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*** Hearts Summer Transfer Window 2022 - Snodgrass signs ***


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Phil D. Corners
12 hours ago, BackOfTheNet said:


Well if the reported £500k we might spend on him is true, then you can get two out of contract players on £5k a week. Which I believe Gordon isn’t even on.


500k would be the value of paying a player 3.2K a week over 3 years. That’s in the ball park of Hearts wage structure and I assume what Shankland would be offered. 
 

Is it better to sign two random/unknown out of contract players in on contracts worth 500k each, at a total of 1 million.  Or just sign 1 player for 500k who is well known to the management team and knows the league for the same wages, which also has a total value of 1 million.
 

Personally 500k is too much for Shankland, but if Robbie wants to pay that for him, then so be it.  
 

 

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5 minutes ago, Phil D. Corners said:


500k would be the value of paying a player 3.2K a week over 3 years. That’s in the ball park of Hearts wage structure and I assume what Shankland would be offered. 
 

Is it better to sign two random/unknown out of contract players in on contracts worth 500k each, at a total of 1 million.  Or just sign 1 player for 500k who is well known to the management team and knows the league for the same wages, which also has a total value of 1 million.
 

Personally 500k is too much for Shankland, but if Robbie wants to pay that for him, then so be it.  
 

 

And his wages. 

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Dick Dastardly
1 hour ago, Newton51 said:

Shankland was playing out of position at left wing in Belgium. Guaranteed goals for whoever he signs for if played in his actual position 

What position was he playing for Dundee Utd? 

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Jambof3tornado
1 hour ago, PapaShango said:

Simms is getting better every week would love another season out of him 

If we fail to get simms we've seen in him exactly what is neded for whoever we do bring in.

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BackOfTheNet
11 minutes ago, Phil D. Corners said:


500k would be the value of paying a player 3.2K a week over 3 years. That’s in the ball park of Hearts wage structure and I assume what Shankland would be offered. 
 

Is it better to sign two random/unknown out of contract players in on contracts worth 500k each, at a total of 1 million.  Or just sign 1 player for 500k who is well known to the management team and knows the league for the same wages, which also has a total value of 1 million.
 

Personally 500k is too much for Shankland, but if Robbie wants to pay that for him, then so be it.  
 

 


I meant £500k that we would spend as a one off could be spent on (just less than) £5k a week for a year for two players. Obviously unknown quantities are unknown quantities, but there are players in England the likes of Simms leaving big clubs who would take such wages as they’ve mostly only played U23 games (like Simms did) or there are players abroad who play for national sides who are currently on less than that seeing out their contracts. We can only talk in hypotheticals at the moment, but with Shankland we know what he can do in the Scottish Premiership as opposed to Championship, so there’s already a barometer there with him. Would be wiser to spend money on Shankland or use that money elsewhere? Only hindsight come this time next year will tell us that really, but with Shankland we have evidence of what benefit or lack of benefit he may bring for any money spent on him.

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Shankland was rumoured to be on a big wage at Dundee Utd and I doubt he'd go to Belgium (and to a team willing to pay £1m for him) without earning similar, or more. You'd have to wonder what his wage demands are like and whether that plus a transfer fee really offers us value for money vs looking elsewhere.

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BackOfTheNet
12 minutes ago, RS86 said:

Shankland was rumoured to be on a big wage at Dundee Utd and I doubt he'd go to Belgium (and to a team willing to pay £1m for him) without earning similar, or more. You'd have to wonder what his wage demands are like and whether that plus a transfer fee really offers us value for money vs looking elsewhere.


Yes, this. Basically what I said, but without my long winded posts spanning several pages. :lol:

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4 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said:


Yes, this. Basically what I said, but without my long winded posts spanning several pages. :lol:

I hadn't read as far down, but in complete agreement 😄

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Bazzas right boot
7 hours ago, WheatfieldWarrior said:

 

Not a criticism and no strong feelings either way on  Shankland, but as a comparison Sims is on 7 goals in 18 games with all his goals coming against SPL sides.   Sims, if we can get him in would be my first pick.

 

 

We can get and imo need 2 strikers. 

I do not think it's an either or scenerio. 

