Joe Savage leaves Hearts ( updated )

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Shooter McGavin said:

The zoomers will argue that the sporting director role has nothing to do with the football side of things, and that he was just wandering about twiddling his thumbs and making coffees.
 

Those sensible among us can see that we’ve went from a Championship level squad, to expecting 3rd, expecting to make inroads in Europe & be in with a chance of winning trophies. Joe has played a huge part in that.

 

And under him we signed our first ever PFA player of the year, SPFL player of the year, SPFL top scorer, back-to-back 20+ goals striker who’s only a few away from being our all-time European scorer, for less than £400k…

 

Only a zoomer would believe Savage was instrumental in Shanks' signing when Neilson had him at DUFC - and of course the manager always has the final say.

[GinRummy]

It’s been explained a few times what he was in charge of and the contract negotiations part. 
 

What I don’t get is what he actually done on a day to day basis. During the transfer window I could see him being busy but out with that, he comes into his work on a Monday morning sits at his desk…then what?

[innerjambo]

Just now, GinRummy said:

It’s been explained a few times what he was in charge of and the contract negotiations part. 
 

What I don’t get is what he actually done on a day to day basis. During the transfer window I could see him being busy but out with that, he comes into his work on a Monday morning sits at his desk…then what?

 

I would bet his duties were far beyond what you have stated, but unless we can see what his full job remit was, it's all guesswork. 

[EH11 2NL]

Savage done really well for Hearts, you can't have a run of seasons like we have had recently (Europe 3 times running for the first time ever? 3rd, 4th, 3rd place league finishes being the most consistent since like the 50s), without a key person within the club having done well. If Savage had been shite, it would of been same old from when he took over. The few seasons before Savage came in were a nightmare, he has hugely helped to turn that around.

 

I'd suggest those that can't see it can't get over their personal dislike for him. There does seem to be a trend, Neilson Shite, Savage Shite, Naisy Shite for first 6 months, Amazing the results we've managed to put together over the last 4 season with all these shite employees. 

[wavydavy]

1 hour ago, Bull's-eye said:

He's no longer at the club and sorry to say it but i haven't seen anything remarkable about his tenure.

 

Football is still as dull as dishwater, we can quite clearly attract better players these days due to financial security and fantastic management by the Board above him.

 

If his job was to improve the Football side of the business then id say hes failed, also allowed a manager to lose the plot completely under his watchful eye.

 

Overall gets pass marks but with an empty trophy cabinet nothing to write home about.

 

Appreciate the hard work and hope you are happier elsewhere. Bye.

 

 

 

Surely that is due to the tactics and will of the players.

 

Look at the players England have to choose from and yet you can hardly say they were entertaining to watch. Their problem in my opinion was down to their manager and his fear of losing.

 

His job was to bring in the best players available within the clubs budget and those that the Manager approved of.

 

I think he has gained pass marks on that front and there is no doubting his hard work.

[Bill Sikes]

23 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

Surely that is due to the tactics and will of the players.

 

Look at the players England have to choose from and yet you can hardly say they were entertaining to watch. Their problem in my opinion was down to their manager and his fear of losing.

 

His job was to bring in the best players available within the clubs budget and those that the Manager approved of.

 

I think he has gained pass marks on that front and there is no doubting his hard work.

 

Pretty sure at the start of Savages tenure he talked a lot about all teams through the age groups playing the same way, something he believed in and would be actioning.

 

Theres a 101 reasons why the England national team, also the Scottish national team are poor on the eye, Joe Savage aint one of them.

 

I dont believe for one minute Joe Savage put a structure in place for Joe Savage leaving either.

 

Worked incredibly hard as far as im aware so no issue really, im not going to kid on he's pulled up any trees and stuck any Silverware in the cabinet though.

 

He's gone, I'm over it.

 

 

[Valois No1]

Savage did well. A good solid appointment. He’s left now. Close thread.

[Jack Torrance]

Be interesting to see where Joe ends up next. Hopefully Will Lancefield is settled here for now.

[cosanostra]

58 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

 

He said Bob had the 'final say' on signings but he was clearly only saying that to make him feel included. 

