U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[John Gentleman]

1 hour ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

The longer Trump doesn't admit defeat then the more likely there is going to an escalation of protests & the inevitable counter protests and the violence which will follow them.

 

America is really at a potentially very dangerous juncture and could decend into total chaos and serious violence very easily.

Wouldn't be the first time, would it? They just can't keep their shite wired tight. 

[frankblack]

2 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

You can almost guarantee that the longer these protests and counter protests go on someone will die.

Maybe I’m being a bit over dramatic but it’s a basket case country.

 

There has seemingly already been a stabbing.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 hour ago, gashauskis9 said:

The second bulletpoint is a belter.  Dropped the case because it wouldn’t change the result.  The guy’s a laughing stock and pissing off a lot of folk in the legal profession who he shouldn’t be if his past misdemeanours come back to haunt him.  

 

Maybe we are missing something here.

 

Trump must know he's lost and can't change the result, but what he can do is stir up the crazies and keep them hyper, so just imagine what they'll be like if/when their hero is pursued by the courts..................boom.

 

Trump will scream that he took on the 'deep state' and look what's happened, they stole the election and now want to jail him...........I really fear this is not going to end well & Trump knows this, he knows what he's doing.

 

The crazies could be his 'get out of jail free card', because the authorities could decide that jailing Trump isn't worth all the trouble that will break out or even things could decend as far as a civil war.

[gashauskis9]

10 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Maybe we are missing something here.

 

Trump must know he's lost and can't change the result, but what he can do is stir up the crazies and keep them hyper, so just imagine what they'll be like if/when their hero is pursued by the courts..................boom.

 

Trump will scream that he took on the 'deep state' and look what's happened, they stole the election and now want to jail him...........I really fear this is not going to end well & Trump knows this, he knows what he's doing.

 

The crazies could be his 'get out of jail free card', because the authorities could decide that jailing Trump isn't worth all the trouble that will break out or even things could decend as far as a civil war.

Spot on 

[DETTY29]

14 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Maybe we are missing something here.

 

Trump must know he's lost and can't change the result, but what he can do is stir up the crazies and keep them hyper, so just imagine what they'll be like if/when their hero is pursued by the courts..................boom.

 

Trump will scream that he took on the 'deep state' and look what's happened, they stole the election and now want to jail him...........I really fear this is not going to end well & Trump knows this, he knows what he's doing.

 

The crazies could be his 'get out of jail free card', because the authorities could decide that jailing Trump isn't worth all the trouble that will break out or even things could decend as far as a civil war.

Yep.

 

Sadly, it looks like America is it high risk of burning unless Trump is given assurances on future personal freedoms.

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

3 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

You can almost guarantee that the longer these protests and counter protests go on someone will die.

Maybe I’m being a bit over dramatic but it’s a basket case country.

It is not only deaths from weapons that will surely follow but these protests are super spreader events for covid 19 and his moronic supporters won't be getting the treatment that the biggest moron of them all got.

[I P Knightley]

Trump has retweeted a short clip of one of his MAGAcolytes taking a sair yin and he's prattled on about the extreme left antifa causing all this trouble.

 

Check the replies and there's a longer clip from another angle that shows the same guy laying into counter-protestors; knocking one of them over and giving him a kick in the head. The shot that takes him down is a beauty and, basically, stops him from punching out at more folk. Sends his phone flying and a couple of wifies pick it up and do a runner - not nice

[Cade]

 

 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

20 minutes ago, Cade said:

 

 

I stopped reading after “He won”.

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

 

 

[Justin Z]

6 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

No, you are not being over dramatic, being realistic in my view.
A country which allows people to openly carry guns in highly charged settings............what could possibly go wrong!

 

The oft-cited reason the second amendment exists—to allow folk to protect themselves from a tyrannical government—has been playing out the past few days.

 

Trump supporting QAnon bigots, flashing white nationalist hand signs and chanting racist slogans, have been given wide berth and free reign by the police as they riot and attack bystanders—as we see from all these tweets, it's basically on orders from above.

