New manager incoming ( merged )

[jambopilms]

8 minutes ago, siegementality said:

If you want to clutch at straws anything can sound in some way positive. The objective was to win the cup, not nearly win it. 

 

I’d be interested in your glass half full outlook on the Alloa and Brora Rangers cup ties. I’ll wait.

There is no upside to Allow and Brora. I never said there was.

But there is on beating Hibs in the semi and taking Celtic to penalties. If you can't see that, I suspect there is a problem with you ability to reason. 

[davemclaren]

3 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

It was in a reply to an email that was sent by someone on here. 

Ah, cheers. Thought their comms had passed me by. 

[Unknown user]

8 minutes ago, Auldbenches said:

We need six new good players for next season, so that means we will have to sign a lot more to make sure we get it right.   If even two aren't succeses, we won't have a strong enough team or squad to go for it next season.  

What a start. 

All he's said is that not all signings work out, it's nothing to pish the frillies over

[Rogue Daddy]

4 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Ah, cheers. Thought their comms had passed me by. 

 

I think it was 'LOU' on the 'SILENCE' thread that received an email from FoH, stating some big exciting plans.

 

 

 

Posted Monday at 12:31

As stated earlier in this thread I emailed FOH with my concerns for next season and asked it they would consider polling members on their current feelings and to ascertain their intentions going forward regarding season tickets and FOH contributions, below is the reply I received today 

 

Hi Louise

 

Thanks for the message, please have my assurance that the club is well aware of the range of thoughts on this one. I feel sure there is no need for a poll of any type, we would be telling the club what they already know.

 

Having the heard the plans I am looking forward to what will happen this summer, hopefully you will share in that news soon.  

 

Then we just need everyone back at Tynie!

 

Take care meantime

Edited April 28, 2021 by Rogue Daddy

[siegementality]

3 minutes ago, Sub4TiddlerMurray said:

 

eh...it was an outstanding second half & ET. What an effort. What did the manager say at half time to rouse that response against a team like Celtic with overwhelmingly better resources than us? ...etc..

Effort, the minimum required in any match, never mind a cup final. Are we back to the Always the Bridesmaid days?

 

Whatever Neilson said why didn’t he say it at half time against Alloa and Brora, or does he only save it for cup finals?

 

Neilson got the first half all wrong against Celtic. They’d been shite (by their standards) for weeks before hand and were there for the taking. I’m past caring about nearly winning, or being unlucky. That is the mentality that has us where we are today. The manager stating a top six finish next year further evidences how the club accept mediocrity. 

 

 

 

[Auldbenches]

Just now, Smithee said:

All he's said is that not all signings work out, it's nothing to pish the frillies over

We'll have to sign more than we need to make sure we get more right for next season.  We need more than 4 players to hit the ground running with the squad we have.  

Ir is he already preparing us for his usual defensive style? 

 

[Nookie Bear]

1 minute ago, Rogue Daddy said:

 

I think it was 'LOU' on the 'SILENCE' thread that received an email from FoH, stating some big exciting plans.

Yes it was her but I couldn’t remember the thread. 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Rogue Daddy said:

 

I think it was 'LOU' on the 'SILENCE' thread that received an email from FoH, stating some big exciting plans.

👍

[siegementality]

4 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Ah, cheers. Thought their comms had passed me by. 

“their comms” 😂😂😂😂😂

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Auldbenches said:

We'll have to sign more than we need to make sure we get more right for next season.  We need more than 4 players to hit the ground running with the squad we have.  

Ir is he already preparing us for his usual defensive style? 

Pish your frillies then

[Auldbenches]

Just now, Smithee said:

Pish your frillies then

More exciting than looking forward to next season with neilson.  

 

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, siegementality said:

“their comms” 😂😂😂😂😂

I was being a tad sarcastic. 😎

[siegementality]

4 minutes ago, Smithee said:

All he's said is that not all signings work out, it's nothing to pish the frillies over

Maybe because it sounds like another pish Neilson excuse. Ther can’t be many occupations where you could come out with a statement like that and not expect to be challenged on it.

