Israel and Palestine

[Malinga the Swinga]

4 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

What about the ones who glorify in innocent civilians being killed that are part of the crowd?

C'mon now, get with the programm, Israeli innocent civilians don't count, just the Hamas voting Palestinians.

[JudyJudyJudy]

11 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Article by the founder of left wing Momentum 

Jon Lansman: what the left gets wrong about Israel

The Momentum founder on his kibbutznik past, how progressives should respond to anti-Semitism and Jeremy Corbyn’s mistakes.

By George Eaton

 

Jon Lansman was 16 when he first visited Israel in 1973 and worked on the Sde Boker kibbutz in the Negev, the desert region in the country’s south.

“I was living in basically a shed with around 30 other people about a hundred yards from [Israel’s founding prime minister, David] Ben-Gurion’s house, picking peaches and pistachios,” the lifelong socialist recalled when we met recently. “That was a radicalising experience, doing manual labour. I was enthused by the collectivism, though it was clearly being eroded.”

This experience – Lansman’s aunt lived in Be’er-Sheva and he has five cousins in Israel today – means he can offer a rare perspective on the left’s fraught relationship with the country.

 

I met Lansman, who founded the Corbynite activist group Momentum in 2015 and led it until 2020, at his partner’s townhouse in Highbury, north London. We spoke in his study, which features a 4-foot-high red statue of Karl Marx, a Gilbert & George print (“Are you angry or are you boring?”) and a mini-library devoted to Labour history. Lansman, 66, who divides his time between London and his home in St Ives, Cornwall, appeared relaxed after several years away from the political front line, but he has been troubled by the left’s response to Hamas’s 7 October massacre in Israel.

“Most of all I feel sorrow and I find it difficult to relate to how much of the left responded,” Lansman, who was raised in an Orthodox Jewish family in north London, told me. “There isn’t an understanding, or there isn’t much sympathy, for the feeling in Israel that they need to prevent such an attack again. And part of that is about how the left sees war, or in fact how all of us in Britain have seen war for a long time. We’ve seen a lot of unjust wars, Iraq most importantly.

 

 

“There isn’t an understanding that there could be a just military response to horrific events. It’s difficult for the left to adjust to that but I do think that it needs to adjust. I think that some level of response by Israel is justified – not all of it, by any means: I am horrified by the extent of civilian deaths in Gaza.”

But in common with another Jewish socialist, the US senator Bernie Sanders, Lansman is wary of supporting an outright ceasefire in Gaza. “I want to see the violence stop as soon as possible… but calling for a ceasefire from the comfort of Britain? I can understand that Israelis need to ensure such attacks [by Hamas] don’t happen again.” The left, he said, “absolutely” needs to demonstrate greater empathy towards Jews and criticised the popular protest chant: “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free.”

“The language you use at times when there are emotionally driven responses to violence on both sides matters. The Jewish community in Britain, understandably, sees the phrase ‘from the river to the sea’ as an attack on Israel’s existence, people should understand that. Why not find another phrase?”

Lansman similarly rejects the description by some leftists of Israel as a “settler colonial state”.

 

“It’s not a characterisation I would make at all. Most Jews who’ve migrated to Israel have been refugees, they’ve been arriving recently from Ukraine. The reason for Israel’s existence is the Holocaust, the fact that no other place would take them! Not Britain, not the US, who introduced immigration controls.

“In Britain’s case it was ironically [Arthur] Balfour, who’s treated as if he’s some kind of hero for Israelis [for signing the 1917 declaration stating Britain’s support for Israel’s founding], but actually introduced the Aliens Act, which ended Jewish immigration, and for those who couldn’t get in… it didn’t end well.”

Lansman harbours no illusions about the nature of the Israeli government, which includes extremist ministers and is led by Benjamin Netanyahu who is facing corruption charges. “It’s a far-right government… they are encouraging terrible things while eyes are on Gaza – the persecution of Palestinians on the West Bank and in mixed cities in Israel is appalling.”

