AGM Week

[Nookie Bear]

Just now, davemclaren said:

They have two directors representing member’s interests. It’s the midt legitimate route for escalation of your concerns I reckon. 

 

Yeah I get that and it wasn’t dig at the FoH. 

 

I just feel that sorting out Section N is becoming a personal matter for AB that she can’t back down from. 

[soonbe110]

36 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

I have no issue with the old firm having he full Roseburn as we don’t sell out and some fans actually stay away from these games, which beggars belief. 

 

But if if we can tolerate those away fans, we can tolerate Section N. 

Think you, and others, are missing the point she made. We/she can’t really complain about OF fan behaviour when some of our fans behave the same way at Tynie, as well as behaving the same way at Away games and trashing parts of the stand at Fir Park etc. Need to put your own house in order first otherwise whataboutery wins. 

[Francis Albert]

2 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Spending on the Tynecastle Redevelopment Programme reached £20.7m at 30 November, up from £15m a year ago.

 

Club resources - £6.7m

Benefactors - £6.75m

FOH - £3m

Supporter initiatives - £2m

Loan facility - £1.75m

Lease funding - £0.5m

 

The most interesting figure in that was the club's contribution having gone up from £4.75m at the last AGM to £6.7m now. That suggests that without the costs of the development there should be the best part of £2m to invest elsewhere (like the team).

Don't you mean the increased cost of the redevelopment?

An increase which has still not been really explained?

 

And of course £3m of the £6.7m of "club resources" are also attributable to FoH funding).

Edited December 18, 2018 by Francis Albert

[Nookie Bear]

3 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Think you, and others, are missing the point she made. We/she can’t really complain about OF fan behaviour when some of our fans behave the same way at Tynie, as well as behaving the same way at Away games and trashing parts of the stand at Fir Park etc. Need to put your own house in order first otherwise whataboutery wins. 

 

Bollocks. 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

4 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Think you, and others, are missing the point she made. We/she can’t really complain about OF fan behaviour when some of our fans behave the same way at Tynie, as well as behaving the same way at Away games and trashing parts of the stand at Fir Park etc. Need to put your own house in order first otherwise whataboutery wins. 

This 

[davemclaren]

27 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Why the facepalm. Poor reporting as per from the News. 

 

One incident above all has produced negative national news and it wasn’t Section N at caused it. The only people bothered by N are other Hearts fans. 

And Motherwell players it would seem. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

32 minutes ago, Nelly Terraces said:

Things Budge cares about: Turning Tynecastle inot a morgue.

 

Things she doesn't care about: Hearts winning football matches.

 

also cares about :

 

families

being all edinburgh united with leanne and the hibees

ladies football

"match day experiences"

telling fans how they should 'enjoy' their match day experience

spending massive amounts on a frankly fairly average stand

tourists

the old firm bigoted coin

 

fortunately there are, or will be soon, swarms of families to take up the slack should a few of the rank and file become a bit disillusioned

 

 

 

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

2 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Bollocks. 

Only response it deserves. You get the whole stadium in order. You can't just pick on a small group/easy target.

[soonbe110]

13 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Was there any clear analysis of the scope and cost variations that on the face of it seem to have resulted in a spend to date almost double the original £11m estimate with another year of the redevelpmemt project still to go?

No there wasn’t because the main stand is nowhere near double the original estimate. What she did say was that the ‘project’ is much more than the stand and listed a whole bunch of things that have been done that were not ‘main stand’ costs eg hybrid pitch, new energy centre, new control centre, upgrade of Gorgie Suite, upgrade of other parts of stadium, retail outlet, offices, there were more but can’t remember them. Interesting that this years projection shows a £1.5m increase in retail and hospitality income and halfway through the year they are on track so the stand is starting to generate a lot of additional income already. Third floor ready for June and already taking bookings for events, weddings etc. 

[graygo]

The seethe on here would be off the scale if it transpired that we did some kind of Ticketus deal for the OF games so we got most of the Roseburn stand money at the start of the season.

 

I think I would probably piss myself laughing.

[Ray Gin]

18 minutes ago, kimosavi said:

So Leveins dinosaur coaching swept under the carpet under its all down to the injuries excuse

 

Thought as much 

 

What exactly is 'dinosaur' about his coaching?

[davemclaren]

10 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I am struggling to understand a threat to close Section N Lower at the same time as guaranteeing the whole of the Roseburn to fans who behave at least as badly as anyone in Section N but on a MUCH larger scale. 

Someone made very much that point at the AGM. He said ( paraphrasing ) we are comfortable with the financial loss of ( correctly ) banning our neds from Section N and elsewhere but apparently not comfortable with rhe financial loss of reducing some of the thousands of away end neds. Somethings are more important than money. 

