Inflation

[ri Alban]

Folk on here talking down on others because they got other folk to pay for their mortgages through renting out at exploitive rates. Maybe some folk don't want to rip off their fellow man.

[ri Alban]

Good luck to the none Tory *******s.

[ri Alban]

May the self righteous preach bullshit.

[ri Alban]

Time rent was what the owner paid per month for the mortgage and no more. Plus anyone who leaves the country must pay heavy taxes or sell up at compulsory purchase after 6 months.

[Tommy Brown]

18 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Got fit the immigrants in as well, it'll be the dinghies causing inflation.

At this rate, we will be wanting to use the dinghies to back the other way.

[ri Alban]

If someone rents a property for more than 15 years they should own half the property.

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Tommy Brown said:

At this rate, we will be wanting to use the dinghies to back the other way.

👍 No problem inflating them. 

[Dazo]

No responsibility then ? Thought so.  As you you were. 

[joondalupjambo]

1 hour ago, Tommy Brown said:

At this rate, we will be wanting to use the dinghies to back the other way.

Properly inflated ones at that.

[XB52]

Tories really don't give a stuff about people struggling, do they. Not in Westminster and not on here

[il Duce McTarkin]

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Folk on here talking down on others because they got other folk to pay for their mortgages through renting out at exploitive rates. Maybe some folk don't want to rip off their fellow man.

 

I take it you provide your roofing service for cost then?

 

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

May the self righteous preach bullshit.

 

You do a decent job, tbf.

 

1 hour ago, ri Alban said:

If someone rents a property for more than 15 years they should own half the property.

 

In the same way that Walter Mitty owns half of your head?

[Unknown user]

36 minutes ago, Dazo said:

No responsibility then ? Thought so.  As you you were. 

 

Didn't you spend most of the last 13 years voting for this shower of shit and braying about it?

 

No responsibility? Thought so.

[doctor jambo]

10 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I’m not being funny but £600 a month is really not a big sum for a mortgage. Unless he’s either got somewhere extremely low value or very little left to pay on it, £370 is absolute peanuts.

 

I first bought in 2006. The interest rate was as high then as it is now. Granted, the cost of living is putting massive pressure on now but the fact is, too many people have unrealistic expectations of how expensive a mortgage should be. And loads who benefitted for tracker mortgages during years and years of zero interest rates did **** all to plan ahead for the day when rates changed.

Years of low interest rates did f-all to benefit people.

we were all locked in austerity pay freezes for a decade.

10+ years of pay cuts were only manageable because borrowing was cheap so we could still move home etc whilst still getting poorer year after year.

at no point did I think, “yay another paycut with a young family, I’ve now got lots of spare money to pay down my mortgage “

[henrysmithsgloves]

Good news for me😃 got a letter from Scottish power yesterday my electricity bill is going down,a whole 52p a week😳

[Dazo]

1 minute ago, Smithee said:

 

Didn't you spend most of the last 13 years voting for this shower of shit and braying about it?

 

No responsibility? Thought so.

No I voted for the proper Tory party not this shower of criminals/shite. Voted tactically in the last elections. Next election will see them out. I pay my bills just fine, don’t claim benefits, use private health where possible and haven’t raised the rent on my buy to let’s in 5 years so I’m not really the problem. So in terms of doing my bit not much else I can do. What is it I’m not being responsible for ? 
 

Not like you to jump in with two feet and land in concrete though. 

 

[Unknown user]

Just now, Dazo said:

No I voted for the proper Tory party not this shower of criminals/shite. Voted tactically in the last elections. Next election will see them out. I pay my bills just fine, don’t claim benefits, use private health where possible and haven’t raised the rent on my buy to let’s in 5 years so I’m not really the problem. So in terms of doing my bit not much else I can do. What is it I’m not being responsible for ? 
 

Not like you to jump in with two feet and land in concrete though. 

 

 

Your choices. The country's in the state it's in because of the party you repeatedly voted for, and here you are acting all superior while others face proper misery.

 

Didn't you cheer on Truss's budget too?

[Dazo]

4 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Your choices. The country's in the state it's in because of the party you repeatedly voted for, and here you are acting all superior while others face proper misery.

 

Didn't you cheer on Truss's budget too?

