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Baxfee

Just watched the 1-3 fester road highlights. It was bouncing and there’s no getting away the stendel song is simply amazing. If there is one reason to keep him - it’s that 

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Hood09

Needs his own team, all depends on which league

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Jocam2325
19 hours ago, GinRummy said:

 

 

why do we need a manager who knows Scottish football? All types of nationalities get success at all levels in all countries without having any prior knowledge of that particular league. What is so unique about the Scottish Championship that makes folk want someone with that type of prior experience?

Coz that's where we operate. Very little of what Stendel brought to the club prior to the shutdown gave me any faith that he will get the right players in should he get another opportunity. 

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soonbe110
35 minutes ago, Hood09 said:

Needs his own team, all depends on which league

Given the current climate he won’t have his own team. He will have what he has got plus a few bargain hires from lower leagues in England plus unwanted players up here. Not sure he has a a good enough knowledge of what’s out there. Think his original plan  of bringing in some Barnsley guys plus a few Germans has gone with the virus. 

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TheBigO
1 hour ago, Hearts1975 said:

It was. Putting the obvious results aside (the Vermin and Orcs results) we absolutely pasted, and I mean pasted the sheep on boxing day 

I can't remember the last time that we dominated the sheep like that. How we never scored that day, Ill never know 

If Stendel's system clicks on the pitch then the football on offer is brilliant to watch. No question. 

If we had went to St Liedown rather than just turn up we should have absolutely hammered them. But we were gash and didn't turn up at all that day. 

Its just that he hasn't been consistent enough in the time he has had with us (for some) and there has still been poor performances in other games. Fully accept this. 

I prefer to put that consistency down to the players, and the mistakes that they have made, rather than the system to which Stendel has implemented. 

I also would question, in that when Stendel came on board, that there is a big element of danger having to implement widespread changes at that particular point, rather than a phased in approach. I don't think that you can judge any new manager mid-season and fully, unless he as had a full pre-season, and for this very same point. 

This is where I'm at.

 

You also need to look at how we've generally started matches. I mean literally the first 5 or 6 minutes. For me, that can show a managers message.

 

Even in games that have gone tits up, we've started well. Hamilton and Killie spring to mind. We started on front foot then lost silly goals which deflated us. St J we totally hammered them for 45 mins. Like dominated them.

 

The players have made individual errors, we've not had much break of the ball, and we've not reacted well to adversity. It has also felt a bit like every error has led to a goal. Like every time a team gets a chance they score (cheers Joel!).

 

Other than playing Joel, I don't put much of this at Dan's door

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GinRummy
43 minutes ago, Jocam2325 said:

Coz that's where we operate. Very little of what Stendel brought to the club prior to the shutdown gave me any faith that he will get the right players in should he get another opportunity. 

Stendel made mistakes. Scottish managers make mistakes as well, Levein is a recent example. I just don’t buy, in the slightest, that the league is so special we need someone knowledgable in Scottish football to succeed. In fact I think it’s ridiculous. 

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Hearts1975
14 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

This is where I'm at.

 

You also need to look at how we've generally started matches. I mean literally the first 5 or 6 minutes. For me, that can show a managers message.

 

Even in games that have gone tits up, we've started well. Hamilton and Killie spring to mind. We started on front foot then lost silly goals which deflated us. St J we totally hammered them for 45 mins. Like dominated them.

 

The players have made individual errors, we've not had much break of the ball, and we've not reacted well to adversity. It has also felt a bit like every error has led to a goal. Like every time a team gets a chance they score (cheers Joel!).

 

Other than playing Joel, I don't put much of this at Dan's door

Too true re Joel and it was a mistake. It’s been done to death in terms of reasons why he was selected, but Joel cost us in several games and lost us points.

no getting away from it, Your 100% right.

 

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Hearts1975
1 hour ago, Vlad Magic said:


Good post.

 

There were some brilliant attacking displays from us and some truly awful ones. No need to name them as we all know them.

 

For me trying to understand why these happened and what can be done is what matters.

 

The football under CL has been talked about and categorically chastised for being laborious, defence based, slow, pedestrian and boring. 
 