 

As discussed ad nauseam over the past few months, 93% of protests in the US over the summer were peaceful and many of the 7% that were not only became such following aggressive instigation with tear gas, pepper spray and rubber bullets from the police, or by right wing terrorist interloping.

 

As has been the complaint since the beginning, law enforcement in the US is structurally racist, full of racists, and doesn't protect people who don't tow the party line towards radical conservatism/Trump.

In a weird way, it's a good thing people have other ways to protect themselves than needing to rely on bent police forces.

 

3 hours ago, frankblack said:

There has seemingly already been a stabbing.

 

Correct, and I've not seen an arrest incident to that stabbing, which was committed by a Trump supporter, on a guy who thankfully was wearing a ballistic vest.

 

Two Proud Boys got into a fight in DC last week and were stabbed; they claimed it was by Antifa. The police repeated these claims without any effort to verify them, resulting in a media burst as if it were true. They've since walked that back. But they're more than willing to push that agenda.

 

Edited November 15, 2020 by Justin Z

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 hours ago, frankblack said:

 

There has seemingly already been a stabbing.

The clown in the WH should be ashamed but he’ll be lapping these incidents up.

[ri Alban]

Why don't they play him at his own game. 

[Sharpie]

2 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

The oft-cited reason the second amendment exists—to allow folk to protect themselves from a tyrannical government—has been playing out the past few days.

 

Trump supporting QAnon bigots, flashing white nationalist hand signs and chanting racist slogans, have been given wide berth and free reign by the police as they riot and attack bystanders—as we see from all these tweets, it's basically on orders from above.

 

As discussed ad nauseam over the past few months, 93% of protests in the US over the summer were peaceful and many of the 7% that were not only became such following aggressive instigation with tear gas, pepper spray and rubber bullets from the police, or by right wing terrorist interloping.

 

As has been the complaint since the beginning, law enforcement in the US is structurally racist, full of racists, and doesn't protect people who don't tow the party line towards radical conservatism/Trump.

In a weird way, it's a good thing people have other ways to protect themselves than needing to rely on bent police forces.

 

 

Correct, and I've not seen an arrest incident to that stabbing, which was committed by a Trump supporter, on a guy who thankfully was wearing a ballistic vest.

 

Two Proud Boys got into a fight in DC last week and were stabbed; they claimed it was by Antifa. The police repeated these claims without any effort to verify them, resulting in a media burst as if it were true. They've since walked that back. But they're more than willing to push that agenda.

 

 To be repetitive when Trump throughout the campaign boasted about having been endorsed by every police association in the United States how could it be a surprise to anyone that police officers who depend on their association for disciplinary, and legal representation if doing what has to be done are subjected to whispers of "if you don't support our principles, how hard will we support you". I don't know the situation now, but in my British police time we could not have a Union but had an Association that to be honest was as much use as some appendages would be on a bull.

I just look at the George Floyd situation, the Association there seemed by statistics to me defended members or at least got them smack on the wrist punishments, a disgrace and that force are now   so short of men due to retirements and assorted leaves that they are having to import from other departments. I can assure you, the average policeman eyes his salary, sick leave, pension and other benefits more diligently than the oath he took to protect and serve, to protect his own interests he will do exactly what he is told, with the defence " I was only obeyng my orders". And if anyone is going to ask the obvious question. "yes I have on occasion".

[ri Alban]

Roll on January, then the US population can come together again. I have high hopes for auld Joe, I think he'll be fantastic. And hopefully he'll bring everyone together. 

 

It's his show and I believe he'll be exactly what he was supposed to be back in the day. 🤞

Edited November 15, 2020 by ri Alban

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

2 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Roll on January, then the US population can come together again. I have high hopes for auld Joe, I think he'll be fantastic. And hopefully he'll bring everyone together. 

