***** The Hearts B super thread - Liam Fox confirmed as coach ******

[skinnybob72]

2-0 Hearts

[skinnybob72]

2-1

[Dayman]

Any idea who the 3 Trialists are? I’m assuming 15 year olds?

[skinnybob72]

7 minutes ago, Dayman said:

Any idea who the 3 Trialists are? I’m assuming 15 year olds?

No idea! 3-1 now, penalty.

[Niemi’s gloves]

26 minutes ago, Dayman said:

Any idea who the 3 Trialists are? I’m assuming 15 year olds?

 You have to be 16 to play in the LL. Two are likely to be Gus Stevenson and James Wilson, both recently turned 16 and who both came on as trialists last week at Cowdenbeath. Academy players who have not yet signed pro forms and we are in competition to keep them. 

[skinnybob72]

4-1

[Dayman]

5 minutes ago, Niemi’s gloves said:

 You have to be 16 to play in the LL. Two are likely to be Gus Stevenson and James Wilson, both recently turned 16 and who both came on as trialists last week at Cowdenbeath. Academy players who have not yet signed pro forms and we are in competition to keep them. 

Ahh I misunderstood the rules. That makes more sense. Thanks!

[heartsfc_fan]

Just now, skinnybob72 said:

4-1

That's a great scoreline. EK are no mugs

[heartsfc_fan]

Finished 4-1. Cracking result.

[Niemi’s gloves]

2 minutes ago, heartsfc_fan said:

Finished 4-1. Cracking result.

Certainly sounds like it. All the more impressive given that Makenzie Kirk and Bobby McLuckie are away with NI u-19 and Scotland U-17 respectively. Calum Sandilands two goals tonight take him on to something like 11 goals from around 18 starts.

[Footballfirst]

That was the most enjoyable game I've seen this season from any Hearts team.

 

What a novel experience of watching an extremely young team always looking to play the ball forward, with runners showing great pace, matched only by a terrific work rate across the team.

 

I suspect that the change of approach was down to Frankie McAvoy taking the team while Naisy is away with Scotland.

[iantjambo]

12 hours ago, skinnybob72 said:

4-1

 Great result. EK were big favourites before the game. Hearts were 3/1 to win.

[Dayman]

12 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

That was the most enjoyable game I've seen this season from any Hearts team.

 

What a novel experience of watching an extremely young team always looking to play the ball forward, with runners showing great pace, matched only by a terrific work rate across the team.

 

I suspect that the change of approach was down to Frankie McAvoy taking the team while Naisy is away with Scotland.

Any idea Who the three trialists were?

Edited March 22, 2023 by Dayman

[davemclaren]

12 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

That was the most enjoyable game I've seen this season from any Hearts team.

 

What a novel experience of watching an extremely young team always looking to play the ball forward, with runners showing great pace, matched only by a terrific work rate across the team.

 

I suspect that the change of approach was down to Frankie McAvoy taking the team while Naisy is away with Scotland.

A bit controversial for you. 😄 we'll be getting 'Naisy out' threads soon. 🥸

[We_are_the_Hearts]

33 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

A bit controversial for you. 😄 we'll be getting 'Naisy out' threads soon. 🥸

Or Frankie in? 😄

[Footballfirst]

1 hour ago, Dayman said:

Any idea Who the three trialists were?

James Wilson started, Gus Stevenson came on as a sub, but I didn't see the third one come on. I assume that it was Matty Gillies as he turned 16 last month, so he is in the same contract situation as the other two.

 

Hearts started with 2 x 16 year olds and 5 x 17 year olds, so a very young side.

[Hungry hippo]

11 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

James Wilson started, Gus Stevenson came on as a sub, but I didn't see the third one come on. I assume that it was Matty Gillies as he turned 16 last month, so he is in the same contract situation as the other two.

 

Hearts started with 2 x 16 year olds and 5 x 17 year olds, so a very young side.

 

Did Wilson look ready to be a regular starter at B team level in your opinion?

[Footballfirst]

50 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

A bit controversial for you. 😄 we'll be getting 'Naisy out' threads soon. 🥸

Not really controversial. Naisy wants the team to play like the first team, keep the ball, slow build up through the lines, look for the diagonals to the wing back and with the central midfielders rotating positions.  He constantly adjusts the players positions during the game. 

 

McAvoy urged them to play at a high tempo and to play the ball forward at every opportunity, runners from midfield and the full backs driving forward with the ball. The set up seemed to be a simple one with everyone knowing their role.

 

I know which sort of play I prefer.

 

Ultimately it was that energy and work rate that wore EK down, added to some clinical finishes. The second goal, in particular, was down to Macaulay Tait driving forward from his own half at pace, leaving defenders struggling in his wake, got to the bye line and rolled the ball to Callum Sandilands to score from close range. 