Stendel ripped that apart. 
 

Some of the players adapted quicker than others. That’s completely natural. Some will take longer to adjust to a complete change in tactics than others. Some simply won’t be able to. 
 

I am prepared to cut those who are trying to play Stendels way some slack. They won’t get it right every time early on after playing the Levin way for so long. However the consistency to play the Stendel way will develop. Remember he had no preseason to install his vision. It had to be done mid season. No mean feat I might add!!!

 

Ive seen enough of what his vision is along with a full preseason to encourage me that Stendel will get a group of players of his choice to get Tynie rocking and take points off any team both home and away.

 

I do not think any of the other managers names being bounded about and I include Robbo in that, are capable of doing that.

 

I would rather trim the squad numbers right back and use the money to give Stendel a contract attractive enough to keep him here. 

 

 

Your reading of the whole situation is absolutely bang on the money in my own opinion. Without foresight no one really knows if DS will be a success. It’s all opinion based and even although I am for, I can see why some might be against.

 

That said, For anyone who is still on the fence re DS would suggest that they read your post from start to finish. Makes a lot of sense 👍

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Hearts1975
58 minutes ago, Jocam2325 said:

Coz that's where we operate. Very little of what Stendel brought to the club prior to the shutdown gave me any faith that he will get the right players in should he get another opportunity. 

You have to consider that the January window is the worst window for player availability. Coupled with that we were already way over our player budget when he came in.

 

given consideration to the above, we got Boyce and Sibbick. We keep Boyce, get Sibbick on another loan, full Pre season and settling in time they could potentially be 2 of our best players. That’s a fact.

 

Langer and The kosovan boy - you could argue other wise. But budget constraints and all that. He had to make big decisions on who to ship out before even signing anyone IE Whelan and Berra. I think it was a very difficult transfer window for him and in respect of the choices of player that he could pick from 

 

I really don’t think Stendel has done any worse with bringing in players that any of his recent predecessors has, and given the amount of players we have turned over in recent years. 

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Vlad Magic
30 minutes ago, Hearts1975 said:

Your reading of the whole situation is absolutely bang on the money in my own opinion. Without foresight no one really knows if DS will be a success. It’s all opinion based and even although I am for, I can see why some might be against.

 

That said, For anyone who is still on the fence re DS would suggest that they read your post from start to finish. Makes a lot of sense 👍


Appreciate your post.

 

What the club really needs right now is stability. 
 

If you speak with any successful business person they will, all most without exception, tell you that they have had bad times. They will also tell you that when times are bad the best way out is to steady the ship. In other words take measures and make decisions to bring stability back and then develop from there.

 

We are where we are for a lot of reasons all discussed ad infinite. We don’t know what division we will be in and we don’t know how much money we will have to spend to get the best results in that division.

 

What we need is a plan and a management team in place now who can plan and strategise for all of the variables.

 

The vast majority of players have signalled they are enjoying working with Stendel and  in the short time he has worked with them there have been some incredible turn arounds in some of them. Sean Clare being the most obvious example but there are quite a few others.

 

Even the players who haven’t quite improved technically as much as Sean are showing far greater desire and willing. 
 

The foundations of our future start with the decisions made now. I hope Ann backs Stendel (I think she will) and I think Stendel will respond. I hope the players continue to back Stendel (again I think they will).

 

We may of course have to completely rip it up again if Stendel says no. That is not stability. 
 

I remember all the recent management comings and going on here from Cathro to Stendel. Carnage on the forum.
 

I don’t want a repeat of that. 
 

Does anyone?

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Hearts1975
6 minutes ago, Vlad Magic said:


Appreciate your post.

 

What the club really needs right now is stability. 
 

If you speak with any successful business person they will, all most without exception, tell you that they have had bad times. They will also tell you that when times are bad the best way out is to steady the ship. In other words take measures and make decisions to bring stability back and then develop from there.

 

We are where we are for a lot of reasons all discussed ad infinite. We don’t know what division we will be in and we don’t know how much money we will have to spend to get the best results in that division.

