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Scottish independence and devolution superthread


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Ha ha depends .....if you apply it at the first mention of them which is by Alba gu brach( sp) then yes it does if you are getting at my point technically no as they aren't specifically mentioned

 

I'll ask a different way did the heroes of McRaes battalion go to war fighting for either Scotland or Great Britain or for Both ? Now I'm no expert there are far more clever and knowledgeable people than me on this subject but I'd guess it was for both which proves to me anyway you can be Scottish and British

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Exactly this!   I was thinking about the naysayers and then thought about WHY a movement would want to lead a nation into independence which would ultimately lead to financial ruin, expulsion from c

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The People's Chimp

Was a good turn out. Was there with the family. I'd say ten thousand.

 

Some unionists turned up from the BNP - about 3 fitba thugs with Union Jacks. That sums it up - a huge swathe of positive people marching for independence and the face of the out of date Union represented by the violence of some thick nazis.

 

Independence is the only option. All this nonsense about the 'British family of nations'?? Eh? Who wants to live with their ma past the age of 17?

Regardless of the pros/cons of independence this is a truly awful post for so many reasons.

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Has anyone yet answered why the match was led by the IRA supporting James Connolly society? It has all gone get quiet.

 

Yup, was pondering the very same thing, I wonder why it's all gone do quiet on that front??? :rolleyes:

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Has anyone yet answered why the match was led by the IRA supporting James Connolly society? It has all gone get quiet.

No idea. Wasn't there. I was at Tannadice.

 

Are you going to give a reason to stay in the union?

 

It's all gone get quiet right enough.

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http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/thousands-take-to-the-streets-of-edinburgh-for-pro-independence-1337817

 

Sounds and looks shite right enough. I'm sorry. Vive la union....

 

:cornette:

 

 

a positive report from a union loving red-top?!? :wtf:

 

Edited by Foxy Knoxy
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jambos are go!

No idea. Wasn't there. I was at Tannadice.

 

Are you going to give a reason to stay in the union?

The

It's all gone get quiet right enough.

The Union has majority support amongst the Scottish people. Support for independence even amongst the SNPs best years has levelled out around only 30%. The Union could not have a more powerful justification.

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Has anyone yet answered why the match was led by the IRA supporting James Connolly society? It has all gone get quiet.

 

Dinnae be a daftie. A handful of guys with a Connolly banner didn't lead the march. I did see yon SNP Transport Minister Keith Brown who if i'm right served in NI with the British Army. Go and raise the issue with him if you're so outraged.

 

The only violent numpties were the BNP kids that turned up. And even they wouldn't have been there if they'd only had a loving childhood and kent their father...

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Still no good reasons for the Union forthcoming.

 

Simply stating the facts that most Scots apparently aren't in favour of independence - yet - isn't acutally an argument for the Union.

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Aye, never though i'd see the Daily Rectum printing a positive view of an occasion like that.

 

One quote jumped out:

 

Many people attending the rally said they would not have supported independence a year ago but had changed their minds.

 

June Sutherland, 64, from Broxburn in West Lothian, said: "The reason for me changing my mind is the UK Government.

 

"They're shutting down all the air bases.

 

"Once they started hitting our soldiers and our airmen, that was enough for me.

 

"I didn't expect the turnout today. I'm proud to be here."

 

 

Strange that some here focus on fringe elements who happen to favour indpendence like Colin Fox or the Connolly lot.

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portobellojambo1

I was there, great day and positive atmosphere.

 

I await a bigger pro-union demo but won't hold my breath :rolleyes:

 

 

Interesting that yesterday's rally was inclusive of an association openly supportive of a terrorist body who thought the murder of Scottish soldiers was fully justified, are these the sort of people the Scottish Nationalists want to align themselves with and class such an alignment as positive and all encompassing.

Edited by portobellojambo1
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Aye, never though i'd see the Daily Rectum printing a positive view of an occasion like that.

 

One quote jumped out:

 

Many people attending the rally said they would not have supported independence a year ago but had changed their minds.

 

June Sutherland, 64, from Broxburn in West Lothian, said: "The reason for me changing my mind is the UK Government.

 

"They're shutting down all the air bases.

 

"Once they started hitting our soldiers and our airmen, that was enough for me.

 

"I didn't expect the turnout today. I'm proud to be here."

 

 

Strange that some here focus on fringe elements who happen to favour indpendence like Colin Fox or the Connolly lot.

and yet you focus on the fringe group that use the Union flag for their vile ideologies cant have it both ways

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jambos are go!

Still no good reasons for the Union forthcoming.

 

Simply stating the facts that most Scots apparently aren't in favour of independence - yet - isn't acutally an argument for the Union.

 

Maybe in a non democratic little world where not being in favour of independence is actually an arguement for independence may.In the real world is all that counts.

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Still no good reasons for the Union forthcoming.

 

The peoples of the world should be coming together not tearing apart from one another. Have a look at a map of Europe and you might see that the UK is a tiny island on the westerns side of the continent. Scotland is a small part of that island and would be much better off remaining in a Union of like minded, English speaking people who share the same democratic principles, monarchy, defence capabilities and broadly similar laws. Separatists have yet to make the case as to why we would be better off being alienated from the rest of the UK in this very small part of the world.

