Levein’s time is up...

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, tcjambo said:

Why can't we just park this thread until after the SC Final? It's clear that the outcome will have a very significant bearing on who we would want as manager going forward.

Can you explain  your theory mate?

[tcjambo]

Just now, Agentjambo said:

Can you explain  your theory mate?

No it's bleedin' obvious.

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, tcjambo said:

No it's bleedin' obvious.

So you think if we win it he will continue...dont you think Ann knows the tide is turning against him and season ticket sales are down and FoH subscriptions cancelled?

[tcjambo]

1 minute ago, Agentjambo said:

So you think if we win it he will continue...dont you think Ann knows the tide is turning against him and season ticket sales are down and FoH subscriptions cancelled?

If we win the SC all the crap :

1) He's a loser

2) The team are bottlers

3) Injuries did not wreck our season, he did

4) Nobody wants to play for him

5) He's the worst person Mikey Stewart has ever met

 

......................will vanish like snow off a dyke (well all except the last one)!

[sandylejambo]

7 minutes ago, tcjambo said:

Why can't we just park this thread until after the SC Final? It's clear that the outcome will have a very significant bearing on who we would want as manager going forward.

I hope not, I couldn't forget the turgid rotten football played this season if we win the cup, I would be a delighted Jambo coming home drunk with happiness but with my memory intact.

[McCrae]

1 hour ago, Inch Hearts said:

 

I’m not sure, do you think he would have signed to play under a head coach Cathro if he thought he was an utter clueless dud that wouldn’t get the best out of him, bearing in mind it’s been told numerous times under Neilson and Cathro Levein didn’t get involved with first team matters?  Lafferty signed for ££ to the third biggest club in the country and possibly the influence of MacPhee and Mikey O’Neil. 

 

You gave a bad example...just accept it.  You could have picked one of several duds and won the argue the argument.

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, tcjambo said:

If we win the SC all the crap :

1) He's a loser

2) The team are bottlers

3) Injuries did not wreck our season, he did

4) Nobody wants to play for him

5) He's the worst person Mikey Stewart has ever met

 

......................will vanish like snow off a dyke (well all except the last one)!

Until the 1st game if next season. 

[tcjambo]

Just now, Agentjambo said:

Until the 1st game if next season. 

We won most of the first ten games this season so it may well take longer than you think

[McCrae]

26 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

What makes you so sure hes still going to be in charge?

 

Its obvious.  If you looks at the numbers .... big cup final, wee cup semi and in top 6 hardly a disaster.  Unless he wants to move on, Budge won’t fire him. He will be our manager at the start of next season.

[Agentjambo]

Just now, tcjambo said:

We won most of the first ten games this season so it may well take longer than you think

Then back to where we are now...how many chances to **** it up is he going to get?

[Agentjambo]

Just now, McCrae said:

 

Its obvious.  If you looks at the numbers .... big cup final, wee cup semi and in top 6 hardly a disaster.  Unless he wants to move on, Budge won’t fire him. He will be our manager at the start of next season.

6th in the league...acceptable??

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

1 hour ago, McCrae said:

 

He signed for us because of the potential opportunities that would open up for him if he did well..... and that is exactly what happened.  Do you really think he would of signed for us if he thought CL sucked?

So not because of Craig Levein then?  ?

[tcjambo]

3 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

Then back to where we are now...how many chances to **** it up is he going to get?

Most fans do not analyse but react so you will find a huge change in mood if we win the cup besides too many clubs just boot a manager when things go wrong rather than thinking long term. It's not a case of chances as your portray it.

[Bridge of Djoum]

17 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

Can you explain  your theory mate?

He just did.

[Forever Hearts]

6 minutes ago, McCrae said:

 

Its obvious.  If you looks at the numbers .... big cup final, wee cup semi and in top 6 hardly a disaster.  Unless he wants to move on, Budge won’t fire him. He will be our manager at the start of next season.

???

[sandylejambo]

Craig Levein may well start next season as manager but one thing is for sure in that case, season tickets sales will be drastically down on this season,.I don't know if Mrs Budge will think that keeping him in charge is worth the hit. the stadium doesn't sell out most games and walk-ups will be the order of the day for me, 5 games I've missed this season so economically it makes sense for me to buy as I go. If we had performed with heart at least I would probably have renewed, I'm not prepared to shell out for the horrible stuff we've been served  this season, next season.

