Yet another school shooting in America

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, hughesie27 said:

They do have background checks already don't they? 

Obviously the check is outdated the second it gets created though.

Nope, certain states do for certain guns. Other states, well a gun is your right, so they don't bother.

[Mikey1874]

39 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Without playing down the reforms which are clearly a good thing how many school shootings did we have in the years before Dunblane ? I’m not sure the UK is a fair comparison to American. The amount of guns in the general population over there compared to here is ridiculous. 

 

You can definitely compare deaths between UK and US.

 

I agree having a gun risks killing someone. I think the highest number of gun deaths in US is still suicides. More Under 5s kill their parents than die in shootings. 

[Peebo]

2 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Has your wife settled okay over here?

This morning, we were standing in wind and pissing rain watching our son’s school sports day. I said to her that this was the trade off for not worrying every single day about his classroom getting shot up.

 

We’re pretty content with the decision! 

[Seymour M Hersh]

12 hours ago, Hansel said:

Fox news is abhorrent. Imagine trying to score political points over the deaths of school children. Absolute ****s. These shootings have been going on for years under Republican and Democrat governments.

 

They need to address the obvious problem which is the gun laws, but they won't, and this will happen again and again.

 

Which is exactly what the Democrats from Biden down did as well. They're all as bad as each other. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Seymour M Hersh

[Auld Reekin']

1 hour ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Which is exactly what the Democrats from Biden down did as well. They're all as bad as each other. 

 

Hmmm... OK, let's take a look at that.

 

Biden, as he has done after every other similar shooting since becoming president (and, no doubt, beforehand too) condemns the horrific and senseless loss of innocent lives and - quite rightly in my view - identifies the major cause of these being the huge number of guns owned in the US and the lack of gun-controls which led to this.

 

Fox News, Ted Cruz, and all of the other "usual suspects" on the US Right, meanwhile maintain it's nothing to do with guns or the lack of gun-controls, but is everything to do with Biden's administration being "soft on crime" and people not praying enough. Their accusations against Biden would tend to have a little bit more credibility if there had been no such horrific incidents during DT's time in charge, or if they had significantly declined during this period. I've not checked the stats, but there definitely were numerous incidents of a similar nature during DT's spell in office.

 

However, in spite of that, those voices in US politics and society who speak out every time in favour of gun-controls and weapons-reduction in the US as being an obvious step in the right direction towards preventing or at least limiting the number of such atrocities are just "as bad as" those on the US Right who are in the pay of the NRA (one way or another), or who will do whatever it takes to stay in power, who insist that any gun-control / reduction measures will be at best ineffective and at worst a dangerous erosion of US citizens "rights" and freedoms*.

 

Sorry, that doesn't add-up at all to me, but then I'm not quite as right-wing as you.

 

(*Mainly the freedom to tool-up with all your guns and ammo and go out and slaughter whoever takes your fancy on the day, right enough.)

 

 

[Sharpie]

America is very gun concious, but even in Canada guns are prevalent because of the land types, and so many enjoy hunting. Of course the Canadians are a gentler people although once in a while a mentally disturrbed person will act up. 

I spent twenty months of my life where every where and thing I done was accompanied by a loaded weapon. I then returned to Britain where the weapons were ornamental. As a police officer once suggested that we may be issued firearms for a specific incident.  

On to Canada, appointed as a Peace Officer, policeman. Issued a Smith and Wesson, four inch pistol. When heading on patrol was issued a rifle which was locked in a special holder in the car. When attending some calls weapons drawn in a convenient position. All in all the safest place I worked in thirty six years of policing was Niddrie Mains where I just had to depend on physical ability, and gain some grudging respect from those with whom I dealt.

 

 

[highlandjambo3]

16 hours ago, Morgan said:

16 hours ago, Morgan said:

Some feckin country.

 

Some feckin world.

