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Zaliukas dropped by Vlad..JJ not happy


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shaun.lawson

But we've not being "doing well" since January. If "doing well" was the hanging offence all hell should have broken loose after our run of 31 points out of 33.

 

3rd place still equals doing well. And both Kello and, for the most part, Zal, have done very well. So what either have done to deserve such treatment - whatever the treatment is, and whoever's meted it out to them - we can only speculate on.

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Clerry Jambo

How can he go though? No-one has the money to make that happen. :ninja:

 

Dave - stuff Romanov I have had it with this guy, he has no ambition for Hearts what so ever.

 

I am very much in the minority on here but hey , who gives a donald :ninja:

 

More importantly we have a team/squad that has a decent platform to progress and at least confirm our 3rd place status

 

We need a football man at the very top, unfortunately we have a dope!!

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shaun.lawson

Would be a disaster if JJ decides he has had enough and quits. I could imagine would be the straw that breaks the camels back for many fans.

 

Nothing whatsoever in his post-match interview suggested he's anywhere near that point. And unfortunately, that this is his dream (and last) job at a club he loves so much it hurts will be used against him by his boss; who has previous for pushing the manager as far as he can as part of a "what can I do to break him?" game.

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Victorian

for my money the only way JJ will leave hearts is if vlad really does want him out. if he does then he will force him out with some really bad interference. if it's just periodical vlad interference then i have every confidence that JJ will ride it out.

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Clerry Jambo

for my money the only way JJ will leave hearts is if vlad really does want him out. if he does then he will force him out with some really bad interference. if it's just periodical vlad interference then i have every confidence that JJ will ride it out.

 

So thats OK then....god almighty :verymad:

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Victorian

So thats OK then....god almighty :verymad:

 

if you can show me where i said it was ok then i will give you the time of day CJ. until such time you remain a clueless individual of epic proportions.

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the general

for my money the only way JJ will leave hearts is if vlad really does want him out. if he does then he will force him out with some really bad interference. if it's just periodical vlad interference then i have every confidence that JJ will ride it out.

Hmmm the next week is very crucial

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Victorian

Hmmm the next week is very crucial

 

general, you know your stuff. you are spot on. if the end game is to make JJ walk then he will be made to walk. nothing surer.

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Clerry Jambo

if you can show me where i said it was ok then i will give you the time of day CJ. until such time you remain a clueless individual of epic proportions.

 

i maybe clueless but certainly not obsessed by the man at the top :thumbsup:

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Fort Vallance

vlad must go end off

Good shout. And take the ground and the 30 mill debt with him.

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Seems like a huge overreaction here from many posters tbh. Something that DH was crucified by many for a couple of weeks ago!

 

1. We don't know for sure if Zal has been dropped by Vlad.

 

2. If he has, we don't if it is justified.

 

3. We don't know if JJ is unhappy or not.

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shaun.lawson

Seems like a huge overreaction here from many posters tbh. Something that DH was crucified by many for a couple of weeks ago!

 

1. We don't know for sure if Zal has been dropped by Vlad.

 

2. If he has, we don't if it is justified.

 

3. We don't know if JJ is unhappy or not.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/may/07/rangers-hearts-spl?CMP=twt_gu

 

Read it and weep. :down:

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there will be no coherent argument as to how vlad will go and hearts survive. all you will get is utter mumbo-jumbo rhetoric and no alternative plan.

 

 

i don't know the full and true story of what has happened. just like everyone else. i do suspect that there has been some interference and it's not a good thing.

 

one thing that always comes to mind is that this has been happening for quite a while now therefore people have had time to get used to it.

 

this is our lot in life. i don't like it but i am one of life's realists.

 

 

for my money the only way JJ will leave hearts is if vlad really does want him out. if he does then he will force him out with some really bad interference. if it's just periodical vlad interference then i have every confidence that JJ will ride it out.

 

Dont need to post anything else. Spot on and we're not the only club that's in this situation, its just in Scotland it's not as heard off due to the lack of overseas and large investors.

 

I'd also have expected JJ to have half expected this.

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Victor Meldrew

It's the cry of an angry, frustrated, helpless supporter. Vlad is our blessing and our curse; we're stuck with him, and along with the good goes plenty of bad. So naturally, people get frustrated and lash out - it's called passion. The alternative is apathy and resigned detachment.