 

In regards to Shankland, as per folk go to the extremes-

 

He's class, a machine etc - clearly not at the higher level, he's got a bit to prove but Tbh I do not expect him to get a return in top flight football like he did in the championship. 

 

On the other hand, folk writing him off as not good enough because his goal return is not as prolific for Utd or a relegated Belgium side where he played left a lot - ffs. 

Also, we are Hearts playing in Europe for the first time in 5 years who play in Scotland, expectations are rightly high but a bit realism is required, we suddenly aren't a European super power that can offer terms better than most. Top strikers will have options greater than Hearts, most of our signings will have a little hope attatched to them rather than complete, proven strikers at our level. 

 

Simms and Shankland would be great options for us to have. 

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Bazzas right boot
36 minutes ago, RS86 said:

Shankland was rumoured to be on a big wage at Dundee Utd and I doubt he'd go to Belgium (and to a team willing to pay £1m for him) without earning similar, or more. You'd have to wonder what his wage demands are like and whether that plus a transfer fee really offers us value for money vs looking elsewhere.

 

 

Agreed to an extent. 

 

However, Bob will make that call. 

Also, it's not like a proven striker at the top level will be cheap. 

 

I'm not the biggest Shankland fan, but I'm interested to see where this mystery, complete, goal scoring striker who is cheap and just dieing to come to Hearts and Scotland to play and  who just happens to have avoided the interest of bigger clubs is? 

 

There won't be many strikers, goal scoring ones anyway that have little interest from other clubs and are interested in Hearts. 

 

A chap in oz, a market we like-  apparently has 11 goals and 5 assists in 19 games.... 🧐

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

 

Agreed to an extent. 

 

However, Bob will make that call. 

Also, it's not like a provan striker at the top level will be cheap. 

 

I'm not the biggest Shankland fan, but I'm interested to see where this mystery, complete, goal scoring striker who is cheap and just dieing to come to Hearts and Scotland to play and  who just happens to have avoided the interest of bigger clubs is? 

 

There won't be many strikers, goal scoring ones anyway that have little interest from other clubs and are interested in Hearts. 

 

A chap in oz, a market we like apparently has 11 goals and 5 assists in 19 games.... 🧐

 

 

 


Provan was a winger and thank fully we got a Colquhoun instead but I can not remember if either were cheap 

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Bazzas right boot
46 minutes ago, Jambof3tornado said:

If we fail to get simms we've seen in him exactly what is neded for whoever we do bring in.

 

 

If that happens, We'd also just have seen that guys like him are out of our reach. 

 

IMO, he's still not good enough for the EPL, really hope Everton stay up and rebuild. 

Our best chance of securing him but would not be suprised if a club like a Forrest or Blackburn take a punt on him. 

 

 

 

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Issue with Shankland for me is the cost reported, half a million is a lot for us. 

 

Arguments can be made for his goals drying up - think he played SPL under Mickey Mellon in a very defensive setup and by all accounts seems to have been thrown wider than he would like for this Beershot team. 

 

I'm not against Shankland coming in but I'd question the value if it costs us near half a million.

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Jambo dans les Pyrenees

Squad for 22/23

 

GK:  Gordon, Stewart/New Signing, Stone

 

DF:  Atkinson, Smith, Sibbick, Halkett, New Signing, New Signing, Kingsley

 

MF:  Haring, Devlin, Beni, Hallinday, Pollock, Cohrane

 

AM:  McEneff, Woodburn, New Signing

 

FW:  Simms, Boyce, McKay, New Signing, New Signing, Henderson

 

25 players, with 5-6 new signings

 

Out - Moore, Souttar, GMS and Gino.  Possibly Stewart too.

 

I'd like to see Stone, Pollock, Henderson brought into the squad.  It's madness we don't have a reserve league or similar which would really support us in doing that (i.e. even if not playing regularly they still get game time to develop)

 

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1 hour ago, Dick Dastardly said:

What position was he playing for Dundee Utd? 