 

😢

Messed up……….

now que the American gun society’s solution……..”arm the teachers”……it’s a nap

16 hours ago, Morgan said:

😢

[Sawdust Caesar]

12 hours ago, luckyBatistuta said:

These are the people that need shot, yet another ******* in a position of power. Disgusting that this allowed to continue on and on. It makes me sick to see all these young innocents with their whole life ahead of them just wiped out needlessly. When will they ever learn😡🤬

 

 

I wonder why he's against any kind of gun control?

 

 

 

[highlandjambo3]

14 hours ago, EH11_2NL said:

Cue NRA nutters trotting out 'More guns means safer communities' and 'Give teachers guns'....etc. America is a shitshow of a nation with 50% of the population totally deranged (MAGA part of it). 

 

Nothing will be done and Trump will use this in another racist diatribe about Mexicans coming over the border. 

 

It's very hard to generate sympathy as it's in the hands of the public to do something about it but the politicians are complete limpdicks terrified of losing votes. 

 

RIP wee ones. 

Oops……should have read the whole thread before posting 

[highlandjambo3]

3 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

You can definitely compare deaths between UK and US.

 

I agree having a gun risks killing someone. I think the highest number of gun deaths in US is still suicides. More Under 5s kill their parents than die in shootings. 

Didn’t trump make some sort of statement about stabbings in London a while back when responding to some *gun control issue/questions about young death comparisons to UK & USA/another mass shooting.

 

* not sure exactly what prompted his statement but I’m sure he said something.

[EH11_2NL]

10 hours ago, John Findlay said:

Nice Boomtown Rats lyric there.

USA as a nation has been broken from 1776.

I wonder if it would be a different country(as in not so violent), if the British had won the war of independence.

A nation built on the gun, a nation that lives by the gun. Where law enforcement shoot first and ask questions later. Where racial tension has existed since the first Black Africans Were shipped there over 200 years ago. They haven't successfully assassinated a president for 59 years now, so another must just be around the corner.

For all its faults, I'm glad I live in Scotland.

I don't think much but that got me thinking. Very interesting question actually. And I say a British-type America would still have to contend with other nations and cultures emigrating there. Take Mexico which is a gun toting nation, would Britain have kept that under control or the majority, unfortunately, of the South America countries who have a shed load of nutters in their populations? El Salvador, Honduras for instance.

[GBJambo]

You would need your head read if you want to move to America 

 

 

[Sharpie]

16 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

You would need your head read if you want to move to America 

 

 

 

I have spent a lot of time in the United States, on business, on vacation, on courses, and being a short distance from the border for shopping, and even with golf buddies going over the line and having  a few beers. I would say the majority of Americans I have met are excellent people, people working in stores, hotels and other businesses are probably the best I have found anywhere at being courteous kind, and easy pleasant people to deal with. Having said all that there were always precautions one took, suss out any bars you thought of going to have a beer in, take stock of changes as you approached a neighborhood, and be careful. My guess is America is a wonderful Country with wonderful people, but there is a darkness in there that you always, always have to be aware of and maintain a sense of alertness.

 

[luckyBatistuta]

1 hour ago, Sawdust Caesar said:

I wonder why he's against any kind of gun control?

 

 

 

Not shocked in the least. Quite happy to look the other way whilst innocent people are murdered for self gain. Their blood is on their hands, but what do they care. 
Argued with a few Americans about this who bang on about their right🙄 Ok then, if you want your right to bear arms, why can’t you start by making it only for a pistol. It doesn’t solve the problem, but it’s a start down the right path. Surely there would be less mass shootings if there was less assault rifles and such being randomly carried around. I don’t get this argument that there are too many guns out there so it’s pointless, you have to start somewhere.

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 hours ago, Peebo said:

This morning, we were standing in wind and pissing rain watching our son’s school sports day. I said to her that this was the trade off for not worrying every single day about his classroom getting shot up.

 

We’re pretty content with the decision! 

Good to hear that.

[trotter]

11 hours ago, John Findlay said:

Nice Boomtown Rats lyric there.

USA as a nation has been broken from 1776.

I wonder if it would be a different country(as in not so violent), if the British had won the war of independence.