 

So you do think he was lying. Fair enough. There were direct quotes from him saying that he's no idea why fans blame him for bad signings because those decisions were not down to him. If you think he's lying though, you're unlikely to believe that either.

[Penrices left boot]

1 hour ago, cosanostra said:

 

Robbie or Naismith. 

All of our players have been their choices according to Savage.

 

Correct.

 

Savage isn't a scout either, he has the over arching role of dof.

He helps employs scouts, Managers across all teams and likley has accountability over spending and being strategic.

 

Scouts, scout players. 

Managers choose and manage players.

Savages role  is more closer to board operations than actual football on the pitch.

Savages day job wasn't going to scout players and then choose them?

Surely folk don't think that?

 

 

Edited July 20, 2024 by Bazzas right boot

[Bad Religion]

1 minute ago, cosanostra said:

 

So you do think he was lying. Fair enough. There were direct quotes from him saying that he's no idea why fans blame him for bad signings because those decisions were not down to him. If you think he's lying though, you're unlikely to believe that either.

 

Or you could simply compare the quality of player signed pre and post Savage joining and that might clarify things for you. 

[cosanostra]

Just now, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Correct.

 

Savage isn't a scout either, he has the over arching role of dof.

He helps employs scouts, Managers across all teams and likley has accountability over spending.

 

Scouts, scout players. 

Managers choose and manage players.

 

Savages role  is more closer to board operations than actual football on the pitch.

 

Savages day job wasn't going to scout players and then choose them?

Surely folk don't think that?

 

 

 

I'd say a large percentage of Hearts fans do think exactly that. 

If anyone can be arsed, just take a look at previous JS threads and see the level of abuse and blame for signing Kio, Kuol, Oda, the Australians etc.

It's completely crazy but some Hearts fans actually hate the bloke.

[cosanostra]

4 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

 

Or you could simply compare the quality of player signed pre and post Savage joining and that might clarify things for you. 

 

It's definitely been better so the recruitment system has been more efficient.

[Penrices left boot]

1 hour ago, GinRummy said:

It’s been explained a few times what he was in charge of and the contract negotiations part. 
 

What I don’t get is what he actually done on a day to day basis. During the transfer window I could see him being busy but out with that, he comes into his work on a Monday morning sits at his desk…then what?

 

He was accountable for all teams and age groups.

Planning will be months if not years ahead with the push for consistent improvement. 

He'd have at least  4/5 heads ( eva, Naismith,  bteam, youth teams, scout teams, medical, etc reporting to him daily and He'd be supporting/ advising them.

Commercial/ financial would be a big part as well. Probably speaks with Hr, nutrition,  charity, media, fan bodies etc and all other depts as well over the month.

Then the transfers,  negotiations and discussions will be all year round with plans in place constantly evolving.

 

Not enough hours in the day tbh, a massive role especially with us the last 3 years as we've been progressing rapidly and not stood still.

 

Be a great job, but 100% all the time.

 

A bit  daft to not know what keeps him busy tbh.

[Des Lynam]

1 hour ago, GinRummy said:

It’s been explained a few times what he was in charge of and the contract negotiations part. 
 

What I don’t get is what he actually done on a day to day basis. During the transfer window I could see him being busy but out with that, he comes into his work on a Monday morning sits at his desk…then what?

Logs into JKB. 

[wavydavy]

49 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Pretty sure at the start of Savages tenure he talked a lot about all teams through the age groups playing the same way, something he believed in and would be actioning.

 

Theres a 101 reasons why the England national team, also the Scottish national team are poor on the eye, Joe Savage aint one of them.

 

I dont believe for one minute Joe Savage put a structure in place for Joe Savage leaving either.

 

Worked incredibly hard as far as im aware so no issue really, im not going to kid on he's pulled up any trees and stuck any Silverware in the cabinet though.

 

He's gone, I'm over it.

 

 

 

I never suggested he was .

[GinRummy]

24 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

He was accountable for all teams and age groups.

Planning will be months if not years ahead with the push for consistent improvement. 