I’m not acting superior in the slightest. You questioned my own responsibility I responded. Who we vote for doesn’t always work out the way we want, I can only change my vote. Blaming me because other preppie are struggling is just nonsense. We’ve been down this road before, I have no time or sympathy for people who mismanage their own affairs. Borrow far more than they should then stand there with their handout when it all goes tits up. The interests rates were so low because of idiotic borrowing last time. Historically where we are at isn’t even bad but people piled on with no thought about what might happen if rates went back to some sort of normal. 

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Dazo said:

I’m not acting superior in the slightest. 

 

That's exactly what you're doing, all over this thread. People need to take responsibility according to you.

 

Our whole economy's built on aspirational spending, it's buying into the Tory dream.

 

Where's your responsibility? The UK went down the path you voted for. 

[hughesie27]

4 minutes ago, Dazo said:

I’m not acting superior in the slightest. You questioned my own responsibility I responded. Who we vote for doesn’t always work out the way we want, I can only change my vote. Blaming me because other preppie are struggling is just nonsense. We’ve been down this road before, I have no time or sympathy for people who mismanage their own affairs. Borrow far more than they should then stand there with their handout when it all goes tits up. The interests rates were so low because of idiotic borrowing last time. Historically where we are at isn’t even bad but people piled on with no thought about what might happen if rates went back to some sort of normal. 

When you vote Tory you get exactly what we have right now. That shouldn't be a surprise. You can partly own this shit show we have had to deal with. Or you can opt for the Johnson defence by saying you were too stupid to see what was actually going on.

[Dazo]

1 minute ago, hughesie27 said:

When you vote Tory you get exactly what we have right now. That shouldn't be a surprise. You can partly own this shit show we have had to deal with. Or you can opt for the Johnson defence by saying you were too stupid to see what was actually going on.

And there it is, everyone who voted Tory is stupid. 😂

 

You guys are just too angry to argue with. I’ll stick to being stupid, seems to work out okay. 👍

[Dazo]

5 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

That's exactly what you're doing, all over this thread. People need to take responsibility according to you.

 

Our whole economy's built on aspirational spending, it's buying into the Tory dream.

 

Where's your responsibility? The UK went down the path you voted for. 

People don’t need to take responsibility ? None ? 😂

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, Dazo said:

And there it is, everyone who voted Tory is stupid. 😂

 

You guys are just too angry to argue with. I’ll stick to being stupid, seems to work out okay. 👍

 

I'm not at all angry, I just think you're a cheeky **** swaggering about telling people to take responsibility for a mess you helped create.

This is people's lives we're talking about.

 

2 minutes ago, Dazo said:

People don’t need to take responsibility ? None ? 😂

 

I didn't say or imply that, as you and everyone else can see.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Smithee

[hughesie27]

4 minutes ago, Dazo said:

And there it is, everyone who voted Tory is stupid. 😂

 

You guys are just too angry to argue with. I’ll stick to being stupid, seems to work out okay. 👍

I never called you stupid. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

59 minutes ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

 

I take it you provide your roofing service for cost then?

 

This is so typical of self employed people, my wife was saying her hairdresser was ranting on about supermarkets profiteering then when she went to pay her haircut it had gone up from £36 to £50.

[BlueRiver]

44 minutes ago, henrysmithsgloves said:

Good news for me😃 got a letter from Scottish power yesterday my electricity bill is going down,a whole 52p a week😳

 

 

Drinks on you? 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

9 hours ago, periodictabledancer said:

That's one great big sweeping generalisation.

You're seriously saying "loads" should have foreseen the perfect storm of the current rates of rampant inflation and outrageously high energy costs coupled with ever climbing interest rates ? Not to mention the war in Ukraine or the disaster that was Trussonomics. 

I’m saying loads should have realised that mortgage rates at 6% is nothing out of the ordinary 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 hour ago, doctor jambo said:

Years of low interest rates did f-all to benefit people.

we were all locked in austerity pay freezes for a decade.

10+ years of pay cuts were only manageable because borrowing was cheap so we could still move home etc whilst still getting poorer year after year.

at no point did I think, “yay another paycut with a young family, I’ve now got lots of spare money to pay down my mortgage “

If you were on a tracker mortgage that tracked the base rate of interest then low rates absolutely did do something to help you 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

11 hours ago, Jambof3tornado said:

He's got 23.5 years left on it. Paid just over 100,000 for a flat in Alloa.