 

Sadly I don’t think this is possible in the near term at least. Too many people living in an alternate reality. And given the likely state of Congress (narrow House Majority, at best a long shot chance of a 50-50

Senate), I have low expectations for what is going to get done in the next year or two. Will still be massively relieved that Trump will be out of the White House, of course.

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

Sadly I don’t think this is possible in the near term at least. Too many people living in an alternate reality. And given the likely state of Congress (narrow House Majority, at best a long shot chance of a 50-50

Senate), I have low expectations for what is going to get done in the next year or two. Will still be massively relieved that Trump will be out of the White House, of course.

The senate isn't the lost cause folk make out. It is 50 50(2 independents) atm and if the Dems can take the run offs they'll be able to rebuild the US and put China, Russia and the menace that has taken advantage under trump, back in their box. 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

7 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

The senate isn't the lost cause folk make out. It is 50 50(2 independents) atm and if the Dems can take the run offs they'll be able to rebuild the US and put China, Russia and the menace that has taken advantage under trump, back in their box. 

It’s not 50/50 right now. The run-offs in Georgia will be a tough ask.

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

It’s not 50/50 right now. The run-offs in Georgia will be a tough ask.

The independents are usually with the dems, so 48 +2 is makes it 50 50. So the run offs make it good. 

Edited November 15, 2020 by ri Alban

[Mysterion]

The runs offs are set against the back drop of two groups of voters and trying to motivate them one more time.

 

One will be be selling the idea of hate and sticking it to the socialist Dems. The twisted mindset of a large amount of republicans will see them come out to gridlock the senate out of spite.
 

 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

3 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

The independents are usually with the dems, so 48 +2 is makes it 50 50. So the run offs make it good. 

Nopr. The 48 already includes Angus King and Bernie Sanders, who are independent but caucus with the Dems.  Republicans already have 50. VP has a deciding vote in a 50-50 senate.

[Boof]

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Why don't they play him at his own game. 

 

Golf?

 

Seems he's a cheating ***** at that too...

[ri Alban]

4 minutes ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

Nopr. The 48 already includes Angus King and Bernie Sanders, who are independent but caucus with the Dems.  Republicans already have 50. VP has a deciding vote in a 50-50 senate.

Nope. 

[DETTY29]

2 minutes ago, Boof said:

 

Golf?

 

Seems he's a cheating ***** at that too...

In his own words

 

'I cheat on my wife, I cheat with my taxes, why should golf be different?'

 

Or along those lines.

[ri Alban]

7 minutes ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

Nopr. The 48 already includes Angus King and Bernie Sanders, who are independent but caucus with the Dems.  Republicans already have 50. VP has a deciding vote in a 50-50 senate.

Apologies. 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

7 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Apologies. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Say's it all really.

 

Watching Ch4 news and the reporter asked a Trump supporter where they got their news from, not from you the MSM came the reply, when asked to expand the woman said they got their news from the 'Citizen News Network' who are just ordinary people like me she said.

 

In all likelihood social media and word of mouth etc, no wonder there is so much mis-information and ignorance out there.

[Dirty Deeds]

Remember this anyone? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/22/scottish-referendum-vote-rigging-claims-recount-petitions

 

A few, myself included found that defeat hard to stomach and wanted to believe in pish vote rigging nonsense.  A bit like a Hibs fan after the semi, after a few days the denial ends.

 

Trump supporters are the same and for most it'll wear off.  Just a shame that the biggest loons tend to also have guns.

[Maple Leaf]

4 minutes ago, Dirty Deeds said:

Remember this anyone? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/22/scottish-referendum-vote-rigging-claims-recount-petitions

 

A few, myself included found that defeat hard to stomach and wanted to believe in pish vote rigging nonsense.  A bit like a Hibs fan after the semi, after a few days the denial ends.

 

Trump supporters are the same and for most it'll wear off.  Just a shame that the biggest loons tend to also have guns.

 

I doubt it.  Trump got about 73 million votes and he'll keep stoking the fires of grievance with those people until 2024.

[Dirty Deeds]

3 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

I doubt it.  Trump got about 73 million votes and he'll keep stoking the fires of grievance with those people until 2024.