He'd have at least  4/5 heads ( eva, Naismith,  bteam, youth teams, scout teams, medical, etc reporting to him daily and He'd be supporting/ advising them.

Commercial/ financial would be a big part as well. Probably speaks with Hr, nutrition,  charity, media, fan bodies etc and all other depts as well over the month.

Then the transfers,  negotiations and discussions will be all year round with plans in place constantly evolving.

 

Not enough hours in the day tbh, a massive role especially with us the last 3 years as we've been progressing rapidly and not stood still.

 

Be a great job, but 100% all the time.

 

A bit  daft to not know what keeps him busy tbh.

So what are all those departments and people going to do come Monday when he’s not there anymore. Surely the whole club will be really badly affected until we find a replacement.  
 

 

[Lone Striker]

2 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

i haven't seen anything remarkable about his tenure.

Football is still as dull as dishwater, we can quite clearly attract better players these days due to financial security and fantastic management by the Board above him.

If his job was to improve the Football side of the business then id say hes failed

Overall gets pass marks but with an empty trophy cabinet nothing to write home about.

 

 

 

Do you actually watch  any Hearts matches ?    Or are you just on the wind-up ?

[Bad Religion]

29 minutes ago, cosanostra said:

 

It's definitely been better so the recruitment system has been more efficient.

I’m unsure of your use of the word ‘efficient’ but at least you seem to agree that the overall quality of signings has improved since Joe has been at the club. 

[cheetah]

18 hours ago, John Findlay said:

Thanks for your time at Hearts Joe.

 

 

All we asked was that he did his best. 😋

[Shooter McGavin]

1 hour ago, JamboAl said:

Only a zoomer would believe Savage was instrumental in Shanks' signing when Neilson had him at DUFC - and of course the manager always has the final say.

He quite literally was instrumental in Shanks signing 😂
 

Neilson wanted him, it was then handed over to Savage to deal with his agent, speak to the club, negotiate a price, negotiate the wages etc. 

 

That was pretty much his key role at the club.

[Bill Sikes]

30 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Do you actually watch  any Hearts matches ?    Or are you just on the wind-up ?

 

All of them.

 

The standard of Football isn't great, to kid on it is, is delusional.

 

 

 

 

 

[cosanostra]

37 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

I’m unsure of your use of the word ‘efficient’ but at least you seem to agree that the overall quality of signings has improved since Joe has been at the club. 

 

Definitely agree. I think he'll be a loss.

[Lone Striker]

8 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

All of them.

 

The standard of Football isn't great, to kid on it is, is delusional.

 

 

 

 

 

What other club's "standard" of football  would you like us to copy or match ?

 

 

Edited July 20, 2024 by Lone Striker

[JamboAl]

26 minutes ago, Shooter McGavin said:

He quite literally was instrumental in Shanks signing 😂
 

Neilson wanted him, it was then handed over to Savage to deal with his agent, speak to the club, negotiate a price, negotiate the wages etc. 

 

That was pretty much his key role at the club.

But he was a Neilson signing.

So what if Savage was involved?  The typist who typed up the contract was alos instrumental by that reasoning.

[Bill Sikes]

11 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

What other club's "standard" of football  would you like us to copy or match ?

 

 

 

Id rather we didnt copy anybody and came up with a masterplan to excite the support and win every week.

 

Back in the real world the standard of Football on show is poor.

 

In fact, I'd say the level of frustration emanating from the stands last season is some of the worse ive heard for years.

 

Just to clarify for the hard of thinking, frustration is different from abuse.

 

 

[soonbe110]

3 hours ago, Shooter McGavin said:

At the end of the day, he might not have actively been out scouting the players, but he was the guy tasked with selling the club to players, getting the deals over the line and getting them in the door.

Shanklands relationship with Neilson was primary reason  he came to Hearts. Recruitment team thought he was a poor signing at the time. 

[soonbe110]

55 minutes ago, Shooter McGavin said:

He quite literally was instrumental in Shanks signing 😂
 

Neilson wanted him, it was then handed over to Savage to deal with his agent, speak to the club, negotiate a price, negotiate the wages etc. 