[jambo-rocker]

So what I'm hearing is another successful looking Joe Savage appointment... 👀

[Footballfirst]

Just now, Hungry hippo said:

 

Did Wilson look ready to be a regular starter at B team level in your opinion?

That was his first start and not surprisingly struggled physically against a big defender.  He also picked up a harsh early yellow card for handball so perhaps was concerned about getting a second yellow if he got stuck in.

 

The defender was subbed early in the second half and James started to get more involved, holding the ball up and on one occasion getting in behind the defence, but his final pass was intercepted.

 

However, he did put in a power of running in the hour or so that he played as being the sole striker means that you have to do a lot of closing down and tracking across the pitch.

 

James will benefit from games at this level, but he will have to be eased into the side as he gets bigger and stronger.  He already has the technical ability and intelligence, but he has only had his first start at this level, so he is very much a work in progress.  

[Dayman]

29 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

James Wilson started, Gus Stevenson came on as a sub, but I didn't see the third one come on. I assume that it was Matty Gillies as he turned 16 last month, so he is in the same contract situation as the other two.

 

Hearts started with 2 x 16 year olds and 5 x 17 year olds, so a very young side.

Thanks for that, and thanks for the analysis!

[Hungry hippo]

20 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

That was his first start and not surprisingly struggled physically against a big defender.  He also picked up a harsh early yellow card for handball so perhaps was concerned about getting a second yellow if he got stuck in.

 

The defender was subbed early in the second half and James started to get more involved, holding the ball up and on one occasion getting in behind the defence, but his final pass was intercepted.

 

However, he did put in a power of running in the hour or so that he played as being the sole striker means that you have to do a lot of closing down and tracking across the pitch.

 

James will benefit from games at this level, but he will have to be eased into the side as he gets bigger and stronger.  He already has the technical ability and intelligence, but he has only had his first start at this level, so he is very much a work in progress.  

 

Cheers FF.

[Footballfirst]

Link to a match report below.

 

 

[Borders Jambo]

6 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Link to a match report below.

 

 

Excellent report. Really enjoyed reading that obviously made even better by the team performance.

[Footballfirst]

Here's a clip of Murray Thomas' penalty (Drew Busby style).

 

 

[Mikey1874]

8 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

James Wilson started, Gus Stevenson came on as a sub, but I didn't see the third one come on. I assume that it was Matty Gillies as he turned 16 last month, so he is in the same contract situation as the other two.

 

Hearts started with 2 x 16 year olds and 5 x 17 year olds, so a very young side.

 

 

[Footballfirst]

Scotland U17s lost 4-2 to Wales in their opening UEFA Championship elite group game this evening.  Bobby McLuckie started and was involved in both Scotland's goals, scoring the first and seeing his cross deflected into his own net by a defender.

 

Two of the Welsh goals resulted by errors by the Scotland keeper, but Scotland was second best throughout.

 

Rocco Friel was an unused substitute. 

[Hesh]

14 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Scotland U17s lost 4-2 to Wales in their opening UEFA Championship elite group game this evening.  Bobby McLuckie started and was involved in both Scotland's goals, scoring the first and seeing his cross deflected into his own net by a defender.

 

Two of the Welsh goals resulted by errors by the Scotland keeper, but Scotland was second best throughout.

 

Rocco Friel was an unused substitute. 

Goals are on Twitter, as you said ,2 poor ones by the keeper

[Footballfirst]

Mackenzie Kirk started for Northern Ireland U19s in their 1-0 defeat by France in the UEFA Championship  group game on Tuesday.

[Mikey1874]

 

[Footballfirst]

10 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Three of the Hearts players (Wilson, Nair & Smutek) who started against East Kilbride were understandably on the bench for the U18 game last night.

[TheBigO]

1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

Three of the Hearts players (Wilson, Nair & Smutek) who started against East Kilbride were understandably on the bench for the U18 game last night.

I'm liking what seems our general approach.  Lads already being played above their age group at 18s also getting time with the Bs.  It'll mean they get plenty of football under their belts and learn from both levels.

 

Are Rangers and Celtic and others taking same approach, do you know, or do our teams tend to be notably younger than our opponents in general?

[Footballfirst]

4 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I'm liking what seems our general approach.  Lads already being played above their age group at 18s also getting time with the Bs.  It'll mean they get plenty of football under their belts and learn from both levels.

 

Are Rangers and Celtic and others taking same approach, do you know, or do our teams tend to be notably younger than our opponents in general?

The OF B Teams are generally drawn from older players, although there have been occasions where they have fielded younger ones, typically when they have lost players to international call ups.