It was as coordinator for Tony Benn’s 1981 deputy Labour leadership campaign that Lansman came to political prominence. Benn, in common with much of the party’s left, initially identified as a Zionist and admired Israel as a socialist experiment. After visiting it in 1956, Benn wrote in his diary of “the miracle of a home for Jews after 1,900 years of pogrom and ghetto” and mused that “perhaps the kibbutzim have the answer – stay rooted to the soil and pass it on more richly fertile than before to your sons and grandsons”.

When did the left’s relationship with Israel fracture? Lansman cited the 1967 war – when Israel occupied the Gaza Strip and the West Bank – and the 1982 Lebanon war as key turning points, but also spoke of a wider political sea change. “It ceased to be a left that had grown out of a broad front between Labour and the Communist Party in the 1930s. The New Left didn’t have a sense of the injustice that had been done to Jews who had migrated to Israel for that reason, they hadn’t lived with Jews as a persecuted people.”

The constituency in which I met Lansman – Islington North – has been represented by Jeremy Corbyn since 1983. If Corbyn, as expected, stands as an independent candidate at the general election, would Lansman support him?

“It’s a mistake for him to stand as an independent. I do think that Jeremy has been unreasonably treated. He didn’t handle anti-Semitism well but he is not an anti-Semite. He shouldn’t have been put in this position but I don’t think he should stand against the party.” Has he had much contact with Corbyn since Labour’s 2019 election defeat?

“I haven’t. I bumped into him in parliament many months ago and spoke to him. I have no animosity towards him, but that’s not to say I think he did a good job – I don’t think he did a good job. But he didn’t expect to win and none of us expected him to win at the start of that leadership campaign [in 2015].”

He added of Corbyn’s handling of anti-Semitism: “He had a real problem talking to Jewish communal bodies. If what you do when you see the Board of Deputies or the Jewish Leadership Council is read out a statement that Seumas [Milne, Corbyn’s director of communications] has written, it’s not going to work – and it didn’t.”

Lansman was for decades regarded by many in Labour as an arch-sectarian. He has long argued for the mandatory reselection of MPs and the empowerment of local activists. But he also has a pragmatic streak and speaks more favourably of Keir Starmer than some of his former Corbynite allies. “Keir Starmer does not have the politics of Tony Blair… He talks too much to Blairites, he listens to them too much, but I don’t think he is at heart a Blairite, he is a social democrat.”

Once asked why he remained in the Labour Party throughout the Blair years, Corbyn recalled Benn’s response to him: “You know what, comrade, we’re just in it, aren’t we?” Jon Lansman takes a similar view today. “I will be canvassing for the Labour Party at the next election. There is no alternative on the left to a Labour government. You can criticise it afterwards, you’re not giving anyone a blank cheque. But I was deeply depressed at times during the Blair government. And if I could stick with the party then, I can stick with it now.”

Interesting article 

[Ulysses]

14 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

If they are deemed to incite riots then yes they should be banned on the 11th .
 

Defecation of war memorials and attacking veterans selling poppies have already happened. And no doubt will increase towards and into the weekend . 
 

But freedom of speech eh 

 

GB, if a protest is considered a big enough risk to public order it can be stopped - on any day.  That is already the position, and if the Met believes Saturday's march is a big enough risk to public order it can be stopped.

 

What @Howdy Doody Jambo's post said was that no-one should be allowed march on a particular date under any circumstances.

 

If you say freedom of speech is a core value of British democracy, is dumping it overboard at the first sign of pressure really the best way of showing that?

 

[The Mighty Thor]

 

 

21 minutes ago, JyTees said:

 

What about the ones who glorify in innocent civilians being killed that are part of the crowd?

 

I think those supporting the Israeli regime are as entiltled to be there the same as everyone else. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by The Mighty Thor

[Jeffros Furios]

Islamists , antifa , socialist worker and others on the so called peace march are scum ,

Letting these tramps spout thier pish has given  Tommy Robinson and  right wing nazis  a reason to mobilise. 

 

You can all get to **** ! 

[The Mighty Thor]

1 minute ago, Jeffros Furios said:

Islamists , antifa , socialist worker and others on the so called peace march are scum ,

Letting these tramps spout thier pish has given  Tommy Robinson and  right wing nazis  a reason to mobilise. 

 

You can all get to **** ! 