 

No, the alternative is realism. There are plenty of us who dislike what Vlad does, but calling for him to go in the current circumstances is utterly futile.

 

Can I just check, are you implying that I am somehow apathetic and detatched, and lacking passion for HMFC?

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Teuchterjambo

Sorry but I am not just going to believe everything that's posted because "that's how Vlad is". The whole Sun-based "Vlad insists Hartley signs Riccarton Three disclaimer" story which ran endlessly on here (and I suspect many still believe) proved to be utter crap.

 

Ewen Murray is however a decent source which makes me believe there is something in this story. Why JJ went to such inordinate lengths to cover up the Kello case, why Zal having signed a contract should again be in the dog house, why JJ (who presumably has a job description which includes responsibility for picking the team) hasn't simply said "no" to Vlad and damn the consequences remain a bit of a mystery to me. I look forward to my little grey cells being unscrambled on these points.

 

I wasn't saying that you had to accept everything FA , of course there is a lot of crap posted that is obvious crap but what really nips my nips is people asking for verification and sources as a put down to anything they don't like. I can't be bothered trawling through posts to verify this but I'll bet those that demand sources only do so when it is contrary to what they believe - i'm sure they don't demand sources for posts that fit their own agenda. It is like a defence mechanism - if they don't want to believe something then it is not true if there is no verified source.

 

 

 

hat situation right now but wants to see us over the line for 3rd place first or maybe he is just working his tiicket on his last job before retiring but I doubt that. I think that if there is no resolution to the current issues soon then I think the big man will blow, I think he is too big a man to sit back and take this and when it comes to the crunch he will act in the best interest of the club - after all he is one of us and he will be feeling what we are feeling.

That's about all the assistance I can give with the grey cell unscrambling but I doubt that you fall into the category of needing it tbh.

 

:thumbsup:

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shaun.lawson

Excuse me for being daft, but could you point me to the section on that article where any of those three are confirmed.

 

Ta.

 

Ewan's not just made that up. That's obvious from him failing to add the rider "is understood...", which journalists use in order to cover themselves when they're going on speculation.

 

You might like to check Ryan McGowan's twitter too.

 

No, the alternative is realism. There are plenty of us who dislike what Vlad does, but calling for him to go in the current circumstances is utterly futile.

 

Can I just check, are you implying that I am somehow apathetic and detatched, and lacking passion for HMFC?

 

You? No. But there are tons of Hearts fans out there who love the club as much as you do, but feel very apathetic and detached - even with us 3rd and, in all likelihood, heading for Europe. That's a consequence of having a foreign owner who lives remotely and doesn't have the same emotional ties to the club as the fans; it's also a consequence of said owner being simultaneously untouchable, and a complete radgepot.

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portobellojambo1

Excuse me for being daft, but could you point me to the section on that article where any of those three are confirmed.

 

Ta.

 

It's all there on the page BH, and it ain't bullshit, unless you think the Lithuanian with the name Romanov was just some random punter sitting in a Kaunas pub, who just happened to have that surname.

 

If it was bullshit Ewan wouldn't have stuck it in his match article.

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bighusref

Ewan's not just made that up. You might like to check Ryan McGowan's twitter too.

 

Is there anything on McGowan's twitter that hasn't been posted on here? I read the bit on here about something that happened before the match but have not heard of anything else.

 

Jim Jefferies, in his post match interview said that Wallace, Webster, Zaliukas, Thomson was to be his team but they had to pull out before hand. He didn't stipulate if Webster or Wallace were injured either, does that mean that Romanov pulled them out.

 

As for what is written by Ewan, neither you nor I know the guy or what he knows.

 

I'll ask again, can you provide me with confirmation that any of the Teacher's three points have been proven either way?

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davemclaren

It's all there on the page BH, and it ain't bullshit, unless you think the Lithuanian with the name Romanov was just some random punter sitting in a Kaunas pub, who just happened to have that surname.

 

If it was bullshit Ewan wouldn't have stuck it in his match article.

 

 

I totally accept what Ewan has printed. That's our reality I'm afraid and I really don't think there is much we can do about it until there is some realistic alternative to 'the radge', as Shaun describes our esteemed leader.