[Unknown user]

Just now, Auldbenches said:

More exciting than looking forward to next season with neilson.  

 

Maybe you could combine the two and at least get a heat at the game. Well, until it goes cold and you're left soaked in cold pish.

 

Anyway, it's an innocuous comment. There are things for us to be concerned about right now, but this isn't one of them.

[TheBigO]

17 minutes ago, jambopilms said:

We beat Hibs in the semi and we only got beat on penalties. Kind of suggests Neilson and the squad might have it in themselves to perform at a better standard than we have seen.

That's glass half full. It is possible.

Way I see it and fully aware may not be logical, perhaps even agenda driven to an extent.

 

We have good players. Ability, experience, bit of pace here and there. There's creativity, we have finishers. Great keeper, CHs an issue but capable on the right occasion

 

Good players will personally raise their games on big occasions. Easy to play at 100% against Hibs is a semi, Celtic in a final. Of course it is. To a huge extent, tactics or maybe more so your methods of attack, are put the window in these games.

 

Our coaching has failed miserable for years to get a group of top 4 prem players to set up in a way and play with the energy to beat lesser teas, now across two divisions (and non league)

 

Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching.

 

I think and hope Savage radicalises and improves recruitment (cos it hasn't been great) but there's little point if we continue with the culture we have on our 1st team squad coaching setup.

 

 

To go back to your post, yeah totally, they are great indicators of what the players can do. But not the manager.

 

All imo obvs!!!

[siegementality]

Just now, davemclaren said:

I was being a tad sarcastic. 😎

Your sarcasm flew over me. If you look for the relevant post you’ll get a reminder of how good their comms are.

[Jim Panzee]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

I'm not so sure, a back 3 has worked for us, Halkett looks better in that formation alongside Souttar so one main CB to bring in for me.

Full backs are ok between Smith Logan and Kingsley, Central midfield with McEneff and Haring has a strong foundation but a creative type would balance it out perfectly. GMS is a quality player who will surely come good, Ginelly can play well and I like our strike force, I think they'll start banging them in once we click.

 

I think we're not far away, there's some decent quality in there especially through the spine of the team where we've really missed Haring and Souttar.

where I'm at. Haring & soutter back are like new signings. Ginnelly joining would be a third signing.

 

Hence just 2-3 more needed for me. 

 

Key is being able to break down bottom 6 teams in the top flight. The top 6 will try come and play - ICT tired v us 1st half last weekend and GMS had time & space to exploit.

 

 

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, siegementality said:

Maybe because it sounds like another pish Neilson excuse. Ther can’t be many occupations where you could come out with a statement like that and not expect to be challenged on it.

Right this is my last post in the subject, I'm sure it's boring everyone.

 

Are we honestly saying it's outrageous that a football manager has acknowledged that not all signings work out? Loads of managers and pundits have said similar over the years so are we raging that it was said, or just raging that Robbie's still the Hearts manager?

 

If it's the latter, fine, I'm not arguing with the sentiment, just the logic of this one.

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Jim Panzee said:

where I'm at. Haring & soutter back are like new signings. Ginnelly joining would be a third signing.

 

Hence just 2-3 more needed for me. 

 

Key is being able to break down bottom 6 teams in the top flight. The top 6 will try come and play - ICT tired v us 1st half last weekend and GMS had time & space to exploit.

 

 

Agreed

[davemclaren]

3 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Right this is my last post in the subject, I'm sure it's boring everyone.

 

Are we honestly saying it's outrageous that a football manager has acknowledged that not all signings work out? Loads of managers and pundits have said similar over the years so are we raging that it was said, or just raging that Robbie's still the Hearts manager?

 

If it's the latter, fine, I'm not arguing with the sentiment, just the logic of this one.

