U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[redjambo]

4 hours ago, Led Tasso said:

He could still go the third party route, but the chances he'd win that are even more remote.

 

Oh yes please.

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

Now izzat cos it'll split the Republican vote, or because you want to see an end to the outdated 2PS that has blighted American politics... 

 

Yes.

[redjambo]

Just now, jonesy said:

😛 

 

I hadn't thought of the latter, to be honest, but it would be nice to see more schisms in American politics and a broader spectrum of voting options. Although knowing the Americans the extremists would no doubt wag the dog when it came to forming governing coalitions.

[redjambo]

4 minutes ago, jonesy said:

It'd be an interesting divide. How much of the Republicans actually like Trump enough to cause irreparable damage to the party?

 

 

Well the latest poll states that 70% of Republican voters have a favourable opinion of Trump against 20% who have an unfavourable opinion. Polls are split as to whether DeSantis or Trump is in the lead regarding Republican support. It could rip the Republicans right down the middle. Definitely popcorn material.

[Unknown user]

15 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

Text Evidence Bomb Hits MAGA World: Coup Plots Unearthed By Jan. 6 Panel

 

MAGA World bracing for the Jan. 6 committee to release its exhaustive report and make criminal referrals. It comes as new coup evidence emerges.

 

Talking Points Memo obtaining text messages from 34 GOP lawmakers to Trump’s chief of staff, Mark Meadows, pushing conspiracy theories and the big election lie.

 

MSNBC Chief Legal Correspondent Ari Melber breaks down why these texts are so damning and why they matter with a focus on the powerful committees many of these lawmakers will soon have.

 

 

 

There's a big day coming, the sealed Trump organisation case gives great hope to anyone alarmed by the apparent lack of action.

 

You can't attack the state and not expect the state to publicly bite back.

[JFK-1]

So here's the "major announcement", Trump trading cards, cards with photos of Trump on them. I bet they're the greatest collectible cards ever in the history of the universe. I just can't wait to get me a collection of cards with an orange bumpkin on them. 

 

In your face Biden, you no cards bitch.

 

 

 

 

[JFK-1]

Trump Should Focus Less On Action Cards And More On Criminal Charges

 

Former Acting Solicitor General Neal Katyal weighs in on the subpoenas sent out by Special Counsel Jack Smith sent out and what that could mean for Trump.

 

 

[Unknown user]

19 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

Text Evidence Bomb Hits MAGA World: Coup Plots Unearthed By Jan. 6 Panel

 

MAGA World bracing for the Jan. 6 committee to release its exhaustive report and make criminal referrals. It comes as new coup evidence emerges.

 

Talking Points Memo obtaining text messages from 34 GOP lawmakers to Trump’s chief of staff, Mark Meadows, pushing conspiracy theories and the big election lie.

 

MSNBC Chief Legal Correspondent Ari Melber breaks down why these texts are so damning and why they matter with a focus on the powerful committees many of these lawmakers will soon have.

 

 

 

I couldn't take this one seriously, they're on about cheering on a coo, and how coos fail, no coo has ever won in America, we saw an illegal coo.

 

It's no right, mon the coos!

 

[ri Alban]

5 hours ago, redjambo said:

 

Yes.

 

 

You are correct.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

I couldn't take this one seriously, they're on about cheering on a coo, and how coos fail, no coo has ever won in America, we saw an illegal coo.

 

It's no right, mon the coos!

 

It weren't just any coo though, it was a coo de ta. Always nice to say ta when someone does something nice for you. Never heard of it being done wi' a coo before, though.

[JFK-1]

Classic, this guy is the best when it comes to mocking the absurdity of Trump. Incidentally if you buy a Trump card which are $99 each you get a chance to have dinner with Donald. And maybe some Nazis, I dunno all the details.

 

Trump's Pathetic "Major Announcement" Is a Major Dud

 

 

 

 

[Maple Leaf]

This card thing that Trump has announced has to be the most pathetic thing I've heard from a former President.  How demeaning.  It's a blatant money grab from his sucker fans.

 

Even more pathetic is that millions of the suckers will buy them.

[Unknown user]

12 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

This card thing that Trump has announced has to be the most pathetic thing I've heard from a former President.  How demeaning.  It's a blatant money grab from his sucker fans.

 

Even more pathetic is that millions of the suckers will buy them.

 

They sold out within 12 hours and they're now trading at more than double the original cost!

[Maple Leaf]

48 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

They sold out within 12 hours and they're now trading at more than double the original cost!