[Francis Albert]

3 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Bollocks. 

Bollocks squared. We are not permitted to complain about or take action against away fans who behave at least as badly but on a much larger scale than a small number of our own fans? In fact we happily guarantee them seats for the season even if Hearts fans might want them.

Pathetic.

[soonbe110]

17 minutes ago, kimosavi said:

So Leveins dinosaur coaching swept under the carpet under its all down to the injuries excuse

 

Thought as much 

He explained it pretty clearly. The squad is built to play a pressing game, keeping the ball in the final third. Worked well when Uche Naismith and MacLean were fit and able to retain possession in final third. Midfield could then push on hence number of goals for Haring and Lee. Uche and Naismith injuries put paid to that and we struggled for a few games due to poor ball retention up front. Still a challenge today and will be until Naismith, Vanacek and Uche are back playing. 

[soonbe110]

16 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I am struggling to understand a threat to close Section N Lower at the same time as guaranteeing the whole of the Roseburn to fans who behave at least as badly as anyone in Section N but on a MUCH larger scale. 

Requires some thought around putting your own house in order first before you start pointing the finger. 

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, soonbe110 said:

Requires some thought around putting your own house in order first before you start pointing the finger. 

I thought Tynecastle was "our house".

[siegementality]

1 hour ago, Thomaso said:

 

I think it was "ridiculous" to agree to give the OF the whole stand before a ball was kicked - and seemingly this agreement cannot be changed.

 

So let's just say we had not had all these terrible injuries and we were still flying at the top of the league.  It all comes down to a title decider against Celtic at Tynecastle after the split - now that would be a game all Hearts would want to see - but instead of giving Celtic minimal tickets, we give them the whole stand because that was what was agreed 9 months before!!

At the beginning of the season did you honestly believe - for one second - that we would ever be in a position that there would be a title decider against Celtic at Tynecastle?

[soonbe110]

7 minutes ago, Bring Back Paulo Sergio said:

Only response it deserves. You get the whole stadium in order. You can't just pick on a small group/easy target.

How do you do that? 

[soonbe110]

7 minutes ago, graygo said:

The seethe on here would be off the scale if it transpired that we did some kind of Ticketus deal for the OF games so we got most of the Roseburn stand money at the start of the season.

 

I think I would probably piss myself laughing.

It’s actually a good idea though! 

[Markymark]

8 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

He explained it pretty clearly. The squad is built to play a pressing game, keeping the ball in the final third. Worked well when Uche Naismith and MacLean were fit and able to retain possession in final third. Midfield could then push on hence number of goals for Haring and Lee. Uche and Naismith injuries put paid to that and we struggled for a few games due to poor ball retention up front. Still a challenge today and will be until Naismith, Vanacek and Uche are back playing. 

 

So very much a one trick pony that can’t have a variety of players and formations to adapt. FFS this is the guy that signed a centre half and plays in midfield. Throws lots of shit onto the pitch hoping that something sticks. To the original point made - a total dinosaur of manager.

[siegementality]

54 minutes ago, Nelly Terraces said:

Things Budge cares about: Turning Tynecastle inot a morgue.

 

Things she doesn't care about: Hearts winning football matches.

Ever thought that our mystery benefactors might just be put off from financially backing the club if some of the more moronic Hearts support continue their behaviour. Personally I’d rather have their cash.

[SUTOL]

53 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Fair points. 

 

But funding the women’s team, cutting the OF and ditching Section N all lose us money that will impact on the first team. 

 

I'm sure the extra stewarding and security for the few in a couple of sections who can't sit on a seat are also costing us money. 

 

[Francis Albert]

12 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

No there wasn’t because the main stand is nowhere near double the original estimate. What she did say was that the ‘project’ is much more than the stand and listed a whole bunch of things that have been done that were not ‘main stand’ costs eg hybrid pitch, new energy centre, new control centre, upgrade of Gorgie Suite, upgrade of other parts of stadium, retail outlet, offices, there were more but can’t remember them. Interesting that this years projection shows a £1.5m increase in retail and hospitality income and halfway through the year they are on track so the stand is starting to generate a lot of additional income already. Third floor ready for June and already taking bookings for events, weddings etc. 

The usual spin and smoke and mirrors I am afraid. "Offices" were always part of the project - in fact the temporary offices under the Wheatfield are now being retained and the cost of offices in the main stand saved. Similarly there was intended to be another Gorgie Suite type facility in the new stand but that has been dropped. I suspect Exhibition space and "syndicate rooms" cost less than fitting out offices and top of the range hospitality space. The retail outlet was surely always part of the new stand project.

