devisive nor offensive

Not wearing it- in his case - most certainly is, as is his open letter

[Maroon Sailor]

 

 

He has published a letter. You have dismissed the content of the letter and are now judging him by stuff you've created.

 

Do you believe everything you read ?

 

I've dismissed the content of it because I think it's bullshit

[2NaFish]

Do you believe everything you read ?

 

I've dismissed the content of it because I think it's bullshit

 

And the reason you think it's bullshit is because of your bigotry and prejudice.

 

Be careful when hunting monsters, lest ye become one yourself.

 

I'm gonna pop you on ignore now. James McLean's bigotry, perceived or otherwise, is passive and I can pass through life without encountering it. Yours is active, so i have to make steps to avoid it.

[Thomaso]

Whether he is a bigot for not wearing a poppy, or others are bigots because they complain, I find his action pathetic!

[i8hibsh]

He is an attention sekeing little *****

 

Yes, he has every right to not wear one but someone also has a right to not doff your hat to an oncoming hearse. Sadly, it just shows him up for being a disrespectful little prick. Let's cut to the chase here, the poppy (although widely regarded for all conflicts) is really just for WW1 rememberence and nothing more. Tens of thousands of his feleow countrymen (Ireland) fell side by side with our soldiers.

 

Fud.

[Optimus Prime]

Off topic a little, but I'd urge some folk on this thread to look around them this time next year and see just how many poppies they spot. It's been described here as 3 week poppy fever, enforced patriotism, a remembrance contest etc. While that is probably true of some people, I'd suggest it's a tiny minority. Out with threads like these and the media, nobody else seems to be caught up in this 3 week fever.

 

I was at a funeral on Friday for a work colleague. He was ex RAF. The chapel was packed so I was standing facing all the seated people. I happened to notice 2 guys in RAF uniform weren't wearing poppies, so I looked around the rest. Of over 100 folk, I counted 3 wearing poppies.

 

In the pub yesterday the barman was wearing a poppy. I had a quick glance around and counted 2 more from around 30 customers.

 

No connection to James McLean, I just think folk are over estimating this supposed sudden explosion of poppy wearing/remembrance contests in recent years. I don't see it outwith Threads like these on football forums.

 

I was going to post something similar. Folk should open their eyes when they're out on the street, i'd say that poppy wearing is less than 10% of the general public. There's either a lot of apathy, a general unease with the current poppy culture or both amongst a large silent majority in this country.

[Optimus Prime]

I would like your definition of "moral" for starters.

 

Oh and Britain and the Empire went to war in WWII because Poland was invaded. If Britain had declared neutrality Hitler wouldn't have bothered trying an invasion in the first place.

 

Just like he never bothered invading the USSR after signing a non agression pact

[XB52]

jeezo JKB is hard work some times. Just looked round the office and I am the only one who is wearing a poppy. That makes them all bigots and they should be sacked

[doctor jambo]

I was going to post something similar. Folk should open their eyes when they're out on the street, i'd say that poppy wearing is less than 10% of the general public. There's either a lot of apathy, a general unease with the current poppy culture or both amongst a large silent majority in this country.

 

Perhaps its because its become another "London Thing"

[SE16 3LN]

Perhaps its because its become another "London Thing"

I know you're joking, but I don't think others will know why.

 

I've hardly seen a poppy worn in London by anyone other than those who have come into the city for remembrance services. The majority of people living in London don't identify with British military campaigns and many don't even know what the whole poppy thing is about.

 

Six people who attended by daughters school in the past 12 years have been identified as Islamic state fighters. Three died fighting in Syria, two are in jail and one is missing.

 

Four people were arrested a couple of weeks ago within half a mile of my London home for alleged terrorist offences connected to Islamic state. I either knew or knew the families of all of them.

 

Yesterday I went to visit the grave of a young man from Paddington who was killed in Afghanistan four years ago. His family were all Irish or London Irish, were wearing the poppy and someone from each generation had a distinguished military career that could be traced back to the first word war.

 

I post this for no other reason than to say, there ain't half a lot of b******s being talked on this thread.

[niblick1874]

 

 

I was going to post something similar. Folk should open their eyes when they're out on the street, i'd say that poppy wearing is less than 10% of the general public. There's either a lot of apathy, a general unease with the current poppy culture or both amongst a large silent majority in this country.