I agree with you but, to coin a popular modern phrase, Robbie shows he isn’t good at reading the room by saying that. 

[Jim Panzee]

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

I agree with you but, to coin a popular modern phrase, Robbie shows he isn’t good at reading the room by saying that. 

perhaps - then is Robbie's only reaction to give out bland press statements and say the bare minimum?

 

then we're almost back to one of JKB's favourite words - SILENCE!!

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Jim Panzee said:

perhaps - then is Robbie's only reaction to give out bland press statements and say the bare minimum?

 

then we're almost back to one of JKB's favourite words - SILENCE!!

Robbie is in a ‘Heads he loses, Tails he loses’ situation. 😄

[May one-six]

11 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Right this is my last post in the subject, I'm sure it's boring everyone.

 

Are we honestly saying it's outrageous that a football manager has acknowledged that not all signings work out? Loads of managers and pundits have said similar over the years so are we raging that it was said, or just raging that Robbie's still the Hearts manager?

 

If it's the latter, fine, I'm not arguing with the sentiment, just the logic of this one.

It's a statement of the bleedin' obvious to say that all signings don't work out - even Fergie had his fair share of transfer blunders. However, it seems that when Robbie Neilson points out this simple fact, it's proof positive that he's a 'loser'. Strange logic, but there you go.

[Jim Panzee]

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

Robbie is in a ‘Heads he loses, Tails he loses’ situation. 😄

yeap - agree. and to be balanced, I see that at his fault. I'd say he's not 'read the room' prior to the latest statement to the press.

 

in hindsight, he'd have been better - after shocking results / performances - sticking with the usual platitudes "not good enough for hearts",  "double training" - any old guff that managers come out with - and stay well clear of "its the pitches fault, ref's fault, everything's fine" etc etc

 

maybe a lesson learned for him?

[NANOJAMBO]

18 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Way I see it and fully aware may not be logical, perhaps even agenda driven to an extent.

 

We have good players. Ability, experience, bit of pace here and there. There's creativity, we have finishers. Great keeper, CHs an issue but capable on the right occasion

 

Good players will personally raise their games on big occasions. Easy to play at 100% against Hibs is a semi, Celtic in a final. Of course it is. To a huge extent, tactics or maybe more so your methods of attack, are put the window in these games.

 

Our coaching has failed miserable for years to get a group of top 4 prem players to set up in a way and play with the energy to beat lesser teas, now across two divisions (and non league)

 

Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching.

 

I think and hope Savage radicalises and improves recruitment (cos it hasn't been great) but there's little point if we continue with the culture we have on our 1st team squad coaching setup.

 

 

To go back to your post, yeah totally, they are great indicators of what the players can do. But not the manager.

 

All imo obvs!!!

"Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching".

 

Nail on the head for me. 

[davemclaren]

Just now, Jim Panzee said:

yeap - agree. and to be balanced, I see that at his fault. I'd say he's not 'read the room' prior to the latest statement to the press.

 

in hindsight, he'd have been better - after shocking results / performances - sticking with the usual platitudes "not good enough for hearts",  "double training" - any old guff that managers come out with - and stay well clear of "its the pitches fault, ref's fault, everything's fine" etc etc

 

maybe a lesson learned for him?

Can’t disagree with that. 

[siegementality]

6 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Right this is my last post in the subject, I'm sure it's boring everyone.

 

Are we honestly saying it's outrageous that a football manager has acknowledged that not all signings work out? Loads of managers and pundits have said similar over the years so are we raging that it was said, or just raging that Robbie's still the Hearts manager?

 

If it's the latter, fine, I'm not arguing with the sentiment, just the logic of this one.

The very, very, vast majority of managers and pundits come out with that line after the signing has not worked out, it’s called hindsight. I can’t recall any manager or pundit saying a signing wouldn’t work out prior to it actually being evidenced, i.e. after the event.