Scored goals for fun under neilson in the championship. Micky Mellon was a very negative manager more known for being a defensive. Shankland played 1 game against us last season and showed his goal scoring ability then

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5 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Scored goals for fun under neilson in the championship. Micky Mellon was a very negative manager more known for being a defensive. Shankland played 1 game against us last season and showed his goal scoring ability then

Shankland meets the criteria that we’re led to believe Savage looks for. He’s about the right age (26) and I would suspect ‘Hungry’ as he’ll believe he has unfinished business with regards to rebuilding his career in Scotland. Add to this that Bob has worked with him in the past then I reckon there’s some mileage in these so called rumours.

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Jambo dans les Pyrenees

So far, speculation on forwards has been Shankland and Lindsay.  Maybe the Japanese lad that was rumoured in the Jan window, not sure if he is an and/or if Simms stays?

 

Any others? 

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tiger Rudi

If we get him, I just hope he's not another Wyness who scored for fun in smaller teams but never made it in a Hearts jersey. He will be an interesting signing but will be an early target for the boo boys if he doesn't hit the ground running. Personally, I think he's worth the risk but he has the potential to be a costly mistake. We might have our eyes on a cheaper option, but remember Gnando and similar who have turned up at Tynecastle in recent years and been absolute gash. Please not again!! 

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jamboinglasgow
12 minutes ago, Queensland Jambo said:

So far, speculation on forwards has been Shankland and Lindsay.  Maybe the Japanese lad that was rumoured in the Jan window, not sure if he is an and/or if Simms stays?

 

Any others? 

 

Alan Forrest on a free contract

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inspector
6 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

If we get him, I just hope he's not another Wyness who scored for fun in smaller teams but never made it in a Hearts jersey. He will be an interesting signing but will be an early target for the boo boys if he doesn't hit the ground running. Personally, I think he's worth the risk but he has the potential to be a costly mistake. We might have our eyes on a cheaper option, but remember Gnando and similar who have turned up at Tynecastle in recent years and been absolute gash. Please not again!! 

We played Wyness as an out and out striker. It was never his position. Always thought he should have been playing the number 10 role as Boyce is now

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kingantti1874
46 minutes ago, Chong said:

Issue with Shankland for me is the cost reported, half a million is a lot for us. 

 

Arguments can be made for his goals drying up - think he played SPL under Mickey Mellon in a very defensive setup and by all accounts seems to have been thrown wider than he would like for this Beershot team. 

 

I'm not against Shankland coming in but I'd question the value if it costs us near half a million.


agreed.. 500k is too much.  £250k though for a guy who will score 10/15 with the chances we create is a bargain.

 

Simms should be #1 target.. and we still need a striker who can run in behind.. we will need 4 strikers next season 

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tiger Rudi

I know I will be in a minority of 1, and expect a major slagging for even mentioning his name, but Simms & Watt up front would do me 🤣.

How anybody can say Watt's a dud based on performances playing in a team with the car crash called Cathro, baffles me. He was being touted for a Scotland call up with Motherwell. Away to put my tin hat on now! 

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3 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

I know I will be in a minority of 1, and expect a major slagging for even mentioning his name, but Simms & Watt up front would do me 🤣.

How anybody can say Watt's a dud based on performances playing in a team with the car crash called Cathro, baffles me. He was being touted for a Scotland call up with Motherwell. Away to put my tin hat on now! 

Never mind the tin hat. Padded cell for you!

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cosanostra
1 minute ago, tiger Rudi said:

I know I will be in a minority of 1, and expect a major slagging for even mentioning his name, but Simms & Watt up front would do me 🤣.

How anybody can say Watt's a dud based on performances playing in a team with the car crash called Cathro, baffles me. He was being touted for a Scotland call up with Motherwell. Away to put my tin hat on now! 

 

He's talented but not what we need and not available. Dundee United just signed him on a long term deal so we'd need to pay a fee which would be crazy for him. 

Maybe the type of guy you sign for free on a Craig Beattie 6 month contract but not convinced buying out his contract at Dundee United would be worth it.

Could get better and more consistent elsewhere.

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PapaShango
21 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

I know I will be in a minority of 1, and expect a major slagging for even mentioning his name, but Simms & Watt up front would do me 🤣.

How anybody can say Watt's a dud based on performances playing in a team with the car crash called Cathro, baffles me. He was being touted for a Scotland call up with Motherwell. Away to put my tin hat on now! 

