Hearts in Europe: 23/24 : v Rosenborg - Away leg on Hearts ppv ( updated )

[Gordon_1874]

5 hours ago, Rockwell said:

Heard of all these teams but apart from AZ  no idea what standard they are . So I really don't know if we have a realistic chance against any of them or not

AZ Alkmaar, beat Dundee United this season 7-1 on aggregate. Finished 4th in the Eredivisie and got to the semi-finals of the conference league.

[ShedBoy]

Just now, Sooks said:

Me too , shake the inferiority complex and get right in about who ever we are drawn against . What do we have to lose 

You get it sooks 💯

[karipidis]

If Hibs win there 2nd round they will still be unseeded for 3rd round.

 

if we win 3rd round against a seeded team for playoff we will be seeded. 

[karipidis]

Another thing, first game appears to be after league season starts. I think it’s actually a slight disadvantage as the league cup group stages actually gives teams a bit of rhythm/momentum going into the season. We were lucky to beat Ross County first game this season.

[Waterboy]

13 minutes ago, karipidis said:

If Hibs win there 2nd round they will still be unseeded for 3rd round.

 

if we win 3rd round against a seeded team for playoff we will be seeded. 

 

That second bit isn't correct.  We could be seeded for the Playoff if the team we beat in Q3 has a high enough coefficient to be seeded in the Playoff.  Looking at last season, there's about a 50% chance of us drawing a team in Q3 with a high enough coefficient to be seeded in the Playoff, but that's not an exact science as all depends on this seasons teams, results and coefficients.

[will-i-am-a-jambo]

42 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

I’m sure they’re the only team that has a stadium in the centre of Istanbul. All the others are in the outskirts. Besiktas are not too far from the just bar….. I think 🤔. Better to get them group stages though 

Correct, we passed the Besiktas stadium on the bus on the way out to the game in Istanbul. I'd rather not go back to Turkey for selfish reasons (ld prefer go visit another country) plus lm still pissed they took my coins/wallet off me at the ground never to be seen again! Robbing bar stewards.

[Negan]

4 hours ago, Jamboross said:

 

I'd be surprised if we did. 

 

Plzen were in the group stages of the CL this season, admittedly they did lose every game but did reasonably well against Bayern and Barca in the home games. 

 

Djurgardens topped their Conference League group, undefeated, with double the points of Gent who were second.  

 

 

I still think we would have enough.

[karipidis]

45 minutes ago, Waterboy said:

 

That second bit isn't correct.  We could be seeded for the Playoff if the team we beat in Q3 has a high enough coefficient to be seeded in the Playoff.  Looking at last season, there's about a 50% chance of us drawing a team in Q3 with a high enough coefficient to be seeded in the Playoff, but that's not an exact science as all depends on this seasons teams, results and coefficients.

That is what I meant but not worded very well! If we win against a team who is seeded for the playoff then we will be seeded. 

[Texaco]

A lot easier to understand than last season even for an old thicko like me. It has a bit of a Fairs cup feel to the first two rounds. I kinda like we know it will most likely be tough opposition and we have to win the ties against the odds a bit. So it's a full on fight and we will be more prepared this season. Let the opposition that expect to progress worry about us. If we go out fair do's we have a tough league campaign to deal with anyway. So nothing to lose really. Bring it on ..

[SMJ_1874]

2 hours ago, will-i-am-a-jambo said:

Correct, we passed the Besiktas stadium on the bus on the way out to the game in Istanbul. I'd rather not go back to Turkey for selfish reasons (ld prefer go visit another country) plus lm still pissed they took my coins/wallet off me at the ground never to be seen again! Robbing bar stewards.

As much as I enjoyed Istanbul, I’d rather visit another country. A few pals got robbed after being followed from the area of the just bar. A lot of the local neds just picking off drunken jambos on their way home.
 

The view from the away end of the stadium was also rank and the heavy netting made it difficult to see anything that happened at the opposite end. I’m sure if we drew besiktas we’d get a proper Turkish welcome though as the basaksehir was pretty young and tame crowd. 

