BackOfTheNet Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Naismith has been talking about Tagawa to EEN Before any “supporter” comes on here and has a go at the guy without reading the article, I’d like you to make you aware of probably the most important part of it: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull's-eye Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Pretty clear to anyone with half a brain, very very difficult to get players in that can hit the ground running on our budget, moreso an attacking player. Hope it works out for the laddie, should be easy enough for him to fill Shanklands boots next season 😜 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1874robbo Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Magic Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 minute ago, 1874robbo said: I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. With the greatest of respect I’m inclined to trust Naismiths judgement on a player than yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr ewing Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 minute ago, 1874robbo said: I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. Agree, hope he does well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 minute ago, 1874robbo said: I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. Bang on the money. At 25 he should'nt be a PROJECT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirror Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 since other clubs are apparently interested, keep the value high Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull's-eye Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 3 minutes ago, wavydavy said: Bang on the money. At 25 he should'nt be a PROJECT. Why, Naismith is 37 and he is a PROJECT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimp Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 7 minutes ago, wavydavy said: Bang on the money. At 25 he should'nt be a PROJECT. What do you define as a project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackOfTheNet Posted February 21 Author Share Posted February 21 (edited) I hoped this thread would go one way, but unfortunately it’s going the way I suspected… Edited February 21 by BackOfTheNet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimp Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 3 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said: I hoped this thread would go one way, but unfortunately it’s going the way I suspected… How foolish of you. Don't you realise a fair chunk of our support have made their minds up on a player after playing a grand total 516 minutes of football for us? No benefit of the doubt or no more time to prove himself, he's hopeless in their minds he needs punted. There's no other way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Perhaps a slight sign within that piece that Tagawa and perhaps Oda, aren't entirely sure of what's being asked of them. There has definitely been an interpreter kicking around since Oda arrived so misunderstanding what's expected shouldn't really be a factor, surely. To suggest that Tagawa has showed absolutely nothing is just not correct. Whether we've signed a player that suits the way we want to play is debatable. It's clear he's got ability though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 A dozen of so appearances and we are writing him off ? I'm sure people were saying the same about Naismith earlier on. Hopefully he can keep getting some game time to see if he can make more of an impact. We should not forget this guy has scored against Porto and Sporting Lisbon whilst he was on loan at Santa Clara last season. I trust Naismith to improve him and adapt him to the more physical game here. Doesn't happen overnight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 9 minutes ago, Chimp said: What do you define as a project? It's not so much what I define as a project but Naismith. My take on a Project Player is someone who is signed from the other side of the world on a long term contract with no idea how well that player will fit in to not only the team and style of play but the City and Culture. If you call them a "Project" then it seems to buy a bit of time to let them settle. I would prefer that we have less of these and stick to signing guys like Frankie Kent who know the score and can hit the ground running. I very much appreciate that we are in a very competetive market and try and find players who can maybe make us some money longer term but I think those players are more of a risk. Ultimately those decisions rest with Naismith and Savage. I have afeeling Naismith will put up with less that maybe Robbie did with what he is offered by way of signings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 22 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said: Why, Naismith is 37 and he is a PROJECT. Naismith was being hounded just a few months back and could well have been out the door. When we eventually start losing a few games which could well be in the next week then some will be questioning this Project no doubt. It's just another buzz word for the moment a bit like Government and Councils saying everything is an Emergency or a Crisis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AC Mallin_51 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Can’t write him off yet. 4 weeks ago Hoff was dugmeat apparently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimp Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 14 minutes ago, wavydavy said: It's not so much what I define as a project but Naismith. My take on a Project Player is someone who is signed from the other side of the world on a long term contract with no idea how well that player will fit in to not only the team and style of play but the City and Culture. If you call them a "Project" then it seems to buy a bit of time to let them settle. I would prefer that we have less of these and stick to signing guys like Frankie Kent who know the score and can hit the ground running. I very much appreciate that we are in a very competetive market and try and find