Less people affected by war could be another one.

[Creepy Lurker]

For me the 'Remembrance Craze' isn't so much about poppies suddenly being everywhere as an attitude among some individuals - usually individuals with a political agenda - of wanting to appropriate it into a part of a broader movement, generally linked to 'supporting our troops' (ie those involved in modern day conflicts) and the upholding of what are held to be 'British values', which all too often leads to xenophobia. The berating of those who choose not to wear a poppy is a part of that. It turns it into a situation of 'us and them', 'them' being those who don't share the values that we hold to be 'right'. The issue here isn't so much James McLean not wanting to wear a poppy as his having been asked to do so by an employer in the first place. Wearing a poppy is a political statement. It's a political statement with which not many reasonable people would disagree, but it's a political statement all the same. Employers shouldn't be asking employees to make political statements even if they are reasonable ones. If Wigan hadn't asked McLean to wear a poppy in the first place then he wouldn't have refused, he wouldn't have had to justify himself (bearing in mind that he did so only after he'd been criticised) and the whole situation would've been avoided. FWIW, after some Google searching as advised by Geoff Kilpatrick I've come to the conclusion that he may well be something of a bigot. If that's the case, however, then he should be getting this kind of treatment only after having done something which is in itself bigoted, not after having exercised the choice to not do something he shouldn't have been required to do anyway. It's also worth pointing out that what he said in the letter isn't necessarily a pack of lies: he could indeed be a bigot and still respect those who died fighting in the World Wars.

 

As I said, I've chosen not to wear a poppy this year because I'm uncomfortable with the way that it seems to have been appropriated into a kind of state sponsored ideology. I'm also uncomfortable with my decision not to wear a poppy: I do respect those who died in past wars, and indeed those who are fighting in modern day wars (not in the exact same way, but I have respect for the fact that they're ordinary people in often horrible circumstances), and I'm not convinced that the best way to deal with the appropriation of a symbol by unsavoury elements is to abandon it to them as I've effectively done.

 

A final point is that someone said earlier on this thread that 'the poppy is really only about the world wars, regardless of the fact that some people see it as also relating to modern day conflicts' (I'm paraphrasing here). This is incorrect and shows a lack of understanding of how symbols work. Their meanings aren't static; they evolve over time depending on who uses them and to what end. Primarily I still see the poppy as a symbol of something positive, and as I've said I'm not sure if I've made the right decision in not wearing one.

[151]

jeezo JKB is hard work some times. Just looked round the office and I am the only one who is wearing a poppy. That makes them all bigots and they should be sacked

 

I obviously have no idea where you work however its a completely diffrent scenario.

 

If a supermarkets employees choose not to wear a poppy on their uniform its not really disrespectful is it, they may just not have thought to get one or whatever.

 

However if said supermarket brought out a t shirt for those two weeks for employees to wear which had the poppy adorned on it, and someone refused to wear it - that is where the disrespect comes in.

 

imo.

 

edit: im not implying you work in a supermarket , it was just an example.

[Kiwidoug]

At the end of the day it would be better if Mclean could do the decent thing and wear the poppy as a symbol of healing between the communities.

If the Queen and Martin Mcguiness could break bread together at her hoose, I'm pretty sure he could wear a poppy, and do an open letter explaing that the troubles are over, grudges should be put aside, and healing should take place

Wearing the poppy is not a political act- it is not devisive nor offensive

Not wearing it- in his case - most certainly is, as is his open letter

 

Totally agree. I'm sure it's his support of the Real IRA which brings about his stance. Not that he would put that in his letter of course.

 

Anyway, couldn't care less what he does or doesn't do but hope he never sets foot in Tynecastle.

 

And from what I've seen of him he's a rubbish player.

[Creepy Lurker]

 

 

I obviously have no idea where you work however its a completely diffrent scenario.

 

If a supermarkets employees choose not to wear a poppy on their uniform its not really disrespectful is it, they may just not have thought to get one or whatever.

 

However if said supermarket brought out a t shirt for those two weeks for employees to wear which had the poppy adorned on it, and someone refused to wear it - that is where the disrespect comes in.

 

imo.

 

edit: im not implying you work in a supermarket , it was just an example.

 

In that situation, the supermarket would absolutely be in the wrong.

