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MaskedMarauder

Vanecek leaves Hearts by mutual consent (title updated)

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Olly Lee's left boot

This thread is a belter. 

 

Every single poster who is first to scream wage thief, etc is moaning that we have let a signing that never worked out go. 

 

Signing does not work out- both parties agree. 

We move on. 

 

Perfect outcome giving the circumstances 

 

Some folk clearly like to moan but disguise it under something about wanting the best for Hearts. Madness and Tragic in equal measure. 

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Artful Dodger
1 minute ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

How would you suggest a club on Hearts budget scouts players? Manchester United scout the player for years, eventually make their move and it still turns out to be a disaster. Liverpool scouted Andy Robertson over 20 times. We don't have the budget to do this. We can't afford to buy the best players from our own league. What's the solution?

 

That's not even scratching the surface of clubs recruitment in England. Sure I read recently Southampton has a dedicated office with over 30 staff that scout the entire world, collating every bit of data possible then moving the suggestion around until they get the player they're after, takes an eternity with a massive budget and they don't always get it right. 

 

Still, at least we've now got another stick to beat Mr Levein over the head with. 

The Vanacek Stick. 

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Mr Elwood P
4 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

That's not even scratching the surface of clubs recruitment in England. Sure I read recently Southampton has a dedicated office with over 30 staff that scout the entire world, collating every bit of data possible then moving the suggestion around until they get the player they're after, takes an eternity with a massive budget and they don't always get it right. 

 

Still, at least we've now got another stick to beat Mr Levein over the head with. 

The Vanacek Stick. 

 

I am aware, wish the rest were. 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48413180

 

Interesting article, which gives an insight into different types of scouting .

 

 

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jbee647
3 hours ago, PB21 said:

 

That was my understanding also, my sons pal plays with Hearts and also said his attitude was shocking. He played with him many times in reserve team and whilst many lads were busting a gut to impress, he strolled around as big time charlie. 

I was in hospitality for the game against Dundee, the game where DV lasted 30 mins before he was substituted.

At half time a prominent figure at Hearts advised us that Hearts were shocked how unfit Vanacek was and despite knowing for six months he was coming to Edinburgh, had made absolutely no effort to learn English.

Playing devils advocate I assume the reason he started the games v Livvy and Dundee was down to the fact of the hype generated by the arrival and anticipation created by Vanacek and Hearts to a lesser extent, Hearts maybe felt they had to let the fans see this new signing or questions would have been asked sooner, obviously that worked out badly 

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Jodami
5 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

How would you suggest a club on Hearts budget scouts players? Manchester United scout the player for years, eventually make their move and it still turns out to be a disaster. Liverpool scouted Andy Robertson over 20 times. We don't have the budget to do this. We can't afford to buy the best players from our own league. What's the solution?

The solution is what we are trying to do, buy promising players and develop our own. The issue comes with bringing in ordinary players who don't add much. If we are going to bring in someone make it a player with proven quality to mitigate the risk. Halkett looks like a lower risk acquisition as he's played in the league and been successful but it is obviously still a risk because there are different pressures on playing for a bigger club. Hopefully we should be looking at bringing in less or no players so we give our young players a chance and give more game time to Clare, Mulraney and Wighton to help them improve. Looking at less players should also mean we can watch them in person. I don't want us to think we can turn around players and improve them enormously, I just want to see solid signings and giving players who our management team has identified as promising a chance over more than one season. 

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sac
7 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

That's not even scratching the surface of clubs recruitment in England. Sure I read recently Southampton has a dedicated office with over 30 staff that scout the entire world, collating every bit of data possible then moving the suggestion around until they get the player they're after, takes an eternity with a massive budget and they don't always get it right. 

 

Still, at least we've now got another stick to beat Mr Levein over the head with. 

The Vanacek Stick. 

Ours must be done by some wee bird sitting in the club shunky looking at panini sticker albums.