 

It's working a culture wars treat. The dafties are all expecting hunners of left wingers and muslamics to storm Haymarket on Sunday so they're mobilising the pavement dancers. 😂

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

Remembrance Sunday is remembrance Sunday exactly that 

The 11th of November Armistice Day on Saturday this year is not a day for protest marches in UK and is off limits

Where is the respect shown from those planning to march in protest?

[SectionDJambo]

Let's say that the pro Palestine march, on Saturday, was banned by the police/uk government.

How are they going to stop those people from turning up anyway?

Is there a suggestion that the police would wade in, to try to disperse them, making absolutely sure that there is violence, which could then spill over to other areas of London, including the Cenotaph.

Would that be the desired outcome that some want, so that they can read all about it in their Mail on Sunday?

Maybe better to give them their march on the Saturday so that there is no excuse for disrupting the Sunday tributes.

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

7 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

Let's say that the pro Palestine march, on Saturday, was banned by the police/uk government.

How are they going to stop those people from turning up anyway?

Is there a suggestion that the police would wade in, to try to disperse them, making absolutely sure that there is violence, which could then spill over to other areas of London, including the Cenotaph.

Would that be the desired outcome that some want, so that they can read all about it in their Mail on Sunday?

Maybe better to give them their march on the Saturday so that there is no excuse for disrupting the Sunday tributes.

Naw 

[il Duce McTarkin]

36 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

 mobilising the pavement dancers. 

 

Finally, a reason to live.

 

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 hours ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

There is good and bad in this conflict and the bad is Israel.

So you consider Hamas as good. Not surprised but it's your own words so you cannot say you have been misunderstood or misquoted.

Always helps when me when I know the level of person I am debating with. 

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

3 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

These clowns bang on about wanting respect, but they don't wish to show any in return. They'd have got a huge amount of credit with the regular people if they'd said 'We originally planned it, realised the significance of the day/the weekend and so we're going to do it the following weekend instead.'

 

 

100% 👍

[Ulysses]

58 minutes ago, Howdy Doody Jambo said:

Remembrance Sunday is remembrance Sunday exactly that 

The 11th of November Armistice Day on Saturday this year is not a day for protest marches in UK and is off limits

Where is the respect shown from those planning to march in protest?

 

Government should honour those who died to preserve freedom of speech by restricting freedom of speech on certain days. That's quite an interesting idea.

 

(Just in case you missed it the first time)

[GBJambo]

2 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Government should honour those who died to preserve freedom of speech by restricting freedom of speech on certain days. That's quite an interesting idea.

 

(Just in case you missed it the first time)

Doubt those that gave their lives saving their country would be happy that on a day of remembrance , they would have memorials etc in their honour desecrated. 
 

Not hard surely for them to show a bit of respect in the country that they choose to live to respect those values. 
 

But they will continue to shout about Hamas , Jihad and freeing Palestine from the river to the sea ( we all know what that means) 
 

Image what would happen protesting like this in a Muslim country 🤣

[Ulysses]

22 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

These clowns bang on about wanting respect, but they don't wish to show any in return. They'd have got a huge amount of credit with the regular people if they'd said 'We originally planned it, realised the significance of the day/the weekend and so we're going to do it the following weekend instead.'

 

 

 

The problem with this freedom of expression bollox that democracies insist on upholding is that freedom of expression is very often daft, annoying, disagreeable, and disrespectful. I've been on one "protest" march in my entire life, and frankly I find almost all of them to be a disruption to traffic and a pain in the hole - even the ones I think are for a good cause.  But if a bunch of sadsacks want to march, or protest, that's their right.

 

The problem isn't people protesting, and it isn't the timing.  It's the fact that some people don't like the reason why there's a march, and so they're just finding reasons to justify their annoyance.

[Ulysses]

2 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

Image what would happen protesting like this in a Muslim country 🤣

 

But the UK isn't a Muslim country, GB.  It's the UK, and it needs to promote and uphold its own values, rather than aping the behaviours of other societies that are less democratic and less free.

[New Town Loafer]

40 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

These clowns bang on about wanting respect, but they don't wish to show any in return. They'd have got a huge amount of credit with the regular people if they'd said 'We originally planned it, realised the significance of the day/the weekend and so we're going to do it the following weekend instead.'