 

What we need is a plan and a management team in place now who can plan and strategise for all of the variables.

 

The vast majority of players have signalled they are enjoying working with Stendel and  in the short time he has worked with them there have been some incredible turn arounds in some of them. Sean Clare being the most obvious example but there are quite a few others.

 

Even the players who haven’t quite improved technically as much as Sean are showing far greater desire and willing. 
 

The foundations of our future start with the decisions made now. I hope Ann backs Stendel (I think she will) and I think Stendel will respond. I hope the players continue to back Stendel (again I think they will).

 

We may of course have to completely rip it up again if Stendel says no. That is not stability. 
 

I remember all the recent management comings and going on here from Cathro to Stendel. Carnage on the forum.
 

I don’t want a repeat of that. 
 

Does anyone?

100%. 5 years ago patience and the understanding around the fact that we would need to build the club up piece by piece was there. In respect of the full support.

 

Now, because of the last 5 years that patience is thin on the ground. I think this is more to do with some posters hitting the panic button now and refusing to acknowledge the fact that we need to start again and this means another project with potential 

 

To a degree I kind of get that although it can’t mean that any further changes that we make can’t be afforded the significant time and patience just because of what has been and gone before. 

 

It Is probably also a vindication in terms of folks overall faith in AB (picking managers). That said, she admitted she got it wrong with CL. It doesn’t mean that she won’t get it right and hasn’t already got it right, and in respect of Stendel. 

 

the positives are good, very good

the negatives, well, as has been discussed, if you look at it on face, there are negatives, But if you look behind the negatives, there are justifiable reasons for a lot of the same negatives 

 

I would love to see the guy get more time, have everyone behind him, and see what he really can do with the club moving forward. We talk about having a siege mentality. I still think he can and will create this for us if he is given the right amount of time.

 

If he leaves us now it will always be one of these unknowns and that doesn’t sit well at all especially with the brand of attacking football he is trying to introduce to the club.

 

Your right. We absolutely need stability now and as you inferred, a period of time where he can work on things and see if he can consistently create what we have seen to date and in patches. I think a pre season (if we get one) will really help things in terms of what he is trying to do.

 

One final point - you mentioned your mates in Barnsley and it appears that the Barnsley support idolises him. That has to count for something. 

 

If the guy is a fraud and “won’t” be able to cut it in Scotland then over a full season how on earth did he get Barnsley out of League 1 where there were a lot of bigger teams than Barnsley in the same division.

 

Unless he guessed his way out of the division tactically I don’t have an Alternative explanation other than the guy knows exactly what he is doing and what he is trying to achieve. 

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Jocam2325
2 hours ago, GinRummy said:

Stendel made mistakes. Scottish managers make mistakes as well, Levein is a recent example. I just don’t buy, in the slightest, that the league is so special we need someone knowledgable in Scottish football to succeed. In fact I think it’s ridiculous. 

Good for you mate

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Jocam2325
1 hour ago, Hearts1975 said:

You have to consider that the January window is the worst window for player availability. Coupled with that we were already way over our player budget when he came in.

 

given consideration to the above, we got Boyce and Sibbick. We keep Boyce, get Sibbick on another loan, full Pre season and settling in time they could potentially be 2 of our best players. That’s a fact.

 

Langer and The kosovan boy - you could argue other wise. But budget constraints and all that. He had to make big decisions on who to ship out before even signing anyone IE Whelan and Berra. I think it was a very difficult transfer window for him and in respect of the choices of player that he could pick from 

 

I really don’t think Stendel has done any worse with bringing in players that any of his recent predecessors has, and given the amount of players we have turned over in recent years. 

No that is fair enough. Sibbick did show something in those few performances (was it 2?)  that he may have something. Langer looked poor and Avidji (sp) appears to be totally the wrong type of player for us.  Ah well, time will tell. If he stays he will have myfull support. 

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GinRummy
5 minutes ago, Jocam2325 said:

Good for you mate

No need for the snippy answer other than knowing you’re wrong. 

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Jocam2325
7 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

No need for the snippy answer other than knowing you’re wrong. 