[Bull's-eye]

4 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

???

????

[tcjambo]

1 minute ago, sandylejambo said:

Craig Levein may well start next season as manager but one thing is for sure in that case, season tickets sales will be drastically down on this season,.I don't know if Mrs Budge will think that keeping him in charge is worth the hit. the stadium doesn't sell out most games and walk-ups will be the order of the day for me, 5 games I've missed this season so economically it makes sense for me to buy as I go. If we had performed with heart at least I would probably have renewed, I'm not prepared to shell out for the horrible stuff we've been served  this season, next season.

You are entitled to your opinion. I might buy one despite being exiled in Leeds so not everyone thinks the way you do.

[ford donald]

2 hours ago, McCrae said:

 

I think there is close to zero chance that CL won’t be managing the team next season.  Next year is the year he needs to deliver a better performance in the league.

 

Win or lose the cup final,Don't think it will matter about changes,they will already be in place i presume.It would be win,win situation for CL, defeat against

Celtic is expected (sincerely hope I am wrong)  so no blame attached to the manager,If we put in a top performance or even beat them,CL could retire as

manager a hero.That's my thoughts.

[Pasquale for King]

5 minutes ago, ford donald said:

 

Win or lose the cup final,Don't think it will matter about changes,they will already be in place i presume.It would be win,win situation for CL, defeat against

Celtic is expected (sincerely hope I am wrong)  so no blame attached to the manager,If we put in a top performance or even beat them,CL could retire as

manager a hero.That's my thoughts.

Surely most fans would be happy with that.

[Jodami]

31 minutes ago, sandylejambo said:

Craig Levein may well start next season as manager but one thing is for sure in that case, season tickets sales will be drastically down on this season,.I don't know if Mrs Budge will think that keeping him in charge is worth the hit. the stadium doesn't sell out most games and walk-ups will be the order of the day for me, 5 games I've missed this season so economically it makes sense for me to buy as I go. If we had performed with heart at least I would probably have renewed, I'm not prepared to shell out for the horrible stuff we've been served  this season, next season.

If it is the case that season tickets are substantially down then that may be the trigger for the board to make a change. Keeping your core customers is key to any business so that will be a significant factor in any decision. The two unknown elements relating to this at the moment are how many additional people purchase now the finance is sorted and any bounce that the cup result might bring. Club should have an idea of where they are at the beginning of June. 

[Jodami]

37 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

????

Yeah, he was wrong as well Dodger. 

[Inch Hearts]

1 hour ago, McCrae said:

 

You gave a bad example...just accept it.  You could have picked one of several duds and won the argue the argument.

 

What are you on about? Why would I choose a dud when I chose two brilliant players who signed for us regardless of who the head coach was in comparison with you saying Haulket and Naismith are signing for Craig Levein and not Hearts. 

[Agentjambo]

1 hour ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

He just did.

?

[GavK1012]

2 hours ago, sandylejambo said:

Craig Levein may well start next season as manager but one thing is for sure in that case, season tickets sales will be drastically down on this season,.I don't know if Mrs Budge will think that keeping him in charge is worth the hit. the stadium doesn't sell out most games and walk-ups will be the order of the day for me, 5 games I've missed this season so economically it makes sense for me to buy as I go. If we had performed with heart at least I would probably have renewed, I'm not prepared to shell out for the horrible stuff we've been served  this season, next season.

 

Amen. Snap. Bang on.

[JamboAl]

2 hours ago, sandylejambo said:

Craig Levein may well start next season as manager but one thing is for sure in that case, season tickets sales will be drastically down on this season,.I don't know if Mrs Budge will think that keeping him in charge is worth the hit. the stadium doesn't sell out most games and walk-ups will be the order of the day for me, 5 games I've missed this season so economically it makes sense for me to buy as I go. If we had performed with heart at least I would probably have renewed, I'm not prepared to shell out for the horrible stuff we've been served  this season, next season.

3

So how will you know?  You waiting to see who we sign?

[Victorian]

[Holyrood_Hearts]

There’s no reasoning why he should be here.  6 months of dreadful results plus season tickets potentially being down for next season is surely enough reason to get rid. 