 

[Cade]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

They sold out within 12 hours and they're now trading at more than double the original cost!

 

dingus probably bought them all himself and is punting them on at an even higher price.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

4 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

They sold out within 12 hours and they're now trading at more than double the original cost!

 

To give a slight bit of credit, he did attach assorted real world value items to each NFT (rights to visit Mar a Lago at some point or some such). I'm sure some of his most ardent supporters saw it as the equivalent of a charity auction but to prop him up.

 

Just proving my old point that he's one of the most successful con artists to ever walk the planet . . .

[JFK-1]

1 hour ago, Led Tasso said:

Just proving my old point that he's one of the most successful con artists to ever walk the planet . . .

 

I tend to go for the Trumpets being the dumbest saps ever to walk the planet. How dumb must you be to be conned by an orange bumpkin? 

[JFK-1]

Seems even many trumpets are becoming  embarrassed by this farce. When Trump came out with his "major announcement soon" drivel they were giddy with excitement.

 

"This is huge, he's got laser beams coming from his eyes"

 

That's a direct quote from one of the giddy trumpets expecting I dunno, another coup attempt imminent? Some were speculating he's going to run for speaker. And what did they get? This.

 

I don't often use smileys, but this merits it. 🤣

 

 

Trump’s Right Wing Supporters ABANDON Him after HUMILIATING NFT launch

 

Donald Trump’s ‘major announcement’ that he is selling Trump Digital NFT trading cards has even outraged his own right wing supporters. MeidasTouch host Ben Meiselas breaks it down.

 

 

[JFK-1]

Michael Cohen Thinks ‘Grifter In Chief’ Donald Trump Will Be Indicted

 

 

 

[JFK-1]

Interesting take on the Julian Assange situation as the New York Times says that Merrick Garland should drop the prosecution of Assange.

 

New Warning On The Trump-DeSantis Press Crackdown

 

 

 

[JFK-1]

MSNBC journalist Ar Melber who is a qualified lawyer has written a foreword for the Jan 6th final report. He reads just a small part of it here. You would have to think this foreword will be in line with the tone of the report contents. 'It was a coup'

I mentioned sometime ago I expect a bombshell or two when they finally publish, and I still think that. It's been their signature from the start, they like to round things off with something previously unknown and damning.

I was also thinking journalists may be of great value when this report is published. We're talking over a million documents plus other types of media. It's going to take a lot of eyes to look over this.

 

 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

5 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I tend to go for the Trumpets being the dumbest saps ever to walk the planet. How dumb must you be to be conned by an orange bumpkin? 

Eh, he conned most of the NYC media and real estate establishment for decades, convinced Forbes he was much richer than he actually was with a bad fake accent on the telephone, outright stole large sums of money from employees and vendors, has lived life free as a serial rapist, lost billions and then got Deutchebank to loan him money again anyway, got himself a game show about his business genius, convinced the establishment media to take him seriously, completely took over a major US party, then concerned trolled until people actually believed there was some amount of equivalence between him and a somewhat flawed but otherwise relatively normal Democratic nominee, became President then kept convincing all kinds of media and politico types that he was growing into the office, flagrantly violated his oath of office for four years, then instigated an insurrection against the government for which, two years later, he has yet to be charged.

 

I mean stepping back from the colossal damage to individuals, the country, and the globe he's done, that's an impressive record of absolute shithousery based on complete and total bullshit.

[JFK-1]

2 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

Eh, he conned most of the NYC media and real estate establishment for decades, convinced Forbes he was much richer than he actually was with a bad fake accent on the telephone, outright stole large sums of money from employees and vendors, has lived life free as a serial rapist, lost billions and then got Deutchebank to loan him money again anyway, got himself a game show about his business genius, convinced the establishment media to take him seriously, completely took over a major US party, then concerned trolled until people actually believed there was some amount of equivalence between him and a somewhat flawed but otherwise relatively normal Democratic nominee, became President then kept convincing all kinds of media and politico types that he was growing into the office, flagrantly violated his oath of office for four years, then instigated an insurrection against the government for which, two years later, he has yet to be charged.

 

I mean stepping back from the colossal damage to individuals, the country, and the globe he's done, that's an impressive record of absolute shithousery based on complete and total bullshit.

 

I don't think he ever conned the NY real estate community. I have read they always regarded him as a joke who would crash and burn. And that's probably part of the chip on his shoulder. He knew they considered him a joke, and with an ego like that? He would hold great resentment.