 

 

Absolutely bang on.

[The Mighty Thor]

I'll wager huge amounts of the 'silent majority' have never been near a cenotaph or remembrance service in their puff.

 

The majority will be sitting watching shitw on the telly this weekend at the 11th hour

[joondalupjambo]

Why is Rishi getting involved?

He has a Home Secretary to undertake the responsibilities for homeland security and policing.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by joondalupjambo

[GBJambo]

15 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

But the UK isn't a Muslim country, GB.  It's the UK, and it needs to promote and uphold its own values, rather than aping the behaviours of other societies that are less democratic and less free.

So we should allow a protest that is going to incite riots/violence on both sides .

 

Freedom of speech is all well

and good but it has its limits. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

55 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

These clowns bang on about wanting respect, but they don't wish to show any in return. They'd have got a huge amount of credit with the regular people if they'd said 'We originally planned it, realised the significance of the day/the weekend and so we're going to do it the following weekend instead.'

 

 

160 children a day in Gaza are being killed by Israel according to the UN so in seven days time a further 1180 children will be killed before the rally for a ceasefire takes place.

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

jimmyD’s truth bullets nailing a few

 

 

 

 

[Diadora Van Basten]

39 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Government should honour those who died to preserve freedom of speech by restricting freedom of speech on certain days. That's quite an interesting idea.

 

(Just in case you missed it the first time)

Spot on it’s like a Monty Python sketch.

[JudyJudyJudy]

18 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

I understand what you're getting at. However, I don't really have an opinion either way on the Palestine/Israel shite, and am surprised that most people do seem to have particularly strong views about how wrong or right one side is, given how much suffering they both seem to have to go through and inflict upon each other. And despite having great respect for those who lost their lives in all wars and the McCrae's connection, I don't feel the need to wear a poppy or indulge in some of the poppy-rage that inevitably ensues at this time of year.

 

People have the right to march around, wave their flags and chant their slogans about Palestine, Israel, as much as they like (well, unless Braverman gets her way). But their lack of sensitivity around what to many British people from all walks of life is a significant event/weekend tells me plenty about their attitudes towards history, optics and respect.

Agreed . 

[Diadora Van Basten]

6 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said:

Why is Rishi getting involved?

He has a Home Secretary to undertake the responsibilities for homeland security and policing.

 

 

Rishi Sunak is trying to shoot Suella Bravermans fox by cosying up to the right wing of the Conservative Party. Braverman is aiming to be Thatcher.

[JyTees]

1 hour ago, The Mighty Thor said:

 

 

 

I think those supporting the Israeli regime are as entiltled to be there the same as everyone else. 

 

You never answered my previous question. Do old poppy sellers being assaulted and Cenotaphs defaced not suit your narrative?

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, GBJambo said:

So we should allow a protest that is going to incite riots/violence on both sides .

 

Freedom of speech is all well

and good but it has its limits. 

 

If you say so.

 

There's a provision in UK law for 37 years now under which Saturday's march could be stopped.

 

I remind you that according to @Howdy Doody Jambo's post, there should be no marches allowed under any circumstances.  Not some circumstances. Not if they'd incite riots. Under any circumstances.

 

And as I said already this is not about a protest or a date.  It's about the issue. People object to the reason for the march.  The rest is just those people finding reasons to justify their objection.

[The Mighty Thor]

Just now, JyTees said:

 

You never answered my previous question. Do old poppy sellers being assaulted and Cenotaphs defaced not suit your narrative?

How you getting on rallying 'the lads'?

 

Are you tooling up ahead of the service?

[GBJambo]

2 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

If you say so.

 

There's a provision in UK law for 37 years now under which Saturday's march could be stopped.

 

I remind you that according to @Howdy Doody Jambo's post, there should be no marches allowed under any circumstances.  Not some circumstances. Not if they'd incite riots. Under any circumstances.

 

And as I said already this is not about a protest or a date.  It's about the issue. People object to the reason for the march.  The rest is just those people finding reasons to justify their objection.

There is a provision to stop it. But the government won’t , they are scared that if they cancel it it could potentially make the situation worse. 