Yup, but surely not all 73m will continue to believe it was a fix? Or all they all bonkers?

[Maple Leaf]

4 minutes ago, Dirty Deeds said:

Yup, but surely not all 73m will continue to believe it was a fix? Or all they all bonkers?

 

Who knows?  But when it comes to Trump and his cult followers, I've given up trying to figure out what will happen next.

[RobboM]

4 minutes ago, Dirty Deeds said:

Yup, but surely not all 73m will continue to believe it was a fix? Or all they all bonkers?

Trump claiming that many of those 73m were fake 😄

[SectionDJambo]

5 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

I doubt it.  Trump got about 73 million votes and he'll keep stoking the fires of grievance with those people until 2024.

That should be the fear for the millions of decent, intelligent Americans. Trump looks like using his lying propaganda to stoke unrest and cause problems over the next 4 years and then run for President again.

Once he’s out of the White House, there has to be a major push back and exposure of his lies and trouble making, or Americans will never have their country free of his nonsense.

This is almost a mirror image of 1930s Germany, where the population wanted to believe the propaganda of the Nazis and ignored all the warning signs of what was to come.

The time for Americans to stand up and face Trump head on, with vigour, has come. It’s also time for the Republicans to reclaim their party from the great imposter.

[Hansel]

1 minute ago, SectionDJambo said:

That should be the fear for the millions of decent, intelligent Americans. Trump looks like using his lying propaganda to stoke unrest and cause problems over the next 4 years and then run for President again.

Once he’s out of the White House, there has to be a major push back and exposure of his lies and trouble making, or Americans will never have their country free of his nonsense.

This is almost a mirror image of 1930s Germany, where the population wanted to believe the propaganda of the Nazis and ignored all the warning signs of what was to come.

The time for Americans to stand up and face Trump head on, with vigour, has come. It’s also time for the Republicans to reclaim their party from the great imposter.

100% agree with you. His supporters are completely taken in by the cult of personality he has created. They won't listen to reason and will believe anything he says. Like my Trump supporting cousin who labels everyone who's anti Trump a democratic sheep. He's the ****in sheep though and he just won't see that he's behaving like he's in a cult. 

 

I wonder if someone will try and assassinate Trump, but that would probably be the worst thing to happen as it would just make him a martyr in the eyes of his supporters and give more credence to their conspiracies.

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

18 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

That should be the fear for the millions of decent, intelligent Americans. Trump looks like using his lying propaganda to stoke unrest and cause problems over the next 4 years and then run for President again.

Once he’s out of the White House, there has to be a major push back and exposure of his lies and trouble making, or Americans will never have their country free of his nonsense.

This is almost a mirror image of 1930s Germany, where the population wanted to believe the propaganda of the Nazis and ignored all the warning signs of what was to come.

The time for Americans to stand up and face Trump head on, with vigour, has come. It’s also time for the Republicans to reclaim their party from the great imposter.

Good post.

[Justin Z]

4 hours ago, Sharpie said:

 To be repetitive when Trump throughout the campaign boasted about having been endorsed by every police association in the United States how could it be a surprise to anyone that police officers who depend on their association for disciplinary, and legal representation if doing what has to be done are subjected to whispers of "if you don't support our principles, how hard will we support you". I don't know the situation now, but in my British police time we could not have a Union but had an Association that to be honest was as much use as some appendages would be on a bull.

I just look at the George Floyd situation, the Association there seemed by statistics to me defended members or at least got them smack on the wrist punishments, a disgrace and that force are now   so short of men due to retirements and assorted leaves that they are having to import from other departments. I can assure you, the average policeman eyes his salary, sick leave, pension and other benefits more diligently than the oath he took to protect and serve, to protect his own interests he will do exactly what he is told, with the defence " I was only obeyng my orders". And if anyone is going to ask the obvious question. "yes I have on occasion".

 

Thanks for this insight, Bob!