[Forever Hearts]

Just now, Holyrood_Hearts said:

There’s no reasoning why he should be here.  6 months of dreadful results plus season tickets potentially being down for next season is surely enough reason to get rid. 

Anybody with a brain can see that the Levein and boot room experiment hasn't worked. Mindboggling that some still can't see the absolute failure it has been. 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

Anybody with a brain can see that the Levein and boot room experiment hasn't worked. Mindboggling that some still can't see the absolute failure it has been. 

 

The "boot room experiment" has worked the one and only time we've used it. Neilson was promoted to head coach from the U20s and did a great job overall.

 

Jack Ross has also done a great job, just unfortunately not with us, but he was the next "boot room" candidate before he left so who knows how he could have done with us if promoted after Neilson left.

 

Cathro bombed obviously but he was never a coach with us. If he had taken the U20s job he turned down when Neilson was promoted, who knows. Cathro though it has to be said is still working at an extremely high level at a club doing well, although I doubt we'll see him in a manager job for another 10 years or so. Maybe he'll do a Steve Clarke and have success after many more years of being an assistant.

 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Guest

[Holyrood_Hearts]

3 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

Anybody with a brain can see that the Levein and boot room experiment hasn't worked. Mindboggling that some still can't see the absolute failure it has been. 

To be fair there was success to a degree the first two years under Neilson, but the the last two & a half seasons (except the start of this season) haven’t been great at all. 2 wins in 19 top 6 games is dreadful 

[Rudy T]

4 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Doyle? From the republic? He did also bring Hughes, Burns, Struna, Tzolis, Alvonitis, so he’s barely in credit I’m afraid. 

 

Hughes and Burns yes. Tzolis was a great player and should’ve been for us. Not a bad return I’d say.

[Rudy T]

38 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

The "boot room experiment" has worked the one and only time we've used it. Neilson was promoted to head coach from the U20s and did a great job overall.

 

Jack Ross has also done a great job, just unfortunately not with us, but he was the next "boot room" candidate before he left so who knows how he could have done with us if promoted after Neilson left.

 

Cathro bombed obviously but he was never a coach with us. If he had taken the U20s job he turned down when Neilson was promoted, who knows. Cathro though it has to be said is still working at an extremely high level at a club doing well, although I doubt we'll see him in a manager job for another 10 years or so. Maybe he'll do a Steve Clarke and have success after many more years of being an assistant.

 

 

Neilson lost to Hibs and fans turned on him. 2nd in the league and starting to play better football yet fans wanted him out. Queue someone telling us he left, which might be the case had he had the entire support behind him he’d never have taken that job. I was guilty of moaning about the football at times but I’m first to say I’d have him back tomorrow!

 

Cathro will never work as a manager he just doesn’t have it, some don’t but he will have a very successful career in football, shame it was us that had to be the club to prove he’ll never be a manager!

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Rudy T said:

 

Neilson lost to Hibs and fans turned on him. 2nd in the league and starting to play better football yet fans wanted him out. Queue someone telling us he left, which might be the case had he had the entire support behind him he’d never have taken that job. I was guilty of moaning about the football at times but I’m first to say I’d have him back tomorrow!

 

Cathro will never work as a manager he just doesn’t have it, some don’t but he will have a very successful career in football, shame it was us that had to be the club to prove he’ll never be a manager!

 

I agree about Cathro on his Hearts showing. He'll no doubt still have a great career coaching or in the new "football analyst" type role that seems to be available at top clubs these days.

 

Found this interesting from the Liverpool-Barca game talking about their winner:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/08/trent-alexander-arnold-liverpool-wow-factor

 

"On Monday Klopp’s first-team analysts delivered a video presentation to the ballboys on duty for the semi-final. They were shown aspects of their performance against Porto in the previous round that could be improved and were drilled on returning the ball faster when Liverpool needed it. The analysts had noticed how Barcelona players regularly switched off after conceding a set piece or free-kick in the first leg."

 

That role seems tailor-made for a Cathro type and to our (and Leaven's to keep on topic) credit we are trying this with McPhee and by appointing Cathro in the first place. That's why talking about Levein as a football dinosaur is so laughable. Sure, he has not done well since the injuries with the team but with him as DoF we've been extremely progressive and are trying to do things top sides are doing. He would never have appointed Cathro in the first place if he was a backwards thinking football man. It's a joke he gets tagged with that.

