Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

1 minute ago, Taffin said:

 

Wasn't suggesting people knew better, just that it's where they had arrived at as the way to go. Of course if it's now looking like more people are in favour of that and there's emerging data to support it then that's great.

 

Probably shouldn't have spoken for Dazo, it was just how I took his post 👍👍

 

Regards the booster there is an element of it being a double edged sword regards global vaccination. Yes we protect lower risk people here, but it impacts elsewhere where they've not even got to 10% of the populace done yet; in part due to vaccine availability and cost. This of course results in direct poorer outcomes for their vulnerable and also maintains variance risk.

 

Personally I wouldn't have been vaccinating anyone under 50 unless they had a specific vulnerability until we'd got much, much further down the road globally. I appreciate others are more interested in domestic success though, as another poster demonstrated earlier, but African, Asian, American, European doesn't really matter for me...get the jabs in those arms who need it most. I appreciate that may be considered idealistic and a dream...but a lot of things previously considered 'impossible' (Tory chancellor paying folk to stay home!) have been achieved over the last 2 years.

I agree with the global vaccination approach. I was actually stunned by the Israelis rolling out a 4th dose.

[Taffin]

2 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Wow.    A runny nose ?   In that case, it would appear that 150k folk in the UK have somehow died from that runny nose.

 

I don't think runny nose was a common symptom for Delta. Or have I missed some significant deaths today from Omicron?

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Wasn't suggesting people knew better, just that it's where they had arrived at as the way to go from gut feel/ideology. Of course if it's now looking like more people are in favour of that and that there's actually emerging data to support it then that's great.

 

Probably shouldn't have spoken for Dazo, it was just how I took his post 👍👍

 

Regards the booster there is an element of it being a double edged sword regards global vaccination. Yes we protect lower risk people here, but it impacts elsewhere where they've not even got to 10% of the populace done yet; in part due to vaccine availability and cost. This of course results in direct poorer outcomes for their vulnerable and also maintains variance risk.

 

Personally I wouldn't have been vaccinating anyone under 50 unless they had a specific vulnerability until we'd got much, much further down the road globally. I appreciate others are more interested in domestic success though, as another poster demonstrated earlier, but African, Asian, American, European doesn't really matter for me...get the jabs in those arms who need it most. I appreciate that may be considered idealistic and a dream...but a lot of things previously considered 'impossible' (Tory chancellor paying folk to stay home!) have been achieved over the last 2 years.

 

The global vaccination issue is,  unfortunately,  rather more dogged with problems and complexities than just supply.  Vaccine refusal and hesitancy is a big problem in various regions and individual countries.  One example is Nigeria where there was recent news that a large quantity of shots are going to be going to waste because of going beyond the date of use.  Due in combination between slow take-up and inadequate planning.  That's just one example.

 

Vaccinate as many as possible as quickly as possible.  Absolutely.  But it's going to take years,  if ever,  to get good coverage throughout the whole world.  It looks very difficult indeed.

[Taffin]

13 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

The global vaccination issue is,  unfortunately,  rather more dogged with problems and complexities than just supply.  Vaccine refusal and hesitancy is a big problem in various regions and individual countries.  One example is Nigeria where there was recent news that a large quantity of shots are going to be going to waste because of going beyond the date of use.  Due in combination between slow take-up and inadequate planning.  That's just one example.

 

Vaccinate as many as possible as quickly as possible.  Absolutely.  But it's going to take years,  if ever,  to get good coverage throughout the whole world.  It looks very difficult indeed.

 

Absolutely, there's many issues that make it hard...and you're right there's also some with plenty doses but weak uptake. There's also plenty using a similar percentage of their doses to the rich Western countries but still have low coverage, suggesting availability is an issue there. 

 

No easy fix but I'd rather we were spending money and using doses to try and overcome that than focusing on 'boosting' people in the West who weren't getting severe illness even before any vaccines were available and with the more virulent variants. As I say though, that's just personal ideology and is no more value than those only interested in what happens in their own country.

Edited January 9, 2022 by Taffin

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Absolutely, there's many issues that make it hard...and you're right there's also some with plenty doses but weak uptake. There's also plenty using a similar percentage of their doses to the rich Western countries but still have low coverage, suggesting availability is an issue there. 

 

No easy fix but I'd rather we were spending money and using doses to try and overcome that than focusing on 'boosting' people in the West who weren't getting severe illness even before any vaccines were available and with the more virulent variants. As I say though, that's just personal ideology and is no more value than those only interested in what happens in their own country.

 

Supply shouldn't be an issue at all going forward.  Not with this generation of vaccines.  First world countries probably wont be using all that much more from now on.  Much more should find it's way into the global campaign.  Where it has previously been sought with high chance of use,  it should soon be available.  Closer to home we see incredible percentages of refusal in first world countries.  I really can't see these groups being eroded to much degree.  