[XB52]

35 minutes ago, kimosavi said:

So Leveins dinosaur coaching swept under the carpet under its all down to the injuries excuse

 

Thought as much 

Total rubbish from you as usual. 

[Nookie Bear]

12 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

How do you do that? 

 

By applying the same standards across the whole stadium. 

[ramrod]

Shutting section N is a joke and a compete cop out by Ann and the club . 

They just need to make sure it's policed properly. 

A lazy way out that will cost the club money . 

 

[siegementality]

15 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

He explained it pretty clearly. The squad is built to play a pressing game, keeping the ball in the final third. Worked well when Uche Naismith and MacLean were fit and able to retain possession in final third. Midfield could then push on hence number of goals for Haring and Lee. Uche and Naismith injuries put paid to that and we struggled for a few games due to poor ball retention up front. Still a challenge today and will be until Naismith, Vanacek and Uche are back playing. 

So he is employing the same tactics as Ian Cathro (who delivered a presentation at the meet the manager event outlining exactly the same principles) funny that!

[XB52]

25 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Don't you mean the increased cost of the redevelopment?

An increase which has still not been really explained?

 

And of course £3m of the £6.7m of "club resources" are also attributable to FoH funding).

Instead of boring us all rigid with your one man campaign, why didn't you go tonight agm and ask. Or go to the foh agm tomorrow and ask

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

1 minute ago, ramrod said:

Shutting section N is a joke and a compete cop out by Ann and the club . 

They just need to make sure it's policed properly. 

A lazy way out that will cost the club money . 

 

Well if people would behave properly she wouldn't have to consider doing this 

[Francis Albert]

3 minutes ago, weehammy said:

Overheard the security/safety guy talking after the meeting. Beyond the emails from the club stewards asking people to sit down are - at best - just ignored as if they aren't there. At worst - told to **** off. As they can't be physically made to sit down it's difficult to see what the club can do, other than threatening to close the section.

Every ground in the UK has areas where the majority stand. In many grounds it involves far larger numbers (I estimate at east 20,000 at the recent North London derby). Why is Tynie different? Anyone in G or lower N who objects to people standing have had many opportunities to move seats and avoid the problem.

 

[XB52]

26 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

also cares about :

 

familie

being all edinburgh united with leanne and the hibees

ladies football

"match day experiences"

telling fans how they should 'enjoy' their match day experience

spending massive amounts on a frankly fairly average stand

tourists

the old firm bigoted coin

 

fortunately there are, or will be soon, swarms of families to take up the slack should a few of the bigots in our support

 become a bit disillusioned

 

 

 

Ftfy 

Edited December 18, 2018 by XB52

[Nookie Bear]

Just now, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

Well if people would behave properly she wouldn't have to consider doing this 

 

But only home supporters, of course. 

[Nookie Bear]

1 minute ago, XB52 said:

 

 

Looking at the empty spaces at recent home games, it doesn’t look like those families are interested 

[Getintaethem]

The club seriously needs to look into safe standing, and in a part of the ground where missiles etc can't be launched at opposition fans or benches.  Would like to see the Gorgie stand being turned into a safe standing zone, where people who prefer to stand/sing etc. can enjoy their match day experience and create an atmosphere, without the problems that we've seen so far this season.  There's room for everybody inside Tynecastle, it just needs managed properly.

[main]

Regarding the standing issue, no stewards have made any effort at all to make us sit in lower G since the statement. Surprised at this considering there were two separate games last season when the stewards made an effort to get us to sit down (which failed). Can't comment on N but find it weird considering the emails the club sent about ignoring warnings and stewards where it doesn't exist. 

[1953]

4 minutes ago, ramrod said:

Shutting section N is a joke and a compete cop out by Ann and the club . 

They just need to make sure it's policed properly. 

A lazy way out that will cost the club money . 

 

They are trying to police it properly but it's quoted in a previous post that the stewards are either ignored or told to **** off. This all could have been avoided if the people who have seats in section N sat in them when asked then when the big games come around there's no room for interlopers who are the ones imo who throw flares etc. This would all have blown over eventually but it's now getting close to the section getting closed down because some can't apply some common sense. They think it's a personal attack on them when it's really an attempt to stop idiots throwing things that will injure or even kill somebody if it's not stopped.  

[ramrod]

10 minutes ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

Well if people would behave properly she wouldn't have to consider doing this 

Dreadful argument, like stopping a school trip for a class of kids because one or two can't behave . 

There are a lot of decent fans in section N who shouldn't be punished because of the half wits . 

Its the lazy option to close it .