I don’t think Cathro was in charge when we had Watt. He definitely has ability but if we want to push on from this season we need to be looking at better. 

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38 prem games, 8 euro games and let’s assume at least 2 in each cup comp, that’s 50 games next year minimum. I’m sure our focus will be on improving the squad depth. I’d go for;

 

New back up GK

Another LB (not Cochrane)

2 x new CBs (not Moore)

New CM (assuming Haring will leave)

2 x wingers (assuming Walker leaves)

2 x strikers (based on not getting Simms)

 

I hope we get Forrest from Livvy and perhaps Clarke currently at Hibs is worth a look as can play various positions, he looked solid at County. I believe Arsenal have a break clause too.

 

Not convinced about Shankland personally, particularly for the reported fee required. 

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TyphoonJambo
1 minute ago, Mort said:

38 prem games, 8 euro games and let’s assume at least 2 in each cup comp, that’s 50 games next year minimum. I’m sure our focus will be on improving the squad depth. I’d go for;

 

New back up GK

Another LB (not Cochrane)

2 x new CBs (not Moore)

New CM (assuming Haring will leave)

2 x wingers (assuming Walker leaves)

2 x strikers (based on not getting Simms)

 

I hope we get Forrest from Livvy and perhaps Clarke currently at Hibs is worth a look as can play various positions, he looked solid at County. I believe Arsenal have a break clause too.

 

Not convinced about Shankland personally, particularly for the reported fee required. 

I'd like to see us get Ronan on a year's loan.

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1 hour ago, Queensland Jambo said:

Squad for 22/23

 

GK:  Gordon, Stewart/New Signing, Stone

 

DF:  Atkinson, Smith, Sibbick, Halkett, New Signing, New Signing, Kingsley

 

MF:  Haring, Devlin, Beni, Hallinday, Pollock, Cohrane

 

AM:  McEneff, Woodburn, New Signing

 

FW:  Simms, Boyce, McKay, New Signing, New Signing, Henderson

 

25 players, with 5-6 new signings

 

Out - Moore, Souttar, GMS and Gino.  Possibly Stewart too.

 

I'd like to see Stone, Pollock, Henderson brought into the squad.  It's madness we don't have a reserve league or similar which would really support us in doing that (i.e. even if not playing regularly they still get game time to develop)

 

Am I right in thinking McFarlane may have leapfrogged Stone?

Would not keep Woodburn.  The (likely) wages/performance return is not appealing.

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tiger Rudi
28 minutes ago, PapaShango said:

I don’t think Cathro was in charge when we had Watt. He definitely has ability but if we want to push on from this season we need to be looking at better. 

Fair point, Cathro's signings were worse. It was Robbie that brought Watt in. Or maybe I mean't Levein ;)

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mellors1874

Shankland if given the right level of service would score goals for Hearts.

All strikers have a spell where they can't miss and spells where they can't score.

Question would u sign a striker who had scored only 28 goals in 120 appearances based on that stat as that was Alan Shearer back in the day at Southampton.

I'm not comparing the two but we need to look at overall picture as if Neilson rates him he's the one to get the best out of him.

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The Real Maroonblood
2 hours ago, Jambof3tornado said:

If we fail to get simms we've seen in him exactly what is neded for whoever we do bring in.

👍

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1 hour ago, PHSCAndy said:

Shankland meets the criteria that we’re led to believe Savage looks for. He’s about the right age (26) and I would suspect ‘Hungry’ as he’ll believe he has unfinished business with regards to rebuilding his career in Scotland. Add to this that Bob has worked with him in the past then I reckon there’s some mileage in these so called rumours.

The Scotland stuff might be enough to convince him to come on a lower wage.

 

If he trusts Robbie and knows he performs under him, he could be in a World Cup squad with a couple good months of football. That would be more valuable to me than a risky move elsewhere that may be more appealing for whatever reason. 