 

Even with widespread and satisfactory coverage the capacity will always exist for further variant evolution.  In a number of different forms.  You can never vaccinate enough to eradicate that out of virology.  Reverse zoonotic - zoonotic exchanges will probably continue,  for example.  

 

If we continue getting similar,  linear evolutions like Omicron then gradually the vaccine hold-outs will become less relevant.  Eventually a sufficient number of people everywhere will be immunised by encountering infection.

[manaliveits105]

Which one of our experts has won the cup ?

[Lone Striker]

31 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I don't think runny nose was a common symptom for Delta. Or have I missed some significant deaths today from Omicron?

My bad - just realised Papa was referring only to Omicron.    I can't find accurate up-to-date stats on UK deaths from Omicron, but its probably in the low hundreds (given that it only started killing folk 4 weeks ago) - does that make it just a runny nose ?  🙄

 

 

[Taffin]

9 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

My bad - just realised Papa was referring only to Omicron.    I can't find accurate up-to-date stats on UK deaths from Omicron, but its probably in the low hundreds (given that it only started killing folk 4 weeks ago) - does that make it just a runny nose ?  🙄

 

 

 

Most diseases will have some corner cases with more severe outcomes for some, including death (even the common cold). In terms of the common symptoms the majority experience it's somewhere between the two extremes that you and Papa are suggesting...however for the majority he's closer to the being on the money.

Edited January 9, 2022 by Taffin

[Dennis Denuto]

21 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

My bad - just realised Papa was referring only to Omicron.    I can't find accurate up-to-date stats on UK deaths from Omicron, but its probably in the low hundreds (given that it only started killing folk 4 weeks ago) - does that make it just a runny nose ?  🙄

 

 

What are the most recent stats for deaths from Omicron?

[Ray Gin]

5 minutes ago, Dennis Denuto said:

What are the most recent stats for deaths from Omicron?

 

What are the most recent stats for people ending up in hospital with the sniffles?

[Dennis Denuto]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

 

What are the most recent stats for people ending up in hospital with the sniffles?

If you can show me somewhere that I have suggested that any variant of Covid are the sniffles I will not post on this thread again. 
 

I am genuinely interested in the bit of data I asked about. 

[Fxxx the SPFL]

1 hour ago, Greedy Jambo said:

 

I've had things come out my arse that were more interesting than this thread. 

Care to spill the beans 😂 

[Ray Gin]

17 minutes ago, Dennis Denuto said:

If you can show me somewhere that I have suggested that any variant of Covid are the sniffles I will not post on this thread again. 
 

I am genuinely interested in the bit of data I asked about. 

 

Fair enough. He already said he can't find the stats though. Asking again made it seem like you were playing silly buggers.

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, **** the SPFL said:

Care to spill the beans 😂 

Branston.

[Fxxx the SPFL]

25 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

What are the most recent stats for people ending up in hospital with the sniffles?

None or the flu all down to covid what a crock of shit that is I’ll say it again in 2017/18 winter people dying in hospital corridors 300 dying daily at one point but wait just ignore that

[Fxxx the SPFL]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Branston.

With the wee sausages

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, **** the SPFL said:

With the wee sausages

👍

[Ray Gin]

2 minutes ago, **** the SPFL said:

None or the flu all down to covid what a crock of shit that is I’ll say it again in 2017/18 winter people dying in hospital corridors 300 dying daily at one point but wait just ignore that

 

You're quite right, we should invent time travel immediately to right this wrong.

[Dennis Denuto]

16 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Fair enough. He already said he can't find the stats though. Asking again made it seem like you were playing silly buggers.

He said he couldn’t find up to date stats, I was happy to look at whatever stats there were for this.  
 

You might not care about the data but some of us do. 

[Fxxx the SPFL]

12 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

You're quite right, we should invent time travel immediately to right this wrong.

It will all come out in the wash when the public enquiry gets underway the SG who are my employers will be found to have made big mistakes during covid they have caused major financial problems with businesses job losses etc. Off the top of my head she lost me when Edinburgh should have been  in Tier 2 but she kept us in Tier 3 because she wanted to protect us from punters coming in from Tier 3 regions aye right. It will also show that the real number of ACTUAL deaths from Covid is far less than the current total 

[Ray Gin]

1 minute ago, **** the SPFL said:

It will all come out in the wash when the public enquiry gets underway the SG who are my employers will be found to have made big mistakes during covid they have caused major financial problems with businesses job losses etc. Off the top of my head she lost me when Edinburgh should have been  in Tier 2 but she kept us in Tier 3 because she wanted to protect us from punters coming in from Tier 3 regions aye right. It will also show that the real number of ACTUAL deaths from Covid is far less than the current total 

 

Quite the tangent you've flown off on there.