A nation built on the gun, a nation that lives by the gun. Where law enforcement shoot first and ask questions later. Where racial tension has existed since the first Black Africans Were shipped there over 200 years ago. They haven't successfully assassinated a president for 59 years now, so another must just be around the corner.

For all its faults, I'm glad I live in Scotland.

Closer than you might think...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61569650

[Maple Leaf]

1 hour ago, Sawdust Caesar said:

I wonder why he's against any kind of gun control?

 

 

 

 

I'm shocked.  Everyone on that list is a Republican.  

[Seymour M Hersh]

3 hours ago, Auld Reekin' said:

 

Hmmm... OK, let's take a look at that.

 

Biden, as he has done after every other similar shooting since becoming president (and, no doubt, beforehand too) condemns the horrific and senseless loss of innocent lives and - quite rightly in my view - identifies the major cause of these being the huge number of guns owned in the US and the lack of gun-controls which led to this.

 

Fox News, Ted Cruz, and all of the other "usual suspects" on the US Right, meanwhile maintain it's nothing to do with guns or the lack of gun-controls, but is everything to do with Biden's administration being "soft on crime" and people not praying enough. Their accusations against Biden would tend to have a little bit more credibility if there had been no such horrific incidents during DT's time in charge, or if they had significantly declined during this period. I've not checked the stats, but there definitely were numerous incidents of a similar nature during DT's spell in office.

 

However, in spite of that, those voices in US politics and society who speak out every time in favour of gun-controls and weapons-reduction in the US as being an obvious step in the right direction towards preventing or at least limiting the number of such atrocities are just "as bad as" those on the US Right who are in the pay of the NRA (one way or another), or who will do whatever it takes to stay in power, who insist that any gun-control / reduction measures will be at best ineffective and at worst a dangerous erosion of US citizens "rights" and freedoms*.

 

Sorry, that doesn't add-up at all to me, but then I'm not quite as right-wing as you.

 

(*Mainly the freedom to tool-up with all your guns and ammo and go out and slaughter whoever takes your fancy on the day, right enough.)

 

 

 

Exactly moves straight into politicising it just like republicans have. Sandy Cortez brings abortion straight into the conversation. But I guess you don't see that as politicising things. Wake up man they're all as bad as each other. No matter what "wing" you  are on. 

[Unknown user]

6 hours ago, iantjambo said:

Sums that ****** up country in one statement.

Americans would rather believe shit like this than give up the 2nd amendment. An outdated law from a bygone era.

Right? This place is getting a bit mental, we need our imaginary friend.

[The Internet]

10 minutes ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Exactly moves straight into politicising it just like republicans have. Sandy Cortez brings abortion straight into the conversation. But I guess you don't see that as politicising things. Wake up man they're all as bad as each other. No matter what "wing" you  are on. 

 

If anything the republicans are trying to de-politicise it by babbling on about God and such nonsense. It needs to be politicised for action to be taken. 

[Auld Reekin']

2 minutes ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Exactly moves straight into politicising it just like republicans have. Sandy Cortez brings abortion straight into the conversation. But I guess you don't see that as politicising things. Wake up man they're all as bad as each other. No matter what "wing" you  are on. 

 

I don't see that as "politicising" at all. For me, it's a statement of fact: gun-controls and arms-reduction might not be a "magic-bullet" (sorry ) solution but they would surely be a big step in the right direction. Far fewer guns in far fewer hands would, as far as I'm concerned, result in far fewer incidents such as the latest of so many in a Texas primary school.

 

OK, it is political in a US context, but that's also a huge part of the problem.

 

I don't know what Sandy Cortez said about abortion, so I can't comment about that directly. (It does, however, seem very clear that the Republican Right care much more deeply about unborn lives than they do about the lives of those already around them, whether children or not.)

 

Do you support the NRA's & Republican Right's stance on gun-control, or rather keepin it as loose as possible? Either way, what possible alternative measures do you see as being effective and possible? I'm genuinely interested.

