Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Pasquale for King said: No top six though, good point though as there are loads of good managers all around the world that could do a great job with our resources and fan base. Didn’t they make the top six last season? They aren’t top six budget let alone top 4 budget and made two cup finals last season beating Rangers and Aberdeen along the way. I believe we could get a better manager than we have just now, of course I do and of course most supporters will do to. But... Levein should get the chance to build on what we displayed on Saturday and hopefully learn with it. Injuries aren’t an excuse at all as Saturday showed either. I just don’t feel it’s time for him to hand the baton to someone else right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: Most successful teams against Celtic do do it. See the huns a couple of times hibs and us. European teams showed the way, I think Levein quoted Salzburg after the 4 nil game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 7 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said: He worked it out when we played them and ended their 69 game run. The object of the press is to win the ball back, either in their half or to get the team to play long. We pressed most teams at the beginning of the season, and played off their mistakes. Do Liverpool, City etc not play long ball teams and still press them? It requires a level of fitness that perhaps we don’t have, to hitch is wrong. We obviously don’t have the players that these teams have but they really shouldn’t be that much fitter surely? As soon as Naismith, Morrison, Haring, Uche picked up their injuries I think we didn’t have the squad to play a pressing game at that time. He tried to, by bringing Clare in before he was fit and rushing Wighton back from injury but neither really worked. Keena was already out on loan, Lee too slow, Cochrane crocked. Think it was a real headache in terms of how to set the team up at times. I think he actually admitted that at one point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Pasquale for King said: European teams showed the way, I think Levein quoted Salzburg after the 4 nil game. He definitely did. Pace, legs, pressing no fear, why on earth didn’t we kick on from that. It’s the potential that’s the sickener. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Inch Hearts said: Didn’t they make the top six last season? They aren’t top six budget let alone top 4 budget and made two cup finals last season beating Rangers and Aberdeen along the way. I believe we could get a better manager than we have just now, of course I do and of course most supporters will do to. But... Levein should get the chance to build on what we displayed on Saturday and hopefully learn with it. Injuries aren’t an excuse at all as Saturday showed either. I just don’t feel it’s time for him to hand the baton to someone else right now. Nah it was the same top six as this season. They did really well and punched above their weight, last season and this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 minute ago, soonbe110 said: As soon as Naismith, Morrison, Haring, Uche picked up their injuries I think we didn’t have the squad to play a pressing game at that time. He tried to, by bringing Clare in before he was fit and rushing Wighton back from injury but neither really worked. Keena was already out on loan, Lee too slow, Cochrane crocked. Think it was a real headache in terms of how to set the team up at times. I think he actually admitted that at one point. We done it on Saturday with a half fit Haring and the rest out though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Pasquale for King said: Nah it was the same top six as this season. They did really well and punched above their weight, last season and this. No bother. Top six last season was a blur, for obvious reasons, apart from the derby win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: As soon as Naismith, Morrison, Haring, Uche picked up their injuries I think we didn’t have the squad to play a pressing game at that time. He tried to, by bringing Clare in before he was fit and rushing Wighton back from injury but neither really worked. Keena was already out on loan, Lee too slow, Cochrane crocked. Think it was a real headache in terms of how to set the team up at times. I think he actually admitted that at one point. Morrison was fit then, he could’ve played him or signed players that were ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: We done it on Saturday with a half fit Haring and the rest out though? Djoum, Smith, Hickey, Clare were all struggling too. I watched the game again today, didn’t notice on Saturday. Edited May 27, 2019 by Pasquale for King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: No bother. Top six last season was a blur, for obvious reasons, apart from the derby win. Most are, we’ve barely won a game in the top six since we came back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said: Djoum, Smith, Hickey, Clare were all struggling too. I watched the game again today, didn’t notice on Saturday. Yep. Yet it was given as an excuse overload all season with flighted balls into Uche all season long. Saturday showed that injuries couldn’t be used as an excuse but st the same time the bravery the manager had leads me wanting him to continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Inch Hearts said: Yep. Yet it was given as an excuse overload all season with flighted balls into Uche all season long. Saturday showed that injuries couldn’t be used as an excuse but st the same time the bravery the manager had leads me wanting him to continue. Would I be right in saying you’ve changed your mind because of Saturday? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 7 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: We done it on Saturday with a half fit Haring and the rest out though? Mulraney has improved significantly, Edwards gives pace, Haring was more than half fit, and Djoum was outstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTT Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 12 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Not sure I get your point. Yes we can play a pressing game but if it was easy as you say, and it was successful, wouldn’t every club try it? I think the difficulty is finding players that can press for 90 minutes. I think players like Edwards, or Scott Pittman at Livi would be ideal in that sort of strategy. I'd love to be a pressing team. Sitting in is horrible to watch and doesn't appear to be a massively successful system, finding players with that sort of engine and the required ability is probably quite challenging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Pasquale for King said: Would I be right in saying you’ve changed your mind because of Saturday? Yes. Because of the performance and the team that was set out I believe Levein will help us progress now and not revert to type. He was very brave on Saturday and the game plan worked a treat. I don’t want to risk an alternative as I believe Levein will learn from this as will the team and push on. If I’m wrong, we lose another season and will be optimistic about a new guy this time next year. If I’m right with what I genuinely feel, then we will have a very good season next and onwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 10 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said: Morrison was fit then, he could’ve played him or signed players that were ready to go. Morrison has been carrying his injury since well before Xmas. Tried to play through with little training between games but it caught up with him. You cant sign players after window is shut which is when most of these guys picked up their injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Mulraney has improved significantly, Edwards gives pace, Haring was more than half fit, and Djoum was outstanding. Given the chance to show what they can do all they player played fantastic and I’m the biggest eater of humble pie over Mulraney (although defences will learn to try and stop him) Haring has to come off because he was goosed. Where was they performances all through the winter when injuries got blamed? I’ll take it though if we learn and we improve and I’ve confidence we will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 22 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: I’m off to watch the hills have eyes watch me go next season as one of the McGinn brothers ? ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 8 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: Yep. Yet it was given as an excuse overload all season with flighted balls into Uche all season long. Saturday showed that injuries couldn’t be used as an excuse but st the same time the bravery the manager had leads me wanting him to continue. Sat was a one-off and the guys carrying knocks had been given weeks off to recover/prepare eg Haring, Djoum. They couldn’t put in the effort they did on Sat every week for any length of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 7 minutes ago, OTT said: I think the difficulty is finding players that can press for 90 minutes. I think players like Edwards, or Scott Pittman at Livi would be ideal in that sort of strategy. I'd love to be a pressing team. Sitting in is horrible to watch and doesn't appear to be a massively successful system, finding players with that sort of engine and the required ability is probably quite challenging. Especially when Celtic and Rangers sign a lot of the guys who could do a job for us and just bench them or put them out on loan eg Fleming, Christie, Morgan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 (edited) We should just sign shite players. Make them watch reruns of Brazil 1970 or Spain ten years ago. Be champions of the universe in no time. Us in five years due to jkb advanced coaching techniques- Edited May 27, 2019 by Olly Lee's left boot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 The bottom line is that the season is a failure and the manager needs to be held accountable for that. Therefore, we need a change in the manager's position and it needs to be external. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: The bottom line is that the season is a failure and the manager needs to be held accountable for that. Therefore, we need a change in the manager's position and it needs to be external. Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: Who? Let's see who applies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 5 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Sat was a one-off and the guys carrying knocks had been given weeks off to recover/prepare eg Haring, Djoum. They couldn’t put in the effort they did on Sat every week for any length of time. Djoum has been fine as has Edwards. We played a pressing game against them and they shat it. Previously we sit back stroll about pass to Berra lose the ball get into shape try to win back possession have no confidence on the ball and get frustrated. How can one team be so Jekyll and Hyde regardless of injuries? Saturday was a Naismith preformance without Naismith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Geoff Kilpatrick said: Let's see who applies. Great plan. Nothing can go wrong with a strategy like that. Won't piss off the players who have just signed/ renewed under CL. Won't disrupt any possible on going transfers. Won't upset any youth players. Bullet proof plan. Well thought out. Can't see how it can go wrong. Great stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Olly Lee's left boot said: Great plan. Nothing can go wrong with a strategy like that. Won't piss off the players who have just signed/ renewed under CL. Won't disrupt any possible on going transfers. Won't upset any youth players. Bullet proof plan. Well thought out. Can't see how it can go wrong. Great stuff. If all that was true those players wouldn't last very long in the game. In football, managers get the sack. New managers come in. It's part and parcel of the game. PS One sentence paragraphs are extremely annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: Great plan. Nothing can go wrong with a strategy like that. Won't piss off the players who have just signed/ renewed under CL. Won't disrupt any possible on going transfers. Won't upset any youth players. Bullet proof plan. Well thought out. Can't see how it can go wrong. Great stuff. C’mon Ollie, managers come and go all the time and players accept it as part of their career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: If all that was true those players wouldn't last very long in the game. In football, managers get the