 

[Fxxx the SPFL]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Quite the tangent you've flown off on there.

 

We’ll see 

[Footballfirst]

1 hour ago, Dennis Denuto said:

What are the most recent stats for deaths from Omicron?

I don't know the split between Delta and Omicron, but 1,295 UK deaths have been reported in the last 7 days, up 31% on the previous week.  The daily reported figures are probably affected by the holiday period, but the direction of travel since Christmas is definitely up, after plateauing since the end of November.

Edited January 9, 2022 by Footballfirst

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, **** the SPFL said:

It will all come out in the wash when the public enquiry gets underway the SG who are my employers will be found to have made big mistakes during covid they have caused major financial problems with businesses job losses etc. Off the top of my head she lost me when Edinburgh should have been  in Tier 2 but she kept us in Tier 3 because she wanted to protect us from punters coming in from Tier 3 regions aye right.* It will also show that the real number of ACTUAL deaths from Covid is far less than the current total 

* If that's the case , they've done helluva lot better than they are crediting themselves with.

Edited January 10, 2022 by ri Alban

[The Mighty Thor]

8 hours ago, **** the SPFL said:

 It will also show that the real number of ACTUAL deaths from Covid is far less than the current total 

I'm sure that has just been poorly worded otherwise it's the most bizarre SNP bad I've ever seen. 

[Dazo]

11 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

It's certainly interesting, but for a lot of us it's clearly been the thing to do for ages in our opinion (rightly or wrongly) which I think was Dazo's point.

 

 

Queue accusations (fairly) that were not qualified to have held that opinion. It has however been the opinion of some experts for quite a while.

 

Along with Omicron is milder opinion these things have been mocked and ridiculed by the high five pile on crew. It’s interesting these things are now interesting. 😂

 

 

[Dennis Denuto]

8 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

I don't know the split between Delta and Omicron, but 1,295 UK deaths have been reported in the last 7 days, up 31% on the previous week.  The daily reported figures are probably affected by the holiday period, but the direction of travel since Christmas is definitely up, after plateauing since the end of November.

December deaths are down from November deaths, but that could be reporting issues over holidays etc. 

 

Certainly Omicron thankfully has not yet shown to cause an increase in deaths in any of the UK nations regardless of restrictions. Hopefully that continues. 

[jambomjm74]

8 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

I don't know the split between Delta and Omicron, but 1,295 UK deaths have been reported in the last 7 days, up 31% on the previous week.  The daily reported figures are probably affected by the holiday period, but the direction of travel since Christmas is definitely up, after plateauing since the end of November.

Does this include expected seasonal impacts of deaths, we would expect an increase through the winter months  in line with seasonal mortality. 
It is grim stuff, but the relatively low increase may be signs of “living with covid” as a result of 

1) booster impact(s). More positive impact to follow after record breaking jab campaign. 
2) Herd immunity, full or partial. Again this increases with each case.
3) That omnicron causes fewer deaths  and serious illness. 

 

[Nucky Thompson]

Drakeford is absolutely raging at Westminster for making him look like an idiot.

Greeting about England not following the science 

[Ex member of the SaS]

1295 deaths out of a population of 67 Million. They died within the 28 day reporting period when the self isolation is 7 days, and how many died due to stroke/heart condition /cancer etc .You can quote figures but without the full data they mean nothing. This is the reason people are asking for the data as without the facts it's a waste of time reporting these figures.

I

[Ray Gin]

.

Edited January 10, 2022 by Ray Gin

[Ex member of the SaS]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

 

150,000 deaths total for the UK. 

I was quoting a figure from an earlier post. However my point is still valid. What's yours?

[Ray Gin]

Just now, Ex member of the SaS said:

I was quoting a figure from an earlier post. However my point is still valid. What's yours?

 

If you are keen on protecting the lives of people with cancer and heart problems, having hospitals packed with people who have Covid and having swathes of staff off sick isn't helping.

 

[Dennis Denuto]

6 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

If you are keen on protecting the lives of people with cancer and heart problems, having hospitals packed with people who have Covid and having swathes of staff off sick isn't helping.

 

One of the issues I have is that tinkering tiers style of restrictions don't make nay difference to the spread, especially with the variants that spread more easily. Only really Tier 4 lockdown type of restrictions have been shown to actually work, so I feel we are in a frustrating situation of suffering restrictions with no tangible benefit.

 

Hopefully we get an announcement on the lifting of these restrictions from next Monday over the next day or so.

[Ex member of the SaS]

13 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

If you are keen on protecting the lives of people with cancer and heart problems, having hospitals packed with people who have Covid and having swathes of staff off sick isn't helping.

 

Dodged the question with another question. You my friend are a waste of space and I refuse to interact further with you. Thanks.

[GBJambo]

14 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

If you are keen on protecting the lives of people with cancer and heart problems, having hospitals packed with people who have Covid and having swathes of staff off sick isn't helping.