 

Its still a 62% increase in the cost,for his low value property!!!

 

He didnt break the bank to buy something he couldnt afford when rates rose,clearly at 2.19% for 2 years they were only going to go up.

Yeah, that’s a tough situation and by no means an expensive property 

[Konrad von Carstein]

12 hours ago, jack D and coke said:

She sounds nice…

Entitled cow...prolly would though 😔

[Carter]

2 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I’m saying loads should have realised that mortgage rates at 6% is nothing out of the ordinary 

They aren't. Or at least shouldn't be perceived as such. Society has been conditioned into believing virtually zero interest rates would remain enduring. 

 

There hasn't been a proper comprehensive economic recover in the aftermath of 2008. Artificially low interest rates have underpinned the apparent recovery, which has basically been low growth, stagnation and a gradual creation of a gig economy. 

 

Historical levels of interest rates weren't on debt multiples evident today. Energy prices weren't proportionately at levels seen at present. The whole green energy nonsense.

 

We're in a great big puddle of piss and neither the Government nor the BoE have the shoes for it. 

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Carter said:

They aren't. Or at least shouldn't be perceived as such. Society has been conditioned into believing virtually zero interest rates would remain enduring. 

 

There hasn't been a proper comprehensive economic recover in the aftermath of 2008. Artificially low interest rates have underpinned the apparent recovery, which has basically been low growth, stagnation and a gradual creation of a gig economy. 

 

Historical levels of interest rates weren't on debt multiples evident today. Energy prices weren't proportionately at levels seen at present. The whole green energy nonsense.

 

We're in a great big puddle of piss and neither the Government nor the BoE have the shoes for it. 

 

There are other pressures too. The percentage of households with mortgages is about 30% now, down from a historic 40%

 

Raising interest rates brings more of mortgage payers' money in to shore things up, and when there are fewer mortgages, they need to be milked even harder to make up the difference.

 

The Tories have made a rip roaring ***** of this and it's going to snowball.

[Carter]

3 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

There are other pressures too. The percentage of households with mortgages is about 30% now, down from a historic 40%

 

Raising interest rates brings more of mortgage payers' money in to shore things up, and when there are fewer mortgages, they need to be milked even harder to make up the difference.

 

The Tories have made a rip roaring ***** of this and it's going to snowball.

They certainly have. Disgraceful. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

Just now, Carter said:

They certainly have. Disgraceful. 

Yet, in the true British spirit some say **** you Jack I’m alright.

[BlueRiver]

I do get some of the argument about debt and a bit of personal responsibility but when you're looking at rate rises as rapidly as this even a lot of prudent people will be getting leathered. 

 

Not everyone that's going to be struggling now was some debt up to the eyeballs, 6 maxed credit cards, car on finance, and a stone island jacket coming on klarna into the bargain. We all know the sort but its important to not think of them as the whole picture. 

 

That said I'd probably be howling at the moon if they took steps to bail out mortgage holders and keep this silly housing bubble going. 

[Carter]

3 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Yet, in the true British spirit some say **** you Jack I’m alright.

Falling asset prices (resi property) will focus the mind. 

[Dazo]

1 hour ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

This is so typical of self employed people, my wife was saying her hairdresser was ranting on about supermarkets profiteering then when she went to pay her haircut it had gone up from £36 to £50.

I feel your pain, my wife informs me her nail girl has put her prices up 3 times in the last year. 🤬

[kila]

1 hour ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I’m saying loads should have realised that mortgage rates at 6% is nothing out of the ordinary 

6% with excessive house prices is a significant chunk of people’s salaries. You can’t compare currently rates to 1970s, it’s entirely different. 
 

If we had cheaper housing then yes 6% wouldn’t be too big a deal for most. That’s the problem, house prices have spiralled out of control, and the banks are rolling in the profits. It’s a ****ed up game and fixed against the majority of us. 

[Jambof3tornado]

2 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

If you were on a tracker mortgage that tracked the base rate of interest then low rates absolutely did do something to help you 

I benefitted. Came off 3rd year of stepped mortgage onto rate guaranteed to be no more than base plus 0.5%. Sat on that until last year when we jumped onto a 10 year 2.19% as it was obvious the rates were scooting up. Had I had a crystal ball we'd have bought a more expensive house!!!!