[redm]

Simply, of all weeks, this is a time to respect other peoples views, and to act with dignity.

 

This. Very much this.

[scott_jambo]

For me the 'Remembrance Craze' isn't so much about poppies suddenly being everywhere as an attitude among some individuals - usually individuals with a political agenda - of wanting to appropriate it into a part of a broader movement, generally linked to 'supporting our troops' (ie those involved in modern day conflicts) and the upholding of what are held to be 'British values', which all too often leads to xenophobia. The berating of those who choose not to wear a poppy is a part of that. It turns it into a situation of 'us and them', 'them' being those who don't share the values that we hold to be 'right'. The issue here isn't so much James McLean not wanting to wear a poppy as his having been asked to do so by an employer in the first place. Wearing a poppy is a political statement. It's a political statement with which not many reasonable people would disagree, but it's a political statement all the same. Employers shouldn't be asking employees to make political statements even if they are reasonable ones. If Wigan hadn't asked McLean to wear a poppy in the first place then he wouldn't have refused, he wouldn't have had to justify himself (bearing in mind that he did so only after he'd been criticised) and the whole situation would've been avoided. FWIW, after some Google searching as advised by Geoff Kilpatrick I've come to the conclusion that he may well be something of a bigot. If that's the case, however, then he should be getting this kind of treatment only after having done something which is in itself bigoted, not after having exercised the choice to not do something he shouldn't have been required to do anyway. It's also worth pointing out that what he said in the letter isn't necessarily a pack of lies: he could indeed be a bigot and still respect those who died fighting in the World Wars.

 

As I said, I've chosen not to wear a poppy this year because I'm uncomfortable with the way that it seems to have been appropriated into a kind of state sponsored ideology. I'm also uncomfortable with my decision not to wear a poppy: I do respect those who died in past wars, and indeed those who are fighting in modern day wars (not in the exact same way, but I have respect for the fact that they're ordinary people in often horrible circumstances), and I'm not convinced that the best way to deal with the appropriation of a symbol by unsavoury elements is to abandon it to them as I've effectively done.

 

A final point is that someone said earlier on this thread that 'the poppy is really only about the world wars, regardless of the fact that some people see it as also relating to modern day conflicts' (I'm paraphrasing here). This is incorrect and shows a lack of understanding of how symbols work. Their meanings aren't static; they evolve over time depending on who uses them and to what end. Primarily I still see the poppy as a symbol of something positive, and as I've said I'm not sure if I've made the right decision in not wearing one.

 

A fantastic post. Best i've read on here in a long time.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

Moral war- we have never been to war to defend civil liberties/freedom of speech/free women from oppression/ stop homophobia/racism/ democracy and so on and so forth.

 

And , in my opinion, we went into WW2 becuase we saw where it was going this time, and who was going to be next and so forth.

It had diddly squat to do with Poland ( as evidenced by the fact at the end of the war we let Russia keep them)

Those are the only morals that matter? How about Bosnia, Kosovo and Sierra Leone to prevent genocide? Is that not moral?

 

Your comment about letting the Soviets "keep" Poland is laughable. We didn't win the war on our own but our resistance allowed others to come in and eventually overcome the Nazis.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

Just like he never bothered invading the USSR after signing a non agression pact

Hitler saw Britons as equivalent to his race in his warped view. Slavs were not.

[Back to 2005]

To me wearing a poppy is a show of respect. No idea how it could be described as political it's just basic respect. MCLean had no need to issue a statement other than to make a political point however. It's unlikely it would have even been newsworthy unless he had chosen to do so.

[Maroon Sailor]

 

For me the 'Remembrance Craze' isn't so much about poppies suddenly being everywhere as an attitude among some individuals - usually individuals with a political agenda - of wanting to appropriate it into a part of a broader movement, generally linked to 'supporting our troops' (ie those involved in modern day conflicts) and the upholding of what are held to be 'British values', which all too often leads to xenophobia. The berating of those who choose not to wear a poppy is a part of that. It turns it into a situation of 'us and them', 'them' being those who don't share the values that we hold to be 'right'. The issue here isn't so much James McLean not wanting to wear a poppy as his having been asked to do so by an employer in the first place. Wearing a poppy is a political statement. It's a political statement with which not many reasonable people would disagree, but it's a political statement all the same. Employers shouldn't be asking employees to make political statements even if they are reasonable ones. If Wigan hadn't asked McLean to wear a poppy in the first place then he wouldn't have refused, he wouldn't have had to justify himself (bearing in mind that he did so only after he'd been criticised) and the whole situation would've been avoided. FWIW, after some Google searching as advised by Geoff Kilpatrick I've come to the conclusion that he may well be something of a bigot. If that's the case, however, then he should be getting this kind of treatment only after having done something which is in itself bigoted, not after having exercised the choice to not do something he shouldn't have been required to do anyway. It's also worth pointing out that what he said in the letter isn't necessarily a pack of lies: he could indeed be a bigot and still respect those who died fighting in the World Wars.