 

Same as any year at this time of year

Replace omicron with flu

Mind you omicron is milder than the flu 👍 

[Ex member of the SaS]

3 minutes ago, Dennis Denuto said:

One of the issues I have is that tinkering tiers style of restrictions don't make nay difference to the spread, especially with the variants that spread more easily. Only really Tier 4 lockdown type of restrictions have been shown to actually work, so I feel we are in a frustrating situation of suffering restrictions with no tangible benefit.

 

Hopefully we get an announcement on the lifting of these restrictions from next Monday over the next day or so.

The problem with the tiers quoted earlier Edinburgh / Glasgow, is there are many who travel for work /other reasons, so claiming it stops Weegies travelling to shop is a con.

The whole lockdown scheme was handled badly. I will concede that early on when this first broke they didn't know how bad it could be ( even though the projections were wildly off ) they needed to do something, BUT they waited too long to lockdown travel and that was their biggest mistake. Anyone entering should have been isolated or tested. 

[Dennis Denuto]

29 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

1295 deaths out of a population of 67 Million. They died within the 28 day reporting period when the self isolation is 7 days, and how many died due to stroke/heart condition /cancer etc .You can quote figures but without the full data they mean nothing. This is the reason people are asking for the data as without the facts it's a waste of time reporting these figures.

I

We have gone over the death figures before, the 28 days daily figure gives everyone a quick barometer of the direction of travel with Covid deaths, when it goes up the ONS death certificate and excess deaths figures go up too.

[Unknown user]

20 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

If you are keen on protecting the lives of people with cancer and heart problems, having hospitals packed with people who have Covid and having swathes of staff off sick isn't helping.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

Dodged the question with another question. You my friend are a waste of space and I refuse to interact further with you. Thanks.

 

You think that was a question?

[Dennis Denuto]

1 minute ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

The problem with the tiers quoted earlier Edinburgh / Glasgow, is there are many who travel for work /other reasons, so claiming it stops Weegies travelling to shop is a con.

The whole lockdown scheme was handled badly. I will concede that early on when this first broke they didn't know how bad it could be ( even though the projections were wildly off ) they needed to do something, BUT they waited too long to lockdown travel and that was their biggest mistake. Anyone entering should have been isolated or tested. 

I am not saying we go back to regional based tiers system, but that if you want to control the spread you need to use the restrictions that were in place for Level 4 or very close to it

[Ex member of the SaS]

Just now, Dennis Denuto said:

We have gone over the death figures before, the 28 days daily figure gives everyone a quick barometer of the direction of travel with Covid deaths, when it goes up the ONS death certificate and excess deaths figures go up too.

The point I was making is, for ANY reason 28 days after a test is a con as there would be many who tested 28 days before but would be clear according to the 7 day isolation figure, but are still being counted.

At no time have the Governments suggested anyone should isolate for 28 days so where did this figure come from?

[Ex member of the SaS]

3 minutes ago, Dennis Denuto said:

I am not saying we go back to regional based tiers system, but that if you want to control the spread you need to use the restrictions that were in place for Level 4 or very close to it

Wasn't a dig Dennis, I was simply stating the reason given for keeping Edinburgh in a higher tier so close to tier 3 was a con.

[Ray Gin]

12 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

Dodged the question with another question. You my friend are a waste of space and I refuse to interact further with you. Thanks.

 

Result

[Ray Gin]

11 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

Same as any year at this time of year

Replace omicron with flu

Mind you omicron is milder than the flu 👍 

 

Omicron is massively more contagious than the flu.

 

[Dennis Denuto]

1 minute ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

Wasn't a dig Dennis, I was simply stating the reason given for keeping Edinburgh in a higher tier so close to tier 3 was a con.

My point really is that only Tier 4 or Tier 0 are relevant or useful anyway.

[Ex member of the SaS]

Looking forward to the day restrictions are removed so that I can walk around laughing at the clowns who are still wearing a face nappy.

[GBJambo]

Just now, Ray Gin said:

 

Omicron is massively more contagious than the flu.

 

Maybe so but remember in 2018 in England alone , 5k a week were in hospital and 22k were visiting GP’s

[Ray Gin]

Just now, GBJambo said:

Maybe so but remember in 2018 in England alone , 5k a week were in hospital and 22k were visiting GP’s

 

How many do you reckon we'd have in hospital right now if we had zero restrictions and no booster programme? Critical incidents are being called as it is.

 

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

Looking forward to the day restrictions are removed so that I can walk around laughing at the clowns who are still wearing a face nappy.

 

You're a particularly unpleasant person tbh.  

[Ex member of the SaS]

Just now, Victorian said:

 

You're a particularly unpleasant person tbh.  

You don't know me so keep such suggestions to yourself, thanks.