players who can maybe make us some money longer term but I think those players are more of a risk. Ultimately those decisions rest with Naismith and Savage. I have afeeling Naismith will put up with less that maybe Robbie did with what he is offered by way of signings. You've no guarantee with any player that they'll hit the ground running. We've signed many British players in the past who haven't settled or took time to settle. On the flip side he might have done well right from the off, just like other foreign imports have done for us. We have a squad where we can allow for having a potential "project" player as Naismith points out in the interview. It was a slight gamble bringing him in as he might need time to adapt which he does, but there's still a chance he could prove to be a good signing for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher75 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 The obvious comparison is between Vargas and Tagawa. Both have come in from abroad with all the challenges that entails. Both have been competing for the same spot in the team. So far Vargas has adjusted quicker and looked the better player, which is why he is getting picked. If Hearts could recoup the fee paid, I would have no issue with Tagawa moving on either now if he goes back to Japan, or in the summer. If he stays, hopefully the coaching staff can work with him to get the best out of him. He certainly looked an exciting prospect when I first saw him (in Perth I think). But I haven't seen anything from him since to make me think he's ever going to be a first team regular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4marsbars Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Good to see that even now some fans know better than our manager. I remember Sean Clare's early days. He arrived amidst much expectation. Early performances led some fans to write him off. On the pitch, you could see Naismith constantly encouraging the lad, applauding when he got things right. Although Naismith has a reputation for being a moaner, he rarely moaned at SC and accentuated the encouragement. At least, that's what I saw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyRightPeg Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Everything is so rosy at the moment, but folk still find ways to knock our players, and go against the gaffer's judgement. It's funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmiyaHearts Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) Bottom line is a 25 Yr old player, who's travelled and lived abroad, should be hitting the ground running. Why wid we even sign a striker, who's never hit double figures in a season, averaging 1 goal every 7 or 8 games? He has hit the ground running, he's just not that good. Edited February 21 by OmiyaHearts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefox Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 TBF Tagawa's favoured position is currently being filled by the best striker in Scotland, so chances to play there rather than out wide have been pretty limited. Maybe if (hopefully not) Shanks gets injured or suspended, we might get to see what Tagawa is made of! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EIEIO Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Hopefully he progresses like Oda, Vargas and the Hoff to name but three who were , until recently, widely regarded as shit by many on here. I will trust Naismith on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamishMcGonagall Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I wish folk would stop bringing up "he scored against porto and sporting".. very much reminding me of folk going on about nade scoring against arsenal and it's making me lose hope that he'll come good eventually 😆. Hopefully he'll show some promise before the season ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I don't think he's shown enough, but I don't see him in training or knew much of him before. Whatever his potential or however it goes it's clear that he was always going to take time to settle - or not. New league, new continent , new house, different culture , new friends etc. He may settle and play well or he may not, but it's clear time was always needed to decide that. The jkb massive ofc can decide a players fate on 30 minutes of football. Ideal scenerio is he settles, gets better and delivers and then Boycey becomes the extra guy as he slows down a little next season and beyond and get used less. It's almost like we have a plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 8 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said: Bottom line is a 25 Yr old player, who's travelled and lived in various countries, should be hitting the ground running. Why wid we even sign a striker, who's never hit double figures in a season, averaging 1 goal every 7 or 8 games? He has hit the ground running, he's just not that good. Naismith disagrees with your bottom line. Gonna go with Naismith on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niemi’s gloves Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, 1874robbo said: I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. Tend to agree. If you look back at what was said on the club web site when he signed., it’s clear that he was expected to “hit the ground running”. Indeed there’s a direct quote attributed to Frankie McEvoy that use that phrase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 10 minutes ago, RustyRightPeg said: Everything is so rosy at the moment, but folk still find ways to knock our players, and go against the gaffer's judgement. It's funny. It's alarming. If it was up to them, this season alone- Naismith sacked after a handful of games. Everyone else to follow. Shankland punted for being a fatty. Oda, Tagawa, Hoff, Grant all punted. No extension to Benny Boyce punted Forrest punted Stadium announcer punted We'd have had Warnock or the goonoin charge at Shef UTD as manager ( on a fortune) while we signed veteran English Championship players for a last pay day working under a board that god only knows where they came from. Nae Hotel At least they've