sack. New managers come in. It's part and parcel of the game. PS One sentence paragraphs are extremely annoying. Shit ideas are also annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 3 hours ago, Pasquale for King said: Absolute nonsense, have any of those teams spent money like the £500k we used for Claire and Wighton. Shit like Lafferty/Naismith/Berra? Our budget is much bigger than Kilmarnocks, whether you can accept it us neither here nor there. We also have a higher budget than Hibs, slightly behind Aberdeen but that will change next season. Maybe instead of buying 20 (113 in 5 years) players we could sign ten and get better quality, and use the youths more as they’ve been encouraging the last few weeks as the injury prone squad fell apart. What are/were the respective (playing) budgets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Nookie Bear said: C’mon Ollie, managers come and go all the time and players accept it as part of their career. They do, and they'll see out thier contracts. Doesn't mean players aren't pissed of tho with the club, tho and become unhappy, especially if the changes were not expected when they signed. Also makes future signings wary. That happens all the time too, especially at the lower levels where it's not all about cash. It's also why these clubs tend not to progress or sometimes even go backwards. Robbie to Cathro must be a distant memory for some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 5 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: Shit ideas are also annoying. No. What's annoying is your attempt to deflect the debate onto the rights and wrongs of any other candidates. I'm not biting. However, I will ask you one simple question. Where do you rank Craig Levein amongst the 12 SPFL managers at the end of the season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enzo Chiefo Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 hours ago, ri Alban said: Come on, Enzo, we were the better team. Especially the first half. With a wee rub of the green, we'd be still celebrating. I'm not sure about being the better team Mr Alban but we certainly gave them a game. I think we knew that everything would have to fall our way for us to win that game. ....we also probably expected Collum to award them a penalty at some stage too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enzo Chiefo Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said: Are you off your head, Berra had an ankle o hurt last season and the hamstring this season.Souttar has missed games due to injury in all the seasons he’s played. Naismith had the same injury TWICE, not one injury. He’s injury prone. He had an operation in har cured it. Haring exactly the same, he’s also not played that many games in his career Uche has had an injury every season he’s played. Wighton and Clare, Mitchell.Djpum, Brandon, Godhino. Smith missed games at the start of the season, got injured, then fit, then injured again meaning he had to be rested before the final. For the last time we’ve had two seasons where only the goalies have been fit for every game. Just luck though eh? 80 players injured? 54 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: What about the Motherwell manager who managed two cup finals and 6th place? Surely that’s a better season on his cv with a bottom 6 budget also good at giving young players their opportunity as shown towards the end of this season? Just an example of others out there. Not that I want him to replace Levein. To be honest I would be happy if Theresa May came in to replace Levein for next season. Doing that wee robotic dance down the touchline after humping Hibs. Tynecastle would be bouncing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 35 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: Yes. Because of the performance and the team that was set out I believe Levein will help us progress now and not revert to type. He was very brave on Saturday and the game plan worked a treat. I don’t want to risk an alternative as I believe Levein will learn from this as will the team and push on. If I’m wrong, we lose another season and will be optimistic about a new guy this time next year. If I’m right with what I genuinely feel, then we will have a very good season next and onwards. I admire your positivity and hope your new found faith is rewarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said: To be honest I would be happy if Theresa May came in to replace Levein for next season. Doing that wee robotic dance down the touchline after humping Hibs. Tynecastle would be bouncing. It’s bad enough when Douglas Ross is in front of me, I take your point on board though ?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 Just now, Pasquale for King said: I admire your positivity and hope your new found faith is rewarded. Me too mate. Ask again in October and hopefully you’re on the same page. If not we will need a new manager come winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 25 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: Djoum has been fine as has Edwards. We played a pressing game against them and they shat it. Previously we sit back stroll about pass to Berra lose the ball get into shape try to win back possession have no confidence on the ball and get frustrated. How can one team be so Jekyll and Hyde regardless of injuries? Saturday was a Naismith preformance without Naismith. Djoum has been carrying an Achilles problem for four or five weeks. Was doubtful for Saturday right up until match day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 36 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Morrison has been carrying his injury since well before Xmas. Tried to play through with little training between games but it caught up with him. You cant sign players after window is shut which is when most of these guys picked up their injuries. I meant before then, when we knew Lafferty was away and we tried to get Sow. You can still sign players outside the window, there was a list of guys that probably could’ve helped us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enzo Chiefo Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said: It’s bad enough when Douglas Ross is in front of me, I take your point on board though ?. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 13 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: No. What's annoying is your attempt to deflect the debate onto the rights and wrongs of any other candidates. I'm not biting. However, I will ask you one simple question. Where do you rank Craig Levein amongst the 12 SPFL managers at the end of the season? I have said early on that if he was replaced with an outstanding candidate, then I'd be happy. Replacing him for the sake of change is pointless. In term of ranking... Unsure. Clarke has done better than last season and being above us, hibs and Aberdeen is an achievement. Mcinnes dropped two league places. Lennon, possibly behind CL based on hibs. Heckingbottom, maybe above but he only had half a season Wright OK, but like us will have been dissapointed to be behind Killie. Motherwell as above. Think Hamilton, Dundee and st mirren changed manager as well. Really difficult to place tbh. It's not that simple We've improved our league form, if not position and got further in both cups, however we fell behind our league target. You could say he out performaned mcinnes based on that? Above Gerrard? Behind Clarke definitely. Above Lennon? On par with Wright and the Motherwell guy? I don't think anyone but Hamilton and Killie will be overall happy at the season. Everyone else will think there is room for improvement with some dissapointed they've slipped v the season before, with others hopefull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 14 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: No. What's annoying is your attempt to deflect the debate onto the rights and wrongs of any other candidates. I'm not biting. However, I will ask you one simple question. Where do you rank Craig Levein amongst the 12 SPFL managers at the end of the season? I’d say behind Clarke, McInnes, Gerrard and probably Lennon. better than the rest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 43 minutes ago, OTT said: I think the difficulty is finding players that can press for 90 minutes. I think players like Edwards, or Scott Pittman at Livi would be ideal in that sort of strategy. I'd love to be a pressing team. Sitting in is horrible to watch and doesn't appear to be a massively successful system, finding players with that sort of engine and the required ability is probably quite challenging. That’s a good point too, surely getting players fitness levels up can be achieved. Lee for instance could do with losing a bit of muscle as could Uche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Djoum has been carrying an Achilles problem for four or five weeks. Was doubtful for Saturday right up until match day. I meant since I he turn of the year where he’s been a passenger due to the style of football we have utilised him at. Saturday was perfect for him and he shone and was easily my man of the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Marsh Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 1 minute ago, soonbe110 said: I’d say behind Clarke, McInnes, Gerrard and probably Lennon. better than the rest You would have to say well below Tommy Wright and Steve Robinson given their respective budgets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 23 minutes ago, JamboAl said: What are/were the respective (playing) budgets? We’ve already discussed all of this before, I’m not going there again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: I have said early on that if he was replaced with an outstanding candidate, then I'd be happy. Replacing him for the sake of change is pointless. In term of ranking... Unsure. Clarke has done better than last season and being above us, hibs and Aberdeen is an achievement. Mcinnes dropped two league places. Lennon, possibly behind CL based on hibs. Heckingbottom, maybe above but he only had half a season Wright OK, but like us will have been dissapointed to be behind Killie. Motherwell as above. Think Hamilton, Dundee and st mirren changed manager as well. Really difficult to place tbh. It's not that simple We've improved our league form, if not position and got further in both cups, however we fell behind our league target. You could say he out performaned mcinnes based on that? Above Gerrard? Behind Clarke definitely. Above Lennon? On par with Wright and the Motherwell guy? I don't think anyone but Hamilton and Killie will be overall happy at the season. Everyone else will think there is room for improvement with some dissapointed they've slipped v the season before, with others hopefull. A lot of words to prevaricate. I would say Robinson and Holt outperformed him for starters. Had you heard of Robinson? Would Holt even merit consideration on here? The point being is that we are quick to denigrate others as not being suitable for HMFC, forgetting of course that Craig Levein was originally appointed after a couple of months at Cowdenbeath but hailed because he was a fantastic player for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 11 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said: To be honest I would be happy if Theresa May came in to replace Levein for next season. Doing that wee robotic dance down the touchline after humping Hibs. Tynecastle would be bouncing. I believe you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said: A lot of words to prevaricate. I would say Robinson and Holt outperformed him for starters. Had you heard of Robinson? Would Holt even merit consideration on here? The point being is that we are quick to denigrate others as not being suitable for HMFC, forgetting of course that Craig Levein was originally appointed after a couple of months at Cowdenbeath but hailed because he was a fantastic player for us. Craig was at Cowdenbeath for years and turned them from the worst side in Scotland for many years (they would be gone by now see East Stirling) into a top team in the league. Didn’t Paatelinen take over from him and take them up the same season he came to us replacing Jeffries when he left to go to Bradford? Levein also came in at a torrid time for the club because of the pie man and gave us two brilliant seasons. Edited May 27, 2019 by Inch Hearts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruyff Turn Posted May 27, 2019 Share Posted May 27, 2019 I’m not worried. We will be a better side next season by a distance. I have no doubts about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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