 

As I said, I've chosen not to wear a poppy this year because I'm uncomfortable with the way that it seems to have been appropriated into a kind of state sponsored ideology. I'm also uncomfortable with my decision not to wear a poppy: I do respect those who died in past wars, and indeed those who are fighting in modern day wars (not in the exact same way, but I have respect for the fact that they're ordinary people in often horrible circumstances), and I'm not convinced that the best way to deal with the appropriation of a symbol by unsavoury elements is to abandon it to them as I've effectively done.

 

A final point is that someone said earlier on this thread that 'the poppy is really only about the world wars, regardless of the fact that some people see it as also relating to modern day conflicts' (I'm paraphrasing here). This is incorrect and shows a lack of understanding of how symbols work. Their meanings aren't static; they evolve over time depending on who uses them and to what end. Primarily I still see the poppy as a symbol of something positive, and as I've said I'm not sure if I've made the right decision in not wearing one.

 

I don't think wearing a poppy is a political statement. Never have done.

 

It's a symbol of remembrance as far as I'm concerned. I haven't got any agenda when it comes to showing my appreciation publicly once a year for those that didn't return.

[2NaFish]

I don't think some people appreciate what creepy means when he says it's political. It's not party political, but it makes a statement about how someone sees the world and how things ought to be.

 

All art is political.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

I don't think some people appreciate what creepy means when he says it's political. It's not party political, but it makes a statement about how someone sees the world and how things ought to be.

 

All art is political.

I think it means different things to different people. In my case, it is personal rather than "political".

[2NaFish]

 

 

I think it means different things to different people. In my case, it is personal rather than "political".

 

surely the other side of the coin to political is private, not personal? its a personal political statement certainly.

 

Some people seem to claim the poppy is some kind of uniform universal view - but this thread's existence proves that isn't the case.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

surely the other side of the coin to political is private, not personal? its a personal political statement certainly.

 

Some people seem to claim the poppy is some kind of uniform universal view - but this thread's existence proves that isn't the case.

Call it what you want. The point is that when I wear mine I am not making a statement.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

Am I right in believing ICT, Hamilton, Partick Thistle, Falkirk, Hibs all never had poppies on their shirts at the weekend ??.

Am I right in believing it doesn't fecking matter if they did or not?

[2NaFish]

 

 

Call it what you want. The point is that when I wear mine I am not making a statement.

 

if it wasn't making a statement there would be no point wearing it. it does and you are.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

if it wasn't making a statement there would be no point wearing it. it does and you are.

Thanks for letting me know. I obviously don't know my own mind.

[2NaFish]

 

 

Thanks for letting me know. I obviously don't know my own mind.

 

we've already established it's personal but not private. therefore your own mind is inconsequential. Whether you wear it is your choice, what it represents is a matter for the public sphere.

[The White Cockade]

Am I right in believing ICT, Hamilton, Partick Thistle, Falkirk, Hibs all never had poppies on their shirts at the weekend ??.

 

It's only the last few years that Hearts or any other club had a poppy on their shirt

I wore a poppy then and do now and not sure there should be a poppy on the jersey

A perfecetly observed two minute silence means a lot more

Totally personal thing and I wish the point scoring on here would stop

In fact in truth the point scoring is basically an own goal as regards Respect and Remembrance

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

we've already established it's personal but not private. therefore your own mind is inconsequential. Whether you wear it is your choice, what it represents is a matter for the public sphere.

Keep that patronisation flowing...

[2NaFish]

Keep that patronisation flowing...

 

If you want to make a point to prove me wrong, go ahead. Patronizing or not, i'm right. Wearing a poppy is a political statement, and you feeling it's not doesnt change that.