*** Official Aberdeen fc v Heart of Midlothian v Match day thread***

[Jambro77]

After I fell out with myself at the Killie game and had a huff I decided not to give a %%%k today.

Wife, kids and myself had a right laugh with the young team and the rest of the support.

The Hearts fans once again make it worth while.

 

Fwiw first half played ok, forgot to turn up the second half.

Aberdeen did not impress me we made them look good.

 

 

 

[maroonsgotop]

7 hours ago, iantjambo said:

Sheep commentator thinks he shouldn’t have got a yellow

 

he was right. should have been a red

[5-1Jambo]

 Being short of your prefere first choice team from a squad of 23 players that you as the manager brought in/kept at the club  is no excuse for them not being able to pass, tackle, track back or tap the ball into the net. It's also not an excuse for players like McKay, Haring and Ginnelly's loss of motivation (McKay looks like he would rather be somewhere else) and it's certainly not an excuse for keeping GMS, Ginnelly and Sibbick if you don't trust them. Nearly all of the players brought in during the transfer window Kio, Grant, Forrest and Snodgrass are now fit but add nothing to our form. 

I still think we will get 3rd spot but only because the other teams are Tom kite. But we will be miles behind the OF

[Bongo 1874]

2 hours ago, IveSeenTheLight said:

It’s a fair point and we also had 2 pen shouts in the first half too.

That said Hearts also had very good chances and had they been taken, we may not have recovered.

Thats why I think overall a draw would have been fair and neither team would have complained

You are talking about the Cochrane chance and Shankland chances.

 

Apart from that what did we offer, centre of a doughnut that's what we offered going forward.

 

Mckay and Forrest were playing hide and seek and they are the champs at that, Aberdeen were the better team and deservedly won.

2 hours ago, DETTY29 said:

Well your second sentence is complete bollocks.

You call that 100% effort you can stick that showing.

 

That's what to do with that.

[Bigteam]

4 hours ago, Hook said:

I had to put up with listening to the game on Radio Scotland.

 

At 0-0 Levein came away with the beauty that if either team went 1 up they didn’t have the bench to put on a defender to hold onto a 1 nil lead. The boy’s a joke. Willie Miller, even came back to him and said Goodwin wouldn’t do that, he’d go for 2.

 

That sums it up for me in terms of the mentality that’s been built up over the years and sadly Neilson would inevitably have done what Levein was suggesting if we had taken the lead.

 

Sad state of affairs. Someone on Radio Scotland, if they were worth their salt, should be asking Levein when will all the conveyor belt of Academy talent start to be produced as part of the original ‘5 year plan’🙈

 

 

Talent is  there but we will only know if it’s real talent if they are played!!

[Holtie]

Aberdeen were rank rotten and we just lost to them but everything will be fine when we get the players back from injury….aye right!

[hearts00]

Just seen the highlights and can’t get over how bad Neilson and Sibbick are. 
 

They are no where near the level rewuired at the moment. 

[LochcarronJambo]

25 minutes ago, hearts00 said:

Just seen the highlights and can’t get over how bad Neilson and Sibbick are. 
 

They are no where near the level rewuired at the moment. 

Yes they were awful…but tbh Kio Forrest & particularly Grant when he came were the same….McKay has quality but definitely looks disinterested & hides…. Yet we should & could have scored three……perplexing…. However quite clear that the set up of the team is poor, there appears to be no system & no solidity. Yes we have some bad luck with injuries this season but I expected the new additions to be far better ☹️

[i8hibsh]

35 minutes ago, hearts00 said:

Just seen the highlights and can’t get over how bad Neilson and Sibbick are. 
 

They are no where near the level rewuired at the moment. 

 

 

Our win rate with Sibbick must be in single digits. A ****ing abysmal player.

[Hook]

35 minutes ago, Bigteam said:

….we will only know if it’s real talent if they are played!!

Totally agree, but it also needs to be coached / managed properly to be able to make the transition from the Academy to the first team and hopefully we see some evidence of that soon.

[Naisys Tackle]

How brutal are Aberdeen by the way?  Thought they would be much better but they are pure rank too. 

[HMFC01]

Shame for Cochrane missing his chance.   I was going to slaughter him but watched it again.    He's tried to take a touch from Humphrys heavy but precise pass(no complaints).   It's unfortunately deflected straight to the keeper.   

 

Shanklands chances were worse.   A chance to show his quality with a lob and another for a closer finish to the back post.   The first one was harder at the near post but you at least expect him to hit the target. 