got their coach'un badges! Edited February 21 by Bazzas right boot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niemi’s gloves Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/blogs/news/kyosuke-is-a-jambo above is a link to what the club said when Tagawa signed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 22 minutes ago, Chimp said: You've no guarantee with any player that they'll hit the ground running. We've signed many British players in the past who haven't settled or took time to settle. On the flip side he might have done well right from the off, just like other foreign imports have done for us. We have a squad where we can allow for having a potential "project" player as Naismith points out in the interview. It was a slight gamble bringing him in as he might need time to adapt which he does, but there's still a chance he could prove to be a good signing for us. Of course everty signing is a risk. However when you bring a player in from a totally different culture who doesn't speak the language then that makes that task of settling them in even harder. I believe we employ a translator specifically for Oda and Tagawa so it is hardly surprising that perhaps they are not getting Naismith instructions properly. Maybe something is being lost in translation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmiyaHearts Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Just now, Bazzas right boot said: Naismith disagrees with your bottom line. Gonna go with Naismith on this. He only needs 2 goals between now and May to hit his career season average. Or should we expect Tagawa to do something he's never done in his career and score every 5 or 6 games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettigrewsstylist Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 SN demonstrating mature skillset there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 6 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said: Naismith disagrees with your bottom line. Gonna go with Naismith on this. Time will tell who is correct. Be interesting to see if he is still with us next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db211833 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, 1874robbo said: I personally think he is being nice there and it’s good to see that but I suspect deep down Naismith knows he’ll be offloaded in the summer. I haven’t seen one tiny part in a game where I’ve said “that tagawa has got something”. We were saying exactly that about Oda at the same point last season. He has improved and admittedly still has a way to go. Give the lad some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Torrance Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 40 minutes ago, AC Mallin_51 said: Can’t write him off yet. 4 weeks ago Hoff was dugmeat apparently Four weeks before that and everyone was dugmeat and we needed a massive clear out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bongo 1874 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 😀. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) 2 minutes ago, wavydavy said: Time will tell who is correct. Be interesting to see if he is still with us next season. I don't think he will be, I don't think he's good enough. Doesn't mean we don't afford him time to settle and then we decide tho. Whether he's brilliant or shite Doesn't negate the point that he was signed with the medium to long term in mind and he should be given time. You are spectacularly missing the point that our manager is making. Edited February 21 by Bazzas right boot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 4 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said: I don't think he will be, I don't think he's good enough. Doesn't mean we don't afford him time to settle and then we decide tho. Whether he's brilliant or shite Doesn't negate the point that he was signed with the medium to long term in mind and he should be given time. You are spectacularly missing the point that our manager is making. Rubbish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upgotheheads Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 His second half against Airdrie was pretty good, but his injuries, and the fact that he has had to compete with Vargas and Oda, not to mention Forrest, has meant that he's fourth in the Pecking order. FWIW I think his touch and pace are good, but he needs to be playing through the middle, rather than wide, and while Shanks is playing the way he is that isn't going to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 58 minutes ago, wavydavy said: It's not so much what I define as a project but Naismith. My take on a Project Player is someone who is signed from the other side of the world on a long term contract with no idea how well that player will fit in to not only the team and style of play but the City and Culture. If you call them a "Project" then it seems to buy a bit of time to let them settle. I would prefer that we have less of these and stick to signing guys like Frankie Kent who know the score and can hit the ground running. I very much appreciate that we are in a very competetive market and try and find players who can maybe make us some money longer term but I think those players are more of a risk. Ultimately those decisions rest with Naismith and Savage. I have afeeling Naismith will put up with less that maybe Robbie did with what he is offered by way of signings. As Naismith said in the article, we already had Shankland and Boyce and we felt we could take a longer term view when it come to Tagawa. There's been no need for him to hit the ground running. Didn't see many folk complain when we signed the guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyRightPeg Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 28 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said: Bottom line is a 25 Yr old player, who's travelled and lived abroad, should be hitting the ground running. Why wid we even sign a striker, who's never hit double figures in a season, averaging 1 goal every 7 or 8 games? He has hit the ground running, he's just not that good. What a load of