 

SOH got us out of jail by stumbling across VR. Can we pull off a trick like that again? :ninja:

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bighusref

It's all there on the page BH, and it ain't bullshit, unless you think the Lithuanian with the name Romanov was just some random punter sitting in a Kaunas pub, who just happened to have that surname.

 

If it was bullshit Ewan wouldn't have stuck it in his match article.

 

I'm sorry, but I will wait to hear from our club before making my mind up.

 

On a day where people have been rejoicing that a newspaper has been put on the naughty step, it is a little ironic that we take everything said by another as gospel.

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Look it's obvious -- Vlad wants Rangers to win the league so he 'rests' some of our players.

 

Now for the conspiracy theories from the East End of Glasgow -- this theory will grow wings :teehee:

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Clerry Jambo

IF JJ has pulled players because Romanov has deemed so, do we accept JJ is a puppet similar to his previous incumbents?

 

If so am very dissapointed in JJ

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shaun.lawson

Is there anything on McGowan's twitter that hasn't been posted on here? I read the bit on here about something that happened before the match but have not heard of anything else.

 

Jim Jefferies, in his post match interview said that Wallace, Webster, Zaliukas, Thomson was to be his team but they had to pull out before hand. He didn't stipulate if Webster or Wallace were injured either, does that mean that Romanov pulled them out.

 

As for what is written by Ewan, neither you nor I know the guy or what he knows.

 

I'll ask again, can you provide me with confirmation that any of the Teacher's three points have been proven either way?

 

And what do you think McGowan might've been referring to there? :whistling:

 

Zaliukas was described before the game as being "unavailable". Eh? And if you're looking for cast iron, "it's a fair cop, guv" proof, you'll never get any - because the manager would be in breach of contract if he told the truth about something like this.

 

I'm going to ask you: have you not found it unbelievably bizarre for our best player, a fan's favourite, and someone we've lauded as the new Niemi, to have just vanished off the face of the earth over recent weeks? I know you have; and I know you're just as concerned by whatever's gone down today.

 

I'll say again: Ewan Murray has not just made that stuff up. You can always tell when a journalist is on to something, especially in a reputable publication: look at the language they use.

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Victorian

i don't think that ewan murray should be dismissed as a trouble maker or a liar.

 

it's what you do with the words he said that's the important thing.

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There is obviously something dodgy going on with Kello and Zal. I believe all is not good!!

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bighusref

And what do you think McGowan might've been referring to there? :whistling:

 

Zaliukas was described before the game as being "unavailable". Eh? And if you're looking for cast iron, "it's a fair cop, guv" proof, you'll never get any - because the manager would be in breach of contract if he told the truth about something like this.

 

I'm going to ask you: have you not found it unbelievably bizarre for our best player, a fan's favourite, and someone we've lauded as the new Niemi, to have just vanished off the face of the earth over recent weeks? I know you have; and I know you're just as concerned by whatever's gone down today.

 

I'll say again: Ewan Murray has not just made that stuff up. You can always tell when a journalist is on to something, especially in a reputable publication: look at the language they use.

 

You could have abbreviated the above to ...

 

In answer to your question, which I avoided last time, no, we have not yet received confirmation that....

  • Zaliukas has been dropped by Romanov.
  • The reason for the dropping was completely unjustified.
  • We KNOW Jefferies is unhappy.

In future, I shall try to look at the question and answer it, not what I want the question to be.

 

I love you BH.thumbsup.gif

 

xxxx

 

 

;)

 

Your post absolutely confirms that you are guessing ( "Oooooh!!!! What ELSE could Gowser mean? It MUST MEAN WE ARE GOING TO DIE!!!!!!!!!!!" ) and getting angry ahead of any confirmation. What if it turns out that Zaliukas has been the subject of a ?4 Million pound bid, which has been accepted but the club refused permission for him to play? Would that make all of this hand wringing look a bit silly? Of course, I don't know if that is remotely true (surely no club would be that stupid) but I'll reserve my anger and ire until I know what my club or my manager tells me.

 

ALL I am saying, and find it incredibly bizarre as to how far off the edge some have jumped, is that whatever we think has happened has not been confirmed yet. We need to, collectively, cool our jets.

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portobellojambo1

I'm sorry, but I will wait to hear from our club before making my mind up.