 

I just don't see anything artful about him. Before he became a presidential candidate I knew who he was but have never seen that TV show he hosted. Not even a clip. But when he began to be covered I instantly knew he was an actual total idiot. If I can see that the majority of others must too. Surely?

 

Am I especially insightful? That would be nice but I think not.

[JFK-1]

Also just had a funny thought. Trumps own niece Mary who is a qualified psychologist has described him as a "deeply unintelligent man"

 

But she says he knows it and it eats away at him. Made me wonder how smart do you have to be to know you're dumb.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

1 minute ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I don't think he ever conned the NY real estate community. I have read they always regarded him as a joke who would crash and burn. And that's probably part of the chip on his shoulder. He knew they considered him a joke, and with an ego like that? He would hold great resentment.

 

I just don't see anything artful about him. Before he became a presidential candidate I knew who he was but have never seen that TV show he hosted. Not even a clip. But when he began to be covered I instantly knew he was an actual total idiot. If I can see that the majority of others must too. Surely?

 

Am I especially insightful? That would be nice but I think not.

 

Again, he amassed quite a large empire of buildings, golf courses, and housing communities using a lot of smoke and mirrors. He routinely conned vendors to build and install things for them and then paid them 10-15% of the agreed price, telling them they were lucky to work for him. Despite this, the NY tabloids, magazines, and yes, even the "Grey Lady" herself, the NYT, had a habit of running fawning pieces on him. The truth is, they *loved* the idea of him, a kid from the Bronx who shot his way up the wealth list with his bravado and brash Bronx accent. Even when he was a joke, he was *their* successful joke.

 

He got himself cast into Home Alone 2 and countless commercials, all appearing in his rakish, good-natured but brash character. You can say, ah, but they saw through him or some such, but how the **** did he get a hold of so much actual real estate? How did Deutchebank get convinced he was a good investment for truly gigantic sums?

 

You don't have to be clever in any particular way to be a good con man. You just have to be a good reader of people and always be looking how to turn a situation to your own advantage. And you have to be shameless.

[JFK-1]

It would now be more surprising if Trump weren't indicted, and it's being suggested there may be indictments for 'house members too. I also saw it being said that indictments for members of Trumps family aside from Trump himself are likely.

Wonder who that might be. I saw it speculated a while back that Jared Kushner may be the insider who told them exactly where the documents were stashed at Mar-a-Lago . If that were indeed Jared snitching he might have a cut a deal.

 

When Trump made the decision to steal these documents, documents which aren't supposed to leave a designated room far less the building far less the state. When he made this decision who would he ask to take them? Some random staffer? Or a family member? Maybe Jared?

 

Jared isn't so bright either, but he is bright enough to know that when they came looking for these documents messing with them could result in jail for somebody. 

 

Trump messed further with them, maybe the guy who carried them there in the first place had reason to worry? Who Trump would throw under the bus in a heartbeat? It's going to be fascinating to watch it be completely unfolded.

 

The House Jan. 6 committee prepares to hold its final public hearing on the Capitol insurrection on Monday. Plus, there is new reporting about the criminal referrals that could be issued by the committee targeting Donald Trump for the plot to overturn the election.

 

 

 

[JFK-1]

Out of curiosity, do any of you personally know anybody who refers to themselves in the third person as Trump frequently does. I was reminded of it tonight when I saw a report speaking of Bill Barr while heading the DOJ during Trumps attempts to overturn the election.

 

Trump was as we know was refusing to accept the outcome of the election, pushing inane Twitter/Youtube conspiracy theories about mass election fraud. While Barr, head of the DOJ was telling associated press there was no evidence of any mass voter fraud.

 

Trump later confronts Barr, did you say that? Barr replies yes. Trump asks why did you say that, how could you do this to me, why did you say it. To which Barr replies because it's true.

 

Trump freaks out, "you must hate Trump, you must hate Trump". That's another feature of Trump, often likes to say things twice, like he thinks saying things twice makes it more powerful regardless of how absurd.

 

I have also seen Trump say that "nobody was tougher on Russia than Trump", while fawning over Putin like some teenage girl at a boy band gig. And many more including another I just came across from when he met Bill Gates. Bill will explain it and more odd behaviour from Trump in the video i'm going to post, set to begin at the relevant time.

 

But yeah, anybody know anyone who speak like that? I don't think I have ever even once in my life seen anyone refer to themselves in third person. Seen it used as a literary device but outside that nothing. Except Trump.