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Mr Elwood P
1 minute ago, Jodami said:

The solution is what we are trying to do, buy promising players and develop our own. The issue comes with bringing in ordinary players who don't add much. If we are going to bring in someone make it a player with proven quality to mitigate the risk. Halkett looks like a lower risk acquisition as he's played in the league and been successful but it is obviously still a risk because there are different pressures on playing for a bigger club. Hopefully we should be looking at bringing in less or no players so we give our young players a chance and give more game time to Clare, Mulraney and Wighton to help them improve. Looking at less players should also mean we can watch them in person. I don't want us to think we can turn around players and improve them enormously, I just want to see solid signings and giving players who our management team has identified as promising a chance over more than one season. 

 

We should still be looking for the odd gem in Europe though, which will have a greater element of risk. Look what Celtic have done with Van Dijk and Wanyama! We were very successful at the start with these kinds of signings; Pallardo, Rossi, Djoum, Ozturk, Zeefuick etc .. Still an avenue worth pursuing. Ultimately signings are investments for the club and by diversifying the types of signings (investments) we reduce the overall risk.

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Jodami
3 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

We should still be looking for the odd gem in Europe though, which will have a greater element of risk. Look what Celtic have done with Van Dijk and Wanyama! We were very successful at the start with these kinds of signings; Pallardo, Rossi, Djoum, Ozturk, Zeefuick etc .. Still an avenue worth pursuing. Ultimately signings are investments for the club and by diversifying the types of signings (investments) we reduce the overall risk.

The original signings were successful at a lower level and we only ever made real money on the Sow deal (which still seems barely believable now!!). I like Djoum and he's been decent for us, Haring is slightly odd in that he has proved to be a good player in a different position. I think some of the more cautionary tales like Oshaniwa, Vanecek, Martin, Amankwaa and Cathro's January job lot show just how much risk there is in bringing these guys in. If you are going to bring someone in then I think you need to watch them in the flesh and do as much due diligence as you can.

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Sir Gio
23 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said:

This thread is a belter. 

 

Every single poster who is first to scream wage thief, etc is moaning that we have let a signing that never worked out go. 

 

Signing does not work out- both parties agree. 

We move on. 

 

Perfect outcome giving the circumstances 

 

Some folk clearly like to moan but disguise it under something about wanting the best for Hearts. Madness and Tragic in equal measure. 

I think it is a showcase thread of how far people will go to meet their agenda. Desperate stuff.

 

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Mr Elwood P
1 minute ago, Jodami said:

The original signings were successful at a lower level and we only ever made real money on the Sow deal (which still seems barely believable now!!). I like Djoum and he's been decent for us, Haring is slightly odd in that he has proved to be a good player in a different position. I think some of the more cautionary tales like Oshaniwa, Vanecek, Martin, Amankwaa and Cathro's January job lot show just how much risk there is in bringing these guys in. If you are going to bring someone in then I think you need to watch them in the flesh and do as much due diligence as you can.

 

The Osman Sow money will have covered the loss on the four you mention. Especially considering Vanacek and Amankwaa were on 18 month deals and left early. Bjorn Johnson has proven to be a great signing from Europe, unfortunately Cathro fired him out the door! We should do diligence on all signings but risk is an inherent part of the business. We can balance out the more risky signings with low risk Berra, Naismith, Lafferty type acquisitions. 

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mitch41
27 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

That's not even scratching the surface of clubs recruitment in England. Sure I read recently Southampton has a dedicated office with over 30 staff that scout the entire world, collating every bit of data possible then moving the suggestion around until they get the player they're after, takes an eternity with a massive budget and they don't always get it right. 

 

Still, at least we've now got another stick to beat Mr Levein over the head with. 

The Vanacek Stick. 

Southampton have a superb scouting system which helps them replace the players they sell for 

vast amounts of money. Get the scouting department right and you keep that conveyer of talent

coming through to the first team and you can sell when it suits everybody. OK  the Vanecek 

signing was a disaster all we can hope is it’s a lesson learned.

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Haringshairband

While I do try to be optimistic in respect to Hearts, you do have to question the recruitment lately. Let's hope we get it right this season or I envisage a meltdown on here.

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Jodami
5 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

The Osman Sow money will have covered the loss on the four you mention. Especially considering Vanacek and Amankwaa were on 18 month deals and left early. Bjorn Johnson has proven to be a great signing from Europe, unfortunately Cathro fired him out the door! We should do diligence on all signings but risk is an inherent part of the business. We can balance out the more risky signings with low risk Berra, Naismith, Lafferty type acquisitions. 