 

On a day where people have been rejoicing that a newspaper has been put on the naughty step, it is a little ironic that we take everything said by another as gospel.

 

I'm guessing you don't know who Ewan Murray is BH. I do, I know him personally, S/T holder at Tynecastle, huge Hearts fan, and he would not print lies about his own club, I can assure you of that. This hasn't been thrown together by some West Coast reporter with an agenda.

 

Where I agree with you is that he doesn't say why Zaliukas was left out today, because this is the part no one knows. It is unclear if it is discipilnary or if indeed it is because an offer has been made and accepted or is in the process of being accepted.

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bighusref

i don't think that ewan murray should be dismissed as a trouble maker or a liar.

 

it's what you do with the words he said that's the important thing.

 

I don;'t believe he is either. FWIW, a guy I know is good mates with him and I have nothing against the lad. However, with the greatest of will in the world, it is possible he has got it wrong. Either way, I will wait until we hear from the club.

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Our manager is far from happy! Fact as you regulars say

 

The bit that gets to me is that anybody is still surprised, least of all JJ. He may be a grump but he's certainly not stupid and knew what he was signing up to. Ewan Murray's comments are accurate.

 

Vlad owns us lock, stock and barrell and every now and again feels the need to remind us of that fact. He will move on soon and concentrate on basketball or something.

 

For those of you who are still undecided then let me be clear, without Vlad there is no Hearts and I accepted this a couple of years ago. Sad but true.

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Jambothroughandthrough

I'm not aware if any of the media conference after the game has been made public yet but I was at it and interviewed JJ and he was angry a very frustrated. He said (paraphrasing) that all week he'd been working on a back four that featured Wallace, Webster and Zal.

 

After yesterday's training session Wallace and Webster suffered setback and he had to change his plan and that still included Zal.

 

The decision for Zal not to be played was made this morning before getting on the team bus.

 

He refused to explian why he'd been dropped but his answer and angry response suggested he wasn't happy. When asked if Zal will be available for Wednesday he said 'I don't know'.

 

That's the jist of the media conference but all quotes will be in the papers in the morning.

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bighusref

I'm guessing you don't know who Ewan Murray is BH. I do, I know him personally, S/T holder at Tynecastle, huge Hearts fan, and he would not print lies about his own club, I can assure you of that. This hasn't been thrown together by some West Coast reporter with an agenda.

 

You are guessing wrong PJ1 (see post above)

 

Let's just wait before getting our pitch forks out.

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Victorian

I don;'t believe he is either. FWIW, a guy I know is good mates with him and I have nothing against the lad. However, with the greatest of will in the world, it is possible he has got it wrong. Either way, I will wait until we hear from the club.

 

indeed. this is also my position, more or less.

 

there appears to be something going on but it could very well be somewhere between 1 - 100 on the vlad-meddle-o-meter.

 

i wont even guess where.

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bighalders

The team selections at all top clubs in Scotland and England are regularly made by the clubs owners, Fergie, Smith, Wenger, Lennon etc are always in the press moaning that their top players have been dropped at the last minute by the owner.........oh no wait it's only Hearts cos we are still run by ERSE and for some unknown reason many on here still support ERSE which I find weird at best.

 

How anyone can still defend ERSE is beyond me.

 

We were already short of many 1st team regulars yet ERSE thought I know whats best for Hearts I'll make JJ drop a couple more, great leading by ERSE yet again. I love Vlad, all hail Vlad...........NOT

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The Merse

I can't understand the attitude of "lets see what the club has to say."

 

As far as I can recall the club has never openly talked about the interference.

 

So why would that change now?

 

It is happening.

 

Of that there can be little doubt.

 

We could soon be very much back to square one.

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Clerry Jambo

The team selections at all top clubs in Scotland and England are regularly made by the clubs owners, Fergie, Smith, Wenger, Lennon etc are always in the press moaning that their top players have been dropped at the last minute by the owner.........oh no wait it's only Hearts cos we are still run by ERSE and for some unknown reason many on here still support ERSE which I find weird at best.

 

How anyone can still defend ERSE is beyond me.