[Ferryjambo99]

Always worth considering that "bigger" teams have a history of underperforming in these qualifying rounds, early season lack of sharpness

[gregzy2k7]

Out of that, Our best bet would be

Apoel Nicosia, Djugardens or maybe one of the Israeli teams. I think anyone else and we would probably get pumped out.

[Waterboy]

Few more teams added to the list of possible opponents based on games last night: Basel, Vitoria Guimaraes and FCSB.  All in order of coefficient below, and the teams in italics are assumed to make it through from previous rounds as the seeded team, some supposedly worse sides (based on coefficients) may take their place if they beat them in those earlier qualifiers.

 

Club Brugge                 Belgium

FC Basel                       Switzerland

AZ Alkmaar                  Netherlands

AA Gent                        Belgium

Dinamo Kiev                 Ukraine

Partizan Belgrade        Serbia

PAOK                            Greece

Maccabi Tel-Aviv         Israel

Viktoria Plzen               Czech Rep

Bodo/Glimt                   Norway

Lech Poznan                Poland

Hapoel Beer-Sheva     Israel

Djurgardens                 Sweden

APOEL Nicosia             Cyprus

Besiktas                       Turkey

NK Rijeka                      Croatia

FC Arouca                     Portugal

Vitoria Guimaraes         Portugal

FCSB                             Romania

[Bdog1426]

10 minutes ago, Waterboy said:

Few more teams added to the list of possible opponents based on games last night: Basel, Vitoria Guimaraes and FCSB.  All in order of coefficient below, and the teams in italics are assumed to make it through from previous rounds as the seeded team, some supposedly worse sides (based on coefficients) may take their place if they beat them in those earlier qualifiers.

 

Club Brugge                 Belgium

FC Basel                       Switzerland

AZ Alkmaar                  Netherlands

AA Gent                        Belgium

Dinamo Kiev                 Ukraine

Partizan Belgrade        Serbia

PAOK                            Greece

Maccabi Tel-Aviv         Israel

Viktoria Plzen               Czech Rep

Bodo/Glimt                   Norway

Lech Poznan                Poland

Hapoel Beer-Sheva     Israel

Djurgardens                 Sweden

APOEL Nicosia             Cyprus

Besiktas                       Turkey

NK Rijeka                      Croatia

FC Arouca                     Portugal

Vitoria Guimaraes         Portugal

FCSB                             Romania

Don't really fancy a trip to Ukraine

 

[tartofmidlothian]

20 hours ago, Waterboy said:

A one stop shop now that it's confirmed we'll be in Europe next season.  I'm working on the assumption that Celtic beat Inverness (hopefully tempting fate :))

 

Hearts will enter the Europa Conference League in the 3rd qualifying round, as an unseeded team.

 

Key Dates:

Q3 first leg:                10 August

Q3 second leg:          17 August

 

If we progress...

 

Playoff first leg:         24 August

Playoff second leg:   31 August

 

If we progress... group stages commence 21 September.

 

Possible Opponents:

 

The draw for Q3 will be made before Q2 ties have been played.  It's therefore possible we will draw the winner of a Q2 tie, and have 2 possible opponents with the winner still to be determined.  There are still some domestic leagues and cups to be finalised, but at this moment in time, these are the sides who will be seeded and are therefore possible opponents.  This assumes that all of the seeded sides in Q2 win their ties - so some could be replaced by supposedly poorer sides - those in italics are the sides that it's been assumed will qualify from Q2.

 

Club Brugge                 Belgium

AZ Alkmaar                  Netherlands

AA Gent                        Belgium

Dinamo Kiev                 Ukraine

Partizan Belgrade        Serbia

PAOK                            Greece

Maccabi Tel-Aviv         Israel

Viktoria Plzen               Czech Rep

Bodo/Glimt                   Norway

Lech Poznan                Poland

Hapoel Beer-Sheva     Israel

Djurgardens                 Sweden

APOEL Nicosia             Cyprus

Besiktas                       Turkey

NK Rijeka                      Croatia

FC Arouca                     Portugal

 

Hearts Coefficient:

 

Hearts will enter with a coefficient of 7.28, which is the 'Scotland' coefficient, based on the performance of Scottish teams over the past 5 seasons.  Hearts actual coefficient is less than the 'Scotland' coefficient at 4, and so we are given the higher 'Scotland' coefficient.  Info on how this was earned, and the coefficients of other Scottish teams for 23/24:

 

 

If Hearts are eliminated in Q3, which is a real possibility, we will earn 2 pts, taking our total for the 24/25 season to 6.  If we made it to the Playoff round and were eliminated, we would earn 2.5 pts taking our total to 6.5.  Both scenarios would likely result in us again being given the 'Scotland' coefficient if we qualify for Europe in season 24/25.