 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Guest

[Rudy T]

5 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I agree about Cathro on his Hearts showing. He'll no doubt still have a great career coaching or in the new "football analyst" type role that seems to be available at top clubs these days.

 

Found this interesting from the Liverpool-Barca game talking about their winner:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/08/trent-alexander-arnold-liverpool-wow-factor

 

"On Monday Klopp’s first-team analysts delivered a video presentation to the ballboys on duty for the semi-final. They were shown aspects of their performance against Porto in the previous round that could be improved and were drilled on returning the ball faster when Liverpool needed it. The analysts had noticed how Barcelona players regularly switched off after conceding a set piece or free-kick in the first leg."

 

That role seems tailor-made for a Cathro type and to our (and Leaven's to keep on topic) credit we are trying this with McPhee and by appointing Cathro in the first place. That's why talking about Levein as a football dinosaur is so laughable. Sure, he has not done well since the injuries with the team but with him as DoF we've been extremely progressive and are trying to do things top sides are doing. He would never have appointed Cathro in the first place if he was a backwards thinking football man. It's a joke he gets tagged with that.

 

 

Its pretty phenomenal the detail the elite clubs put into everything they do. Every top manager has their time but are soon overtaken by younger guys with new ideas as hard as it is to believe today eventually Klopp and Guardiola will be regarded as past it. Mourinho has been this years casualty he’s just not adapted and just can’t live with those at the top of the game now. Levein I agree has tried to adapt and implement forward thinking ideas, unfortunately I don’t think he can as a manager now, DoF he can and he has great ideas I just don’t think his own natural way of working gets the best out of players. I’d really like to see him step upstairs again and provide direction but bring in a good manager to impose a real attacking style to the team.

[Finlay James]

14 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I agree about Cathro on his Hearts showing. He'll no doubt still have a great career coaching or in the new "football analyst" type role that seems to be available at top clubs these days.

 

Found this interesting from the Liverpool-Barca game talking about their winner:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/08/trent-alexander-arnold-liverpool-wow-factor

 

"On Monday Klopp’s first-team analysts delivered a video presentation to the ballboys on duty for the semi-final. They were shown aspects of their performance against Porto in the previous round that could be improved and were drilled on returning the ball faster when Liverpool needed it. The analysts had noticed how Barcelona players regularly switched off after conceding a set piece or free-kick in the first leg."

 

That role seems tailor-made for a Cathro type and to our (and Leaven's to keep on topic) credit we are trying this with McPhee and by appointing Cathro in the first place. That's why talking about Levein as a football dinosaur is so laughable. Sure, he has not done well since the injuries with the team but with him as DoF we've been extremely progressive and are trying to do things top sides are doing. He would never have appointed Cathro in the first place if he was a backwards thinking football man. It's a joke he gets tagged with that.

 

 

Spot on mate, I just think he's too forward thinking at times as I'm not sure we have the players to execute his tactics.  He needs to get the basics right to begin with and take it from there.

 

 

[sadj]

34 minutes ago, Rudy T said:

 

Neilson lost to Hibs and fans turned on him. 2nd in the league and starting to play better football yet fans wanted him out. Queue someone telling us he left, which might be the case had he had the entire support behind him he’d never have taken that job. I was guilty of moaning about the football at times but I’m first to say I’d have him back tomorrow!

 

Cathro will never work as a manager he just doesn’t have it, some don’t but he will have a very successful career in football, shame it was us that had to be the club to prove he’ll never be a manager!

Sensible post alert... we really need a emoticon thingymajig for these.

Edited May 13, 2019 by sadj

[frazman1874]

Just looked at the league table and see we have now lost more games than we have won. Really not good enough for a team of our size. The only way levein will go though is if he decides to move back upstairs. Football has been dire to watch. Still have a feeling we might pull something out of the bag for the cup final. You can only but hope.

[Morgan]

4 minutes ago, sadj said:

Sensible post alert... we really need a emoticon thingymajig for these.

 

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, Rudy T said:

 

Hughes and Burns yes. Tzolis was a great player and should’ve been for us. Not a bad return I’d say.

