U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[Dawnrazor]

24 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

There is no dilemma in my eyes.

 

If you want to run a guest house or a bakery or a beauty salon or a bicycle repair shop, you don't get to pick and choose who you will or will not serve, even in the extreme examples you cited.

Ok, we can disagree. 

[Governor Tarkin]

3 minutes ago, J.T.F.Robertson said:

 

Fallible?

 

 

Come on, you can't blame folk for doing good stuff.

 

[Dawnrazor]

8 minutes ago, J.T.F.Robertson said:

 

You're using hypothetical, philosophic extremes to make your point.

Why would a white supremacist wish to bed down in a black-operated b&b? Same applies to your neo nazi analogy.

All encompassing answers don't exist, common sense does. (occasionally)

It's the point really, but I could racist groups, especially in the states, trying to make trouble by going to places where they know they'll stir stuff up. But the religious argument has already been an issue.

[J.T.F.Robertson]

1 minute ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Come on, you can't blame folk for doing good stuff.

 

 

 Blame, no. Be suspicious of their motives, aye.

 

 

[Governor Tarkin]

1 minute ago, J.T.F.Robertson said:

 

 Blame, no. Be suspicious of their motives, aye.

 

 

 

Always. 👍

 

[JJ93]

37 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

I presume that most of us want to live in a society that is governed by the rule of law. And governments have the right to enact laws or repeal them.  I doubt if philosophy guides most governments; it's more likely to be political bias.

 

A person's freedoms shouldn't include the right to make anyone else's life miserable. If I have to surrender some of my so-called freedoms in order for us to live in a more tolerant society, that's fine by me.

 

By the way, I think the Trump administration is anti-reason, and you might very well be right in your prediction of doom!

 

 

What I mean when I refer to philosophy is that politics is a result of philosophy (consciously or subconsciously integrated).

 

Totally agree about Trump being anti-reason but so are the Dems. For me, I'm an individualist. I want freedom to the fullest extent and this is the best thing for humanity (too much to get into on a forum!) and I do worry about the future. Europe is diabolical too. The only places I see as being stable are UK, Canada, NZ and AUS.

[JJ93]

11 minutes ago, kila said:

Folk will defend discrimination until they become the ones being discriminated

 

If you mean me then no I defend the right of someone to discriminate against me in terms of their policy in a business. I may not like it but that is their right.

[JJ93]

37 minutes ago, Normthebarman said:

I wouldn't have a problem with this, as long as employers and businesses state what restrictions they have on who they employ or who they let in, and display this on any and all advertising. 

They probably would if they were allowed. Previously I recall seeing 'no blacks' or whatever on a sign. Horrible to see but their right to be that way if they want to be!

[kila]

1 minute ago, JJ93 said:

If you mean me then no I defend the right of someone to discriminate against me in terms of their policy in a business. I may not like it but that is their right.

 

Aye unless that business offers an essential service and discriminates against you and you can't go anywhere else. Then you'll get pissed off and moan about how unfair it is.

 

It is the "I'm alright Jack' attitude to life. Something doesn't directly affect you, heck it might even help elevate your social status. You're keen to defend that, I understand. But it seems what you're lacking is the ability to put one's self in another's shoes and imagine what life would really be like. Ignorance is bliss.

[Justin Z]

16 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Your welcome, the feeling is definitely mutual 👍

 

I was never talking to you until you interjected yourself, nor would I deign to.

[JJ93]

1 minute ago, kila said:

 

Aye unless that business offers an essential service and discriminates against you and you can't go anywhere else. Then you'll get pissed off and moan about how unfair it is.

 

It is the "I'm alright Jack' attitude to life. Something doesn't directly affect you, heck it might even help elevate your social status. You're keen to defend that, I understand. But it seems what you're lacking is the ability to put one's self in another's shoes and imagine what life would really be like. Ignorance is bliss.

Not at all. Not sure why you presumed this?

 

We are all human and have the same (philosophically defined) rights.

[JJ93]

Can I just voice my appreciation for the turn this thread has had. Very civil now! Keep it up chaps!

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, Justin Z said:

 

I was never talking to you until you interjected yourself, nor would I deign to.

Ouch😆

[Justin Z]

4 minutes ago, JJ93 said:

Can I just voice my appreciation for the turn this thread has had. Very civil now! Keep it up chaps!