Johnsen was a sore one, bit of a mystery as well because he was technically good which you would have thought would suit Cathro's plans. A debacle which set us back at least 18 months. 

I think what I'm driving it is looking at less players but spending more time watching them to try and mitigate risk. Our low risk players have been acquired through contacts in the management team rather than through our scouting network which is slightly damning in itself.

I genuinely don't think it's a case of adding players, it's new ideas from a coaching perspective to help break down teams at home. When we seen the likes of Smith, Irving, Cochrane and Hickey given game time they were trying to play football, particularly in transition which we were poor at last season. That's how they have been up brought up to play and I think ultimately that should be the real focus for the new season.

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Phil Dunphy
17 hours ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

He talked himself up. It is there in black and white. Concede that you were wrong and stop embarrassing yourself. If you are in any further doubt check his social media!

 

He never did anything of the sort :laugh: Here’s how the difference works here;

 

”I really want to buy a Ferrari.”

 

This doesn’t mean I’m going to buy one. Or that I’m “bigging up” that I am. It’s merely a statement saying I would like to do that. 

 

I didn't think I’d have to explain the difference to a ****ing adult, but here we are.

 

:cornette:

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Olly Lee's left boot
33 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

I think it is a showcase thread of how far people will go to meet their agenda. Desperate stuff.

 

 

 

Yip 

 

My sc poll showed that as well.

 

 

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Olly Lee's left boot
25 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

Southampton have a superb scouting system which helps them replace the players they sell for 

vast amounts of money. Get the scouting department right and you keep that conveyer of talent

coming through to the first team and you can sell when it suits everybody. OK  the Vanecek 

signing was a disaster all we can hope is it’s a lesson learned.

 

 

A disaster? 

 

 

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Olly Lee's left boot
1 hour ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

That's not even scratching the surface of clubs recruitment in England. Sure I read recently Southampton has a dedicated office with over 30 staff that scout the entire world, collating every bit of data possible then moving the suggestion around until they get the player they're after, takes an eternity with a massive budget and they don't always get it right. 

 

Still, at least we've now got another stick to beat Mr Levein over the head with. 

The Vanacek Stick. 

 

 

That means 29 staff are getting paid to run football manager over and over and over. 

😁

 

The other other guy watching sky and  bt. 

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Mr Elwood P
15 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

He never did anything of the sort :laugh: Here’s how the difference works here;

 

”I really want to buy a Ferrari.”

 

This doesn’t mean I’m going to buy one. Or that I’m “bigging up” that I am. It’s merely a statement saying I would like to do that. 

 

I didn't think I’d have to explain the difference to a ****ing adult, but here we are.

 

:cornette:

 

That was worth the 17 hour wait.

 

I think you need to understand the difference between explicit and implied language. If you say you want to buy a Ferrari it is implied, that you think that at some point, you will be wealthy enough to afford one. Otherwise it is an idiotic statement. If you say you want to be the top goal scorer in Scottish Football, it is implied that you think you are very good at football and are going to score a lot of goals. The semantics between the use of 'want' or 'will' is irrelevant to the perception that is created by the comment. 

 

Perhaps if you use less emojis and replace them with actual words, you will find it easier to understand these things.

Edited by Mr Elwood P

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Artful Dodger
8 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said:

 

 

That means 29 staff are getting paid to run football manager over and over and over. 

😁

 

The other other guy watching sky and  bt. 

 

I don't think you're taking this situation very seriously Olly.

 

Supporters are embarrassed, its an horrific shambles of unaccountability. Toys have abandoned prams.

 

I fail to see how this CATASTROPHIC chain of events can amuse you.

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Pasquale for King
11 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Yeah Murray and Swanson were shipped out pretty sharpish. Terrible recruitment. Signed injured players. Shambles. Failed to persuade key players to stay. Inexcusable. Relied on lots of short term loans. Abysmal. And all while spending Hibs biggest ever transfer budget apparently. Answers required for sure.

Probably the reason most Hibs fans were happy to get rid of Lennon in January, then signed 4 players before the next manager arrived.

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