 

 

[Seymour M Hersh]

2 minutes ago, The Internet said:

 

If anything the republicans are trying to de-politicise it by babbling on about God and such nonsense. It needs to be politicised for action to be taken. 

 

Most of the US political class bang on about religion. Way too much as far as I'm concerned. 

[Seymour M Hersh]

3 minutes ago, Auld Reekin' said:

 

I don't see that as "politicising" at all. For me, it's a statement of fact: gun-controls and arms-reduction might not be a "magic-bullet" (sorry ) solution but they would surely be a big step in the right direction. Far fewer guns in far fewer hands would, as far as I'm concerned, result in far fewer incidents such as the latest of so many in a Texas primary school.

 

OK, it is political in a US context, but that's also a huge part of the problem.

 

I don't know what Sandy Cortez said about abortion, so I can't comment about that directly. (It does, however, seem very clear that the Republican Right care much more deeply about unborn lives than they do about the lives of those already around them, whether children or not.)

 

Do you support the NRA's & Republican Right's stance on gun-control, or rather keepin it as loose as possible? Either way, what possible alternative measures do you see as being effective and possible? I'm genuinely interested.

 

 

 

I have zero interest in what they do over there regarding the 2nd amendment etc theatship has sailed, the train has left the station or any other idiom you sare to employ to put a lid on gun ownership in the US. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 hours ago, highlandjambo3 said:

Didn’t trump make some sort of statement about stabbings in London a while back when responding to some *gun control issue/questions about young death comparisons to UK & USA/another mass shooting.

 

* not sure exactly what prompted his statement but I’m sure he said something.

 

He did, tried to claim that the reason they use knives is because they can't get guns, he was trying to say guns were better than knives which is why we need more good guys with guns etc.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Jambo-Jimbo

[Sharpie]

Is there anyone else who finds it rather repugnant that an eighteen year old can walk into gun shop, examine the stock and just buy a deadly assault style weapon. Christ when I was his age I was just that year allowed to buy cigarettes, although I was deemed old enough to die for my Country all those dear innocent wee bairns dead, and not one person who says Mea Culpa. Mebbe I get too emotional about kids, but I have had the misfortune of on numerous occasions seen the devastation of sadness in a neighborhood when one child has died even by accident, I cannot visualise the emotional outpourings of this present tragedy.

 

[Maple Leaf]

School shootings are a regular occurrence in the US, twenty so far this year apparently, although this one is particularly appalling.

 

This incident will drop out of the news soon enough.  Everyone will express their shock and horror, politicians will point fingers at each other, many will send their thoughts and prayers, the media will maintain it's interest for only a few days, and nothing concrete will change.

 

Mass shootings in the US are a daily event.  Nothing to see folks, please move along.

[Maple Leaf]

10 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

Is there anyone else who finds it rather repugnant that an eighteen year old can walk into gun shop, examine the stock and just buy a deadly assault style weapon. Christ when I was his age I was just that year allowed to buy cigarettes, although I was deemed old enough to die for my Country all those dear innocent wee bairns dead, and not one person who says Mea Culpa. Mebbe I get too emotional about kids, but I have had the misfortune of on numerous occasions seen the devastation of sadness in a neighborhood when one child has died even by accident, I cannot visualise the emotional outpourings of this present tragedy.

 

 

I read some details this morning and it's enough to give a person nightmares.

 

He is said to have walked into a single classroom, barricaded the door behind him, then shot the two teachers and the kids one by one.  It's unimaginable what those children went through in their last minutes of life.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

12 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

Is there anyone else who finds it rather repugnant that an eighteen year old can walk into gun shop, examine the stock and just buy a deadly assault style weapon. Christ when I was his age I was just that year allowed to buy cigarettes, although I was deemed old enough to die for my Country all those dear innocent wee bairns dead, and not one person who says Mea Culpa. Mebbe I get too emotional about kids, but I have had the misfortune of on numerous occasions seen the devastation of sadness in a neighborhood when one child has died even by accident, I cannot visualise the emotional outpourings of this present tragedy.