From the guy who just called my opinion ridiculous.  Having a different opinion does not make me wrong nor does it make you right.

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jamboinglasgow
1 hour ago, TheBigO said:

This is where I'm at.

 

You also need to look at how we've generally started matches. I mean literally the first 5 or 6 minutes. For me, that can show a managers message.

 

Even in games that have gone tits up, we've started well. Hamilton and Killie spring to mind. We started on front foot then lost silly goals which deflated us. St J we totally hammered them for 45 mins. Like dominated them.

 

The players have made individual errors, we've not had much break of the ball, and we've not reacted well to adversity. It has also felt a bit like every error has led to a goal. Like every time a team gets a chance they score (cheers Joel!).

 

Other than playing Joel, I don't put much of this at Dan's door

 

Agree with all that. 

 

I do think in most of our games we started well, our biggest problem was that we couldn't score. Stendels first game was one where we were all over St Johnstone for most of that match but could not finish, St Johnstone get their chance and score from it. Hamilton away was the same but with two bad mistakes. 

 

Something that has gone under the radar was how the team was able to fight back. Kilmarnock we almost went from 3-0 down to 3-3 in 15 mins, after we have shot ourselves in the foot badly. Hamilton again was a dodgy offside and another mistake then we got 2 back. We came from behind to beat Rangers.

 

Individual errors destroyed us this season as you point out. Sort that out and the season would have been very different.

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GinRummy
Just now, Jocam2325 said:

From the guy who just called my opinion ridiculous.  Having a different opinion does not make me wrong nor does it make you right.

You think the way for a club of hearts size to compete against the likes of Hamilton or st mirren is to get someone with knowledge of the Scottish game. I shouldn’t have called your opinion ridiculous but surely there’s nothing special or distinct about the Scottish game that needs this? Stendel hasn’t been a success so far but that doesn’t mean we should narrow our search for a manager to people who know a lot about our game. 
 

Apologies if I caused offence btw I wasn’t having a go at you in particular. I just disagree that we should go down the same tired route of every club outside the old firm  of appointing guys who know the game here inside out. Stendel had 17 games and inherited an unfit, overpaid and unmotivated squad. That shouldn’t mean we don’t look at foreign managers.

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Jocam2325
1 minute ago, GinRummy said:

You think the way for a club of hearts size to compete against the likes of Hamilton or st mirren is to get someone with knowledge of the Scottish game. I shouldn’t have called your opinion ridiculous but surely there’s nothing special or distinct about the Scottish game that needs this? Stendel hasn’t been a success so far but that doesn’t mean we should narrow our search for a manager to people who know a lot about our game. 
 

Apologies if I caused offence btw I wasn’t having a go at you in particular. I just disagree that we should go down the same tired route of every club outside the old firm  of appointing guys who know the game here inside out. Stendel had 17 games and inherited an unfit, overpaid and unmotivated squad. That shouldn’t mean we don’t look at foreign managers.

No offence taken. If he stays, which I doubt unless common sense breaks out re which league we will compete in, then he will have my full support. 

 

Cheers

 

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Hearts1975
15 minutes ago, Jocam2325 said:

No that is fair enough. Sibbick did show something in those few performances (was it 2?)  that he may have something. Langer looked poor and Avidji (sp) appears to be totally the wrong type of player for us.  Ah well, time will tell. If he stays he will have myfull support. 

Yes. Think it was 2. Sure his last game was against Rangers at Tynie before he fell ill.

Thought his reading of the game and overall performance that day was excellent. I wouldn’t say he is a brilliant player in all honesty but he obviously understands DS’s system very well and he soaked up anything Rangers could throw at us

if Stendel can get us playing consistently well that’s the key, and probably, he would admit himself and has admitted that it hasn’t happened to date. That’s not to say it won’t happen and if he stays with us 

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jamboinglasgow
3 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

You think the way for a club of hearts size to compete against the likes of Hamilton or st mirren is to get someone with knowledge of the Scottish game. I shouldn’t have called your opinion ridiculous but surely there’s nothing special or distinct about the Scottish game that needs this? Stendel hasn’t been a success so far but that doesn’t mean we should narrow our search for a manager to people who know a lot about our game. 
 