 

In this video Gates is speaking to staff at the Gates foundation he's taking questions from.

 

 

 

[BlueRiver]

9 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

Michael Cohen Thinks ‘Grifter In Chief’ Donald Trump Will Be Indicted

 

 

 

 

I really dislike that guy. 

[Ulysses]

On 16/12/2022 at 16:02, Maple Leaf said:

This card thing that Trump has announced has to be the most pathetic thing I've heard from a former President.  How demeaning.  It's a blatant money grab from his sucker fans.

 

Even more pathetic is that millions of the suckers will buy them.

 

On 16/12/2022 at 16:15, Smithee said:

 

They sold out within 12 hours and they're now trading at more than double the original cost!

 

On 16/12/2022 at 18:11, Cade said:

 

dingus probably bought them all himself and is punting them on at an even higher price.

 

On 16/12/2022 at 21:07, Led Tasso said:

 

To give a slight bit of credit, he did attach assorted real world value items to each NFT (rights to visit Mar a Lago at some point or some such). I'm sure some of his most ardent supporters saw it as the equivalent of a charity auction but to prop him up.

 

Just proving my old point that he's one of the most successful con artists to ever walk the planet . . .

 

On 16/12/2022 at 22:21, JFK-1 said:

 

I tend to go for the Trumpets being the dumbest saps ever to walk the planet. How dumb must you be to be conned by an orange bumpkin? 

 

Trump is, as ever, hiding his corruption in plain sight.

 

[JFK-1]

2 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

 

 

 

 

Trump is, as ever, hiding his corruption in plain sight.

 

 

Think that might soon be the least of his worries. He's absolutely done.

 

Jan 6th committee is going to recommend indictment on conspiracy to overthrow the government. He's also cooked on the theft of and attempts to conceal classified documents. 

[JFK-1]

BREAKING

Committee refers criminal charges against Trump

Representative Jamie Raskin confirms the committee is recommending four criminal charges against former President Donald Trump.

 

It is seeking charges of obstructing an official proceeding, conspiracy to defraud the United States, conspiracy to make a false statement, and insurrection.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-us-canada-63994477

[Jambo-Jimbo]

11 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

BREAKING

Committee refers criminal charges against Trump

Representative Jamie Raskin confirms the committee is recommending four criminal charges against former President Donald Trump.

 

It is seeking charges of obstructing an official proceeding, conspiracy to defraud the United States, conspiracy to make a false statement, and insurrection.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-us-canada-63994477

 

Should be treason he's facing, however that might be for another day.

[Notts1874]

I'd have rather the committee just handed their findings to the DoJ without recommending charges. Imo he's guilty as sin but he will just use this and say its political. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

1 minute ago, Notts1874 said:

I'd have rather the committee just handed their findings to the DoJ without recommending charges. Imo he's guilty as sin but he will just use this and say its political. 

 

He'll say it's political no matter what. This brings it around all three branches of government in the most methodical (if infuriatingly dragged out) way possible. Garland will immediately hand off the recommendation to the special prosecutor who can make a determination then bring it charges to a court if appropriate.

[Notts1874]

9 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

 

He'll say it's political no matter what. This brings it around all three branches of government in the most methodical (if infuriatingly dragged out) way possible. Garland will immediately hand off the recommendation to the special prosecutor who can make a determination then bring it charges to a court if appropriate.

To be open, I don't really understand the whole special prosecuter thing. 

[JFK-1]

12 minutes ago, Notts1874 said:

I'd have rather the committee just handed their findings to the DoJ without recommending charges. Imo he's guilty as sin but he will just use this and say its political. 

 

I don’t think opinion comes into it when considering his guilt. He's obviously guilty, we all saw what he did. There is no way out of this for Trump. Aside from maybe an insanity plea.

[Notts1874]

3 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I don’t think opinion comes into it when considering his guilt. He's obviously guilty, we all saw what he did. There is no way out of this for Trump. Aside from maybe an insanity plea.

The only reason I put "imo" is that everyone should be allowed their say in court. He's obviously guilty though 😂😂

[Maple Leaf]

1 hour ago, Led Tasso said:

 

He'll say it's political no matter what. This brings it around all three branches of government in the most methodical (if infuriatingly dragged out) way possible. Garland will immediately hand off the recommendation to the special prosecutor who can make a determination then bring it charges to a court if appropriate.