 

I was speaking to an SFA employed coach/scout for the CAS age groups a couple of months ago. He had been talking to his boss about the B Teams. They both agreed that Hearts were getting the best development outcomes by playing a younger team that were having to work harder for every point, rather than adopting the OF approach of playing older and more physically developed players.

[Carter]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/sport-opinion/gary-mackay-hearts-board-backed-the-signings-now-we-need-a-backlash-at-kilmarnock-4075719

 

Gary makes some interesting observations about development of young players. 

[Mikey1874]

 

[TheBigO]

2 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

The OF B Teams are generally drawn from older players, although there have been occasions where they have fielded younger ones, typically when they have lost players to international call ups.

 

I was speaking to an SFA employed coach/scout for the CAS age groups a couple of months ago. He had been talking to his boss about the B Teams. They both agreed that Hearts were getting the best development outcomes by playing a younger team that were having to work harder for every point, rather than adopting the OF approach of playing older and more physically developed players.

Yes, agreed (albeit with little knowledge!!!).  What I've seen a lot from our boys, even going back to the Holt, Walker etc generation is technically good footballers who could keep the ball off you in a phone box, but no street smarts, tactical nous or toughness.  I know a coach at Hearts at the time who said the boys couldn't tackle or head, some of them barely had the physique to run let alone play against 30 yearold pros!!

 

Playing 30odd games against men, or a mix of 18s game and LL mens simply has to be a great first step for our 16 and 17 yearolds in comparison to anything we've had in recent times.  Being tough is really, really important, it really is.  Mentally as well as physically.

 

You're kind of signing a contract and instantly have pressure to perform on a weekly basis, whereas before you signed a contract and it was kinda train, play age group game if there is one, train, duck about a bit.  Thats how it seemed.  Not easy to shine or hone your skills properly.

[Mikey1874]

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Niemi’s gloves]

2 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Bobby McLuckie also won a penalty late on, with the Montenegro player sent off for the foul (but the penalty was missed by another Scotland player)

 

As I understand the format, there are 8 groups in the elite round and 16 teams in the finals in Hungary in the summer. Since Hungary will be there as hosts, I think this means 8 group winners and 7 runners up go through. As far as I can see, a win on Tuesday against Iceland will definitely put Scotland through to the finals but a draw might not be enough. 
 

edit: had a look again at the standings. I now think a win against Iceland gives a reasonable chance but not certainty of going through

Edited March 25, 2023 by Niemi’s gloves

[Niemi’s gloves]

Scotland u-17 drew 0-0 with Iceland with Bobby McLuckie playing the first 65 minutes and no Rocco Friel (presumably injured given the bench was depleted). 
 

Scotland finished runners up in the group with a record of W1, D1, L1 and 4 points and a goal difference of -1. By a quirk of the rules, this looks good enough to make them one of the 7 best runners up and thus take them to the finals in Hungary in the summer. 
 

(In Group 1 Belarus and Bosnia both finished with similar W1,  D1, L1 and 4 points with goal differences of 0 and -4 respectively. But it is Bosnia who finish runners up on head to head in that group; and it is their record that is then compared with the other 7 runners-up. So Scotland should be through ……. I think!)

Edited March 28, 2023 by Niemi’s gloves

[Mikey1874]

3 hours ago, Niemi’s gloves said:

Scotland u-17 drew 0-0 with Iceland with Bobby McLuckie playing the first 65 minutes and no Rocco Friel (presumably injured given the bench was depleted). 
 

Scotland finished runners up in the group with a record of W1, D1, L1 and 4 points and a goal difference of -1. By a quirk of the rules, this looks good enough to make them one of the 7 best runners up and thus take them to the finals in Hungary in the summer. 
 

(In Group 1 Belarus and Bosnia both finished with similar W1,  D1, L1 and 4 points with goal differences of 0 and -4 respectively. But it is Bosnia who finish runners up on head to head in that group; and it is their record that is then compared with the other 7 runners-up. So Scotland should be through ……. I think!)

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Footballfirst]

Mackenzie Kirk started for Northern Ireland U19s in their final group game this afternoon. They lost 5-2 to Norway, leaving them bottom of their group having lost all three games.

[Big John Colquhoun]

On 24/03/2023 at 13:13, Carter said:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/sport-opinion/gary-mackay-hearts-board-backed-the-signings-now-we-need-a-backlash-at-kilmarnock-4075719

 

Gary makes some interesting observations about development of young players. 

He does, it’s a real bugbear the lack of young players getting a chance or coming through. Robbie doesn’t even bring them on for fifteen minutes when we’re two or three goals up at home. I mean, what’s the point on bringing on Gary Mackay Steven who has no future at the club? Have we nobody at all that would be worth giving some game time and experience to instead? 