 

We were already short of many 1st team regulars yet ERSE thought I know whats best for Hearts I'll make JJ drop a couple more, great leading by ERSE yet again. I love Vlad, all hail Vlad...........NOT

 

But but but but ach, yir right BigH :thumbsup:

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I can't understand the attitude of "lets see what the club has to say."

 

As far as I can recall the club has never openly talked about the interference.

 

So why would that change now?

 

It is happening.

 

Of that there can be little doubt.

 

We could soon be very much back to square one.

 

This

 

And thanks to the decisions of Romanov we basically handicapped ourselves ahead of a trip to Ibrox

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shaun.lawson

You could have abbreviated the above to ...

 

 

 

 

;)

 

Your post absolutely confirms that you are guessing ( "Oooooh!!!! What ELSE could Gowser mean? It MUST MEAN WE ARE GOING TO DIE!!!!!!!!!!!" ) and getting angry ahead of any confirmation. What if it turns out that Zaliukas has been the subject of a ?4 Million pound bid, which has been accepted but the club refused permission for him to play? Would that make all of this hand wringing look a bit silly? Of course, I don't know if that is remotely true (surely no club would be that stupid) but I'll reserve my anger and ire until I know what my club or my manager tells me.

 

ALL I am saying, and find it incredibly bizarre as to how far off the edge some have jumped, is that whatever we think has happened has not been confirmed yet. We need to, collectively, cool our jets.

 

 

I don;'t believe he is either. FWIW, a guy I know is good mates with him and I have nothing against the lad. However, with the greatest of will in the world, it is possible he has got it wrong. Either way, I will wait until we hear from the club.

 

But - you cheeky wee scamp - there's an obvious sidelight to the above. If Vlad has interfered, Jim Jefferies isn't about to say so - because he'd be in breach of contract if he did, and also because any hope he has of sorting it out is in private, behind the scenes. Meaning if you take what the club says as gospel, it's very naive.

 

You are guessing wrong PJ1 (see post above)

 

 

 

Hang on, have I got this right?

 

Our manager gives a post-match press conference. One of the journalists attending writes for The Guardian and is liked by us. Another works for Real Radio and is loathed by us. So when both go away afterwards and report much the same thing, you dismiss it as potentially "thrown together by a West coast reporter with an agenda"?

 

:what:

 

On that basis, you may as well dismiss all future news stories about anything whenever someone you don't like repeats something that his colleagues are already reporting. :blink:

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shaun.lawson

I can't understand the attitude of "lets see what the club has to say."

 

As far as I can recall the club has never openly talked about the interference.

 

So why would that change now?

It is happening.

 

Of that there can be little doubt.

 

We could soon be very much back to square one.

 

Bingo. :thumbsup:

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We're all moaning about what's happened... Quite rightly so.. We're annoyed. We should maybe think about why it's happened.

 

Does any one think Vladimir could have a good reason to do what he is doing... Would they be happy if he was trying to sell the players and didn't want to risk the possible investment?

 

Just looking for people's opinions? Hey may believe 3rd is secure, if we do lose it then I believe jj's neck could be on the line.

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bighusref

I can't understand the attitude of "lets see what the club has to say."

 

As far as I can recall the club has never openly talked about the interference.

 

So why would that change now?

 

It is happening.

 

Of that there can be little doubt.

 

We could soon be very much back to square one.

 

Your memory is flawed. It has been discussed by pretty much every manager since Romanov's arrival. I can only assume that you fail to recollect the comments made by Jefferies little more than a few weeks ago about Kello, Jefferies comments about Zaliukas prior to him signing his new contract, Jefferies comments about Goncalves.... should I go on?

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Oi,whats the matter with the Pans?

well rudi, got to agree with you on this one maybe he originates from hawkhill, lochend, or easter road

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The Merse

Your memory is flawed. It has been discussed by pretty much every manager since Romanov's arrival. I can only assume that you fail to recollect the comments made by Jefferies little more than a few weeks ago about Kello, Jefferies comments about Zaliukas prior to him signing his new contract, Jefferies comments about Goncalves.... should I go on?

 

Deary me.

 

You think that was them being open and up front about what was going on? Seriously?

 

Who from the club are you expecting to come out and talk about it exactly? If Jefferies gives anything more than a cursory mention to whats really going on he'll be out on his arse.

 

And we're never going to get anything official from boardroom level.