To be fair you haven't tried to claim again that the height of capitalistic prosperity and opportunity for all, in the history of the world, was in the United States near the end of the Gilded Age when eight year olds were working in coal mines, smoking pipes, and dying of black lung at 30 or younger.

 

Wrong opinion has always been tolerated around here, contrary to Jake's whinging. It's when it's framed as clearly dismissible nonsense--yet keeps getting pushed--that people's hackles tend to get up a bit.

 

Please do keep this new leaf you've turned up.

 

Edited June 2, 2020 by Justin Z

[JJ93]

1 minute ago, Justin Z said:

To be fair you haven't yet tried to claim the height of capitalistic prosperity in the history of the world was in the United States near the end of the Gilded Age when eight year olds were working in coal mines, smoking pipes, and dying of black lung at 30 or younger.

 

Wrong opinion has always been tolerated around here, contrary to Jake's whinging. It's when it's framed as clearly dismissible nonsense--yet keeps getting pushed--that people's hackles tend to get up a bit.

 

Please do keep this new leaf you've turned up.

haha well let's keep that for another conversation. But one thing is for sure - there has never been a better time to be alive than today and despite all the bad things going on in the world, there are so many great things going on and we should look at those if we get too downtrodden when watching the news (which is always negative).

 

wishing you well!

[Justin Z]

9 minutes ago, JJ93 said:

haha well let's keep that for another conversation. But one thing is for sure - there has never been a better time to be alive than today and despite all the bad things going on in the world, there are so many great things going on and we should look at those if we get too downtrodden when watching the news (which is always negative).

 

wishing you well!

 

The news is poison, no doubting it. I don't remember the last time I intentionally "tuned in". But now getting news sources from so many other places, it's easy to get sucked into the negativity without realising it. It's a minefield for sure.

 

Be safe and keep healthy.

[The Mighty Thor]

The hostage looks even more drugged up/terrified than normal.

 

If she ever writes memoirs of being in the passenger seat of that car crash then it'll be a doozy. 

[Sharpie]

42 minutes ago, kila said:

Folk will defend discrimination until they become the ones being discriminated

 

 Paraphrase the famous WW2 quote. When they came for the Unions I said nothing, When they came for the Jews I said nothing, When they came for me there was nobody left to say anything.

[Dawnrazor]

18 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

Wrong opinion has always been tolerated around here......

 

Now, I don't want you to reply to me but, that has got to be the most strikingly arrogant thing I've read on here... ever! Carry on.

[Pasquale for King]

3 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

 Paraphrase the famous WW2 quote. When they came for the Unions I said nothing, When they came for the Jews I said nothing, When they came for me there was nobody left to say anything.

Indeed. Our owner likened her attitude in trying to help clubs and Scottish football in general to this on Saturday “some of the worst things in history have happened because people stood back and watched”.

[Justin Z]

2 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Now, I don't want you to reply to me but, that has got to be the most strikingly arrogant thing I've read on here... ever! Carry on.

 

🙄 Well you're getting replied to.

 

You know full well I was speaking in generalities--i.e. the point was it's tolerated regardless of who thinks who is wrong. But nice try, sweetcheeks.

[Sharpie]

16 minutes ago, JJ93 said:

haha well let's keep that for another conversation. But one thing is for sure - there has never been a better time to be alive than today and despite all the bad things going on in the world, there are so many great things going on and we should look at those if we get too downtrodden when watching the news (which is always negative).

 

wishing you well!

 

I am sure thats true for yourself and others of your generation, For me the years basically between 1945 and 1960's were really good. We had through television increased our communication with the rest of the world. Yes there were international conflicts, but people were getting well settled after the war years and the reparation period, but life was still simple really. You got married, got a house had kids, and that was it, good job and sit back and view your empire. We didn't really know all that was going on and our ignorance was bliss.

[Justin Z]

2 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

 

I am sure thats true for yourself and others of your generation, For me the years basically between 1945 and 1960's were really good. We had through television increased our communication with the rest of the world. Yes there were international conflicts, but people were getting well settled after the war years and the reparation period, but life was still simple really. You got married, got a house had kids, and that was it, good job and sit back and view your empire. We didn't really know all that was going on and our ignorance was bliss.

 

Indeed Bob, and a cursory glance at the numbers would show how little opportunity there is now compared to then for the vast majority.