[Tommy Brown]

4 hours ago, joondalupjambo said:

Properly inflated ones at that.

Hmm...there are a lot in this country that would be quite happy to set to sea in an under deflated one.

[mrmarkus1981_1]

Octopus Energy reducing my projected yearly bill by £393....... For now!

[periodictabledancer]

2 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

There are other pressures too. The percentage of households with mortgages is about 30% now, down from a historic 40%

 

Raising interest rates brings more of mortgage payers' money in to shore things up, and when there are fewer mortgages, they need to be milked even harder to make up the difference.

 

The Tories have made a rip roaring ***** of this and it's going to snowball.

Which was the point I was making yesterday. We are being told "core inflation" is the problem (new car purchases being one of the two main  items I read about, also cost of flights ). In which case the govt needs to do something that attacks this directly - start with huge VAT increases on new cars because screwing mortgage payers (who aren't likley buying new cars right now) won't help that particular problem. 

It was interesting watching Petson last night : he absolutely roasted the Tory MP spokesperson put up and said bluntly , higher mortgages are hurting  people and not addressing the core problem. All the Tories can do is repeat the manta that the punishment will continue until morale improves, even if it takes years. 

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

Which was the point I was making yesterday. We are being told "core inflation" is the problem (new car purchases being one of the two main  items I read about, also cost of flights ). In which case the govt needs to do something that attacks this directly - start with huge VAT increases on new cars because screwing mortgage payers (who aren't likley buying new cars right now) won't help that particular problem. 

It was interesting watching Petson last night : he absolutely roasted the Tory MP spokesperson put up and said bluntly , higher mortgages are hurting  people and not addressing the core problem. All the Tories can do is repeat the manta that the punishment will continue until morale improves, even if it takes years. 

 

The middle classes are going to get hammered unless something absolutely massive happens.

 

Unfortunately they can expect the same level of support and empathy as the unemployed, disabled, working poor and single parents have faced over the last 13 years

[periodictabledancer]

2 hours ago, BlueRiver said:

I do get some of the argument about debt and a bit of personal responsibility but when you're looking at rate rises as rapidly as this even a lot of prudent people will be getting leathered. 

 

Not everyone that's going to be struggling now was some debt up to the eyeballs, 6 maxed credit cards, car on finance, and a stone island jacket coming on klarna into the bargain. We all know the sort but its important to not think of them as the whole picture. 

 

That said I'd probably be howling at the moon if they took steps to bail out mortgage holders and keep this silly housing bubble going. 

100% correct.

My missus works for a mortgage advisory lender and she has been seeing borrowers refused loans on a regular baisis. Some lenders asking , in some circumstances, can borrowers afford interest rates of 15 % (and I posted about this months ago). 

Lenders routinely ask for household budget plans that go into excruciating detail and borrowers have to show they can afford the inevitable higher rates. It seems like a few people on here are ignorant of the reality. 

The current rates are affordable (or should be for the majority) - but not againt a backdrop of falling wages (this year is a notable exception) , soaring food costs and rampant energy inflation.  Neither of which shows any great signs of returning to "normal". 

[periodictabledancer]

Just now, Smithee said:

 

The middle classes are going to get hammered unless something absolutely massive happens.

 

Unfortunately they can expect the same level of support and empathy as the unemployed, disabled, working poor and single parents have faced over the last 13 years

This is where it becomes a problem for tories & tory voters , none of whom care about anything but their own. The govt is terrified already that the rate of repossessions is rocketing and when that happens and we have the inevitable fall in house prices ...

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

100% correct.

My missus works for a mortgage advisory lender and she has been seeing borrowers refused loans on a regular baisis. Some lenders asking , in some circumstances, can borrowers afford interest rates of 15 % (and I posted about this months ago). 

Lenders routinely ask for household budget plans that go into excruciating detail and borrowers have to show they can afford the inevitable higher rates. It seems like a few people on here are ignorant of the reality. 

The current rates are affordable (or should be for the majority) - but not againt a backdrop of falling wages (this year is a notable exception) , soaring food costs and rampant energy inflation.  Neither of which shows any great signs of returning to "normal". 

 

Just on the stress testing part, the banks were told, last summer I believe, that they could relax their stress testing if they wanted.