 

Ewan Murray would not just trot this line out in the national press unless he was sure. He's a Hearts fan and would not want to stir the shit without good reason.

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bighusref

But - you cheeky wee scamp - there's an obvious sidelight to the above. If Vlad has interfered, Jim Jefferies isn't about to say so - because he'd be in breach of contract if he did, and also because any hope he has of sorting it out is in private, behind the scenes. Meaning if you take what the club says as gospel, it's very naive.

 

Naive? Is the person believing something blithely without confirmation really suggesting naivete from the guy who is waiting to hear the facts? Whilst I have no issue with Murray, are you really saying that Jefferies is less reliable than him?

 

Also, is it in Jefferies contract that he cannot comment on Romanov removing a player for selection? Do we know this for sure? If so, it's a new clause that I'd suggest wasn't in previous managers contracts, otherwise why would they comment on team selection and who decides.

 

Hang on, have I got this right?

 

Our manager gives a post-match press conference. One of the journalists attending writes for The Guardian and is liked by us. Another works for Real Radio and is loathed by us. So when both go away afterwards and report much the same thing, you dismiss it as potentially "thrown together by a West coast reporter with an agenda"?

 

:what:

 

EH? I think you need to re-read my post to see where I suggested that was ever the case.

 

 

On that basis, you may as well dismiss all future news stories about anything whenever someone you don't like repeats something that his colleagues are already reporting. :blink:

 

Far from it. What has happened in this case is that something has been written by a Hearts fan and we instantly overreact. I, like all people, have my opinion, but, as noted above (something that you seem to have missed as regularly as The Merse) I fully believe that Jefferies will comment, much like Robertson, Burley, Frail, Laszlo and Jefferies himself has done. Again, PJ1 and yourself seemed to suggest that confirmation had been made, in The Guardian. I merely refute that such reporting is confirmation.

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bighusref

Deary me.

 

You think that was them being open and up front about what was going on? Seriously?

 

Who from the club are you expecting to come out and talk about it exactly? If Jefferies gives anything more than a cursory mention to whats really going on he'll be out on his arse.

 

And we're never going to get anything official from boardroom level.

 

Ewan Murray would not just trot this line out in the national press unless he was sure. He's a Hearts fan and would not want to stir the shit without good reason.

 

Why wasn't Jefferies sacked when he spoke about the above noted players then?

 

Obviously, Jefferies isn't as big a Hearts fan as Jefferies.

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shaun.lawson

Naive? Is the person believing something blithely without confirmation really suggesting naivete from the guy who is waiting to hear the facts? Whilst I have no issue with Murray, are you really saying that Jefferies is less reliable than him?

 

Also, is it in Jefferies contract that he cannot comment on Romanov removing a player for selection? Do we know this for sure? If so, it's a new clause that I'd suggest wasn't in previous managers contracts, otherwise why would they comment on team selection and who decides.

 

 

 

EH? I think you need to re-read my post to see where I suggested that was ever the case.

 

 

 

 

Far from it. What has happened in this case is that something has been written by a Hearts fan and we instantly overreact. I, like all people, have my opinion, but, as noted above (something that you seem to have missed as regularly as The Merse) I fully believe that Jefferies will comment, much like Robertson, Burley, Frail, Laszlo and Jefferies himself has done. Again, PJ1 and yourself seemed to suggest that confirmation had been made, in The Guardian. I merely refute that such reporting is confirmation.

 

All of which means we've reached a stalemate:

 

Your position, of not accepting anything without 100% confirmation, is perfectly fair enough;

 

My position, that you'll never get 100% confirmation on a story like this, is also fair enough.

 

Incidentally, to answer one of your questions above: I am saying that Murray is potentially more reliable than JJ, in certain circumstances. That is to say, circumstances which, were they revealed by Jim, would compromise his team and his job.

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The Merse

Why wasn't Jefferies sacked when he spoke about the above noted players then?

 

Obviously, Jefferies isn't as big a Hearts fan as Jefferies.

 

Because he didn't tell us anything.

 

Edit:

 

Not sure what you mean by the second line?

 

FWIW I think the interference is bogging JJ down big time, but being as big a Hearts fan as he so obviously is, he is trying to work through this as he probably doesn't want to think of what would happen should he resign/be sacked.

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