 

I saw an article come out within the last day which dubbed millennials the unluckiest generation, and it charted everything out quite comprehensively--only had a glance at it though. Maybe I'll go track it down, although it's a fair bit off topic from this thread.

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, Justin Z said:

 

🙄 Well you're getting replied to.

 

You know full well I was speaking in generalities--i.e. the point was it's tolerated regardless of who thinks who is wrong. But nice try, sweetcheeks.

Now, don't be getting your nappy all twisted out of shape, I'd have pointed that out who ever said it, unfortunately, but predictably, it was you, you've had your wee atempt at backtracking regarding your incredibly arrogant, offensive and somewhat ironically  Trumpian remark, now don't bother replying please, Id not want you to have to converse with someone with the "wrong opinion" to you. 

Good night.

[Justin Z]

Wee lambs about tonight indeed.

 

To quote one of my favourite films, "We are men of action. Lies do not become us."

[Maple Leaf]

1 hour ago, Justin Z said:

To be fair you haven't tried to claim again that the height of capitalistic prosperity and opportunity for all, in the history of the world, was in the United States near the end of the Gilded Age when eight year olds were working in coal mines, smoking pipes, and dying of black lung at 30 or younger.

 

Wrong opinion has always been tolerated around here, contrary to Jake's whinging. It's when it's framed as clearly dismissible nonsense--yet keeps getting pushed--that people's hackles tend to get up a bit.

 

Please do keep this new leaf you've turned up.

 

 

Hey, there's only room enough for one leaf around here! 

[Justin Z]

2 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

Hey, there's only room enough for one leaf around here! 

 

Now that's not a very Canadian attitude of you, eh?

[vegas-voss]

1 hour ago, The Mighty Thor said:

The hostage looks even more drugged up/terrified than normal.

 

If she ever writes memoirs of being in the passenger seat of that car crash then it'll be a doozy. 

Is that her or the body double ?

[jake]

2 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

The point you're trying to make is that you doubt if I would live up to my own standards.

 

We'll never know.

No it wasnt.

 

[jake]

2 hours ago, Justin Z said:

To be fair you haven't tried to claim again that the height of capitalistic prosperity and opportunity for all, in the history of the world, was in the United States near the end of the Gilded Age when eight year olds were working in coal mines, smoking pipes, and dying of black lung at 30 or younger.

 

Wrong opinion has always been tolerated around here, contrary to Jake's whinging. It's when it's framed as clearly dismissible nonsense--yet keeps getting pushed--that people's hackles tend to get up a bit.

 

Please do keep this new leaf you've turned up.

 

You mean dismissable nonsense like white skin privilege ?

Or do you mean nonsense like socialism is the answer?

Or real nonsense like explaining white skin privilege with a meme with a bad cop and a sportster.

😄

 

You're struggling.

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, jake said:

You mean dismissable nonsense like white skin privilege ?

Or do you mean nonsense like socialism is the answer?

Or real nonsense like explaining white skin privilege with a meme with a bad cop and a sportster.

😄

 

You're struggling.

Don't Feed The Troll!!

[Unknown user]

7 hours ago, JJ93 said:

Too much logic for you to handle?

Look, you clearly see yourself as an intellectually superior, free thinking maverick, capable of seeing truths hidden from the sheeple, but you're not.

 

Things like the state shouldn't provide education, you don't care about kids and parents being separated - these aren't intellectually superior positions, they show an uncaring bedroom intellectual who's read stuff but learned nothing about what people need or the relationship between state and population for others.

[jake]

Just now, Dawnrazor said:

Don't Feed The Troll!!

I dont .

I'm easy about giving my opinion .

 

 

 

 

[jake]

2 hours ago, Justin Z said:

Wee lambs about tonight indeed.

 

To quote one of my favourite films, "We are men of action. Lies do not become us."

Says the wee lamb who despite being educated and having white skin privilege found the little fascist forms too much oppression to get a Visa for the UK.

 

Awwww wee lamb

[Unknown user]

9 minutes ago, jake said:

Says the wee lamb who despite being educated and having white skin privilege found the little fascist forms too much oppression to get a Visa for the UK.

 

Awwww wee lamb

That's poor form

[jake]

9 minutes ago, Smithee said:

That's poor form

 

Aw come on Smithee.

I hardly think so .

In any way .

 

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, jake said:

 

Aw come on Smithee.

I hardly think so .

In any way .