Apologies if I caused offence btw I wasn’t having a go at you in particular. I just disagree that we should go down the same tired route of every club outside the old firm  of appointing guys who know the game here inside out. Stendel had 17 games and inherited an unfit, overpaid and unmotivated squad. That shouldn’t mean we don’t look at foreign managers.

 

I do suspect that the knowledge of Scottish football line is often trotted by the media by ex-players who want to get a management job or get one for their mates. So its suits them to make the pool small for managers. So the narrative is trotted out and if a foreign manager fails then rather look at the many reasons for the failure, its easier to just say its because they have no knowledge of Scottish football.

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GinRummy
Just now, Jocam2325 said:

No offence taken. If he stays, which I doubt unless common sense breaks out re which league we will compete in, then he will have my full support. 

 

Cheers

 

One way or another I think he’ll go as well. I’d like him to stay but despite the challenges he faced I’ve been disappointed he hasn’t had a bigger impact. 

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GinRummy
1 minute ago, jamboinglasgow said:

 

I do suspect that the knowledge of Scottish football line is often trotted by the media by ex-players who want to get a management job or get one for their mates. So its suits them to make the pool small for managers. So the narrative is trotted out and if a foreign manager fails then rather look at the many reasons for the failure, its easier to just say its because they have no knowledge of Scottish football.

I think that plays a part. There was a willingness by the media for DS to fail and it was unclear if that was xenophobia an anti hearts agenda or both. We were all willing him to succeed but he fell short which is a shame But shouldn’t put us if taking on an outsider in the future. 

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Pasquale for King
21 hours ago, Rods said:

May be a bit left field but we have Gary Naysmith and Gary Locke at the club. Why not just move them up to the top positions. 

 

 

21 hours ago, Rods said:

 

 

What?

 

Both Naysmith and Locke have managed at the championship level.

 

They are already at the club they know the club.I think your overreaction is a bit stupid.

 

ps there is a global pandemic going on we maybe have to cut cost. 

Because they both have poor records as managers, there’s a reason they’re doing the jobs they currently do.

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Pasquale for King
22 minutes ago, jamboinglasgow said:

 

I do suspect that the knowledge of Scottish football line is often trotted by the media by ex-players who want to get a management job or get one for their mates. So its suits them to make the pool small for managers. So the narrative is trotted out and if a foreign manager fails then rather look at the many reasons for the failure, its easier to just say its because they have no knowledge of Scottish football.

Exactly, Cathro and Levein had knowledge of Scottish football.

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S Form

All the excuses in the world - he’s not had enough time or his own players, we were in a dreadful position when he came in etc, etc - don’t mean shit. If DS isn’t winning games he needs shipped out; it’s as simple as that. Affording get outs is exactly what happened with CL and see where that’s landed us. I’m not saying Daniel should be booted out right now, but if he is in charge when we resume Ann’s message to him should be clear - get us winning in short order or pack your bags.

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Pasquale for King
58 minutes ago, S Form said:

All the excuses in the world - he’s not had enough time or his own players, we were in a dreadful position when he came in etc, etc - don’t mean shit. If DS isn’t winning games he needs shipped out; it’s as simple as that. Affording get outs is exactly what happened with CL and see where that’s landed us. I’m not saying Daniel should be booted out right now, but if he is in charge when we resume Ann’s message to him should be clear - get us winning in short order or pack your bags.

We were 8th in the form table when lockdown started, he had turned it the corner with the squad.

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Vlad Magic

There have been some excellent posts on this thread.

 

Pretty much all constructive and well thought out points.

 

Bottom line is does Stendel want to come back and finish off what he started?

 

Can the club put a package together that will enable us to secure his services on a long term contract?

 

Will the division we are in affect his decision?

 

Do we the fans support Stendel if the boxes are ticked above and he agrees to come back?

 

What are the options if he either doesn’t want to or we cant afford him?
 

I hope he comes back. 
 

Managerial merry go rounds do nothing for stability which is what we need and the crux of me being on and posting on this thread.

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