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We want shankland and he seems to want us. Anything between 200/300k and he will be here, we won’t be paying the 500 they’re asking. Woodburn is keen to stay and we are keen to keep him, apparently really impressed in training this season and we believe once he finds form there is money to be made👍🏻

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Goodfella
4 minutes ago, Jamboj1 said:

We want shankland and he seems to want us. Anything between 200/300k and he will be here, we won’t be paying the 500 they’re asking. Woodburn is keen to stay and we are keen to keep him, apparently really impressed in training this season and we believe once he finds form there is money to be made👍🏻

 

Thanks for update. Seems fanciful to get him for 200/300k if they paid 1million for him, but I suppose that depends how much Beerschot want to get rid of him. Woodburn an interesting one going by what you've said. Take it Forrest is looking a done deal?

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3 minutes ago, Jamboj1 said:

We want shankland and he seems to want us. Anything between 200/300k and he will be here, we won’t be paying the 500 they’re asking. Woodburn is keen to stay and we are keen to keep him, apparently really impressed in training this season and we believe once he finds form there is money to be made👍🏻

 

I think paying up to £300k for Shankland is probably okay, but anything over that and IMO we're overpaying and taking a risk. 

 

re Woodburn, I don't think his performances are deserving of a deal tbh. We've saw big Ellis come in and absolutely hit the ground running, and even Cochrane hold his own. The flashes of quality from Woodburn have been too few and far between. The flip side of it is that he's probably known he's getting binned at Liverpool which I think would probably knock his confidence a bit. If Robbie is confident then I think Robbie has earned backing in that regard. 

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14 hours ago, BackOfTheNet said:

 Shankland is a poacher and will be ineffective when we’re out of possession or in terms of build up play


Where does this opinion come from, incidentally? Did you actually watch him closely at Dundee United, or are you just inferring his playing style from his goal stats? Most people did the same with Boyce before he signed for us, only realising he had a bit more about him when he actually played in maroon. People I've heard from (and whose opinion I trust) suggest his all-round game is better than you credit him with and, after a quick google, I can find articles highlighting his movement and link-up play.

 

Having said that, given his limited track record in our league, I'd only take him as a rotation option if the price is right. We should be looking for better as the main man (preferably Simms).

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BackOfTheNet
4 minutes ago, DC_92 said:


Where does this opinion come from, incidentally? Did you actually watch him closely at Dundee United, or are you just inferring his playing style from his goal stats? Most people did the same with Boyce before he signed for us, only realising he had a bit more about him when he actually played in maroon. People I've heard from (and whose opinion I trust) suggest his all-round game is better than you credit him with and, after a quick google, I can find articles highlighting his movement and link-up play.

 

Having said that, given his limited track record in our league, I'd only take him as a rotation option if the price is right. We should be looking for better as the main man (preferably Simms).


His name has been touted for us for years now, and his record was enough to peak my interest. Not going to say I’m watching him weekly, but I did watch him at United when they were in the Championship when games were on Alba (or when he scored against us) and whenever their Premiership games were on TV. And of course his limited Scotland time. Different strikers offer different things, like in Scotland we have Adams and Dykes, and the you had Nisbet. There’s a reason Nisbet wasn’t a starter and that’s because he doesn’t offer more than his ability to strike the ball in the box, really. Shankland is similar in that regard. Not saying he’s useless and a one trick pony, just saying his out of the box game isn’t strong from what I’ve seen. Have a couple of United supporting mates too who although they loved him, did say he was pretty limited. They were getting frustrated with him in the Premiership but they understood the team overall weren’t playing well, which I myself did consider when thinking how he’d be for us. Again though, it’s not that he wouldn’t be a good addition, it’s whether or not he’d be worth the outlay is my only concern.

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Portable Badger
34 minutes ago, Jamboj1 said:

We want shankland and he seems to want us. Anything between 200/300k and he will be here, we won’t be paying the 500 they’re asking. Woodburn is keen to stay and we are keen to keep him, apparently really impressed in training this season and we believe once he finds form there is money to be made👍🏻

Woodburn - Reading his interview in one of the papers it was obvious he’s very keen to stay, wants to discuss a contract and accepts money is not important at this time - he’ll make his once he secures a transfer to a bigger club after being a success at Hearts.     I think we should go for him permanently as he’s a very good talent, great attitude and would get us a few £million in transfer fees.

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LarrysRightFoot
2 minutes ago, Portable Badger said:

Reading his interview in one of the papers it was obvious he’s very keen to stay, wants to discuss a contract and accepts money is not important at this time - he’ll make his once he secures a transfer to a bigger club after being a success at Hearts.     I think we should go for him permanently as he’s a very good talent, great attitude and would get us a few £million in transfer fees.