[Carter]

1 hour ago, Big John Colquhoun said:

He does, it’s a real bugbear the lack of young players getting a chance or coming through. Robbie doesn’t even bring them on for fifteen minutes when we’re two or three goals up at home. I mean, what’s the point on bringing on Gary Mackay Steven who has no future at the club? Have we nobody at all that would be worth giving some game time and experience to instead? 

Gary knows better than any of us I'd imagine. As someone who emerged as part of a young group who went on to have very good careers. Neilson hasn't given youth a chance, particularly in this spell. Young Pollock looks like he's got about him. If I'm young Finlay and I'm watching Kio and Grant I'd be wondering about my future. The goal he set up in Istanbul showed he has got a bit about him. 

 

I strongly suspect we scrape 3rd and him and Savage & co bring in another mediocre bunch in the summer. 

[Niemi’s gloves]

2 hours ago, Big John Colquhoun said:

He does, it’s a real bugbear the lack of young players getting a chance or coming through. Robbie doesn’t even bring them on for fifteen minutes when we’re two or three goals up at home. I mean, what’s the point on bringing on Gary Mackay Steven who has no future at the club? Have we nobody at all that would be worth giving some game time and experience to instead? 

GMS? He hasn’t played since October and isn’t standing in anybody’s way. 

[Niemi’s gloves]

12 minutes ago, Carter said:

Gary knows better than any of us I'd imagine. As someone who emerged as part of a young group who went on to have very good careers. Neilson hasn't given youth a chance, particularly in this spell. Young Pollock looks like he's got about him. If I'm young Finlay and I'm watching Kio and Grant I'd be wondering about my future. The goal he set up in Istanbul showed he has got a bit about him. 

 

I strongly suspect we scrape 3rd and him and Savage & co bring in another mediocre bunch in the summer. 

Finlay Pollock has been out injured since mid-January. 

[OTT]

1 hour ago, Carter said:

Gary knows better than any of us I'd imagine. As someone who emerged as part of a young group who went on to have very good careers. Neilson hasn't given youth a chance, particularly in this spell. Young Pollock looks like he's got about him. If I'm young Finlay and I'm watching Kio and Grant I'd be wondering about my future. The goal he set up in Istanbul showed he has got a bit about him. 

 

I strongly suspect we scrape 3rd and him and Savage & co bring in another mediocre bunch in the summer. 

 

Robbie hasn't ever seemed overly interested in youth development. I dare say there are some stats that would argue with that statement, but based on what we see week in week out, its not high on his priority list. Frankly, its not something I'm massively bothered about. Youngsters will just as quickly run down their deal and ensure the years spent developing them and giving them a platform count for nothing, so I can't honestly blame him. Why go through the trials and tribulations of developing these players to have them leave you in the lurch? - Remember Jordan McGhee and that idiotic hand ball? We're kind of caught in between since we have the funds to run a decent academy, but not the money to retain the talent once they come decent (I'm not talking prime, I'm talking that contract that takes them to early 20s). Fact is, in the modern era Robbie is probably our most consistent manager and he's done that by not putting high stock in youth development. 

 

However, on recruitment, what started out really strong has became pretty weak of late IMO. Kio, Grant, Atkinson, Hill, Kuol, Forrest, Hill and Oda have had a pretty negligible impact. You can't get things right all the time of course, but particularly in the cases of McEneff and Kio, when we're going to spend a significant amount of money, we need to be much more certain about what we're buying and how they will fit into our team, at the level we operate at we don't need to spend money on fees and we don't have endless cash to spend, so it annoys me to see us waste money. Shankland I think is a different kettle of fish because Robbie had worked with him before and was sure of his qualities. I think if we're going to spend money it needs to be players we're extremely familiar with or young players (like Devlin or Beni) that we can develop a bit.

[gorgierulesapply88]

You mentioned Oda, injured limited game time 21 years old. 0 words of English, Meshino technically very good, you could see he want the ball in tight areas etc again little to no English.

 

Happy to wait for Oda.

[Footballfirst]

Another decent performance this afternoon from the B team in a 3-0 win over Gala FR.  It wasn't quite as fluent as their recent win over EK, but Hearts were much more clinical than their opponents.  On chances it could easily have been 6-3 to Hearts.

 

Finlay Pollock had his first game in a couple of months and was perhaps a bit rusty, but he did provide a good assist for Hearts 3rd goal.

 

Hearts struggled with balls over the top in the early stages of the first half and were pushed back for the first 15 minutes of the second half, but other than that they looked comfortable.

 

Goals from McLuckie, Sandilands and Thomas.

 

It's a pity about the first team result as I was having a good day, having watched the U13s and U15s beat Dundee United 9-1 and 8-0 respectively earlier.