[JyTees]

24 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

I'll wager huge amounts of the 'silent majority' have never been near a cenotaph or remembrance service in their puff.

 

The majority will be sitting watching shitw on the telly this weekend at the 11th hour

 

You're clueless.

[JyTees]

5 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

How you getting on rallying 'the lads'?

 

Are you tooling up ahead of the service?

 

Again, dodging the question. Tool.

[Victorian]

You're all just hate marchers.  Hate spewing,  pro-terrorist,  hatelords.

 

Would you mind awfully changing your next planned protest as it would cause us a headache rather,  wadda ya say?

[Malinga the Swinga]

11 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

160 children a day in Gaza are being killed by Israel according to the UN so in seven days time a further 1180 children will be killed before the rally for a ceasefire takes place.

Good to know your keeping count. How many hostages left to be released or don't we give a **** about them? After all, they're the bad side according to you.

[Japan Jambo]

17 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

160 children a day in Gaza are being killed by Israel according to the UN so in seven days time a further 1180 children will be killed before the rally for a ceasefire takes place.

 

So I guess numbers aren't your thing either.

[Ulysses]

9 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

There is a provision to stop it. But the government won’t , they are scared that if they cancel it it could potentially make the situation worse. 

 

I imagine they're concerned that preventing people from exercising their democratic rights would be more risky than letting the march go ahead.

 

I wonder how much of their risk assessment - the Met's risk assessment - is based on the timing and location of the march?  The route runs two miles from Whitehall and Westminster, and the march is due to start 2 hours after the Albert Hall commemorative event gets under way.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Ulysses

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

1 minute ago, Jim_Duncan said:

I've no idea what a 'truth bullet' is, or whether your post is criticising me, but the emoticon you used looks like he just stood on Lego.

not criticising you mate - making some good points like bullets of truth

 

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

3 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

If you say so.

 

There's a provision in UK law for 37 years now under which Saturday's march could be stopped.

 

I remind you that according to @Howdy Doody Jambo's post, there should be no marches allowed under any circumstances.  Not some circumstances. Not if they'd incite riots. Under any circumstances.

 

And as I said already this is not about a protest or a date.  It's about the issue. People object to the reason for the march.  The rest is just those people finding reasons to justify their objection.

It is about the day, time and place, the risk to public safety on this Remembrance weekend

Where is the respect?

Couldn't care less if they were protesting about people farting in the street or whatever 

Have their march on the Friday, Monday morning or whenever 

So why protest during armistice Day?

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

You're all just hate marchers.  Hate spewing,  pro-terrorist,  hatelords.

 

Would you mind awfully changing your next planned protest as it would cause us a headache rather,  wadda ya say?

 

 

[Victorian]

5 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

 

 

Point is you can't demonise people for political reasons and then expect them to conform to what you prefer for political reasons.

[JyTees]

11 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

So I guess numbers aren't your thing either.

 

🤣

[Malinga the Swinga]

10 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

If you say so.

 

There's a provision in UK law for 37 years now under which Saturday's march could be stopped.

 

I remind you that according to @Howdy Doody Jambo's post, there should be no marches allowed under any circumstances.  Not some circumstances. Not if they'd incite riots. Under any circumstances.

 

And as I said already this is not about a protest or a date.  It's about the issue. People object to the reason for the march.  The rest is just those people finding reasons to justify their objection.

Quite the opposite. They can march if they want but they knew the date and they're looking for any opportunity to cause bother. They had demo on Saturday in Edinburgh that I saw and while I disagree with them, didn't bother me when I was in Waverley and I just ignored them.

Some others will not ignore them and that's what they are counting on.

It would be better if they held march but were totally ignored by media and general public but that won't happen as BBC, Channel 4 will be too busy over the whole lot of them while their sympathisers on here will be cheering their heroes on, from home obviously as joining in would require them to actually get off their arses and do something.

They'll say it isn't anti Semitic but there will be plenty of the 'river to sea' chants and the paraglider motifs on jackets will be in full view. Idiots manipulated by *****, that's what they are.

[Ulysses]

4 minutes ago, Howdy Doody Jambo said:

So why protest during armistice Day?