[graygo]

19 minutes ago, weehammy said:

For the first time since he became DoF, his reappointment was opposed by a minority in show of hands.

 

It was 5 disgruntled fans/Levein haters.

[davemclaren]

27 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

The usual spin and smoke and mirrors I am afraid. "Offices" were always part of the project - in fact the temporary offices under the Wheatfield are now being retained and the cost of offices in the main stand saved. Similarly there was intended to be another Gorgie Suite type facility in the new stand but that has been dropped. I suspect Exhibition space and "syndicate rooms" cost less than fitting out offices and top of the range hospitality space. The retail outlet was surely always part of the new stand project.

Is the ‘exhibition space’ not replacing where the offices were meant to go? ??‍♂️

[graygo]

25 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Every ground in the UK has areas where the majority stand. In many grounds it involves far larger numbers (I estimate at east 20,000 at the recent North London derby). Why is Tynie different? Anyone in G or lower N who objects to people standing have had many opportunities to move seats and avoid the problem.

 

 

Ours is a new stand and doesn't have a full safety certificate yet.

 

How many times does this need pointed out?

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

26 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

But only home supporters, of course. 

Well it's home supporters our board responsible for because we've got data base for them ! Up to police and stewards to police away fans 

[soonbe110]

34 minutes ago, weehammy said:

For the first time since he became DoF, his reappointment was opposed by a minority in show of hands.

I counted three, could have been five or six though. So it was roughly 400-5 in favour of re-appointment. 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

16 minutes ago, ramrod said:

Dreadful argument, like stopping a school trip for a class of kids because one or two can't behave . 

There are a lot of decent fans in section N who shouldn't be punished because of the half wits . 

Its the lazy option to close it .

Agree the decent fans who behaving shouldn't have to suffer 

[soonbe110]

36 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

The usual spin and smoke and mirrors I am afraid. "Offices" were always part of the project - in fact the temporary offices under the Wheatfield are now being retained and the cost of offices in the main stand saved. Similarly there was intended to be another Gorgie Suite type facility in the new stand but that has been dropped. I suspect Exhibition space and "syndicate rooms" cost less than fitting out offices and top of the range hospitality space. The retail outlet was surely always part of the new stand project.

Time will tell if you or she is correct. 

[Selkirkhmfc1874]

1 minute ago, soonbe110 said:

I counted three, could have been five or six though. So it was roughly 400-5 in favour of re-appointment. 

Probably be more than that but they wouldn't put hands up because pointless when motion would pass anyway 

[soonbe110]

34 minutes ago, ramrod said:

Shutting section N is a joke and a compete cop out by Ann and the club . 

They just need to make sure it's policed properly. 

A lazy way out that will cost the club money . 

 

They explained why that is not easy nor inexpensive. Ever heard of corroboration? 

[Footballfirst]

1 hour ago, soonbe110 said:

Not sure that’s fair. The increased revenue the club is seeing is a result of the redevelopment project. Chicken and egg situation. 

 

48 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Don't you mean the increased cost of the redevelopment?

An increase which has still not been really explained?

 

And of course £3m of the £6.7m of "club resources" are also attributable to FoH funding).

 

I'm not sure that I have made myself clear.  My comment wasn't a meant to be criticism or a judgement on anything. All I noted, as an observation, was that the club has contributed £1.95m from its own resources towards the redevelopment programme in the last year, going by the AGM figures. If that is the case, then once the redevelopment programme is complete then that £1.95m should be available for other purposes, such as investment in the team.

 

It's a positive situation for the future, but I recognise the constraints that the current capital spending puts on investment in the team. It's something that I have posted about previously. That's why it is better for FOH funds to be spent on infrastructure projects that will provide a return on investment over several years, rather being invested directly in player transfers or salaries. If the player turns out to be a dud, then that is money down the drain.

[soonbe110]

34 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Every ground in the UK has areas where the majority stand. In many grounds it involves far larger numbers (I estimate at east 20,000 at the recent North London derby). Why is Tynie different? Anyone in G or lower N who objects to people standing have had many opportunities to move seats and avoid the problem.

 

Fans standing is a small part of the problem. What happens because fans are standing in that area is a problem. Flares, sectarian songs etc probably from fans who don’t have tickets for that section. Making everyone sit is a large part of making sure only those with tickets for that section are in that section. I’m not sure why this is difficult for people to understand. 

[mitch41]

I stand when we score. I stand when an incident happens in a corner because everyone else stands up. I stand up when the person in front of me stands up if they think a goal is going to be scored. Need I go on because I sit in section B in the  Wheatfield should my section be closed ?

Ann Budge is taking a sledge hammer to crack a nut.  

[Mikey1874]

Angry Levein haters out peddling