 

Two poor defensive errors from Neilson.   Sibbick with a poor decision to pass it out left which gave them possession under little pressure.   Luckily that one didn't result in a goal.    Unfortunately Neilsons did. 

 

I'm not too despondent.   First round of games done except the St Mirren rescheduled match.  We could have been on 17 points.    Going into the second round of games with a load of injuries is worrying.    Get the first game out the way and hopefully have some players back.   

 

I can't see us beat celtic under normal circumstances.    With VAR it could get worse or we might get lucky.    Just have to wait and see what happens. 

 

One things for sure, Neilson needs trained to defend better and Sibbick needs to cut the silly mistakes.   Kingsley wasn't exactly perfect himself but has more to offer.   

 

Sort it out Hearts.   We're better than that. 

[NextGenerationJambo]

4 hours ago, maggieb said:

I’d love to see Pep or Jurgen doing it in his place. Imagine 8 first team players out? On you go son 🤞🏻

I love how the argument of more money = better players and therefore better results doesn't transfer to managers.

 

There is a reason Guardiola and Klopp get paid what they get paid and manage the teams that they do. They are inconceivably better at their jobs that Neilson ever will be. They identify weaknesses and strengths in their teams and play to them. They assemble squads capable of dealing with congested fixtures, drop offs in form, injuries and suspensions. Their teams are total experts at the absolute basics of football, which allows them to focus intricatly on the more complex aspects of the game. They consider the opposition, but not to the extent where they completely deviate from their regular gameplan. They have players playing on the same wavelength, who understand their own, as well as their team mate's roles. And crucially they don't split fan opinion as much as Neilson does. This does not mean they are immune to critisicm after some poor results, but by in large the fans buy in to what they have built, and are continuing to build. 

 

Now, the predictable response to these arguments is that it is all down to money, because that is all football is apparently about these days. (It is a massive factor... not a single person disputes that, but it is not the SOLE factor and that is the facts.)

 

The level they are playing at is much better, as is every aspect of the game, particularly the coaching. The best coaches in the world are saught after and paid millions because they most definitely would be doing better than Neilson right now. It's utterly ludicrous to suggest otherwise. Better players would be doing a better job than the current crop and so would a better manager. Let's stop pretending Robbie is not at fault for anything. Let's stop pretending we are only where we are because of extenuating circumstances outwith our control. Let's stop pretending that the reason fans are leaving games feeling a mixture of anger, frustration, apathy and downright boredom isn't because of a manager driving us backwards instead of forwards. 

 

It's not just one result. It feels like deja vu and like we are sleepwalking into the bottom 6 when we should be cementing our place as Scotland's third biggest team. We are slowly letting a massive oppertunity slip and at some point we need to realise we can do better than Neilson.

 

He is not the best manager Hearts can conceivably have (what a disgustingly depressing thought that is btw) but we are the best team he will ever manage. That says it all.

Edited October 16, 2022 by NextGenerationJambo

[gregzy2k7]

10 minutes ago, NextGenerationJambo said:

I love how the argument of more money = better players and therefore better results doesn't transfer to managers.

 

There is a reason Guardiola and Klopp get paid what they get paid and manage the teams that they do. They are inconceivably better at their jobs that Neilson ever will be. They identify weaknesses and strengths in their teams and play to them. They assemble squads capable of dealing with congested fixtures, drop offs in form, injuries and suspensions. Their teams are total experts at the absolute basics of football, which allows them to focus intricatly on the more complex aspects of the game. They consider the opposition, but not to the extent where they completely deviate from their regular gameplan. They have players playing on the same wavelength, who understand their own, as well as their team mate's roles. And crucially they don't split fan opinion as much as Neilson does. This does not mean they are immune to critisicm after some poor results, but by in large the fans buy in to what they have built, and are continuing to build. 

 

Now, the predictable response to these arguments is that it is all down to money, because that is all football is apparently about these days. (It is a massive factor... not a single person disputes that, but it is not the SOLE factor and that is the facts.)

 

The level they are playing at is much better, as is every aspect of the game, particularly the coaching. The best coaches in the world are saught after and paid millions because they most definitely would be doing better than Neilson right now. It's utterly ludocris to suggest otherwise. Better players would be doing a better job than the current crop and so would a better manager. Let's stop pretending Robbie is not at fault for anything. Let's stop pretending we are only where we are because of extenuating circumstances outwith our control. Let's stop pretending that the reason fans are leaving games feeling a mixture of anger, frustration, apathy and downright boredom isn't because of a manager driving us backwards instead of forwards. 