 

 

I said it earlier that there is something way wrong with a country, when an 18 year old can walk into a gun shop and buy an assault rifle but would have to wait another 3 years before they could buy a beer.

[JudyJudyJudy]

I cant even read any stories about it. Its just that upsetting and completely avoidable in the main really. Poor kids and families. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

8 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

School shootings are a regular occurrence in the US, twenty so far this year apparently, although this one is particularly appalling.

 

This incident will drop out of the news soon enough.  Everyone will express their shock and horror, politicians will point fingers at each other, many will send their thoughts and prayers, the media will maintain it's interest for only a few days, and nothing concrete will change.

 

Mass shootings in the US are a daily event.  Nothing to see folks, please move along.

 

The mother of one of the Sandy Hook victims was on CBS and she was saying that 120 families in America are touched by gun violence every single day, but few of them even make the news anymore, maybe if the media reported them, then maybe it would start to hit home to people just how many lives are being lost to guns.

[Ray Gin]

Now is not the time to politicise it, according to the press conference live on bbc right now. Apparently its not a political issue. We need to concentrate on prayers.

 

Protester launched and called a sick son of a bitch for having a go at them for continually doing eff all to change anything.

[Gards]

5 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

Now is not the time to politicise it, according to the press conference live on bbc right now. Apparently its not a political issue. We need to concentrate on prayers.

 

Protester launched and called a sick son of a bitch for having a go at them for continually doing eff all to change anything.

The protestor was Beto O'Rourke - former house representative for Texas...Democrat.  So would definitely have been related to gun laws.

[Psychedelicropcircle]

Not old enough to drink but is old enough for an assault rifle. 
 

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

There can’t be a country in the world with a more misplaced impression of itself than America. Run by some of the thickest ***** known to man and willing to sacrifice kids for the sake of a bit of paper written hundreds of years ago (and money, obviously).

[The Real Maroonblood]

3 minutes ago, Psychedelicropcircle said:

Not old enough to drink but is old enough for an assault rifle. 
 

 

Absolute mental. 

 

[Auld Reekin']

1 hour ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

I have zero interest in what they do over there regarding the 2nd amendment etc theatship has sailed, the train has left the station or any other idiom you sare to employ to put a lid on gun ownership in the US. 

 

But you clearly are interested when a Democratic president and other politicians very reasonably state the view that gun-control and gun-limitation would be desirable as a means to try and stop this type of horrifying mass-shooting happening yet again as this is scoring "political points" in your view.

 

In my view you have a very skewed set of priorities on this matter.  

[Ray Gin]

When people care more about their right to own a gun than they do about protecting the lives of kids, there's really not much hope for the country. Their society is ****ed and there's no sign that it will ever change.

 

 

[Victorian]

There could be one of these every single day from today until Christmas and nothing would change the dynamics of the 'debate'.  

 

It's just boils down to another example of some people caring infinitely more about themselves than for others losing their right to live.  Part of the human condition.

[Maple Leaf]

10 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

When people care more about their right to own a gun than they do about protecting the lives of kids, there's really not much hope for the country. Their society is ****ed and there's no sign that it will ever change.

 

 

 

That is correct.

 

The US Senate has adopted a procedure they call a 'filibuster', which is different from the filibuster in British or Canadian politics.  The American filibuster requires that all major legislation needs a 60% vote in the Senate to pass, rather than a simple majority.  The current balance in the Senate is 50-50, which means that at least 10 Senators have to vote with the other side on any major bill.  

Since the Dems and Republicans despise each other, that isn't going to happen.

[Seymour M Hersh]

31 minutes ago, Auld Reekin' said:

 

But you clearly are interested when a Democratic president and other politicians very reasonably state the view that gun-control and gun-limitation would be desirable as a means to try and stop this type of horrifying mass-shooting happening yet again as this is scoring "political points" in your view.

 

In my view you have a very skewed set of priorities on this matter.  