 

That was pretty much his key role at the club.

Eventually it happened. After weeks of procrastination because the recruitment team didn’t think his stats were good enough and they could find better but didn’t.  The procrastination between manager and recruitment team cost us a lot of players at that time, Satka, Koroma and Hirst being some of the other players that Neilson thought he was getting that never turned up. 

[Shooter McGavin]

21 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

But he was a Neilson signing.

So what if Savage was involved?  The typist who typed up the contract was alos instrumental by that reasoning.

It’s okay mate, if you don’t think the person who speaks to agents, speaks to clubs, manages our transfer budget, negotiates the fees and wages, is instrumental in signing players then that’s cool.

 

Also, I’ve never suggested Savage’s job was to find players if that’s the angle you’re trying to take here.

[Shooter McGavin]

12 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Shanklands relationship with Neilson was primary reason  he came to Hearts. Recruitment team thought he was a poor signing at the time. 

First of me hearing anything like that, if I’m honest.

 

If there’s any sources or articles you could direct me to to have a look into that it would be much appreciated 👍🏻

[JamboAl]

17 minutes ago, Shooter McGavin said:

It’s okay mate, if you don’t think the person who speaks to agents, speaks to clubs, manages our transfer budget, negotiates the fees and wages, is instrumental in signing players then that’s cool.

 

Also, I’ve never suggested Savage’s job was to find players if that’s the angle you’re trying to take here.

The angle I'm taking is that JS seems to have provided the support work which he would have done if we'd signed Joe Bloggs and maybe someone else in his position could have negotiated terms more beneficial to Hearts.  We'll never know.

You seemed to claim the signing was a Savage signing.

The identification was , more than likely, down to Neilson, and as Head Coach he would have had the final say anyway.

Edited July 20, 2024 by JamboAl

[Bad Religion]

11 minutes ago, Shooter McGavin said:

First of me hearing anything like that, if I’m honest.

 

If there’s any sources or articles you could direct me to to have a look into that it would be much appreciated 👍🏻

He is a fantasist.  

[john thomas]

34 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Id rather we didnt copy anybody and came up with a masterplan to excite the support and win every week.

 

Back in the real world the standard of Football on show is poor.

 

In fact, I'd say the level of frustration emanating from the stands last season is some of the worse ive heard for years.

 

Just to clarify for the hard of thinking, frustration is different from abuse.

 

 

It really isn't.

When fans get frustrated they abuse players/team .

When 'hard of thinking' phrase is used you can almost guarantee BS is on its way 

[Shooter McGavin]

3 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

The angle I'm taking is that JS seems to have provided the support work which he would have done if we'd signed Joe Bloggs and maybe someone else in his position could have negotiated terms more beneficial to Hearts.  We'll never know.

You seemed to claim the signing was a Savage signing.

The identification was , more than likely, down to Neilson, and as Head Coach he would have had the final say anyway.

I have never claimed he was a Savage signing.

 

If you think anybody can takeover his position, and deal with agents, clubs, budgets, negotiations, then you’ll need to get your application in.

 

In a way, I kind of wish recruitment in football is as simple as it is in your head 😂

[Penrices left boot]

1 hour ago, GinRummy said:

So what are all those departments and people going to do come Monday when he’s not there anymore. Surely the whole club will be really badly affected until we find a replacement.  
 

 

 

Not if everyone continues to do their day to day job in the short term.

Be Moreton OK.

 

Long term having no one in charge would have a bad effect,  as it would on any business. 

 

Can't believe that needs explained.

 

Be like an area manager leaving, in short term the local teams get on with it and pick up a bit slack,  but long term culture, kpi's, accountability etc would go to the way side.

 

Really isn't rocket science. 

 

 

[GinRummy]

Just now, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Not if everyone continues to do their day to day job in the short term.

Be Moreton OK.

 

Long term having no one in charge would have a bad effect,  as it would on any business. 

 

Can't believe that needs explained.

 

Be like an area manager leaving, in short term the local teams get on with it and pick up a bit slack,  but long term culture, kpi's, accountability etc would go to the way side.