[Lone Striker]

46 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

That should be the fear for the millions of decent, intelligent Americans. Trump looks like using his lying propaganda to stoke unrest and cause problems over the next 4 years and then run for President again.

Once he’s out of the White House, there has to be a major push back and exposure of his lies and trouble making, or Americans will never have their country free of his nonsense.

This is almost a mirror image of 1930s Germany, where the population wanted to believe the propaganda of the Nazis and ignored all the warning signs of what was to come.

The time for Americans to stand up and face Trump head on, with vigour, has come. It’s also time for the Republicans to reclaim their party from the great imposter.

Excellent post.    Quite worrying to see how these armed nutjobs are reacting.   This guy's got an eye mask  😲...... 

 

 

[Mysterion]

10 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Excellent post.    Quite worrying to see how these armed nutjobs are reacting.   This guy's got an eye mask  😲...... 

 

 

 

Seb Gorka is a prime example of someone selling his soul to make money out of the stupid. He's considered a fraud too with many people questioning the validity of his PhD.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

On 14/11/2020 at 05:52, Justin Z said:

 

I've been called a drama queen, a “woke American” (as an unmoderated racial epithet, seriously!) and a virtue signaller more times than I can count However, the vast majority of the folk here have been very tolerant, especially as I ranted with the deepest skepticism about the coming neoliberal garbage that we're now seeing—with Biden bringing the heartless woman responsible for caging and deporting a record number of migrants under Obama into his transition team, for but one small example.

 

Anyway, can hardly blame you for your extended leave of absence! Congrats on all the positive change in your life!

 

It will be an, er, "interesting" time -- interesting if I could regard it at a distance instead of a collision of immanent crises. I was very, very against a Biden nomination but in some ways the pandemic played to his strengths, as he didn't need to campaign as much and just held down the fort for radical ideas such as "listening to public health experts" and "not yanking babies away from their mothers" (which however bad ICE and CBP got under Obama, was worse). But he's been wrong on critical policy decisions for four decades and I wasn't optimistic.

 

But he's at least making noises about wanting to do big things, a la FDR and LBJ, which means there's at least a shot at a halfway decent climate bill (pending the runoffs in Georgia of course, which I'm hopeful for but would never put even money on). And there's a lot of speculation that he won't run again, which I hope for.

 

So yeah I'm not super-enthused about Biden but he is of course an immeasurable upgrade over the malicious blunderer surrounded by genocidal freaks.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

4 hours ago, SectionDJambo said:

That should be the fear for the millions of decent, intelligent Americans. Trump looks like using his lying propaganda to stoke unrest and cause problems over the next 4 years and then run for President again.

Once he’s out of the White House, there has to be a major push back and exposure of his lies and trouble making, or Americans will never have their country free of his nonsense.

This is almost a mirror image of 1930s Germany, where the population wanted to believe the propaganda of the Nazis and ignored all the warning signs of what was to come.

The time for Americans to stand up and face Trump head on, with vigour, has come. It’s also time for the Republicans to reclaim their party from the great imposter.

 

The hope comes from the fact that much of the damage done over the last four years has been not directly by Trump, but by cynical and corrupt Republican officials who have laughed at Trump behind his back while getting him to sign off on their reactionary nonsense. (McConnell being far and away the worst but far from the only one) There are a lot of elections between now and 2024 and there's a substantial portion of the GOP that, while they liked the goodies they got on the ride, may not be sure that a four year restoration ride is a sure fire way to keep power. Already the signs are that they all are trying to figure out how to go through the motions of supporting his delusions of stolen victory while figuring out just how fast they can drop him like a hot rock and not get called a backstabber.

 

Further, there's always been jockeying behind the curtains as to who's going to get to inherit the GOP after Trump is gone. Donald himself wants to set up his own family members and no one else, of course, but I remain unconvinced that Don Jr. or Ivanka really have the celebrity power to hold the center of the racket together.

[Unknown user]

5 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

I doubt it.  Trump got about 73 million votes and he'll keep stoking the fires of grievance with those people until 2024.