 

I wasn't even replying to you in the first place. I merely made the point they all jump on these situations and politicise them to suit their own agenda. You've made up the rest in your head. I think you must be living up to your name. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Seymour M Hersh

[Sharpie]

I stand to be corrected but the interminable Right to Bear Arms, was that not instituted when the cry was The British are Coming, The British are Coming, now they are welcoming millions of British tourists, subsidising their National Debt with the money raised from the same British tourists, but they still maintain the law or order that had them bear arms to keep those same British out of their Country.

[RobNox]

The Daily Onion put out the same story that they do after all of these mass shootings, they just change the specifics of the latest shooting.  Headline is always the same 'no way to prevent this' says only nation where this regularly happens.  Quotes are always the same, but attributed to made up people who can't see any way to stop this happening.

 

https://www.theonion.com/no-way-to-prevent-this-says-only-nation-where-this-r-1848971668

[Sharpie]

On the news today he locked himself in a classroom with the kids and I think two teachers and in full view of the prisoners executed them one by one, so one kid saw all their friends and teachers shot  and killed before that poor child was executed. I may be losing my mental ability over this, but I feel his corpse should be displayed publicly and subjected to disgusting abuses and amputations and a message broadcast to any future pig like him that this is what their fate will be when captured whether alive or dead. First time in my life I have felt this bitter,but nobody let alone a child should have to see their friends and teaches slaughtered. And if the question arises would you do the chopping and cutting, you bet your f.....g life I would with no conscience or shame. This pig has changed me totally if I even saw some pig indecently expose himself to a youngster right now, I would take doing time for what I done to him as an honor and pleasure.

[Unknown user]

5 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

When people care more about their right to own a gun than they do about protecting the lives of kids, there's really not much hope for the country. Their society is ****ed and there's no sign that it will ever change.

 

 

It's past fixing too. What if they saw sense, the voters and politicians all agreed Yes, it's time to ban guns. What next, who hands in their guns? All the law abiding citizens do, leaving them helpless at the hands of all the armed crooks out there who see a competitive advantage.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

9 hours ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Exactly moves straight into politicising it just like republicans have. Sandy Cortez brings abortion straight into the conversation. But I guess you don't see that as politicising things. Wake up man they're all as bad as each other. No matter what "wing" you  are on. 

 

Gun laws are made by politicians and are therefore political.

 

The Democrats are politicizing this because it should be poltiicized. If the GOP want to stop politicizing it, they can stop filibustering every basic gun control measure that comes before them. Until then, every school shooting (FFS, just the phrase "every school shooting" is infuriating) will be and should be politicized because it is an example of catastrophic policy failure that used to be a bipartisan failure but is now wholly down to a single party.

 

There is blood on every GOP Senator's hand, and they should be made to answer politically every time this happens and every blessed day in between where it doesn't.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

7 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

When people care more about their right to own a gun than they do about protecting the lives of kids, there's really not much hope for the country. Their society is ****ed and there's no sign that it will ever change.

 

 

 

To be clear, an ovewhelming majority of the country wants stricter gun limits, but they are blocked because of the dogged work of the NRA to keep the GOP on a leash and the inherently undemocratic institutions baked into American governance like the Senate (both in its skewed representation and in its byzantine rules) and the Electoral College.

 

If major gun control measures were put to a direct vote they'd pass with 60% easily.

 

The US is in a terrible state at the moment, on this and on so many other issues.

[ri Alban]

It's a pity they couldn't take this ***** alive, he'd be in a whole world of pain for the rest of his days when he went to prison. The dirty filthy animal.

 

 

 

I read/heard that 90% of the population of the USA want gun control. They should have referendum on whether to ban guns or not. 

 

And Yes people say they'd use a knife, but at least you have a chance with a knife, or the Polis can feck the ***** up .

Edited May 26, 2022 by ri Alban

[SpruceBringsteen]

Cops were too cowardly to tackle the gunman.

 

[Jeffros Furios]

Ted Cruz is a scumbag .

[Seymour M Hersh]

1 hour ago, Jeffros Furios said:

Ted Cruz is a scumbag .

 

Without knowing that much about him he does look sleazy certainly.