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The peoples of the world should be coming together not tearing apart from one another. Have a look at a map of Europe and you might see that the UK is a tiny island on the westerns side of the continent. Scotland is a small part of that island and would be much better off remaining in a Union of like minded, English speaking people who share the same democratic principles, monarchy, defence capabilities and broadly similar laws. Separatists have yet to make the case as to why we would be better off being alienated from the rest of the UK in this very small part of the world.

 

As alienated as the dutch are to the Belgians? It would be a bit harsh of the other nations on this island to alienate us.

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Interesting that yesterday's rally was inclusive of an association openly supportive of a terrorist body who thought the murder of Scottish soldiers was fully justified, are these the sort of people the Scottish Nationalists want to align themselves with and class such an alignment as positive and all encompassing.

 

One countries terrorist is another countries freedom fighter , depends on your point of view really !

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Personally think independence was inevitable the moment the snp broke the back of the core labour support in Scotland , when the time is right it will happen and the Scottish people will wonder why they clung to the bosom of mother England for so long !

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We won't have an army !!!!!!!

 

On a separate question if this was either 1914 or 1939 would Colin fox been for or against going to war ?

 

 

Why wouldn't an independent Scotland have an army? Smaller countries than ours have military forces appropriate to their size.

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Know what will be a sight? The border the day after Independence. Seeing thousands of negative roasters who hold this country back getting the **** out of there so another people can continue to wipe their soiled backsides for them. Tear to a glass eye material, likes.

 

:glorious:

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and yet you focus on the fringe group that use the Union flag for their vile ideologies cant have it both ways

yep some vile organisations use the saltire

 

aasdl.jpg

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Interesting that yesterday's rally was inclusive of an association openly supportive of a terrorist body who thought the murder of Scottish soldiers was fully justified, are these the sort of people the Scottish Nationalists want to align themselves with and class such an alignment as positive and all encompassing.

 

 

Do they actually support the IRA? I don't know much about them, apart from the fact they have an annual march, but a quick scan of their website this morning suggests they are a socialist repuplican group which you might not agree with but isn't illegal.

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Does anyone see the irony of people wanting independence from the rest of the United Kingdom, with the inevitability that this will result in ever more control of our daily lives from Europe? According to the SNP, Scottish public opinion is moving more and more towards independence at the same time as the EU is moving closer and closer to integration.

 

So when we have our nirvana, will we be as independent as Ireland who, when they vote "no" in referendums are simply instructed to have another vote until they say "yes"?

 

Until someone can persuade me that a Scotland separated from the rest of the UK will be able to stand up for itself against the interests of Germany, France and the UK (for these are the countries that determine everything that happens in the EU), then independence is just a crock of shit.

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Aye, never though i'd see the Daily Rectum printing a positive view of an occasion like that.

 

One quote jumped out:

 

Many people attending the rally said they would not have supported independence a year ago but had changed their minds.

 

June Sutherland, 64, from Broxburn in West Lothian, said: "The reason for me changing my mind is the UK Government.

 

"They're shutting down all the air bases.

 

"Once they started hitting our soldiers and our airmen, that was enough for me.

 

"I didn't expect the turnout today. I'm proud to be here."

 

 

Strange that some here focus on fringe elements who happen to favour indpendence like Colin Fox or the Connolly lot.

 

The quote above is from my cousins mother-in-law.

 

She says she changed her mind because of the air bases etc.

 

Does this mean there will be a prominent army and air force funded by an independant Scotland if the SNP get their way?

 

If not surely Mrs Sutherlands comments are null and void.

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Got any for pulling out of it? Genuine question. Citing examples of small countries who cope is not a reason by the way.

 

 

No, I have not.

 

The partnership with England has been good for Scotland.

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The quote above is from my cousins mother-in-law.

 

She says she changed her mind because of the air bases etc.

 

Does this mean there will be a prominent army and air force funded by an independant Scotland if the SNP get their way?

 

If not surely Mrs Sutherlands comments are null and void.

 

Of course it will. Remember that the first rule of being a politician is to make sure that you have promised enough things to enough people to ensure you get the result you want. After that, you can make a decision about which of the fanciful dreams can be discarded.

Edited by Jambo66
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Of course it will. Remember that the first rule of being a politician is to make sure that you have promised enough things to enough people to ensure you get the result you want. After that, you can make a decision about which of the fanciful dreams can be discarded.

 

 

But surely in this case there is one aim of all these people which is to get independence. After that there would be elections and the party, or parties, in power can then do what they want. On that basis any pre independence policies can hardly be guaranteed.

Edited by davemclaren
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But surely in this case there is one aim of all these people which is to get independence. After that there would be elections and the party, or parties, in power can then do what they want. On that basis any pre independence policies can hardly be guaranteed.