 

I’d suggest if Neilson is attempting to apply hindsight, before he’s even signed any player, then that needs questioned. Surely every manager signs a player with the expectation that it will work out? 

 

It’s just another Neilson excuse. Pish performances explained away as the pitch was too sandy/bobbily/dry/wet, despite having seen the pitch prior to kick off. The weather was too cold/sunny/wet despite having seen the weather forecast. Now we have not all players work out, prior to even signing them, and despite the time and effort put into identifying them, and financial outlay in signing them.

 

Neilson is just full of shite. That’s why people are sick of listening to him. 

 

[Vlad the impaler]

Why isn’t Ann saying look with what’s went on you’re on your last leg with supporters(he’s actually no legs left) so you need ti make sure EVERY signing is the right one,if not you’ll be be picking up your p45. I’d imagine the really reply from Ann was you just try your best Robbie that’s all you can do🤬

[siegementality]

Just now, Vlad the impaler said:

Why isn’t Ann saying look with what’s went on you’re on your last leg with supporters(he’s actually no legs left) so you need ti make sure EVERY signing is the right one,if not you’ll be be picking up your p45. I’d imagine the really reply from Ann was you just try your best Robbie that’s all you can do🤬

His best isn’t good enough, that’s the issue.

[Des Lynam]

5 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

"Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching".

 

Nail on the head for me. 

Fully agree. Unless we sort this and stop talking about transfer windows to fix our problems we’ll keep repeating mistakes. 

[NANOJAMBO]

Just now, Vlad the impaler said:

Why isn’t Ann saying look with what’s went on you’re on your last leg with supporters(he’s actually no legs left) so you need ti make sure EVERY signing is the right one,if not you’ll be be picking up your p45. I’d imagine the really reply from Ann was you just try your best Robbie that’s all you can do🤬

Neilson is savvy enough to know how piss poor the signings have been over the years - hearing it laid bare on the BBC, 7 signings per "window" for 7 years, on average - he knows there's no patience left amongst the fans.  

[Sertse]

1 hour ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Yeah, I think we have a decent decent squad also - certainly good foundations. It's consistency that seems to be lacking... looking back at the Morton game, it was terrible but (away from home) are they being told to be more conservative!? Over the last 3 games we've pretty much played the same formation with the same players... why was the Morton game soooo bad? That's whats worrying me for next season if RN stays.

It's the same old though, I thought the team we had last season were a good team... On paper. It means nothing unless the manager can get a tune out of them. The team we had last season was one that should have been easily challenging for third and look what happened. Same with RN, he won the championship but the football was eye bleeding and some players looked like they regressed. He's not the man to take us forward regardless of what players we have. I definitely don't disagree, the foundations are there but the club as a whole would be better served getting someone else to lead the players.

[Jim Panzee]

30 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

"Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching".

 

Nail on the head for me. 

again - would agree. on paper all our signings look somewhere between great (GMS), looks ok (Kinglsey) or hmmm but should be good (Logan)

 

in the last few years the majority of signings have started fine but then looked poor. 

 

which has to be down to team tactics and instructions to the players.

 

I'm hoping RN's hand is being more forced by the return of Soutter and Haring - plus Kingsley out leading to a change in the back line up. Which has allowed McEneff to play in his preferred position.

 

 

[JamboAl]

20 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

"Yes, we can talk about personal and professional responsibilities of players but the coach's job is to have his team play to their potential as often as is realistic. Under Levein and Neilson, that rate has been unacceptably low.

 

I'm a bit fed up with all the onus being put on poor recruitment. Not the issue as far as I'm concerned. Some stinkers yes, but our hit/miss rate is way ore down to coaching".

 

Nail on the head for me. 

That's an interesting phrase.

Starting with injuries, our play overall has improved since Haring and Soapy came back.  Then you have the odd suspension.  Is it realistic to believe you can have the same standard of performance without them as with them?