 

The 'Scotland' coefficient is calculated based on a slightly different method to how the individual club coefficients are calculated, and so won't tie in with the figures you see above.  For season 24/25, the points earned from Scottish sides during the upcoming season will replace the points earned in 18/19.  Scottish sides therefore need to improve on 6.75 if they want to improve their ranking (and European places that come as a result), having only scored 3.5 in the season just past.

 

 

 

 

Excellent work, WB. I posted on another thread asking this the other day but it sank, the perils of a badly-titled thread.

 

I looked more closely at this, I know it's about as likely as the Second Coming, but if ICT do win the cup then that's no Europe for Hibs and no guaranteed group for Aberdeen. 

[Ricardo Quaresma]

43 minutes ago, Bdog1426 said:

Don't really fancy a trip to Ukraine

 

 

They're playing in Poland

[pettigrewsstylist]

29 minutes ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

Excellent work, WB. I posted on another thread asking this the other day but it sank, the perils of a badly-titled thread.

 

I looked more closely at this, I know it's about as likely as the Second Coming, but if ICT do win the cup then that's no Europe for Hibs and no guaranteed group for Aberdeen. 

We are all Caley Jags on Sat!

[Percival King]

1 hour ago, Waterboy said:

Few more teams added to the list of possible opponents based on games last night: Basel, Vitoria Guimaraes and FCSB.  All in order of coefficient below, and the teams in italics are assumed to make it through from previous rounds as the seeded team, some supposedly worse sides (based on coefficients) may take their place if they beat them in those earlier qualifiers.

 

Club Brugge                 Belgium

FC Basel                       Switzerland

AZ Alkmaar                  Netherlands

AA Gent                        Belgium

Dinamo Kiev                 Ukraine

Partizan Belgrade        Serbia

PAOK                            Greece

Maccabi Tel-Aviv         Israel

Viktoria Plzen               Czech Rep

Bodo/Glimt                   Norway

Lech Poznan                Poland

Hapoel Beer-Sheva     Israel

Djurgardens                 Sweden

APOEL Nicosia             Cyprus

Besiktas                       Turkey

NK Rijeka                      Croatia

FC Arouca                     Portugal

Vitoria Guimaraes         Portugal

FCSB                             Romania

Excellent couple of posts, thanks for putting that all together.

[Bdog1426]

1 hour ago, Ricardo Quaresma said:

 

They're playing in Poland

I know, was a joke

 

Fancy a trip to Norway though!

[PapaShango]

23 minutes ago, Bdog1426 said:

I know, was a joke

 

Fancy a trip to Norway though!

Wouldn't mind a trip there or Portugal, although the team from there only has a 5,000 capacity stadium which might be problematic getting a ticket. 

[TyphoonJambo]

27 minutes ago, Bdog1426 said:

I know, was a joke

 

Fancy a trip to Norway though!

You seen the price of beer up there?

[PauloSergio]

Give us a week away in Cyprus.

[Bdog1426]

35 minutes ago, TypoonJambo said:

You seen the price of beer up there?

Surely the Mountain view is worth it haha

[Bdog1426]

39 minutes ago, PapaShango said:

Wouldn't mind a trip there or Portugal, although the team from there only has a 5,000 capacity stadium which might be problematic getting a ticket. 

So 200 tickets most likely

 

[davemclaren]

33 minutes ago, PauloSergio said:

Give us a week away in Cyprus.

That would be lovely. 

[Romulus]

Nearly a couple of months until the draw, plenty time.

 

Out of that list, a trip to Portugal or Czech would be nice.

[tian447]

There are always shocks in the earlier qualifying rounds, and the teams we expect to be in our round might suffer an early loss themselves. 