I’d like to see Woodburn start the next 2 games as the number 10. Think that’s his position and Boyce needs a rest before the final. 

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Tom Hardy’s Dug
14 hours ago, BackOfTheNet said:


Can’t see us making a huge leap from what we’ve done in the past though. I can see us making gradual adjustments in things like wages paid and fees paid. But I don’t expect us to pay six figure sums for multiple players. I’ll wait for the financial reports before seeing if we’re “minted”. :)

I agree - I was just pointing out that our income will take a significant leap over the next 12 months by more than just the headline prize money for qualifying. 
 

The 4 home Euro games will also be “money spinners” for ticket sales.

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Portable Badger
Just now, LarrysRightFoot said:

I’d like to see Woodburn start the next 2 games as the number 10. Think that’s his position and Boyce needs a rest before the final. 

Agree - I don’t think we’ve used Woodburn in his ‘natural ‘ position often enough

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132goals1958
1 hour ago, Portable Badger said:

Woodburn - Reading his interview in one of the papers it was obvious he’s very keen to stay, wants to discuss a contract and accepts money is not important at this time - he’ll make his once he secures a transfer to a bigger club after being a success at Hearts.     I think we should go for him permanently as he’s a very good talent, great attitude and would get us a few £million in transfer fees.

 

I genuinely wish I could share your enthusiasm but over the piece I think he has been very disappointing. Would love to be proved wrong but I see it as a big gamble in terms of fulfilling what to date has been unrealised potential.

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Dick Dastardly
3 hours ago, Newton51 said:

Scored goals for fun under neilson in the championship. Micky Mellon was a very negative manager more known for being a defensive. Shankland played 1 game against us last season and showed his goal scoring ability then

Using his championship scoring record isn't much use though, is it?  I'm neither for or against Shankland (if Neilson thinks he is good enough thats good enough for me) but he definitely hasn't proved his goal scoring ability at our level

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If Shankland is just a one trick pony/just a penalty box striker then how come he’s been playing most recently as a winger in Belgium?

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AllyjamboDerbyshire
7 minutes ago, Ribble said:

If Shankland is just a one trick pony/just a penalty box striker then how come he’s been playing most recently as a winger in Belgium?

Not knocking Shankland, but maybe it goes some way to explaining why they got relegated, especially if he was not the only player regularly played out of position. Is there any evidence that he was any good playing as a winger?

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soonbe110
2 hours ago, Portable Badger said:

Agree - I don’t think we’ve used Woodburn in his ‘natural ‘ position often enough

His natural position is up front as a poacher.  Woodburn or Shankland? 

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Rick Sanchez

I really don't get why people are knocking Shankland. There's room for different kinds of strikers next season.

 

Simms/Other - powerful, on the shoulder runs and holding the ball up. Can finish. Main striker.

 

Shankland - goalscorer who can do a bit of the above but not to the same extent. Emphasis on goalscorer...left, right, head, in the box, out the box and even the half way line at Utd. Second striker.

 

Other/Ginnelly - Pace, pace, pace. Third striker.

 

Boyce - 10 and backup.

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Absolute Scenes

I don’t understand why Shankland is still getting shat on here. At Dundee United, he had worse players round him than what he would at hearts, played in a team that created very little. Surely, surely, in a team where you have the likes of McKay, Boyce, Atkinson etc focussing on attacking and creating chances we’d see the best of him? Look at McKay for example. Did nothing of merit since leaving rangers and yet is one of our best players this season. Folks need to stop the one dimensional, cave man thought process. 

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BackOfTheNet

Christ on a bike, not one person saying that Shankland may not be the best option is knocking him. Simply highlighting that he’s not the proven goal scorer some claim he is is not correct as he has yet to show at our level or above that he can score regularly. That’s not a criticism but statement of fact. Not sure why many get defensive at that. I’ve also yet to see anyone saying they wouldn’t take him in the team, all people have been saying is he’d be expensive for what we’d be getting - which as it currently stands is a proven Championship scorer and a not yet proven Premiership scorer.

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