 

You're sneering at the guy's attempts to improve his life jake, take a step back

[jake]

3 minutes ago, Smithee said:

You're sneering at the guy's attempts to improve his life jake, take a step back

Yes I know I'm sneering.

And I think I've been pretty reasonable.

I always try to play the ball Smithee .

Getting chased round the forum is fekin nippy.

Like I said pretty reasonable

 

 

[Unknown user]

31 minutes ago, jake said:

Yes I know I'm sneering.

And I think I've been pretty reasonable.

I always try to play the ball Smithee .

Getting chased round the forum is fekin nippy.

Like I said pretty reasonable

 

 

We'll need to agree to disagree I think, I'm sure we'll both get over it

[ri Alban]

9 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

Reactions like this out of the likes of you are among the best affirmations, so I thank you very kindly. ❤️

Wee persecuted lamb. 

[ri Alban]

9 hours ago, Sharpie said:

 

I am sure thats true for yourself and others of your generation, For me the years basically between 1945 and 1960's were really good. We had through television increased our communication with the rest of the world. Yes there were international conflicts, but people were getting well settled after the war years and the reparation period, but life was still simple really. You got married, got a house had kids, and that was it, good job and sit back and view your empire. We didn't really know all that was going on and our ignorance was bliss.

Sharpie, with your experience, I for one would like to know your opinion of the EU. Do you think the strive for the EU stopped more conflict? Or is that down to Nato? 

Sorry, put it on the brexit thread, if you can bothered. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

12 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Sharpie, with your experience, I for one would like to know your opinion of the EU. Do you think the strive for the EU stopped more conflict? Or is that down to Nato? 

Sorry, put it on the brexit thread, if you can bothered. 

Tweet Trump and ask him.

He’s best ever President and Commander in Chief.

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Tweet Trump and ask him.

He’s best ever President and Commander in Chief.

Tweet? Where's LHO when you need him. 

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

4 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Tweet Trump and ask him.

He’s best ever President and Commander in Chief.

Certainly seems to be a lot of whitewashing going on.

[Governor Tarkin]

9 hours ago, Smithee said:

You're sneering at the guy's attempts to improve his life jake, take a step back

 

9 hours ago, jake said:

Yes I know I'm sneering.

And I think I've been pretty reasonable.

I always try to play the ball Smithee .

Getting chased round the forum is fekin nippy.

Like I said pretty reasonable

 

 

 

It is poor form, Jake, but for balance, JZ does seem to maintain a sneering tone throughout his interactions with you.

[Sharpie]

5 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Sharpie, with your experience, I for one would like to know your opinion of the EU. Do you think the strive for the EU stopped more conflict? Or is that down to Nato? 

Sorry, put it on the brexit thread, if you can bothered. 

To be absolutely honest I have no connection with Europe other than this forum. I didn't even read much of the Brexit thread. I think NATO has been a positive thing..

[ri Alban]

21 minutes ago, Sharpie said:

To be absolutely honest I have no connection with Europe other than this forum. I didn't even read much of the Brexit thread. I think NATO has been a positive thing..

OK 👍

[maroonlegions]

18 hours ago, J.T.F.Robertson said:

 

You're using hypothetical, philosophic extremes to make your point.

Why would a white supremacist wish to bed down in a black-operated b&b? Same applies to your neo nazi analogy.

All encompassing answers don't exist, common sense does. (occasionally)

 

 

Here is an example of how "white privilege " sounds and how they argue their case on most levels.

 

Most whites privilege are saying its a shame that a black man was killed, but destroying property has to stop.

 

What they should be saying is its horrible that property is being destroyed but the killing of  INNOCENT black men has to STOP.

They are  PRIORITIZING the WRONG part.

 

 

[maroonlegions]

And it begins , just like i suspected how it would pan out as they say.

 

These are serious hackers and they are well capable of digging up shite from his past, they have done it before.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Trump’s Dirty Laundry: Anonymous Hackers Threaten To Reveal All

 

Edited June 3, 2020 by maroonlegions

[Maple Leaf]

15 minutes ago, maroonlegions said:

 

 

Here is an example of how "white privilege " sounds and how they argue their case on most levels.

 

Fox News is saying its a shame that a black man was killed, but destroying property has to stop.

 

While CNN is saying is its horrible that property is being destroyed but the killing of  INNOCENT black men has to STOP.

 

 

 

 

I hope you don't mind me altering your words a bit.