 

Also, why can't we be the shock result in our round?  Depending on who is manager then, we might not be playing the cagey "try not to lose" tactic that we have been used to seeing in big games.

 

No reason we can't take any of them on. Can't do any worse than United last season anyway

 

[tian447]

1 hour ago, PapaShango said:

Wouldn't mind a trip there or Portugal, although the team from there only has a 5,000 capacity stadium which might be problematic getting a ticket. 

 

Should have no problems seeing over the walls then. Climb a tree with a 6 pack and you're sorted

 

[Jambo Buckets]

We won't beat any of those teams but still looking forward to the trip and just make sure there isn't a humiliation like what happened to Dundee United against AZ. 

 

Big change next year though. Finishing 4th in the league next year qualifies you for the Europa League 2nd qualifying round which means if you lose you drop into the Conference League. That means you get 4 guaranteed European games instead of 2. Hopefully we finish 3rd though and dont need to worry about that. 

[cheetah]

 

Wouldn't mind getting Hapoel Beer Sheva, cracking wee city in the desert, will be roasting in august though. Reckon we would give them a good game and got pals there. 

 

[PapaShango]

3 minutes ago, cheetah said:

 

Wouldn't mind getting Hapoel Beer Sheva, cracking wee city in the desert, will be roasting in august though. Reckon we would give them a good game and got pals there. 

 

What's the safety like over there? I know the city looks quality but is there any issues with terror attacks? 

 

A trip to Prague for me would be decent, if not there Belgium would be a decent one although the Dutch and Belgian fans can be a bit notorious for crowd trouble. 

[cheetah]

1 minute ago, PapaShango said:

What's the safety like over there? I know the city looks quality but is there any issues with terror attacks? 

 

A trip to Prague for me would be decent, if not there Belgium would be a decent one although the Dutch and Belgian fans can be a bit notorious for crowd trouble. 

 

Safety is ok, its far enough away from the zones where rockets are fired and land (more importantly  ) 

Although it's Israel so you can never be sure. security would be tight as they wouldn't want an incident with so many tourists around. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

36 minutes ago, Jambo Buckets said:

We won't beat any of those teams but still looking forward to the trip and just make sure there isn't a humiliation like what happened to Dundee United against AZ. 

 

Big change next year though. Finishing 4th in the league next year qualifies you for the Europa League 2nd qualifying round which means if you lose you drop into the Conference League. That means you get 4 guaranteed European games instead of 2. Hopefully we finish 3rd though and dont need to worry about that. 

Can you fill me in on Arouca, dont know much about them

[PapaShango]

13 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Can you fill me in on Arouca, dont know much about them

I had never heard of them before but finished 5th in the league and are based just outside Porto. Would be a great trip, only caveat being their stadium is small unless they shifted their games to another stadium. Looking at their ground how that complies with UEFA rules (if it does) I have no idea! 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

3 minutes ago, PapaShango said:

I had never heard of them before but finished 5th in the league and are based just outside Porto. Would be a great trip, only caveat being their stadium is small unless they shifted their games to another stadium. Looking at their ground how that complies with UEFA rules (if it does) I have no idea! 

Average attendance? They might fancy 2k drunken Scots on the doorstep

 

[PapaShango]

Just now, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Average attendance? They might fancy 2k drunken Scots on the doorstep

 

Looking at UEFA rules the minimum seating capacity should be 8k so they might have to play games elsewhere. No idea what their attendances are like. 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Average attendance? They might fancy 2k drunken Scots on the doorstep

 

Braga was a great trip. Did it on a one day Dave McPherson special.  

[PapaShango]

2 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Average attendance? They might fancy 2k drunken Scots on the doorstep

 

Just checked their average attendance is 1,836

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

4 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Braga was a great trip. Did it on a one day Dave McPherson special.  

 

4 minutes ago, PapaShango said:

Just checked their average attendance is 1,836

Settled then, we are going to Arouca, hit and run, booze planes, book the toilet early

[dannymack]

On 29/05/2023 at 14:02, DB-14 said:

Here is a more extensive list of potentials but of course a lot depends on round two as if an unseeded club beats a seeded club at that stage then we could get very fortunate.