Next we have the opposition.  They're not just sitting there waiting for us to carry out our plans and much of this is a guessing game.  I do accept that in the main we have better players than most/all of Championship teams so in theory we should win every game but that's seldom how football pans out.  Fact is we have won more than enough to win the league which was our chief objective.  Job done.

Personally i would have liked to have viewed better entertaining football but not at the cost of another season in the Championship.

[sadj]

4 hours ago, fancy a brew said:

 

I really don't get the argument that this season wasn't the time to play young players.

Next season when we're playing better teams who are all full-time is supposedly a better time to chuck young players in.

Going by that logic you should never blood the kids as you will always finish higher by replacing them with journeymen.

Doesn't make any sense to me, especially when money is supposed to be tight.

 

I realise you've said we should probably have played youth more, so not a dig at you.

Sorry was going to answer this in depth after I got back in. However if you can listen to Mark Donaldson talking about Finlay Pollock and protocols this season on this weeks “Scarves around the funnel”. That was a large part of what I was going to say. My position should make sense to you based on that. Although as I said my personal opinion is that I think we should have seen a bit more youth this season. 

Edited April 28, 2021 by sadj

[mitch41]

I’m worried about which players are retained for next season. 
I’m worried about which players are released/sold next season.

I’m worried about which players are brought in for next season.

I’m worried about what positions are thought to be good enough.

I’m worried about what positions are thought to be not good enough. 
I’m worried about the young up and coming players getting a chance.

I’m worried that Ann Budge fails to sack the management of our First team.

I know that if Neilson & co are not replaced we will see many eye bleeding games next season.

This will lead to many unhappy supporters voicing their views at Ann Budge, FOH & the Manager.

 

Am I looking forward to next season, well the next 2 months will give myself a bigger insight as to what is going to happen.

[stevie1874]

3 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

I'm not so sure, a back 3 has worked for us, Halkett looks better in that formation alongside Souttar so one main CB to bring in for me.

Full backs are ok between Smith Logan and Kingsley, Central midfield with McEneff and Haring has a strong foundation but a creative type would balance it out perfectly. GMS is a quality player who will surely come good, Ginelly can play well and I like our strike force, I think they'll start banging them in once we click.

 

I think we're not far away, there's some decent quality in there especially through the spine of the team where we've really missed Haring and Souttar.

Just waiting to be coached properly

[Mr Rabbit]

It was mentioned on one of the podcasts, not sure what one, but we’re really poor from a PR perspective.

 

Whilst what he’s saying is correct he doesn’t need to say it. It’s condescending and instead of keeping quiet and realising that we’ve not been good enough this year he almost looks like he’s reacting to fan criticism. 
 

This comment is similar to his stupid quote saying that if fans want to win week in week out watch Man City. If he hadn’t shat the bed in both cup competitions most reasonable fans would of gave him the benefit of the doubt and wouldn’t be calling for his head.

[JamboAl]

3 minutes ago, stevie1874 said:

Just waiting to be coached properly

Can you elaborate on what you mean by "coached properly"?

[Le Chat]

I just can't bring myself to read anything he says anymore as it just winds me up.

 

Sooner he's bombed out of Gorgie the better.  Arsehole.

[hmfc_liam06]

Some people are seriously damaged.

[Nookie Bear]

Just now, hmfc_liam06 said:

Some people are seriously damaged.

 

Who?

 

 

[Lfhearts]

2 minutes ago, Le Chat said:

I just can't bring myself to read anything he says anymore as it just winds me up.

 

Sooner he's bombed out of Gorgie the better.  Arsehole.

100%, man's a tool of highest order, it's like he thinks he is better than everyone and untouchable.

[suds66]

10 minutes ago, Le Chat said:

I just can't bring myself to read anything he says anymore as it just winds me up.

 

Sooner he's bombed out of Gorgie the better.  Arsehole.

Fair comment. 