Hughes was here to keep fit for NI, a waste of a wage for 2.5 years who was barely fit when we needed him had 2 or 3 good games, also played in the capitulation at ER and Livi. Burns has a long way to go to be good enough to play for us on a regular basis in a good Hearts team. Lafferty for all the baggage was a success, we would’ve been in relegation trouble last season if he hadn’t been signed. If Macphee didn’t realise that Tzolis wouldn’t suit Scottish football then he shouldn’t be bringing players to the club.

[Bridge of Djoum]

8 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Hughes was here to keep fit for NI, a waste of a wage for 2.5 years who was barely fit when we needed him had 2 or 3 good games, also played in the capitulation at ER and Livi. Burns has a long way to go to be good enough to play for us on a regular basis in a good Hearts team. Lafferty for all the baggage was a success, we would’ve been in relegation trouble last season if he hadn’t been signed. If Macphee didn’t realise that Tzolis wouldn’t suit Scottish football then he shouldn’t be bringing players to the club.

If you believe Hearts signed Hughes to keep him fit for NI...

 

 

He could've done that at any number of clubs. Criticism is fine but FFS. At least toy with the truth.

 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Bridge of Djoum

[McCrae]

5 hours ago, Agentjambo said:

6th in the league...acceptable??

 

Not longer term.

[bistokid]

40 minutes ago, Finlay James said:

 

Spot on mate, I just think he's too forward thinking at times as I'm not sure we have the players to execute his tactics.  He needs to get the basics right to begin with and take it from there.

 

 

 

Levein is too forward thinking? 

[sadj]

29 minutes ago, Morgan said:

 

How about no... only if its a choice between that or a pic of Lawson would that win.

3 minutes ago, bistokid said:

 

Levein is too forward thinking? 

There is an argument for that. Both in terms of appointing Cathro and his tactics and thought process. I often think he beats himself by over complicating or tinkering. I am not the only one. From there when he loses players we stop playing our game and worry about them. Possibly due to lack of confidence in the squad. As Finlay says we need to get back to doing basics correctly whether that is under Levein or not.

[Enzo Chiefo]

Anyone advocating that Levein should stay on in any capacity, at first team level, is quite clearly trolling. He should be fired for the nonsense he mumbles pre and post match alone. He is so far out of his depth,  tactically and in a man management context, it's frightening. Give him his day in the sun on the 25th then thank him and move him on. His presence creates a dismal cloud over the club and we now need some fresh ideas in order for the club to progress.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Enzo Chiefo

[bistokid]

7 minutes ago, sadj said:

How about no... only if its a choice between that or a pic of Lawson would that win.

There is an argument for that. Both in terms of appointing Cathro and his tactics and thought process. I often think he beats himself by over complicating or tinkering. I am not the only one. From there when he loses players we stop playing our game and worry about them. Possibly due to lack of confidence in the squad. As Finlay says we need to get back to doing basics correctly whether that is under Levein or not.

 

Appointing Cathro was a risk and unprecedented in our backwater I'll give you that. 

 

The idea that Leveins own tactics are too forward thinking is utterly absurd. 

[sadj]

3 minutes ago, bistokid said:

 

Appointing Cathro was a risk and unprecedented in our backwater I'll give you that. 

 

The idea that Leveins own tactics are too forward thinking is utterly absurd. 

Its not if you are within the game. Execution is a different story.

 

Cathro was a risk and a highly regarded coach the problem was his man management and personality. Water under the bridge though.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

1 hour ago, Finlay James said:

 

Spot on mate, I just think he's too forward thinking at times as I'm not sure we have the players to execute his tactics.  He needs to get the basics right to begin with and take it from there.

 

 

One minute you're saying he should go, the next you're saying he should revise his tactics. Make your mind up!

[bistokid]

2 minutes ago, sadj said:

Its not if you are within the game. Execution is a different story.

 

Cathro was a risk and a highly regarded coach the problem was his man management and personality. Water under the bridge though.

 

No issue with the Cathro appointment at the time. Was all for it.

 

In that case the difference between theory and execution must be so enormous as to be completely unrecognizable. I mean I am not 'in the game ' so admittedly I might be missing something. Unless it's a new improved route one 2.0 that no modern coach has considered. It could be that. 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

6 minutes ago, sadj said:

Its not if you are within the game. Execution is a different story.

 

Cathro was a risk and a highly regarded coach the problem was his man management and personality. Water under the bridge though.

Gordon Strapon style post alert!