shite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Loblaw Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 (edited) I think it's a fair article, admits there are reasons he's toiled while also wanting more from him. He's had the equivalent of 5 full games, mainly out of position and had injuries. These are legitimate reasons why he's not shown up as well as he should've, but equally to suggest he's shown absolutely nothing isn't true. I assume he's effectively on trial for his future between now and the end of the season. Good luck to him. Edited February 21 by Bob Loblaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Ian Malcolm Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 He's hardly going to slate the guy publicly. Naismith's being diplomatic, as he's not exactly got much evidence to suggest that Tagawa has shown anything. He'll be quietly moved on in the summer. Suspect it would have happened last month if they could have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 39 minutes ago, Chimp said: You've no guarantee with any player that they'll hit the ground running. We've signed many British players in the past who haven't settled or took time to settle. On the flip side he might have done well right from the off, just like other foreign imports have done for us. We have a squad where we can allow for having a potential "project" player as Naismith points out in the interview. It was a slight gamble bringing him in as he might need time to adapt which he does, but there's still a chance he could prove to be a good signing for us. Aberdeen have a not dissimilar situation with Pape Habib Gueye. Although he has far more experience across Europe than Tagawa. Similar sort of outlay (€500,000) and he's been sent off to Norway on loan. Aberdeen transfer dealings last summer were quite dreadful it must be said. There has possibly been a temptation to consider a loan for Tagawa. There might even be some merit in considering something with the like of Partick Thistle if a loan deal at this stage in the season is still permissible. Naismith is probably handling this the right way in fairness. Ultimately I think a move away this summer is more than likely, which would be a shame as I see parts of his game in his relatively brief appearances which could be very useful for us. He's different to other forward players at the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmiyaHearts Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 6 minutes ago, RustyRightPeg said: What a load of shite. Thanks dear x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyRightPeg Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Just now, Carter said: Aberdeen have a not dissimilar situation with Pape Habib Gueye. Although he has far more experience across Europe than Tagawa. Similar sort of outlay (€500,000) and he's been sent off to Norway on loan. Aberdeen transfer dealings last summer were quite dreadful it must be said. There has possibly been a temptation to consider a loan for Tagawa. There might even be some merit in considering something with the like of Partick Thistle if a loan deal at this stage in the season is still permissible. Naismith is probably handling this the right way in fairness. Ultimately I think a move away this summer is more than likely, which would be a shame as I see parts of his game in his relatively brief appearances which could be very useful for us. He's different to other forward players at the club. I think Gueye had his fair share of off the field issues. I seen one Aberdeen fan saying his departure will cripple the already struggling hospitality industry in Aberdeen 😂 Tagawa has just been unlucky IMO. Injured not long after he scored against Partick and behind the captain but more importantly a striker in the form of his life in the pecking order. Vargas has played the minutes and delivered what we expected Tagawa to be at this point and vice versa IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 minute ago, RustyRightPeg said: I think Gueye had his fair share of off the field issues. I seen one Aberdeen fan saying his departure will cripple the already struggling hospitality industry in Aberdeen 😂 Tagawa has just been unlucky IMO. Injured not long after he scored against Partick and behind the captain but more importantly a striker in the form of his life in the pecking order. Vargas has played the minutes and delivered what we expected Tagawa to be at this point and vice versa IMO. Oh really, likes a night out does he! Cormack let Robson loose with a chunk of dough. That unit at the back for them is terrible too. Tagawa probably has been unlucky. Hopefully he can still make an impact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarmerTweedy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 1 hour ago, BackOfTheNet said: I hoped this thread would go one way, but unfortunately it’s going the way I suspected… If this had been someone else posting, I might ask if they're new here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboozy Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I trust Mr Naismith on this one , if he thinks he can get a performance out him? Then that will do for me.👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackOfTheNet Posted February 21 Author Share Posted February 21 (edited) 50 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said: Bottom line is a 25 Yr old player, who's travelled and lived abroad, should be hitting the ground running. Why wid we even sign a striker, who's never hit double figures in a season, averaging 1 goal every 7 or 8 games? He has hit the ground running, he's just not that good. Jorge Grant signed as a 27 year old English speaking Englishman who crossed a border. He took time to settle. Alan Forrest signed as a 25 year old English speaking Scotsman from the next town over, people were happy to have him punted just in the summer window there. Not everything is one way or the other. It’s ridiculous this has to be said. Edited February 21 by BackOfTheNet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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