[Jambof3tornado]

1 hour ago, siegementality said:

His best isn’t good enough, that’s the issue.

Correct. 

[DH1986]

11 minutes ago, Lfhearts said:

100%, man's a tool of highest order, it's like he thinks he is better than everyone and untouchable.

Yep.....his arrogance is badly misplaced.

 

 

[Sub4TiddlerMurray]

2 hours ago, siegementality said:

Effort, the minimum required in any match, never mind a cup final. Are we back to the Always the Bridesmaid days?

 

Whatever Neilson said why didn’t he say it at half time against Alloa and Brora, or does he only save it for cup finals?

 

Neilson got the first half all wrong against Celtic. They’d been shite (by their standards) for weeks before hand and were there for the taking. I’m past caring about nearly winning, or being unlucky. That is the mentality that has us where we are today. The manager stating a top six finish next year further evidences how the club accept mediocrity. 

 

 

 

 

Churlish IMO to slag RN off for the first half and then give him no credit whatsoever for the half time turnaround that took us within a baw hair of winning the SC. That was an exciting match and all the players deserve applause too for the way they responded.

 

Anyway, your aptly named user name suggests there's little room for shifting your opinion on RN.

 

As I've stated before, I wanted him out too, but we did win the Championship at first time of asking. Which means things could have been a lot worse if we'd Hibsed it. And, there are signs in 2 of the last 3 games that RN can pick a team and shape to create fast flowing quality football. For that reason, I am now happy to give him a chance in the early part of next season.

 

Given what we've had to put up with over the last few years, as the cliche goes, I'd bite your hand off for top 6 next year. Anything better would truly be outstanding.

 

 

[sadj]

23 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said:

Some people are seriously damaged.

🤣

[Gambo]

3 hours ago, jambopilms said:

How many teams have poor half's of football. Most of them at some point, particularly when playing better teams. It's not as simple to say if we turned up earlier we would have won. 

Some would say coming back at 2-0 down against a better team is a good result.

I'd never say losing any cup final is a good result, but that's just me.

[Jim Panzee]

1 hour ago, mitch41 said:

I’m worried about which players are retained for next season. 
I’m worried about which players are released/sold next season.

I’m worried about which players are brought in for next season.

I’m worried about what positions are thought to be good enough.

I’m worried about what positions are thought to be not good enough. 
I’m worried about the young up and coming players getting a chance.

I’m worried that Ann Budge fails to sack the management of our First team.

I know that if Neilson & co are not replaced we will see many eye bleeding games next season.

This will lead to many unhappy supporters voicing their views at Ann Budge, FOH & the Manager.

 

Am I looking forward to next season, well the next 2 months will give myself a bigger insight as to what is going to happen.

you remind me of Monty Python's Terry Jones...

 

Lyrics - I'm so worried

I'm so worried about what's happening today
In the Middle East, you know
And I'm so worried about the baggage retrieval
System they've got at Heathrow

I'm so worried about the fashions today
I don't think they're good for your feet
And I'm so worried about the shows on TV
That sometimes they want to repeat

I'm so worried about what's happening today
And you know
And I'm worried about the baggage retrieval
System they've got at Heathrow

I'm so worried about my hair falling out
And the state of the world today
And I'm so worried about being so full of doubt
About everything anyway

I'm so worried about modern technology
I'm so worried about all the things
That they dump in the sea, I'm so worried about it
Worried about it, worried, worried, worried

I'm so worried about everything that can go wrong
I'm so worried about whether people like this song
I'm so worried about this very next verse
It isn't the best that I've got

And I'm so worried about whether I should go on
Or whether I shouldn't just stop

I'm worried about whether I ought to have stopped
And I'm worried because it's the sort of thing I ought to know
And I'm so worried about the baggage retrieval
System they've got at Heathrow

I'm so worried about whether I should have stopped then
I'm so worried that I'm driving everyone round the bend
I'm worried about the baggage retrieval
System they've got at Heathrow