 

It's not just one result. It feels like deja vu and like we are sleepwalking into the bottom 6 when we should be cementing our place as Scotland's third biggest team. We are slowly letting a massive oppertunity slip and at some point we need to realise we can do better than Neilson.

 

He is not the best manager Hearts can conceivably have (what a disgustingly depressing thought that is btw) but we are the best team he will ever manage. That says it all.

good luck getting those heads out of the sand though, i geniunely think some on here must be blind to what they are watching under this manager, its getting worse every week.

[Bongo 1874]

25 minutes ago, NextGenerationJambo said:

I love how the argument of more money = better players and therefore better results doesn't transfer to managers.

 

There is a reason Guardiola and Klopp get paid what they get paid and manage the teams that they do. They are inconceivably better at their jobs that Neilson ever will be. They identify weaknesses and strengths in their teams and play to them. They assemble squads capable of dealing with congested fixtures, drop offs in form, injuries and suspensions. Their teams are total experts at the absolute basics of football, which allows them to focus intricatly on the more complex aspects of the game. They consider the opposition, but not to the extent where they completely deviate from their regular gameplan. They have players playing on the same wavelength, who understand their own, as well as their team mate's roles. And crucially they don't split fan opinion as much as Neilson does. This does not mean they are immune to critisicm after some poor results, but by in large the fans buy in to what they have built, and are continuing to build. 

 

Now, the predictable response to these arguments is that it is all down to money, because that is all football is apparently about these days. (It is a massive factor... not a single person disputes that, but it is not the SOLE factor and that is the facts.)

 

The level they are playing at is much better, as is every aspect of the game, particularly the coaching. The best coaches in the world are saught after and paid millions because they most definitely would be doing better than Neilson right now. It's utterly ludicrous to suggest otherwise. Better players would be doing a better job than the current crop and so would a better manager. Let's stop pretending Robbie is not at fault for anything. Let's stop pretending we are only where we are because of extenuating circumstances outwith our control. Let's stop pretending that the reason fans are leaving games feeling a mixture of anger, frustration, apathy and downright boredom isn't because of a manager driving us backwards instead of forwards. 

 

It's not just one result. It feels like deja vu and like we are sleepwalking into the bottom 6 when we should be cementing our place as Scotland's third biggest team. We are slowly letting a massive oppertunity slip and at some point we need to realise we can do better than Neilson.

 

He is not the best manager Hearts can conceivably have (what a disgustingly depressing thought that is btw) but we are the best team he will ever manage. That says it all.

Neilson fans reaction too that great post , that has most definitely finished Robbie. 

 

Bongos reaction to that great post.

[manaliveits105]

6 hours ago, Robbies Tackle said:

How brutal are Aberdeen by the way?  Thought they would be much better but they are pure rank too. 

Yet Staedler and Waldorf (Miller and Gordon) were drooling about them on Sportsound 

[Bigteam]

8 hours ago, Hook said:

Totally agree, but it also needs to be coached / managed properly to be able to make the transition from the Academy to the first team and hopefully we see some evidence of that soon.

I see no evidence of academy/ B team players being prepared for the first team . If they do get a chance they will simply be thrown in at the deep end!

[Harry Potter]

Heard Goodwin on the radio this morning, Hearts had no clear cut chances Ha Ha Ha😂, what planet is he on.

honestly slaver of the month.

[John Rambo]

I will retain a sense of perspective but may join the bun fight after the World cup is done.

 

We are 3 points off 3rd in the league with a game in  hand on the current incumbents of that position and 2 points behind those in 4th and 5th. We are missing an entire team now due to injury, we have lost our 2 best central defenders for a huge chunk of games and we look devoid of confidence and missing chances galore.

 

Although the European money is a welcome bonus to the coffers, it has come at a cost in terms of fatigue and injuries; lessons MUST be learned going forward.

 

Having said all that, we are still strangely, unbelievably in a decent position in the league. Probably says more about the quality directly above us but we need to look at the positives, get to the month long break as soon as possible and trust that we will have the bulk of the injured players back.

 

I am sure we will be fine after that.

 

As for Robbie and the tactics employed, it seemed to work reasonably well last season but the injuries have not helped consistent team selection this season. My major beef with Robbie is the often defensively minded set up. Ohh, and being a wee bit too scared of the uglies when we play them.

 

Lets just see where we are when the January window opens...and lets hope a central defender is top of the shopping list.