It has been really irritating for non-legal people like me to watch the slow pace.  Hopefully the special prosecutor will turn up the burners.  But it really all depends if he thinks that they have enough evidence to secure a conviction.  It will be nauseating if they put Trump on trial but fail to get a conviction, then all of us having to listen to him shout "witch hunt" for the rest of our lives.

[JFK-1]

43 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

It has been really irritating for non-legal people like me to watch the slow pace.  Hopefully the special prosecutor will turn up the burners.  But it really all depends if he thinks that they have enough evidence to secure a conviction.  It will be nauseating if they put Trump on trial but fail to get a conviction, then all of us having to listen to him shout "witch hunt" for the rest of our lives.

 

I would suggest there’s absolutely no way they would be recommending such charges unless they know they can nail him on it. And at the end of the day, his guilt is obvious.

[Maple Leaf]

15 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I would suggest there’s absolutely no way they would be recommending such charges unless they know they can nail him on it. And at the end of the day, his guilt is obvious.

    < ----  That's me praying that you're right.

 

But the Jan 6 committee are all politicians.  Do they know what it takes to get a conviction in a court of law?  Just asking.

[Unknown user]

When you look at how they interpret insurrection, hopefully that ****ing Alex Jones will get his too - all he has to do is provide aid or comfort to the insurrectionists, never mind the blatant encouragement witnessed in footage of him in the lead up.

Take him down tae!

[Ked]

4 minutes ago, Smithee said:

When you look at how they interpret insurrection, hopefully that ****ing Alex Jones will get his too - all he has to do is provide aid or comfort to the insurrectionists, never mind the blatant encouragement witnessed in footage of him in the lead up.

Take him down tae!

Funny how a catch all law like breach of the peace which once riled those from the left is now championed.

[JFK-1]

14 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

Do they know what it takes to get a conviction in a court of law?  Just asking.

 

Absolutely, the committee is littered with lawyers. Isn't Cheney also a lawyer?

[Notts1874]

Can nobody explain what a special prosecutor is to me?? 😭😭

[Unknown user]

13 minutes ago, Ked said:

Funny how a catch all law like breach of the peace which once riled those from the left is now championed.

What, insurrection?

[Maple Leaf]

5 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Absolutely, the committee is littered with lawyers.

[JFK-1]

Note one of the charges is "conspiracy to make a false statement"

 

Wonder how that will effect Trumps ability to keep pushing the lie as he still does. Will he dig an even deeper hole for himself? I expect he is stupid enough to do so.

[Cade]

2 hours ago, Notts1874 said:

Can nobody explain what a special prosecutor is to me?? 😭😭

It's someone put in charge of an investigation who both sides agree has no conflict of interests.

 

In a 3rd world banana republic like the USA with politically appointed, partizan courts (all the way up to the Supreme Court), conflicts of interest are baked into the entire system.

So to avoid accusation of political witch hunts, a special prosecutor is assigned.

Edited December 20, 2022 by Cade

[Watt-Zeefuik]

2 hours ago, Notts1874 said:

Can nobody explain what a special prosecutor is to me?? 😭😭

 

The DoJ is a branch of the Executive and under the control of the Attorney General, which is an inherently political appointment, and they can be fired by the President at any time. Many past AGs have been former senators, governors, etc. The idea is if there's a situation where someone has done something where it's too politically hot for the normal channels to pursue, you name a special counsel or special prosecutor who has only the barest oversight from the DoJ, and that oversight is heavily watched.

 

In this case, Jack Smith has been named to handle it.  Congress has effectively said, "we think he did crimes," Smith will make the decision of if he thinks there's enough to make it worth filing charges and IIRC would also be in charge of the prosecution of the case.

 

4 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

It has been really irritating for non-legal people like me to watch the slow pace.  Hopefully the special prosecutor will turn up the burners.  But it really all depends if he thinks that they have enough evidence to secure a conviction.  It will be nauseating if they put Trump on trial but fail to get a conviction, then all of us having to listen to him shout "witch hunt" for the rest of our lives.

 

Agreed, but perhaps totally accidentally, the timing may turn out to be perfect. The GOP as a whole, including primary voters, have never been more ready to turn on Trump than they are now. 12 months ago you'd probably have had various politicians throwing giant fits about it. Now I'm sure a few will but a fair few GOPers will put on a serious face and mumble about the Constitution and the integrity of the courts while letting him twist in the wind.

[ri Alban]

6 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I would suggest there’s absolutely no way they would be recommending such charges unless they know they can nail him on it. *And at the end of the day, his guilt is obvious.

*OJ says "Haud ma beer"