I'm glad your Mrs works for a responsible lender but they're not all like that.

 

Sorry, I just re read her actual job

Edited June 22, 2023 by Smithee

[BlueRiver]

6 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

100% correct.

My missus works for a mortgage advisory lender and she has been seeing borrowers refused loans on a regular baisis. Some lenders asking , in some circumstances, can borrowers afford interest rates of 15 % (and I posted about this months ago). 

Lenders routinely ask for household budget plans that go into excruciating detail and borrowers have to show they can afford the inevitable higher rates. It seems like a few people on here are ignorant of the reality. 

The current rates are affordable (or should be for the majority) - but not againt a backdrop of falling wages (this year is a notable exception) , soaring food costs and rampant energy inflation.  Neither of which shows any great signs of returning to "normal". 

 

Yep and I'm sure I saw something about those background tests being relaxed. 

 

I've no idea how much of an interest rise they previously took into account but I doubt it was as extreme as what we're seeing happening with interest rates now. I saw an article earlier about how mortgage stress tests didn't take into account inflation either. I'll try and find it. It was Guardian or Independent but I'm sure your wife would probably be able to confirm it. 

 

On another point i noted further up that your suggestion as at odds with Salmond. I find your idea of raising VAT on certain things made more sense o cool inflation and I'm still mystified at how Salmond believed a reduction in VAT would help in this crisis? Any ideas? 

[periodictabledancer]

22 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

Which was the point I was making yesterday. We are being told "core inflation" is the problem (new car purchases being one of the two main  items I read about, also cost of flights ). In which case the govt needs to do something that attacks this directly - start with huge VAT increases on new cars because screwing mortgage payers (who aren't likley buying new cars right now) won't help that particular problem. 

It was interesting watching Petson last night : he absolutely roasted the Tory MP spokesperson put up and said bluntly , higher mortgages are hurting  people and not addressing the core problem. All the Tories can do is repeat the manta that the punishment will continue until morale improves, even if it takes years. 

For comparison, I'm looking at flights to Larnaca for the Cyprus game in September. Flights coming in at £500-£600 (that's a flight, not a holiday) - blatant profiteering. I paid around £450 to fly to JFK in April. 

[Shooter McGavin]

Bank rate increased by 0.5%, new bank rate is 5%

[Diadora Van Basten]

Interest rates up 0.5% that means I will be paying an extra £60 a month groan.

[periodictabledancer]

7 minutes ago, BlueRiver said:

 

Yep and I'm sure I saw something about those background tests being relaxed. 

 

I've no idea how much of an interest rise they previously took into account but I doubt it was as extreme as what we're seeing happening with interest rates now. I saw an article earlier about how mortgage stress tests didn't take into account inflation either. I'll try and find it. It was Guardian or Independent but I'm sure your wife would probably be able to confirm it. 

 

On another point i noted further up that your suggestion as at odds with Salmond. I find your idea of raising VAT on certain things made more sense o cool inflation and I'm still mystified at how Salmond believed a reduction in VAT would help in this crisis? Any ideas? 

In speaking with my mussus, not much has changed in her experience (and her role is to get the best deal she can for customers so she has a lot of dealing with a lot of lenders ).

It may be that stress testing doesn't (or maybe never did) anticipate high inflation , especially given that 2% was the "norm" for so many years. No one could've foreseen the current economic scenario - like I say,  a perfect storm of super inflation,  massive increase in energy prices/all foodstuffs  coupled with falling real incomes (and that's in spite of the wage increases we're seeing now - which are for from typical for the last 15 years). 

I don't see how a VAT reduction helps (unless we're talking about VAT on fuel* & utility bills - which the govt could've cut and still mainatined their tax take). There's no VAT on food anyway so that wouldn't help. 

*Sunak manged to rake in £2 billion in fuel duty when petrol prices were at their peak. Which he'd planned for tax cuts ahead of the next election. 

 

VAT has always been a touchy subject* because it hits the rich the most. The poor dont have much disposable income so you're not gonna get anything out of them and tories hate the idea of taxing luxury items (it's been mooted over the years and they always refuse). 

* It was orinibally 8% , then doubled to 15% and then "temporrily" incresed to 20% (which it's been at for over  decade now ?). Imagine, a Labour govt raising taxes to that level.