I'm sure he'd like to, but he's made a whole lot of very powerful enemies, people, government departments,  former allies, how many legal actions are waiting for him to lose his protected status? How many people are just waiting to get their own back?

 

He's got an enormous tsunami of shit coming his way, the biggest, the most wonderfully stinking shit you can imagine.

[Maple Leaf]

52 minutes ago, Smithee said:

I'm sure he'd like to, but he's made a whole lot of very powerful enemies, people, government departments,  former allies, how many legal actions are waiting for him to lose his protected status? How many people are just waiting to get their own back?

 

He's got an enormous tsunami of shit coming his way, the biggest, the most wonderfully stinking shit you can imagine.

 

I hope that you're right.  He deserves it.

[Justin Z]

5 hours ago, Lone Striker said:

Excellent post.    Quite worrying to see how these armed nutjobs are reacting.   This guy's got an eye mask  😲......

 

Y'all Qaeda . . .

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

3 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

Y'all Qaeda . . .

 

 

Pretty scary and sadly spot on.

[Lovecraft]

[Cade]

Another lawsuit withdrawn.

This time it was disputing the legality of 682,479 mail-in votes in PA that the suit claimed had not been processed correctly.

Trump's team now admit they had been.

 

They're pressing ahead with a far smaller suit claiming that election officials had contacted persons who had sent a mail-in ballot and asked them to come in and fix some errors in it, such as an illegible signature or sealing it in a security envelope.

This is not illegal in county nor state law, so I'm not really sure what they're moaning about.

They are alleging that counties with strong Democrat representation were contacting more people about this than Republican run counties.

So Democrats were breaking the law by following a law that Republicans ignored?

 

[Des Lynam]

It has to be gloves off time for the Democrats. How do you deradicalise 72 million people? Isolating the Trump enablers would be a start. Offer top jobs to Mitch or Lindsey in Joe’s bringing America together administration. If they refuse call them out as unpatriotic at every turn. If we don’t figure out why so many voted for him then worse will come in 2024. It’s just too easy and lazy to condemn all his support as racist loons. 

[RobboM]

I don't think this one has been on here before. It's a funny and revealing twitter from Kenyan journalist Patrick Gathara reporting on US election like Americans report on other elections

 

https://boingboing.net/2020/11/08/kenyan-journalist-reports-on-us-election-like-americans-report-on-other-elections.html

 

and a wee taster from a recent tweet

[Lovecraft]

48 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

It has to be gloves off time for the Democrats. How do you deradicalise 72 million people? Isolating the Trump enablers would be a start. Offer top jobs to Mitch or Lindsey in Joe’s bringing America together administration. If they refuse call them out as unpatriotic at every turn. If we don’t figure out why so many voted for him then worse will come in 2024. It’s just too easy and lazy to condemn all his support as racist loons. 

I wouldn't say it's 72 Million that are the problem.  Most of them will just be Republicans voting for a Republican candidate regardless who it is.  The crazies will probably only be a few million.  Still a scary amount though.

 

You just need to look at their Million MAGA March to see the real numbers of Trump followers rather than Republicans.

 

 

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 minutes ago, Lovecraft said:

I wouldn't say it's 72 Million that are the problem.  Most of them will just be Republicans voting for a Republican candidate regardless who it is.  The crazies will probably only be a few million.  Still a scary amount though.

 

You just need to look at their Million MAGA March to see the real numbers of Trump followers rather than Republicans.

 

 

 

 

Indeed, I think this 72 million is a red-herring, simply because by far the vast majority of people would have I believe, voted Republican before they voted for Donald Trump, Donald Duck could have stood for the Republicans against Joe Biden and would have still got many many millions of votes.

 

Like you say the real number of Trump roasters are relatively small in number compared to the Republican voter base, and once Trump is no longer relevant they'll slither off back to their flat earth society conventions, until that is, another nutjob loser comes along to fly the conspiracy fruitloaf's banner.