 

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

9 hours ago, NextGenerationJambo said:

I love how the argument of more money = better players and therefore better results doesn't transfer to managers.

 

There is a reason Guardiola and Klopp get paid what they get paid and manage the teams that they do. They are inconceivably better at their jobs that Neilson ever will be. They identify weaknesses and strengths in their teams and play to them. They assemble squads capable of dealing with congested fixtures, drop offs in form, injuries and suspensions. Their teams are total experts at the absolute basics of football, which allows them to focus intricatly on the more complex aspects of the game. They consider the opposition, but not to the extent where they completely deviate from their regular gameplan. They have players playing on the same wavelength, who understand their own, as well as their team mate's roles. And crucially they don't split fan opinion as much as Neilson does. This does not mean they are immune to critisicm after some poor results, but by in large the fans buy in to what they have built, and are continuing to build. 

 

Now, the predictable response to these arguments is that it is all down to money, because that is all football is apparently about these days. (It is a massive factor... not a single person disputes that, but it is not the SOLE factor and that is the facts.)

 

The level they are playing at is much better, as is every aspect of the game, particularly the coaching. The best coaches in the world are saught after and paid millions because they most definitely would be doing better than Neilson right now. It's utterly ludicrous to suggest otherwise. Better players would be doing a better job than the current crop and so would a better manager. Let's stop pretending Robbie is not at fault for anything. Let's stop pretending we are only where we are because of extenuating circumstances outwith our control. Let's stop pretending that the reason fans are leaving games feeling a mixture of anger, frustration, apathy and downright boredom isn't because of a manager driving us backwards instead of forwards. 

 

It's not just one result. It feels like deja vu and like we are sleepwalking into the bottom 6 when we should be cementing our place as Scotland's third biggest team. We are slowly letting a massive oppertunity slip and at some point we need to realise we can do better than Neilson.

 

He is not the best manager Hearts can conceivably have (what a disgustingly depressing thought that is btw) but we are the best team he will ever manage. That says it all.

You say it's not all aboutoney, then your post goes into detail and it's all about money. Klopp and Guardiola may be best managers but by ****, it's a lot easier when you go out and spend £30m or £40m on squad players or £100m in City's case.

Like to see either of them manage a team with budget that Scottish teams, out with Sevco and Celtic, have. Would they be better organised, probably but they still wouldn't win anything and managers would need to change style as players couldn't cope with Liverpool/Man City style.

More money = better players & better coaches. Who would have guessed.

[upgotheheads]

Our best current signed 11 (in my opinion) plus bench, as of today .   Against our injuries and suspensions for next game v Celtic

 

 Best start 11                    Bench                                                                              Next Saturday v Celtic                                                 Best  bench 

 

Gordon.                              Clark                                                                                        Gordon                                                                  Clark

                                           Haring                                                                                                                                                                    Shankland

                                           Halliday

Halkett                               Ginnelly             

Rowles                               Smith            

Kingsley                             Shankland                                                                                Kingsley                                                

                                           GMS

                                            

Atkinson                                   

Beni                                             

Devlin                                                                                                                                  Devlin

McKay                                                                                                                                 McKay

Cochrane                                                                                                                            Cochrane

 

Boyce                             

Humphrys                                                                                                                           Humphrys

 

 

Obviously Shankland will start next week but you will get my drift.  If we can get a couple of injured players back, especially Smith and Halkett, that would help, but I don't think Neilson will risk anything against Celtic, It will be damage limitation with a view to some 'easier' games coming up.

[upgotheheads]

10 minutes ago, upgotheheads said:

Our best current signed 11 (in my opinion) plus bench, as of today .   Against our injuries and suspensions for next game v Celtic

 

 Best start 11                    Bench                                                                              Next Saturday v Celtic                                                 Best  bench 

 

Gordon.                              Clark                                                                                        Gordon                                                                  Clark

                                           Haring                                                                                                                                                                    Shankland

                                           Halliday

Halkett                               Ginnelly             

Rowles                               Smith            

Kingsley                             Shankland                                                                                Kingsley                                                

                                           GMS

                                            

Atkinson                                   

Beni                                             

Devlin                                                                                                                                  Devlin

McKay                                                                                                                                 McKay

Cochrane                                                                                                                            Cochrane

 

Boyce                             

Humphrys                                                                                                                           Humphrys

 

 

Obviously Shankland will start next week but you will get my drift.  If we can get a couple of injured players back, especially Smith and Halkett, that would help, but I don't think Neilson will risk anything against Celtic, It will be damage limitation with a view to some 'easier' games coming up.