Hearts ! FFS it's Heart of Midlothian. 

[dannymack]

48 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Can you fill me in on Arouca, dont know much about them

Seemingly you've got to walk over their infamous Ponte da Perdição (Bridge of doom) to get to the game 😉

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

27 minutes ago, dannymack said:

Seemingly you've got to walk over their infamous Ponte da Perdição (Bridge of doom) to get to the game 😉

I'll need Dutch courage for my vertigo

[davemclaren]

29 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I'll need Dutch courage for my vertigo

Not too difficult to arrange I would hazard. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

Not too difficult to arrange I would hazard. 

Not sure Dave, a bridge too far, certainly puts doom to shame!

[Ricardo Quaresma]

5 hours ago, Bdog1426 said:

I know, was a joke

 

Fancy a trip to Norway though!

 

Pretty poor taste, bud

You know any Ukrainians?

[tartofmidlothian]

12 hours ago, pettigrewsstylist said:

We are all Caley Jags on Sat!

 

[Samuel Camazzola]

On 30/05/2023 at 07:06, gregzy2k7 said:

Out of that, Our best bet would be

Apoel Nicosia, Djugardens or maybe one of the Israeli teams. I think anyone else and we would probably get pumped out.

Swedish sides at that time of the year is a concern as they are in the midst of their season and fully up to speed. Scottish sides have history of failing against the Scandinavians at that stage of European competition. 

[spacerjoe]

On 29/05/2023 at 14:02, DB-14 said:

Here is a more extensive list of potentials but of course a lot depends on round two as if an unseeded club beats a seeded club at that stage then we could get very fortunate.

Shows how important getting into the groups was for us in terms of boosting our own coefficient. 3 seasons in a row getting the same result and we'd be seeded.

 

Which will become even more important in 3 years when Rangers two good seasons in the Europa drop out and we lose the automatic group place (unless one of the OF starts performing in Europe again this season).

 

It also kind of shows the importance of playing at a level where you can actually compete.

[Waterboy]

Fenerbahce added to the list...

 

Club Brugge                 Belgium

FC Basel                       Switzerland

AZ Alkmaar                  Netherlands

AA Gent                        Belgium

Dinamo Kiev                 Ukraine

Fenerbahce                  Turkey

Partizan Belgrade        Serbia

PAOK                            Greece

Maccabi Tel-Aviv         Israel

Viktoria Plzen               Czech Rep

Bodo/Glimt                   Norway

Lech Poznan                Poland

Hapoel Beer-Sheva     Israel

Djurgardens                 Sweden

APOEL Nicosia             Cyprus

Besiktas                       Turkey

NK Rijeka                      Croatia

FC Arouca                     Portugal

Vitoria Guimaraes         Portugal

FCSB                             Romania

[Ricardo Quaresma]

18 minutes ago, spacerjoe said:

Shows how important getting into the groups was for us in terms of boosting our own coefficient. 3 seasons in a row getting the same result and we'd be seeded.

 

Which will become even more important in 3 years when Rangers two good seasons in the Europa drop out and we lose the automatic group place (unless one of the OF starts performing in Europe again this season).

 

It also kind of shows the importance of playing at a level where you can actually compete.

 

Season after next is still groups, so 3rd and the cup angle covered this coming season and we can hopefully get at least another 4; would be great to beat a decent seeded side and steal their rating, as stated above

 

However, the OF need to be in EL after Christmas; hopefully rangers go straight into EL group & other cheek make 3rd, but all they seem to care about is grabbing the CL money & getting pumped out immediately

 

The parkhead mob are truly deplorable here, some might think they want the coefficient lower to stop the group stages for 3rd, so us & sheep don't get the money to strengthen

 

Some will think we'll be a nap to get celtic very soon in the cup & will cry foul; well, we got hibs away & when we pumped them, their big brothers were next, it certainly stinks; some will think there will be an effort to get hibs or even the midden 3rd next season; then there's the TV deal meddling and that kept low, less for the rest; we'll see, but the ECL money sure has made things exciting; it's really stirred the pot and added an extra dimension to the league