 

Really isn't rocket science. 

 

 

I doubt he’ll be replaced. Don’t get me wrong the club was in a bit of a mess when he took over and he was no doubt a massive factor in fixing it. 
 

I can’t see why McKinlay and the recruitment guys can’t take it from here and I’m pretty sure that’s what will happen.  

[Penrices left boot]

2 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

Logs into JKB. 

 

Yip, gets the expert advice in-

 

Legal

Finance 

Transfers

Wumunz team

Tactics and formation 

Medical 

Stadium expansion 

Hotel fire safety

( list is not exhaustive)

 

Then after sifting through it all he passes on the advice to the relevant folk.

 

Better he does this than 20 folk waste their time looking for their area.

 

 

[Penrices left boot]

1 minute ago, GinRummy said:

I doubt he’ll be replaced. Don’t get me wrong the club was in a bit of a mess when he took over and he was no doubt a massive factor in fixing it. 
 

I can’t see why McKinlay and the recruitment guys can’t take it from here and I’m pretty sure that’s what will happen.  

 

Nah, I think  we'll get someone else in, in some capacity.

 

Big role.

Can't punt it to a director or on to Naismith. 

 

 

[GinRummy]

Just now, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Nah, I think  we'll get someone else in, in some capacity.

 

Big role.

Can't punt it to a director or on to Naismith. 

 

 

We’ll see. I think the biggest thing he’s done is put the structures in place we have now. Just keep in place what he’s set up and we’ll be fine. 

[innerjambo]

Pretty sure he will be replaced. The club don't seem inclined to take any shortcuts these days, which is the right thing to do.

[Jim Panzee]

2 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

We’ll see. I think the biggest thing he’s done is put the structures in place we have now. Just keep in place what he’s set up and we’ll be fine. 

Would agree. JS put the operating model in place. It can be left as is for the short to mid term - but no longer as it still requires someone in the role to provide strategic leadership and adjust to keep it working well

[JamboAl]

16 minutes ago, Shooter McGavin said:

I have never claimed he was a Savage signing.

 

If you think anybody can takeover his position, and deal with agents, clubs, budgets, negotiations, then you’ll need to get your application in.

 

In a way, I kind of wish recruitment in football is as simple as it is in your head 😂

I didn't say anybody.  I didn't say I could.

but you go on glorifying JS.

[Jambo in Bathgate]

27 minutes ago, innerjambo said:

Pretty sure he will be replaced. The club don't seem inclined to take any shortcuts these days, which is the right thing to do.

I’m sure he will too! It’s a very important role at the club. 

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, Shooter McGavin said:

First of me hearing anything like that, if I’m honest.

 

If there’s any sources or articles you could direct me to to have a look into that it would be much appreciated 👍🏻

I could give you a few sources just can’t give you their names. 

[Taffin]

Savage had a really important role and was good at it.

 

He'll need replaced.

 

He isn't a scout.

 

The Head Coach doesn't have the final say on signings.

 

 

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, Bad Religion said:

He is a fantasist.  

The sad folk are the ones that call others  names because they have nothing better to say. 

[soonbe110]

2 minutes ago, Taffin said:

Savage had a really important role and was good at it.

 

He'll need replaced.

 

He isn't a scout.

 

The Head Coach doesn't have the final say on signings.

 

 

Previous head coach didn’t.  Current head coach didn’t for a while but does now. That is the crux of the issue. 

[Taffin]

31 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Previous head coach didn’t.  Current head coach didn’t for a while but does now. That is the crux of the issue. 

 

Not a chance, imo. Will always be a board member.

[Bad Religion]

4 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

The sad folk are the ones that call others  names because they have nothing better to say. 

No, the sad folk are the middle aged men on here that peddle bullshit to suit their own personal agendas in desperate attempt look in the know. 

[soonbe110]

10 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

No, the sad folk are the middle aged men on here that peddle bullshit to suit their own personal agendas in desperate attempt look in the know. 

Sorry, thought you were referring to me but obviously not 😂😂