Add Kio to the benches.

[Ex member of the SaS]

Some still going on about three points off third only have to look at the league table to see other teams around us are also close to third, then take into account we have Celtic next, and we will be 8th or worse next week. Motherwell and Livi FFS can pull away from us and once down there our already poor confidence will disappear leaving us in the bottom six with little or no chance of recovery. Do we risk being in that position or does someone on the board speak up and make it clear our tactics/selections are wrong and MUST change. 

[upgotheheads]

7 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

Some still going on about three points off third only have to look at the league table to see other teams around us are also close to third, then take into account we have Celtic next, and we will be 8th or worse next week. Motherwell and Livi FFS can pull away from us and once down there our already poor confidence will disappear leaving us in the bottom six with little or no chance of recovery. Do we risk being in that position or does someone on the board speak up and make it clear our tactics/selections are wrong and MUST change. 

 

If we can get even half of our injured players back before Christmas then we still have a good enough squad to finish third. We will also make two or three signings in the window. There's not a manager infootball who could keep us in third place with this injury list.

[No Idle Talk]

I've had the Watching Gorgie on a Thursday Night song going round in my heid ever since I woke up and the original song just came on Radio 2 there.

 

That cheered me up a bit after yesterday. 🙂

[NextGenerationJambo]

31 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

You say it's not all aboutoney, then your post goes into detail and it's all about money. Klopp and Guardiola may be best managers but by ****, it's a lot easier when you go out and spend £30m or £40m on squad players or £100m in City's case.

Like to see either of them manage a team with budget that Scottish teams, out with Sevco and Celtic, have. Would they be better organised, probably but they still wouldn't win anything and managers would need to change style as players couldn't cope with Liverpool/Man City style.

More money = better players & better coaches. Who would have guessed.

If that is what you have gathered from my post then I think you need to read it again, slowly. 

 

As I said, no one is disputing that money isn't a massive factor but you know what else are massive factors? Tactical gameplans. Coaching ability to impliment said gameplans. Coaching ability to improve players. Selection of the right backroom staff. Player recruitment (again you can argue this is down to money but there are plenty of examples of players flopping after astronomical transfer fees - see Man Utd). Team Selection. Tactical adaptation during games.

 

I could go on for paragraphs about how Klopp and Guardiola (and literally thousands of other managers) are better at their job than Neilson is. It is just plain lazy to say it's all down to the money they have available to spend. If you genuinely think Neilson is as good as we can do for the money we have available, then you are entitled to that opinion. My opinion, and the opinion of many others, is that Heart of Midlothian can do better and deserve better. 

[toonland]

Very much in the Nielson out camp and always have been however. Everyone slating us, we have 6 arguable starters missing with injury/suspension. Including 3 of our main defence. Playing twice a week outside the OF, yet only 3 points of 3rd with a game in hand v st mirren at home as much as a despise and hate Nielson we will cruise 3rd after World Cup, almost all our players be back and we be playing once a week

[poultry]

Probably shear optimism, but I think after the break when we see our injured players back we will kick on. 3rd is our main objective so we can have more days in European like we just did. At least am hopeful of it anyway. 🇱🇻

[theshed]

All this talk about getting our injured players back and suddenly we will be world beaters again some on here think. 
 

The only two big loses are the 2 defenders. 
Halkett Is the major lose but when he does come back he will probably be a stone over weight and will take a while to get fit. 
He’s also no been fit since March so no holding out much hope he’s going to be the savior any time soon.  
 

Rowels is the other miss but not seen enough of him to say he will be the other savior 
 

The long term injured aren’t playing till well

after the year if this season at all and the others that are out aren’t going to make any difference as it’s the same tactics they have to follow anyway 

[The Grim Reaper]

11 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Our win rate with Sibbick must be in single digits. A ****ing abysmal player.

 

He isn't receiving proper coaching. He'll improve under a new manager as will the rest of the players who continue to regress.

[i8hibsh]

Just now, The Grim Reaper said:

 

He isn't receiving proper coaching. He'll improve under a new manager as will the rest of the players who continue to regress.

 

 

Agreed. However the next appointment will be from the 'cosy inner circle'.

[The Grim Reaper]

2 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Agreed. However the next appointment will be from the 'cosy inner circle'.

 

I really hope not. We desperately need a new manager and coaches with fresh ideas and a new approach.