 

Exactly, so someone saying that they have changed their mind because an air base is being closed is hardly making a balanced judgement on whether or not independence is a good thing. If I were a politician supporting independence, I would play on exactly this kind of thing and promise to keep the air base open. After all, we have all this oil and gas, so we will be an incredibly wealthy country after independence. Clearly, we will be able to afford to keep an air base open. Just look at Norway. Norway is a wonderful example of what a small independent country can do. (We don't include Ireland and Iceland in these comparisons any more, since they screwed up)

 

Of course, Norway really is independent since it's not a member of the EU. Maybe, just maybe, the sort of thinking that means that Norway has stayed out of the EU is the sort of thinking that helps to make it a wealthy and independent country. The equivalent small countries in the EU are no more independent than Scotland is right now. Sure they have a seat at the table, but they are still obliged to do what the big boys in the playground tell them to do - especially now.

Edited by Jambo66
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Interesting that yesterday's rally was inclusive of an association openly supportive of a terrorist body who thought the murder of Scottish soldiers was fully justified, are these the sort of people the Scottish Nationalists want to align themselves with and class such an alignment as positive and all encompassing.

As opposed to the British Government who have never done anything bad to Scotland. Ever.

 

Right you are.

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jambos are go!

Why woduldn't an independent Scotland have an army? Smaller countries than ours have military forces appropriate to their size.

In a sense it will have two armies given the SNP wantt the British Army, Navy and Air Force to remain at their bases here. You couldnae make it up.

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Please keep to the topic.

 

Make it personal once, and you'll lose whatever time and effort you put into typing. Make it personal a second time, and I'll see to it that the m0dzor5 are set on you.

 

 

Love and hugs,

 

Ulysses

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In a sense it will have two armies given the SNP wantt the British Army, Navy and Air Force to remain at their bases here. You couldnae make it up.

 

 

You could, given there are still plenty US Military bases in the UK. That's what allies do is it not?

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Marching alongside the James Conolly society? Aye OK then.

 

:muggy:

 

 

Connolly himself was an influential marxist and republcan. No idea about this society though.

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jambos are go!

You could, given there are still plenty US Military bases in the UK. That's what allies do is it not?

That exceed the number of British Forces here? Methinks not. And the UK and US are members of Nato. Official SNP policy is to withdraw is it not?

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Connolly himself was an influential marxist and republcan. No idea about this society though.

 

Irish Republican Socialist = INLA = horrible murdering terrorist scum.

 

If that's the kind of folk they want to be affiliated with then fair enough.

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Referring to the Westminster Government, Mr Salmond said to cheers and applause: "Why should they choose austerity when we want to choose to invest in the future?

 

 

That'll do me. Only way out of recession is capital project spending, job creation and a growing workforce. Couple that with lower corporation and income taxes? Have the north of England changing allegiances come Independence Day

 

:verysmug:

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What about them? I don't know what you're referring to.

 

 

Then you need to do some research instead of jumping on somebody else's bandwagon.

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Then you need to do some research instead of jumping on somebody else's bandwagon.

 

This thread isn't about Labour though is it? :lol:

 

In any case I'm not a Labour supporter so I don't really know how it's relevant in any way.

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That exceed the number of British Forces here? Methinks not. And the UK and US are members of Nato. Official SNP policy is to withdraw is it not?

 

You'll have to show me the numbers re remaining UK forces against any Scottish military as I don't have them, do you have link?

 

SNP policy is to withdraw from NATO but that might change. Anyway, as I keep mentioning there is no guarantee that the SNP would remain as a viable party and/or be in power post any independence

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Irish Republican Socialist = INLA = horrible murdering terrorist scum.

 

If that's the kind of folk they want to be affiliated with then fair enough.

 

It is out of order. It will put a lot of people off voting for them.

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This thread isn't about Labour though is it? :lol:

 

In any case I'm not a Labour supporter so I don't really know how it's relevant in any way.

 

 

The James Connolly Society is a group looking to unify Ireland. Is it directly linked with terrorism? With branches in Scotland, Ireland, Canada, USA...all terrorists? It would seem rather unlikely.

 

It would appear on this basis however, anybody and any country that chose to remove itself from British colonial rule were in fact terrorists....USA, Canada, Australia, India, and many, many more besides.

 

Wallace monument? Obviously a totem to terrorism. Aye, right yeh are.

Edited by Das Root
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Irish Republican Socialist = INLA = horrible murdering terrorist scum.

 

If that's the kind of folk they want to be affiliated with then fair enough.

 

 

I don't think the irish Republican Socialist party were matching in Edinburgh yesterday but, as I was at Tannadice, I can't be totally sure.

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Italian Lambretta

Dave, i think you know the answer to that question im surprised you had to ask it. :rolleyes:

 

 

Do they actually support the IRA? I don't know much about them, apart from the fact they have an annual march, but a quick scan of their website this morning suggests they are a socialist repuplican group which you might not agree with but isn't illegal.

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Dave, i think you know the answer to that question im surprised you had to ask it. :rolleyes:

 

 

I actually don't know the answer to that question. I would assume that some of their members will but do they officially support it?

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