 

Because they can.

 

It is that simple.  I wouldn't, but that's my choice.  I wouldn't go on their protest on any day, but that's also my choice.

 

We shouldn't ban stuff just because we don't like it.

 

The Lord Mayor's Show is the same day, all glitz and fancy coaches parading around St Paul's. A bit naff on a day of respect, no?

 

Do Arsenal or Spurs have a home game on Saturday? Or Remembrance Sunday, for that matter?  What about other London clubs?  Fans roaring and cheering when a more sombre mood might be called for?

 

You can do a beer bike tour of Piccadilly.  Get in a group and get pissed while pedalling about London city centre, singing away and giving shout-outs to passers by.  You can bet that'll be running right through the weekend.

 

P.S. I won't be doing any of those things, but I wouldn't be calling for them to be stopped or banned either.

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, Ulysses said:

 

 

We shouldn't ban stuff just because we don't like it.

 

 

Dog fighting?

Bull Baiting?

Female Genetal Mutilation?

Forced Child Labor?

Slavery?

[HeartsandonlyHearts]

1 hour ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

So you consider Hamas as good. Not surprised but it's your own words so you cannot say you have been misunderstood or misquoted.

Always helps when me when I know the level of person I am debating with. 

When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.

[New Town Loafer]

1 minute ago, Ulysses said:

 

Because they can.

 

It is that simple.  I wouldn't, but that's my choice.  I wouldn't go on their protest on any day, but that's also my choice.

 

We shouldn't ban stuff just because we don't like it.

 

The Lord Mayor's Show is the same day, all glitz and fancy coaches parading around St Paul's. A bit naff on a day of respect, no?

 

Do Arsenal or Spurs have a home game on Saturday? Or Remembrance Sunday, for that matter?  What about other London clubs?  Fans roaring and cheering when a more sombre mood might be called for?

 

You can do a beer bike tour of Piccadilly.  Get in a group and get pissed while pedalling about London city centre, singing away and giving shout-outs to passers by.  You can bet that'll be running right through the weekend.

 

P.S. I won't be doing any of those things, but I wouldn't be calling for them to be stopped or banned either.

This is my position, too. Let them hold their demonstration, but re-route it away from the cenotaph. It only reflects poorly on these idiots if they misbehave. Any serious crimes - arrest them.

 

For what it's worth, if any of these demonstrations are funded/organised by anyone in connection with Hamas then ban them.

[Ulysses]

3 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Quite the opposite. They can march if they want...

 

I repeat, I was replying to someone who said that all marches should be banned in all circumstances on a particular day (or days).

 

They can march if they want, and whether or not I agree with them that's how it should be.

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, Jim_Duncan said:

I think you just copied and pasted the 'Hobbies and Interests' section from your CV, mate.

Jings😳

[Ulysses]

Just now, New Town Loafer said:

This is my position, too. Let them hold their demonstration, but re-route it away from the cenotaph. It only reflects poorly on these idiots if they misbehave. Any serious crimes - arrest them.

 

Have you seen the route?  I haven't, but I read somewhere that the march finishes 2 miles from Whitehall, and never gets closer than 1.5 miles.

 

I'm not sure it reflects well on them even if they don't misbehave, IYSWIM, but it is what it is. 

[JyTees]

4 minutes ago, New Town Loafer said:

This is my position, too. Let them hold their demonstration, but re-route it away from the cenotaph. It only reflects poorly on these idiots if they misbehave. Any serious crimes - arrest them.

 

For what it's worth, if any of these demonstrations are funded/organised by anyone in connection with Hamas then ban them.

 

They are, and you're right, banned terrorist organisations shouldn't be allowed to voice their opinions, on Armistice Day, Remebrance Sunday, or any other day. There are rules in place and I've no idea why they're not being enforced. Well, I have...

[New Town Loafer]

3 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Have you seen the route?  I haven't, but I read somewhere that the march finishes 2 miles from Whitehall, and never gets closer than 1.5 miles.

 

I'm not sure it reflects well on them even if they don't misbehave, IYSWIM, but it is what it is. 

I've not seen it, no. Lot of misinformation flying about on both sides with regard to it - quelle surprise!